Open 65 - Mini Love (Over!) before 578

[eldarad]

/confirm

[eldarad]

hi guys, it's snowing. Therefore

vote farside

[eldarad]

meh, I'll vote for her now

unvote
vote: Jex

[eldarad]

I like Jex. A lot.

OK. So...does that change anything? Do you feel lucky?

[eldarad]

Sorry, I was playing Marathon Day games. Back now

Incidentally, my question to ABR ("do you feel lucky?") was kinda serious, but I don't want an answer anymore.

unvote
vote Seth

for asking ABR where to place your vote. It's trying to absolve yourself of responsibility for your actions.

[eldarad]

@Elderad

Incidentally, my question to ABR ("do you feel lucky?") was kinda serious, but I don't want an answer anymore.

unvote
vote Seth

for asking ABR where to place your vote. It's trying to absolve yourself of responsibility for your actions.

So, it's okay for you to ask questions regarding voting, but not for me? We're both going the same place with those questions.

No, questions are fine.
Giving your vote to someone else is not fine.

In general: I wasn't necessarily going to just vote whatever ABR said. I wanted to see what his response would be.

What where you expecting him to say? "I'm the cop" maybe?
At least that would have given us an easy lynch today, huh?

[eldarad]

ABR, what is your opinion on our two sets of lovers?

Do you think it would be beneficial to lynch one of them on day 1 on the off-chance that they are scum?
Or do you think the 1/4 chance of a lover being treacherous (as opposed to 1/3 chance of a non-lover being scum) means we should lynch a non-lover instead?

[eldarad]

Defense of my actions:

Newbie. Stupid newbie. Check my join date.

I really did just want to see what response would come of it. ABR keeps insistently making "I love Jex" posts, which is a little weird. Obviously, I didn't think people would use it as a reason to lynch me. A lot of people were saying a lot of stupid things, and no one seems to have singled them out for death. (Specifically, elderad admits he was kind of serious in asking ABR about his vote, then jumps on the BW to lynch me.)

Well, if I die, when I'm proven townie, I hope it helps you find the real scum.

I'm guessing the scum will just claim that I was playing anti-town and deserved to die for being unhelpful anyway. (I can make a great argument against myself.)

@dahill Again: Newbie, stupid stupid newbie, doesn't know what's acceptable discussion and what's going too far.

Do you want to attempt this post again? Maybe with an actual defence this time? Being new doesn't make you stupid.
Also, what things have I said that are stupid?

We live together. We die together. Bad boys for life.

Everybody BUM RUSH SETHANIEL!!!!!!!!!!!!!! NOW!!!!!

Shut up ABR...

[eldarad]

This post massively bothers me! If you look at the roles, killing one lover kills the other.

What happens if one lover is lynched, and the other lover survives the night?

Therefore, if we out the lovers then we will either kill 2 town or 1 town and 1 mafia based on which pair we lynch. I do not find this beneficial to the town in any way shape or form.

How is trading one town for one scum not beneficial for the town?

Third thing on this post, you are voting for sethaniel for asking and opinion from ABR yet you are doing the exact same thing. I find this hypocritical.

Please show where I asked ABR who I should vote for.

I never really thought about the fact that he may be trying to make it look that way with his posts.
<snip>
Overall, good point about him trying to make it look like he's a lover, bad conclusion because he is not my lover.

erm...how?
Given how you have just said that you think the lovers should stay hidden, why should we believe a thing you say?

[eldarad]

elderad is confirmed town. More S lynching plz.

why do you discount a jex lynch?

[eldarad]

I'll gladly give myself over in exchange of lynching 2 scumzz

cool. who are the 2 scum?

unvote
vote ABR

[eldarad]

I also don't understand why he said eldarad is 'confirmed town', and also don't understand eldarad's vote after Albert has claimed doctor.

At this moment - right here, right now - do you believe ABR's doc claim?

[eldarad]

Yoshi, I don't believe ABR's doc claim, so the fact he claimed is irrelevant. And your desire to have the doc counterclaim smells of rolefishing for the real doc.

Jex, huh, you're right. Lovers =/= masons. Sorry.

