Mafiascum.net

zach, read on ira?

ira, read on zach?

In post 281, heuristically_alone wrote:Still confused about what you meant by this. Were you assuming that we though it obvious why you voted thus?

i thought that i could maybe get a read on a couple people because my reasons to me were not-obvious enough that if someone conveyed a similar enough thought process that went behind my vote they'd be more likely town

so basically the opposite

In post 257, iraonavp wrote:I shouldn't have moved my vote away, I also think my reasoning for voting Bins was poorly elaborated and possibly partially imaginary.

i think you elaborated just fine, like to the point where it was over justified

please explain what about your reasoning now seems imaginary

In post 297, Keyser Söze wrote:This feels like a manufactured sheep-dump off iraonavp's unsupported logic.

could you clarify your bottom line here a bit more

like what does this do for how you feel about their dynamic - more likely town/scum or scum/scum?

Wait. Yeah, Keyser I'm confused it seems like you have strong feelings about Ira but you haven't made a clear stance on them? What do you think of ira? Why not go for the person with the bad logic instead of the person that follows them?

In post 303, Tyler the Creator wrote:could you clarify your bottom line here a bit more

like what does this do for how you feel about their dynamic -

more likely town/scum or scum/scum?

In post 304, Bins wrote:Wait. Yeah, Keyser I'm confused it seems like you have strong feelings about Ira but you haven't made a clear stance on them? What do you think of ira?

Why not go for the person with the bad logic instead of the person that follows them?

I promise to answer these questions after iraonavp and heuristically_alone have responded to me first .

I'm still a page behind too - I'll be fully caught up tonight hopefully (looks like there's a few wall-posts to conquer )

In post 300, Tyler the Creator wrote:zach, read on ira?

I don't have much to say about him, except the way he uses " town-aligned " and " scum-aligned " tickles me.

In post 261, iraonavp wrote:

I cannot answer this fairly because of the assumption that I am "derailing his point".

In post 264, iraonavp wrote:
I cannot answer any of these questions because they have false or misrepresentative premises.

You should really explain what you actually are doing, instead of making it clear what you aren't. You sound smart, you sound like a lawyer or something, but you're not explaining much. It's probably why people think you're scum.






I get why a few think I'm mafia, but I'm going to collectively just say........ you're not right. Bang.

s/o floof for the townread G

In post 253, Dunnstral wrote:Anyway I think Zach is actually town and thinks I'm mafia because he thinks I'm acting different from another game

Hey buddy, I see right through you. I remember that night in Beaverton.

In post 307, Zachstralkita wrote:
You should really explain what you actually are doing, instead of making it clear what you aren't. You sound smart, you sound like a lawyer or something, but you're not explaining much. It's probably why people think you're scum.

Did you really just say this

Dunnstral wrote:

In post 307, Zachstralkita wrote:
You should really explain what you actually are doing, instead of making it clear what you aren't. You sound smart, you sound like a lawyer or something, but you're not explaining much. It's probably why people think you're scum.

Did you really just say this

In post 305, Keyser Söze wrote:I promise to answer these questions after iraonavp and heuristically_alone have responded to me first .

ight that's cool

Zachstralkita wrote:I don't have much to say about him, except the way he uses " town-aligned " and " scum-aligned " tickles me.

"tickles?"

In post 269, heuristically_alone wrote:Because Iraonavp fought back a little defending his reasons is why I think he is town.

Why can't scum-iraonavp ?

In post 281, heuristically_alone wrote:

Jack

First off, I found it so strange that so many people read Jack so early on as scum or town based on his vote in post 13 against Robert. I think anyone voting him as an easy vote at the beginning makes for possible scum players, (Keyser, tool, floof for example), not that I'm saying that one of them HAVE to be scum. As for Jack, I don't have enough information yet from him to really say for me what he is, but for now I'm leaning on town.

Floof

Also a suspect of mafia for voting Jack. There hasn't been any more substantial reading from Floof to get more of an opinion.

