Open 671: Greater Idea - OVER

[alban]

Hi mod, VLA till 24th.

[alban]

Let's get this party started!

I'm Masons with RadiantCowbells and Lovers with Not_Mafia.

Crazy, I know.

VOTE: culted

This was a random stunt or you were hoping to achieve something more?

[alban]

Let's get this party started!

I'm Masons with RadiantCowbells and Lovers with Not_Mafia.

Crazy, I know.

VOTE: culted

Overreaction.

WTF.

If you are a town, you have exposed not 1 but 3 power roles. Also you hav indicated that there are only 1 extra lover and only 1 extra mason assuming that mason PT and lovers PM will tell the list of all members.

So @Radiant and @Not_Mafia, if you are town and know Grey is lying, expose him.

On the contrary, since there are multuple factions likely, each faction would be more interested to take out others before taking out townies. So scums are likely to claim citizens quite early. For now i hav eyes on you.

And for using a possible genuine reason as an excuse to make the RVS sound more like a serious vote,

VOTE: RadiantCowbells

[alban]

Let's get this party started!

I'm Masons with RadiantCowbells and Lovers with Not_Mafia.

Crazy, I know.

VOTE: culted

Overreaction.

WTF.

If you are a town, you have exposed not 1 but 3 power roles. Also you hav indicated that there are only 1 extra lover and only 1 extra mason assuming that mason PT and lovers PM will tell the list of all members.

So @Radiant and @Not_Mafia, if you are town and know Grey is lying, expose him.

On the contrary, since there are multuple factions likely, each faction would be more interested to take out others before taking out townies. So scums are likely to claim citizens quite early. For now i hav eyes on you.

And for using a possible genuine reason as an excuse to make the RVS sound more like a serious vote,

VOTE: RadiantCowbells

Ignore the easier post.
Bangthemafia, this was an over reaction.

[alban]

Earlier*

[alban]

Why did you RVS in this set-up RC?

Why not?

[alban]

Let's get this party started!

I'm Masons with RadiantCowbells and Lovers with Not_Mafia.

Crazy, I know.

VOTE: culted

WTF.

If you are a town, you have exposed not 1 but 3 power roles. Also you hav indicated that there are only 1 extra lover and only 1 extra mason assuming that mason PT and lovers PM will tell the list of all members.

So @Radiant and @Not_Mafia, if you are town and know Grey is lying, expose him.

On the contrary, since there are multuple factions likely, each faction would be more interested to take out others before taking out townies. So scums are likely to claim citizens quite early. For now i hav eyes on you.

And for using a possible genuine reason as an excuse to make the RVS sound more like a serious vote,

VOTE: RadiantCowbells

So you scold me for roleclaiming on the grounds that it outs three (presumably town) power roles... in a role madness game, no less... then illustrate why my claim doesn't prove alignment at all

in the same post.

VOTE: bangthemafia

Why aren't you pushing bangthemafia for an answer?

[alban]

I think everyone takes first few posts as not serious. Only you will know whether your posts were jocular or serious. Which means you should still try to get an answer from him.
That first post of yours.. that was for fun or some other motivation?

[alban]

Why aren't you pushing bangthemafia for an answer?

Why are you asking this question when bang hasn't even POSTED since my vote?

That's a circular argument. He is more likely to answer if you ask him something.
I don't think this is very important, so i will back off. But i think you should follow up with him.
I am more interested in knowing about your motivation behind your first post.

[alban]

Why aren't you pushing bangthemafia for an answer?

Why are you asking this question when bang hasn't even POSTED since my vote?

That's a circular argument. He is more likely to answer if you ask him something.
I don't think this is very important, so i will back off. But i think you should follow up with him.
I am more interested in knowing about your motivation behind your first post.

You don't know the definition of circulation argument.

You asked why I wasn't pushing for answers when the dude hasn't even HAD A CHANCE to show he was ignoring my vote in the first place.

Your question was bullshit.

There's something known as lurking. Which can be dealt with by questioning. But as said before, it's your shit to clean up.

However, i have given you SEVERAL CHANCES. Why aren't you saying anything about your first post? Was there an ulterior motive?

VOTE: -Grey-

[alban]

Nope. My role isn't less powerful. The revelation has zero impact.

It's a single word. The first part has something to do with where cowboys are found in movies. The second part has something to do with my profile pic.

Theatrical. I wonder why.

[alban]

Hey Charloux. Nice to see you again.

@grey I don't think it was shitty. I like being surprised.

My choice was pretty Wild....
.
.
.
wait for it.
.
.
.
... card.
It was wildcard. The only role whose revealation has zero impact.

This is so not you. The style I mean. I haven't read your games here to know if this is adapted specifically for ms. But all this drama is not you.

[alban]

You are assuming that I found you scummy.

My questioning you was out of curiosity to know if you had a scheme to lure the scum. And my vote was not coz I found you scummy, but coz you refused to answer. It served the purpose. You answered. UNVOTE:

[alban]

I didn't answer at all.

I asked questions you can't answer, so you're running away.

What did you ask me?

[alban]

My language would be different if i found you scummy. I wouldn't start by asking you why you aren't questioning bangthemafia. If anything, i found his reply to your post a lil suspicious.

You can say that you are not convinced. But you can't say i haven't answered. See 174.

[alban]

And this is a perception.

[alban]

Spade, why did you unvote?

[alban]

Hey!!!

Parrot role looked really interesting. Why would you discard that?