[eldarad]

I was going to say pretty much what Korts said, but I got up late this morning and so I couldn't post before I left for work.
Post 166 is just horrendous, car crash mafia...

unvote
vote Yoshi

[eldarad]

Yoshi, I didn't start this game with any pre-conceived ideas about you as I had never heard of you before.
I'm voting for you because you are trying to draw the real doc out and I feel this is scummy behaviour:

Yoshi, I don't believe ABR's doc claim, so the fact he claimed is irrelevant. And your desire to have the doc counterclaim smells of rolefishing for the real doc.

Other than that, Korts has summarised it perfectly in post 172.

Now, all we need is for the other 6 players who signed up for this game but haven't posted recently to show up and lynch us a scum or explain why Yoshi is a bad lynch.

[eldarad]

I've got this overwhelming urge to vote Korts Today. I also had this urge towards the end of Day 1, but I figured saying so would get me killed.

vote Korts

[eldarad]

Ignoring the pre-confirm and joke posts at the start:

unvote vote dahill

he was clearly trying to set up a bandwagon and a quicklynch.

Another joke vote? Maybe. But surely one joke vote is enough...So this is a serious vote then?

More garbage about how the Korts wagon needs pushing more. Self votes. Which is a scumtell, in the

eldarad book of scumtells

.

Post 85 is another joke post with no game content.

Post 163 is the first post after Korts' absence. The pressure has been piling on Yoshi, and so Korts decides to stick the knife in:

Sorry,

unvote

. Also, sorry for forgetting to post. Had a lot going on. And now, I'm gonna OMGUS.

Vote: Yoshi

I find it odd that so many votes are on Albert even though he's claimed! Albert, what do you think now, I'm scum, even though I realize that you are really the doctor, and four other people don't?

Anxious for feedback: scumtell in my read. Also, pointing fingers.

About Jex: I'd like you to tell me why her vote looks odd. Is it because you're convinced ABR is doc?

Gratuitously half-defends Jex here for no obvious reason.

About me. How the heck did you figure out that being away is scummy? I didn't even post for what, one, two weeks? And yet, after rereading you fail to call me out for lurking, only for selfvoting, and something about some role that I don't understand. You calling me suspicious is the most suspicious thing in this game, since I didn't even post past the random stage, because I was waiting for replacement, and when I came back, I had to reread some other games I came back to also.

I partly agree with the part about Sethaniel. The claim was premature. But the vote on him I don't understand.

This time criticising Yoshi's stance on Seth, whilst sending Seth good vibes.

Claiming doc and not getting the counterclaim isn't a very solid case for ABR being doc, methinks. I find it much more likely he's scum trying to draw the real doc. And the real doc has surely realized this and may have decided to keep his mouth shut, wanting to live to D2. Also, even if he is the doc, he doesn't have anything against Seth. Absolutely no proof that only ABR can have. A doc isn't an investigative role, and even if it were, we didn't have a night 1, as far as I remember.

This is pretty accurate, but to me this sounds like scum casting off a scumbuddy he sees as a liability.

eldarad, your voting Albert smells of *wanting to lynch the real doc* to me.

No, as I said, ABR's claim is not very believable. It smells more to me of "wanting to lynch the scum

fakeclaiming

doc".