1) Why is it for players to take a firm stance on a vote during early D1 play?
2) / - if you're scum-reading players off Jaack's early wagon, this sounds like your town-read should be stronger than "leaning on town" / "don't have enough information yet".

Either (a) you have a strong town-read of Jaack, thus, naturally scum-reading the players on his wagon (confirmation bias) or (b) you 'know' he is town.

Bins:

-Starts off with her read on dunn (#23), which people (myself included) were confused by, and which she later backed away from (#176). I can buy her reasons for backing away from it -- that the attitude she thought was scummy became consistent and started looking more like playstyle than alignment-indicative. It's a very natural thing to happen early in the game.
-Votes ira in #213. It's kinda one of those situations where she lets somebody else talk her into the vote. Slightly scummy to do, since she'd unvoted dunn after being criticized and needed a place to put her vote.
-Still overall pretty neutral on this slot though. It mostly just looks like she's trying to get into the game, which comes from either alignment.

Zach:

-Most of zach's posting makes it clear that he's taking a lighthearted/"jokey" approach to the game, which is fine. I assume that posts that make absolute statements like #94 and #159 are exaggerations.
-The dunn vote appears to me to be zach's way of trying to get things moving. It's like he's trying to get a reaction out of dunn or something. What's unclear is what exactly he expects to get out of dunn, or anybody else, with his vote. He hasn't switched off of dunn yet, and he's basically just been focusing on him.
-My theory is that this approach to the game is more likely to come from town, simply because it shows that the person doesn't really care how they look. I've seen exceptions to that (where the player in question was actually scum), but just on percentages I'd give the edge to town. That being said, it'll definitely be useful to keep track of patterns in Zach's pushing/votes/etc. throughout the game.

Tyler:

-I don't see a whole lot worth commenting on in Tyler's ISO. It's all pretty standard stuff, asking people for questions, collecting information, etc. The only thing to note is that although Tyler has been questioning people and it looks like he's attempting to drive the game forward, the game remains somewhat stagnant. Idk if that reflects more on Tyler or other people, but it's there.
-So I'm just going to revert back to my original reasoning on townleaning on Tyler -- that it makes sense to me that there was a cascade of townreads on him because he's town.

This is a good narrative on iraonavp's voting behaviour:

In post 282, toolenduso wrote:ira:

-Ostensibly, ira treated the game like it was RVS until #198, because when people gave him flak for his Keyser vote his defense was that he was trying to build a wagon to get out of RVS. Fair enough. But in that same post he votes Bins, right after Dunn begins pushing for a Bins wagon. It's the same MO as when he voted for Keyser, basically, but at this point he's putting reasoning behind it. So it kind of all comes together to look like ira was floating along trying to look active, then got criticized for it and came up with an excuse (I'm trying to get out of RVS) but also tried to escape the criticism by going to the next viable wagon he could find (Bins). It's worth noting that ira says he didn't know Dunn was voting Bins (#256).
-He switches back to Keyser in #257. He has reasoning, and I do follow it logically, but it should be noted that it happens amid pressure for his Bins vote, and in the process of switching to Keyser he distances himself from the Bins vote.

I like post 282 as a whole alot, including toolenduso's expression of his reads of xyzzy and Jaack (healthy paranoia + re-checking his positions continually) i.e townie-mindset.

In post 282, toolenduso wrote:Would like to do Bins, Zach and Tyler next.

Please - more of the same mate

In post 283, heuristically_alone wrote:I don't see how an RVS from another game has anything to do with reading how he plays as scum or town.

Sorry if I didn't make this clear in my last post -- it seemed to me like you were kinda just scumreading Keyser based on his posting style, and I wanted to show you a towngame where his posting style was similar.

Which doesn't necessarily make him town here, but it does show that his posting style doesn't necessarily make him scum.

In post 283, heuristically_alone wrote:And why did he become pretty obvtown? Just by posting a lot of commentary of what others were saying?

No. Part of it had to do with this attitude he had that he was just town and didn't seem to get why people would think he wasn't town. Later it had to do with some specific voting he did. And then eventually he just started doing some super in-depth and helpful analysis that seemed very pro-town to me.

