Open 674: Duck Duck Goose [Game Over]

[cassielle]

i dont see a scum!momo world as very likely, yeah

ooo is a big possibility, he never pushed hapa hard enough
rels could be scum with hapa still, but possibility decreasing
kidamn also, but further decreased (hes either scum or paranoid town, but town is naturally paranoid so the odds are more in favor of town!him than it sounds)

p much no one els eis scum with hawk and hapa. one or the other, sure, both never

like, im pretty sure fitz is town now, scum!fitz doesnt push hapa like that in the early game unless hes on some insane WIFOM shit
bv is never scum
im town (obv)
creature is townie-ish (rather: hes not his usual town self but hes never scum with those flips)
kop is town from hapas push on him

[Rels]

@Rels, the one thing stopping me from solidly townreading you is your reaction to Hap's cases on KidAmn, Fitz, and Kop D1. Can you explain what made you change your mind there?

I thought they were nice cases. And Hapa did the same thing last game I've played with him: he was super lackluster during half of D1, then came back with a nice case on a player nobody really suspected. In that game I didn't immediately townread him after that, but in retrospect I should have. So I thought it was a repeat of that. Link to what I'm talking about:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/5 ... age=25#483

[Rels]

Hapa coming back with a big case on KidDamn + fighting with KidDamn for a few posts and KidDamn getting emotionnal means they are very very likely to not be partners.

[BlackVoid]

Okay thanks, I'll look it over when I get a bit more time later on. What do you think of outoforder and Hap's initial interaction D1? outoforder did start out launching a push on Hap which if he doesn't bus would be an outlier. He kept at it until he went V/LA. When he got back, he started on the Fitz push and never pushed Hap again though so that was weird.

[cassielle]

Yeah, 1425 pinged me slightly when I read it but for different reasons. Telling Cass she was disruptive because she was pushing me before Hawk's flip feels manipulative given Cass wouldn't know that I had led a lynch on mafia and would just be arguing for what she thought was best.

its my experience that near-deadline switches onto a wagon that wasnt getting much traction before are very often mislynches
and its my experience that scum can pull that crap on d1 especially easily because no one has hard evidence

so in general i prefer to agree on a lynch d1 at about midday and then continue to scumhunt. d2 lynches are much easier to agree on like that because theres no shade being thrown about that d1 wagon, but you get the same amount of AI discussion and a lot of work on theory and attempting to gamesolve

given my experience your wagon on hawk was the worst wagon possible: mere hours till deadline, not very many online, stonewalling the obvious lynch, begging people to put votes down on hawk

so it was insanely good play on your part to hit that, yeah, and that makes that sort of lynch hitting scum very possible. i dont ever assume insanely good play, i assume merely average or below. thats why i reacted that way

[cassielle]

so i guess what i mean is: for the average player, your play was godawful there. for a really good player, it was the right move

and that shows

[Rels]

Okay thanks, I'll look it over when I get a bit more time later on. What do you think of outoforder and Hap's initial interaction D1? outoforder did start out launching a push on Hap which if he doesn't bus would be an outlier. He kept at it until he went V/LA. When he got back, he started on the Fitz push and never pushed Hap again though so that was weird.

Something he could do. As you said he spent the rest of the day being undecided. And I remember him unvoting Hapa for a weird reason actually that you might be remembering wrong.

UNVOTE: Hapahauli
Shit i have to reconsider this.

As town, I just post and worry about the consequences later. It's not always going to be consistent on the surface, because a lot of it is feelz, and it often moves too fast for me to justify every little thing I do.

Yes i had totally forgot about this. But when Rels brought up the game that ultimately brought me to this game i went back and read it again. That is true.
I am not entirely sure of you being town yet, but bugging you about something i feel like isn't gonna lead me anywhere is not productive rn. I mean if i continuously ask you for explanations you're not gonna be productive in case i am wrong. So please do your thing, we can discuss if you're scum or not later (for once, god bless two weeks dayphases:) ).

Yeah. That.
Althought he revoted him after I did:

And Hapa is still the best lynch. Just because we are not talking about him doesn't erase that.