This time buddying up to me. Nice.

~~~
Post 168 explains to Yoshi the whole ABR-doc reasoning again.
I agree with post 172, but that doesn't mean it can't be bussing by Korts.
174 and 176 is part of the stupid back-and-forth between ABR and Korts.
Then Korts agrees to lead the Seth wagon Day 2. Why exactly? This is even worse proxying than Seth's. If Seth is town, Korts can say "ABR told me to"
This is despite already acknowledging, as part of the case on Yoshi, that ABR can't possibly have any additional info.

So, yeah. I'm not liking your play at all. Hence the vote.

[eldarad]

Yeah, but Korts, how many joke votes are reasonable?
At what point does the joking become an excuse to avoid posting content?
Also I find self-voting, even as a random vote, to be scummy. I notice Jex self-voted too, you'll see that I voted for her.

You're wrong about Yoshi being pressured in my absence. I was the first to vote him, and

other than questioning him about his belief of the ABR-claim

, relatively little attention was on him.

That questioning was leading somewhere, and Yoshi wasn't handling the attention well at all. I agree that you put the first vote on, but to claim that there was no pressure is wrong.

I was questioning, through this, again, the credibility of ABR's claim. Also, I was pretty annoyed by Yoshi's lame way of twisting words.

Hmm. You answered something directed towards me on my behalf, which I don't like.

I agreed to lead the Seth wagon because I find him most suspicious after Yoshi. And I have a mouth of my own, and a brain attached to it, I will never defend myself with "ABR told me to."

Yeah, but this is setting up the Day 2 lynch on Day 1 without reference to any information we gain from the lynch and NK. Why would you do that?
What's more, you followed through with this plan, and I have no doubt that Seth would be on more votes than he is on now if I hadn't intervened and called you up on this.

I'll let Seth respond to your case before commenting on it.

[eldarad]

The town needs to consider farside's death. It's highly unlikely the scum chose her randomly. Who profits by removing farside from the game? Why her, instead of the claimed doc?

Hmm. This is actually quite scummy. As ABR says, this is WIFOM and no good can come from it. However, I'm just not prepared to accept that we're owning this game so easily.

So, in your opinion, discussing night kills is scummy?

Yes. In particular, using the NK from last night as evidence that you can't possibly be scum is very scummy.

This is setting up a Day 2 bandwagon that we can gain information from. I don't think we gain much information from yesterday's lynch, correct me if I'm wrong. And the NK doesn't help much, either. I mean, apart from the early D1 argument between farside and Qman, farside didn't pick a lot of fights. If I had thought differently, I wouldn't have started Day 2 with the Seth wagon.

So how is setting up a Day 2 wagon in advance beneficial to anyone?
I agree that Yoshi's lynch wasn't the most informative but that doesn't justify setting up lynches - or bandwagons or even just the agenda - a Day in advance.
Why, exactly, did you do that? How does the town benefit from knowing that you are going to lead a bandwagon Day 2? Does the town benefit more than the mafia? How so?

[eldarad]

You missed out the crucial part of my quote there.

In particular, using the NK from last night as evidence that you can't possibly be scum is very scummy.

See?

[eldarad]

If it wasn't beneficial to anyone, why do it?
It strikes me as beneficial to scum as it immediately confines discussion to the wagon target (and, potentially, the wagoners I guess).
I also find it weird that, until very recently, ABR disowned the Sethwagon. I'm still trying to work out what that means.

In fact, ABR, why did you disown the Sethwagon at the start of the Day?

[eldarad]

Flameaxe, what do you think?

[eldarad]

Post 258 bugs me. A lot.
I need to think about what I am going to do about that.

In the mean time, it would be nice to hear from the people who replaced in.

[eldarad]

Hmm.

my main points against korts are that he seemed to be a bit too eager for the Seth lynch D2. he even later admitted that setting up a D2 wagon would not be beneficial to the town.

i admit Seth is looking scummy and i'm considering him as a possible D3 lynch, depending on what happens today.

Having voted Korts for setting up a lynch a Day ahead, dahill then attempts to set a lynch up a Day ahead... it's like he wants to use my argument as an excuse to vote for Korts but needs to give himself wiggle-room for Day 3.

as for babygirl, this seems to be how she plays in all of her games, from what i have read. but i still would appreciate more feedback from her.

This seems like a gratuitious mention of babygirl, and it involves justifying her lurking. Strikes me as odd.

unvote
vote dahill

[eldarad]

NO, GUYS, NO!!! SETHANIEL AND JEX!!!

dahill is the play for Today I think. I say this with the utmost seriousness.

[eldarad]

I'm not overly impressed with Korts' switch to dahill. Come to mention it, I'm not impressed with ABR's jump onto the dahill wagon either.

[eldarad]

Jex is most likely to be scum right now. I suspect she might also be a treacherous lover, so I'm trying to figure out who her partner might be in that contingency. If we lynch her partner, she will also die without me having to build a solid case on her. I cannot explain my gut feeling on her yet, and I feel like I have to resort to these kinds of methods to get her killed.

If you're right about this, all you need to do is convince Jex's lover of this.

At the moment, you're just giving yourself an excuse to baselessly attack people as Jex's lover.

[eldarad]

Well now you've just given yourself wiggle-room for when you get a townie lynched. "I thought he was Jex's lover"
You ought to focus exclusively on lynching scum. If you're right and Jex is a treacherous lover, her lover will figure it out before you do.

Unless you want to change your claim...do you feel lucky?