In post 298, Jake from State Farm wrote:Ha's made some good points. That vote for him is probably not a good one.

Do his good points make him more likely town?

Also, what are your thoughts on Dunn -- as in, why not vote him after your back-and-forth with him where you said he was lying?

In post 316, toolenduso wrote:

In post 298, Jake from State Farm wrote:Ha's made some good points. That vote for him is probably not a good one.

Do his good points make him more likely town?

Also, what are your thoughts on Dunn -- as in, why not vote him after your back-and-forth with him where you said he was lying?

Well yes I think it makes him likely town which is why I said that vote is probably not a good one.

I'm not voting Dunn cause I like my vote where it's at now. I will say dunn's avoidance of me now proves he was just doing that for show and has no real interest in trying to find out my reasoning and that worries me.

Right now I could vote for 3 people and would feel pretty good that each would flip scum based on what I've read so far. Well technically 2 cause I'm already voting one of them.

OK, could you go into more detail on the zach read then? Because I weaklean town on that slot.

In post 317, Jake from State Farm wrote:

In post 316, toolenduso wrote:

In post 298, Jake from State Farm wrote:Ha's made some good points. That vote for him is probably not a good one.

Do his good points make him more likely town?

Also, what are your thoughts on Dunn -- as in, why not vote him after your back-and-forth with him where you said he was lying?

Well yes I think it makes him likely town which is why I said that vote is probably not a good one.

I'm not voting Dunn cause I like my vote where it's at now. I will say dunn's avoidance of me now proves he was just doing that for show and has no real interest in trying to find out my reasoning and that worries me.

Right now I could vote for 3 people and would feel pretty good that each would flip scum based on what I've read so far. Well technically 2 cause I'm already voting one of them.

My avoidance of you? You pretty much said you weren't going to answer me and that's ok just something to keep in mind

The fact that you keep trying to twist what I do into things that aren't there irks me, and I'm tempted to vote for you if you don't basically admit that you're just making stuff up to get on my nerves

Who is this third person you wouldn't mind voting?

In post 318, toolenduso wrote:OK, could you go into more detail on the zach read then? Because I weaklean town on that slot.

Well for starters he tries to say that the mascot for an American car insurance company who speaks with a British accent is somehow better than me.

But that aside his early posts were kind of meh. I didn't like how he answered on dunn's behalf. I personally can't stand when people do that. His and dunn's early interaction feels too
Cheeky but that's just a guy thing. His unvote on me without anything else kind of bugs me but that's just a "me" thing. His vote on Dunn seems to come out of left field for me and his certainty of scum really struck me as odd. At first I thought it was scum pushing on town Dunn to make it look like he was contributing but it actually now looks more like distancing to me. He knows his push is so ludicrous that it'll never get steam and people wil never think they are scum together. The post that sealed it for me is post 159. The whole if I'm wrong lynch me Schtick is played out. Nobody gets lynched for being wrong day 1 and even n00bs know that. I've seen scum do that in an attempt to make themselves look town.

In post 319, Dunnstral wrote:My avoidance of you? You pretty much said you weren't going to answer me and that's ok just something to keep in mind

No I said if you as simple questions you would get simple answers. Did you see what tool did? He basically asked me to explain why I'm scum reading him and guess what happened next? I responded to him. It's not my fault you are too stupid/lazy to figure out how to get me to talk.

In post 319, Dunnstral wrote:The fact that you keep trying to twist what I do into things that aren't there irks me, and I'm tempted to vote for you if you don't basically admit that you're just making stuff up to get on my nerves

I haven't twisted anything. What I did do is factually state things about you. Again with the lies. Will it ever stop? Yo I don't know.

As for the 3rd person. It's pretty obvious if you read my posts. Robert is the 3rd. He said he was scum last time we played and I figured he was scum but didn't get him lynched. He says I worry him this game which would imply that he's not town. If he was town why would I worry him? It's strange and I think that means he's probably scum. He's also hasn't really impressed me with his posts so it's still leaning scum on him.

Guys, sorry! I'll catch up tomorrow I have a shit load of work today.