I agree with this again.
In fact i agree with it this much:
VOTE: Hapahauli

OK yuo were right he then go into V/LA and unvoted Hapa after.

I am up to p27. Unfortunately the finnish wifi in trains is shit and i hought i would have a bit time yesterday despite hoing to visit friends outside my home country.

I am gonna finish catching up tonight and then gollow up on haps and i also got some questions for cassielle.

For now UNVOTE: hapahauli

[cassielle]

also interesting:

if ooo ends up red d3, it will be the third game on this site where only scum have said that my posts make no sense

3/4 is a good track record when it comes to choosing an early target, i might keep it

[Rels]

also interesting:

if ooo ends up red d3, it will be the third game on this site where only scum have said that my posts make no sense

3/4 is a good track record when it comes to choosing an early target, i might keep it

lol I also said that p:

[cassielle]

also interesting:

if ooo ends up red d3, it will be the third game on this site where only scum have said that my posts make no sense

3/4 is a good track record when it comes to choosing an early target, i might keep it

lol I also said that p:

nah you said the reasoning doesnt make sense, very different

one says the content is flawed
the other says the presentation is flawed

scum are appearance-conscious by nature, arguably thatd be the source of the tell

[Rels]

TBH your style is effective at getting reaction.

[cassielle]

TBH your style is effective at getting reaction.

thats /precisely/ why i use it

i get good reads from people reacting to me. watching them react to each other is also instructive, but watching them react to me is far moreso. i can tailor a post to get a certain kind of reaction, and i can tell if theyre going off of gut, going off of considered thought, or going off of pre-existing knowledge given enough of that

ive been slow to really grill the hell out of slots this game though, so my reads are all over the fucking place
things for me to improve upon in the future

[Rels]

alright boys and girls gonna go to sleep soon. If you still have a question shoot it now p:

[BlackVoid]

Yeah, before you go, what's your read on Kop?

[outoforder]

You're dumb Rels. After this game at least never try to claim you can read me. ^^

[outoforder]

BV please later on when you join another game pm me. It's been a pleasure playing with you.

[Creature]

Okay, momo or outoforder.

[Rels]

Yeah, before you go, what's your read on Kop?

Bad. But HAPA coming back and trying to sway you into voting him makes them somewhat unlikely partners.

[Rels]

You're dumb Rels. After this game at least never try to claim you can read me. ^^

Cause you didn't make 20 posts this game calling me scum right

[outoforder]

I must say i find it weird havingfitz treats me and hapa very differently when we both call him out for the same post of his.

[outoforder]

You're dumb Rels. After this game at least never try to claim you can read me. ^^

Cause you didn't make 20 posts this game calling me scum right

That's very reasonable in case i am still right and havingfitz is mafia.

[cassielle]

I must say i find it weird havingfitz treats me and hapa very differently when we both call him out for the same post of his.

there is no way hapa/fitz is a team

fitz was one of the first people to seriously push hapa hard, he made a big damn case about it and all

if youre scum you could at least try distracting town by way of reality instead of ridiculous nonsense
if youre town youre confbiased to the point of near uselessness

[Tenshii]

Votecount 2.7

[LYNCH] hapahauli - BlackVoid, Rels, Creature, havingfitz, KidAmn, Kop
[L-3] havingfitz - outoforder, momo, hapahauli

Not voting: cassielle

With 10 alive, a majority vote is decided with 6 players.

Deadline: Thread locked with ~8 days, 6 hours, and 30 minutes left in the day.

Spoiler: hapahauli Flip

hapahauli is a

Mafia Goon

[/spoiler]

Night 2 begins!

Night Deadline: (expired on 2017-03-12 17:35:00)

[Tenshii]

I apologize for not starting Day 3 promptly.

[Tenshii]

Spoiler: 0-2 Flips

Kop is a

Town 1-shot Paranoid Gun Owner

[/spoiler]

Day 3 Begins!

Votecount 3.0

Not voting: outoforder, Rels, BlackVoid, KidAmn, havingfitz, momo, cassielle, Creature

With 8 alive, a majority vote is decided with 5 players.

Deadline: (expired on 2017-03-27 10:45:00)