[eldarad]

No seriously, I think you're scum. I don't follow your thought process in the various bandwagon campaigns you undertake. Its not genuine. You're making things up as you go.

If you think Jex is scum, try to lynch her. Going after her hypothetical townie lover is just stupid.

[eldarad]

Also,

unvote

Although it worries me that dahill has clammed up following the pressure.

[eldarad]

You ought to focus exclusively on lynching scum. If you're right and Jex is a treacherous lover, her lover will figure it out before you do.

Why would this be so? The lover has no magic power anyway

OK. Let's assume Jex is the treacherous lover, and someone else - we'll call him Mr A - is her lover.
1) Mr A knows for certain that Jex is his lover
2) Mr A can night-talk with Jex
3) If Mr A believes Jex is scum, then he knows that she must be the treacherous lover, rather than a goon.

The vanilla townies and the doc (and the other 2 lovers) don't know any of those 3 things.

[eldarad]

What about ABR's jump onto the dahill wagon? Was that scummy to you?
Moreso than Seth's?

[eldarad]

Anything that you find suspicious from Korts is invalid if it also applies to me. I am the living proof that a townie could want dahill to claim for his atrocious beliefs and to attack Sethaniel for scummy play.

Huh.
You'll only be proof once you're dead...

vote Korts

[eldarad]

Korts, if you had survived, would you have campaigned against Jex with me ?

I'd like to hear the answer to this question, as it happens.

[eldarad]

meh, this game makes absolutely no sense.

And I feel like there are only 5 people playing, although the first post claims that there should be double that...

[eldarad]

Suspects atm:

Jex
Dahill
Elderad

I'm not really feeling that any of them is scummy at the moment...

I think that if ABR is not the doc, then the real doc is someone who has played with ABR before - so they've decided to delay counterclaiming...Having said that I do think it is likely now that ABR is in fact the doc and the mafia have decided to keep ABR alive - maybe for comedy value.

I still don't like Korts, and a Seth lynch is kinda growing on me, if only out of a process of elimination.
But then there are babygirl and Coron who it is impossible to get a read on because they aren't posting in the thread.

[eldarad]

B) they stay alive either because dahill or his partner is in fact treacherous lover, or because scum want to try WIFOM.

Or because of a doc save, or because the scum target the claimed doc instead.
Quite an enormous oversight on your part there Korts...

Besides which, forcing the scum to NK dahill instead of lynching him delays the death of his lover by a Night. So there is always an outside possibility that his lover will be targeted for a NK even though they are going to die anyway.
If dahill's lover is revealed that option disappears.

And another thing - the scum may NK dahill even though his lover is treacherous just for the WIFOM value of having a scum who knows he is dead man walking anyway.

[eldarad]

yeah man i dont like seeing dahill go like this... its like 1-2 people said "hey lets lynch him and see"... not enough participation from other people.
We need more opinions, drama, resistance, anything

lol, I can't help thinking of the Erasure song "Drama". But that's my (psychological) damage, not yours...
If it's worth anything, I am currently opposed to a dahill lynch at the moment.

[eldarad]

yeah man i dont like seeing dahill go like this... its like 1-2 people said "hey lets lynch him and see"... not enough participation from other people.
We need more opinions, drama, resistance, anything

lol, I can't help thinking of the Erasure song "Drama". But that's my (psychological) damage, not yours...
If it's worth anything, I am currently opposed to a dahill lynch at the moment.

what do you, and everyone else for that matter, think about another lover claiming but only if they are lovers with Korts?
of course, Korts could be just a regular goon, but if he is a lover i think it is highly possible that he is the scum lover

Hypothetically?
I would lynch Korts at the drop of a hat anyway - a Korts-lover claim would complicate things somewhat. But in a rather interesting way...
I'm guessing that is not the answer you were looking for?

[eldarad]

While I understand the logic of killing off the known lover today, I feel that Korts only brought this plan up in order to get everyone's attention off of him and onto someone else. Korts is on the top of my scum list, as well as many others lists, and I feel he's the best lynch for the day.

The love plan works on any day, so we kill korts today

(getting rid of one scum)

and then deal with the lovers tomorrow.

The bolded part really gets to me. It's a much stronger statement than a townie would make, I feel. I think that by lynching Korts we are lynching the

most likely

scum, but I'm not complacent about it.

All we need to figure out is whether Jex is pushing for a townie lynch, or whether she's bussing Kortscum. In the meantime,

unvote
vote Jex

[eldarad]

Coron, what don't you like about my tone?
Is my tone scummy?

[eldarad]

meh. I started re-reading and got bored.
I still don't like the interaction between Korts and ABR on Day 1 about setting up a bandwagon for Day 2. I don't have anything new though.

Even so, I'd rather lynch Korts in preference to dahill.

unvote
vote Korts

[eldarad]

Anyway, we would be killing only two lovers. The rest would die all by themselves.

ha ha.

Surely we're much better off trying to lynch scum rather than just lynching lovers by default.

[eldarad]

Yes, there's that. But with this plan, we get one scum guaranteed, while trying to find the goon won't necessarily yield so good results. God, I feel like some kind of a salesman.

I'd rather find the goon first. The surviving townie lover can claim as soon as the other (all-townie) lover pair is killed. If dahill isn't NK'ed Tonight, we just wait until a lover

is

NK'ed.
In the meantime, scum have to choose between targeting the doc or lover-hunting.

Add the fact that I don't like your interaction with Yoshi, and I'm happy with you being the play for the day.

[eldarad]

Why doesn't the lover plan work tomorrow?
We're still trading 3 town for scum - which may very well me a trade worth making.
Worst case scenario is we end up with 1 scum vs 2 town, which is lylo but probably what we'd expect anyway.
If we're lucky, scum NK's one of the townie lovers for us, which saves us a Day in terms of lynches.

So let's lynch Korts Today.

[eldarad]

I'm fairly sure I mentioned that concept (of lynching all the lovers to kill the one scum) first, and then went cold on the idea.

Besides, I suspect the mafia will take the decision out of our hands when they night-kill.

[eldarad]

More of this weird ABR-Korts interaction...

[eldarad]

confirmed

[eldarad]

Once one lover dies, the other dies that Night (or the same Night).
I think we should force the mafia to kill the lovers - that way we automatically know which pair has the treacherous lover in, and we don't end up doing half the mafia's job for them.

[eldarad]

Even if you think eldarad is town, if dahill is the treacherous lover, then they have to die.

Why should the other set of lovers claim? In case they have a member who looks scummier than dahill?

Seth: Are you thinking of placing a vote somewhere before the deadline hits? What are your thoughts at the moment? Lynch dahill or Korts? Or is there a third option that you prefer?

[eldarad]

I think you guys are wrong. If we lynch Korts and he is not scum at what point do you lynch the lovers to find out if one is scum?

We don't. We let the mafia kill the lovers, so we're guaranteed to find the treacherous lover in the aftermath.
Why should we lynch the townie lovers? We'd just be doing the mafia's job for them.

[eldarad]

Good.
Now that we've sorted that out, what do our non-voters think?

[eldarad]

Well, so long and thanks for all the fish.

Man, I've always wanted to say that...

I'm off to Rome in about 90 minutes. I may miss the start of the Day when it restarts. I

don't

need replacing.

[eldarad]

I guess the only thing we need to know before we 100% clear ABR is to ask the 'real' doc to claim now.

In the absence of a claim, we can confirm ABR.
Even if this generates a fake claim, then we get a guaranteed scum in a 1 for 1 trade, rather than the 1 for 3 trade when we lynch a lover.

[eldarad]

Right...although if someone does claim, then we have a scum for certain. (Either ABR or the claimer). A 1 for 1 trade - doc for goon - is absolutely a good trade for town.
Furthermore, if the treacherous lover attempts to claim doc then the townie lover can step in.

If someone doesn't claim, then ABR is 100% confirmed doc.
It's a win-win situation, and completely defeats the WIFOM that the scum may have been trying to set up by not killing.

There is no reason for the real doc (if ABR is lying) to stay silent.

[eldarad]

Silence and dahill(in a lesser way), the speed on which you jumped on your horses with the lynching rope is noted.

It looked pretty damn OBVIOUS ABR was joking.

I didn't think it was obvious...This looks like an opportunity to jump on people for no reason. Also interesting how your attack on dahill is qualified somewhat.
Dahill does look scummy sometimes - although he played the lover claim really well I thought. I think I could see a Kravhen-dahill scumgroup.

vote Kravhen

It's a win-win situation, and completely defeats the WIFOM that the scum may have been trying to set up by not killing.

We can't know whether they didnt kill or just landed on doc protection... stop assuming =/

Everyone else is assuming that the scum hit someone who was protected, thus farside is confirmed.
That's a much more dangerous assumption.

[eldarad]

ABR, why aren't you voting for Kravhen?

[eldarad]

eldarad, why did you ask ABR why he wasn't voting for kravhen?

Because I wanted to know...
ABR seems to like wagons, I'm a bit surprised that he dislikes this one.

[eldarad]

What is that really the reason thers a wagon on me?
Kravhen-voters, please confirm.

see post 614 for my reasons.

[eldarad]

It still eludes me why Farside, presumably confirmed town, keeps being dumb with flameaxe accusations. But more interesting are those who followed the bandwagon on such an empty, worthless case.

Like who? Name names.

Also, if you want to respond to something, respond to the post I pointed you to, rather than ignoring it.

[eldarad]

armix, why did you vote for Kravhen?
What does "not progressing discussion" mean anyway?

[eldarad]

He was just babbling away instead of trying to combat the points people made about his behavior, aka stalling.

And I did not Vote him. I put an FOS on him that I intended to be a vote for all purposes except putting him at L-1.

You aren't doing anything to progress the discussion. Very scummy.

Unvote, FOS, may as well be Vote Kravhen

Claim please.

Oh. See, this looks like "vote Kravhen" to me. And I'm not the only one who thought so.

I do see your point about babbling and general railing against the wagon.
What he has never done - and I have tried to illicit this - is to answer the points I made.
I seem to recall a thread in Mafia Discussion about scum complaining for being lynched for the "wrong reasons" (rather than complaining about being lynched). Maybe it's relevant here.

[eldarad]

Meh. I'm tempted to just vote for armix on a whim and see what happens.

There's a 2 in 5 chance of him being scum, so that's not the worst odds we're ever going to get

unvote
vote armix

[eldarad]

I am dahill's lover. I claimed bloody ages ago.

Kravhen, there's no cop in this game you muppet...

[eldarad]

How have we managed to get up to page 29?! There doesn't seem to be 29 pages of content.
Anyway...I'm re-reading the thread, focussing on:
Coron (

Qman

)
Sethaniel
Kravhen (

Flameaxe

)
farside (

babygirl

)

Looking for links with Yoshi and armix (

Jex

) (and possibly silence, if the mafia decided to buddy up to the treacherous lover's lover)

~~~

Quick Day 1 Re-read

ABR, do you have a reason for liking Jex? If you can give me a good one, I'll vote for her.

This looked scummy at the time (almost 3 months ago!). It looks scummy now. But you know what? I'm not sure if it means he's scum.

Jexscum makes an early case based on Coron-farside interactions. Farside has since been NKed as town. And has since replaced into a different role. Which makes re-reading a bitch.

Yoshi finds "Jex, Korts/replacement, and Sethaniel most suspicious."
That's Yoshiscum linking Jexscum to Kortstown and Seth???
Yoshi'd next post explains the Jexhate, and asks Seth for an explanation. The Korts suspicion is dropped.

Seth claims vanilla townie. It's a very early claim. Sounds sincere, but I'm not sure.
Jex puts Yoshi at L-1. babygirl (now farside) hammers.

ABR - 3 (Flameaxe, Sethaniel, Yoshi)

3 people voting for the doc on Day 1. One of which is confirmed scum. Were there 2 scum on the ABR counterwagon Day 1? That doesn't seem unlikely.

[eldarad]

Kravhen, does that mean that you think I am wrong in saying that 2 scum were on ABR's wagon? Or do you think that Seth in scum?

[eldarad]

Just to clarify, I'm not scum.

Thanks for the clarification...

It's Friday tomorrow (yay!), and after that is the weekend. I'll read Day 2 then.

[eldarad]

Post 725 by Kravhen does look like a case on me, developed as a way of defending himself. Unfortunately for Kravhen, I am confirmed town.
Sethaniel makes a good observation:

That said, I do have to agree that #725 looks oddly like you're making a case against eldarad, whom we know is confirmed town. What is the idea behind that, anyway? Are you trying to discredit eldarad's reasoning?

My problem is Kraven has been so damn scummy. I will go back and find quote in a minute, but the scary thing in all this is I think he may not be the scum. I am serious when I say this.

Sigh. I agree with this too. Personally, I do my best scumhunting when I am under pressure as I respond to attacks. But even so, we're now effectively in the endgame, so it pays to be familiar with all the players' roles before you start attacking people.

I haven't quite got my head around post 749. I don't really see the logic in clearing Kravhen for the purposes of Today's lynch. Possibly this is a massive gambit from Seth, and he's hoping to turn it around Tomorrow once we lynch Coron Today. Possibly he is a townie.

Now I'm up-to-date I will re-read Day 2.

[eldarad]

Day 2

farside - in her original incarnation - is NK'ed.
I have an overwhelming urge to vote Korts, and do so. Korts begins the Seth wagon, as promised. babygirl (now farside) follows.
I make a case on Korts.
[quote="Jex, post 228]More to come later as I don't have much time to post right now but here's my starting thoughts:

Top of my scum list: Sethaniel, dahill, korts - will explain in a bit.

I'd also like to do a read of Flameaxe and Silence. My guess is that at least one of the scum were on the opposing wagon of ABR (Flameaxe and Sethaniel) and then Silence didn't vote which seems odd to me.[/quote]
On that scumlist there are 2 confirmed townies (Korts and dahill). Either Jexscum really did list three townies as her top scum targets or - more likely - she included one real scum in the list. Which means Seth is scum.
Silence reminds us of Seth's very early VT claim.
Seth wheels out the WIFOM defence, which no-one likes.
My case on Korts continues. dahill votes, but in a way I really didn't like (to the extent that I ended up voting for him later on)

I skimmed through most of Day 2. The next interesting bit is:

Anyway,

Pinky Finger of Suspicion

Sethaniel for post 535. Making a point of trying to do the math and then failing, seems to me like a filler post.

...which is very true, actually.

farside, in her second incarnation, is protected Night 2 and the scum kill fails.

Pretty short post considering how much I read, but I'm fairly confident that, of our 3 potential scum, there is real linkage between Jex and Seth. So:

vote Sethaniel

[eldarad]

I don't think Jexscum would have listed 3 townies as potential scum. For one thing, it means that she locks herself out of bussing her scumbuddy if it becomes necessary.
Also, given the Jex cannot realistically name her lover (silence) as scum, I think it is almost certain that her list of 3 includes her scumbuddy.
Later, she posts this:

I'll be honest...I made the dahill argument in hopes of getting this type of reaction out of it and am absolutely shocked that he got to L-1 so quickly. Korts, Sethaniel, elderad and ABR were the ones that jumped on the train.

Elderad gave a reason for his vote so doesn't say scum to me all that much at this point.

Korts switched his vote without saying another word. Way sketch since he had been so gung ho for Sethaniel all day.

Sethaniel didn't give reasoning for putting his vote on dahill which is sketch, however he's a little less sketch in my eyes than korts seeing as how he wasn't really advocating for anyone before that. Its still sketch to jump on a bandwagon with no reasoning though.

ABR....how do you really analyze anything ABR does. He's claimed doctor so as of now I have no reason to suspect him since no one has counterclaimed.

Therefore my top scum are Korts and Sethaniel so

unvote vote korts

So, she thinks your jump on the wagon is kinda scummy, but not that scummy. But ABR is doc and can't be attacked, I gave reasons and in any case I've been playing very pro-town all game.
So she points at you, but makes sure she lays into Korts.
Again, I simply do not believe that Jex took a hard look at 4 players she knew to be town and attacked 2 of them, thus completely ignoring her scumbuddy.

how does silence reminding us of my vt claim link me to jex?

how does a wifom defense link me to jex?

how does korts's fos on me link to jex?

Stop being obtuse.

Your very very early VT claim is odd.
Your WIFOM defence is scummy.
Your post "doing the maths" but not actually doing the maths IS a filler post. If the maths don't work, why did you post it? Creating the illusion of contributing content when you are not is scummy.

Therefore, you look scummy + link to Jexscum = you are scum

[eldarad]

Great! Let's lynch Seth then. We have his permission.

[eldarad]

farside, do you oppose a Seth lynch, or just prefer a Coron one?
Any reasons why you favour Coron over Seth as our scum?

[eldarad]

erm...yay?

Now that there's only Coron and farside left, it's down to you to repopulate the town. Off you go then...

I don't even remember what happened in this game, to be honest.