Am confident that if I reveal the role that I 'kept', the impact of that on the game would be zero.

I don't like this post. You are repeating something someone said, and then you are revealing your role even without anyone asking about it. Why?

[alban]

Nope. My role isn't less powerful. The revelation has zero impact.

It's a single word. The first part has something to do with where cowboys are found in movies. The second part has something to do with my profile pic.

And i get it that it has zero impact. But why would anyone announce it?

[alban]

I'd legit like to see a bangthemafia wagon.

The way he raged at me for my claim and then put out a flaccid RC vote, he was hoping to spark a wagon on me but didn't want the blowback of doing it himself.

That was my first thought too.

[alban]

I still didn't understand what your point is. I discarded alien prober, kept wildcard. Was given the new role when the game started.

You are saying your role is "Wild Card"

@grey and vaxkiller I dare you both to get me lynched today.

This can easily happen. Though I understand your exasoeration.

[alban]

Hey!!!

Parrot role looked really interesting. Why would you discard that?

Am confident that if I reveal the role that I 'kept', the impact of that on the game would be zero.

I don't like this post. You are repeating something someone said, and then you are revealing your role even without anyone asking about it. Why?

Ohh didnt know having the same opinion as someone else was a crime.

@alban the WHOLE point of it was that i WASN'T revealing my actual role. I was only revealing the choice I 'kept'.

Why? Cos it was fun that was why. But people have sucked the fun part out of it so much so that i regret it now.

Hmm..
That post read as if you are sucking up to people. Sorry if this further decreases your interest in the game.

[alban]

Spade, why did you unvote?

Though i find him annoying as hell, he appears as the only player wants to improve the game state.

Why aren't you trying to improve the 'game state'?

[alban]

Spade, why did you unvote?

Though i find him annoying as hell, he appears as the only player wants to improve the game state.

Also, please explain how he is doing that.

[alban]

I thought so too, but now I think he is pretending.

[alban]

That was about Grey.

[alban]

I still didn't understand what your point is. I discarded alien prober, kept wildcard. Was given the new role when the game started.

You are saying your role is "Wild Card"

@grey and vaxkiller I dare you both to get me lynched today.

This can easily happen. Though I understand your exasoeration.

That wasn't an actual dare. I was trying to convey that I have a role that can be easily verified as town.

But it appears that i was mistaken on the actual power of my role and cant be verified.

My role is weird. I win when town wins. But my power is anti-town. Dont know what to do with that.

You are again revealing your role.
P-edit: you slept the whole day?
And no, this is not my scumhunting. I am opinionating as i am reading the posts.

[alban]

I thought so too, but now I think he is pretending.

Could very well be. But the game just started. And am giving him the benefit of the doubt.

It's a bit coincidental and convenient that 'the benefit of the doubt' is happening now that he is suspecting others apart from you. You omgused him when he was building a case on you.

[alban]

His vote is on Not Mafia and his lynch pool consists of me and Bang. So yeah, you are not his priority anymore.

P-edit: exactly.

[alban]

Oooooooooohhh game set match. He is correct, Grey.
I dunno why but i think the interaction between you two is totally staged.

[alban]

Motherfucker, I'll votepark you out of spite of you don't shut the fuck up.

Is this how they vent anger in where to come from?
Stop swearing. I am serious.
VOTE: Grey

[alban]

Anger where you*

[alban]

I know. Not a thick skin.

[alban]

Motherfucker, I'll votepark you out of spite of you don't shut the fuck up.

Is this how they vent anger in where to come from?
Stop swearing. I am serious.
VOTE: Grey

So in your little worldview, scum tries to win by being assholes and pissing people off, right?

Voting me for any other excuse than thinking I am scum is basically admitting to playing to a scum wincon, so I'm sure you'll find some way to call me scum because I used a dirty word.

Let's hear it.

You have already heard it in 199 and 212. Your melodrama (considered effort and improvement by some) rings fake.
Much before I took objection to your language.

[alban]

Loll

[alban]

Why is it more fun to be a trivial town?

[alban]

That's what rc said about nm, if I remember correctly.

[alban]

mmmm Alban feels like he's backpedaling on page 7

Town
-Grey-, Spade_Ace
Gap
Charloux, Kop, Secret Agent Jin, Not_Mafia, davesaz - Null/unsorted line here
Vaxkiller
Bangthemafia, Alban
RadiantCowbells
Scum
Charles and Dave might be sorted at some time soon.

Please sum up reasons for your hierarchy, especially on me, Grey, Spade, Bang and RC.

I believe you must have mentioned these as you were posting, but it will be good to see them together in one post.

[alban]

First quote unnecessary.

[alban]

Town is shit.

VOTE: RC

Lynch NM tomorrow. bye.

I doubt town!RC would vote herself so early in the game and that too with just 3 previous votes.
So. Bye

VOTE: RC

She could be frustrated as a town. We have all been in her shoes.
Your vote on her is very opportunistic.

[alban]

Most people are not playing at all. It's frustrating.

[alban]

Gamma, I will reply to your question tonight.

[alban]

I am surprised you find her self-vote suspicious enough to vote for her when town!you has done it

so many times

out of frustration in our games. Bang can confirm a frustrated town!Spade's predisposition to self-vote.

Who knows what affiliation she is, but I find it suspicious that you won't give her that leeway and acknowledge that a town can be driven to self-vote.

[alban]

*He and *him in all my posts for RC.

[alban]

RC is like a child throwing a tantrum. There is no frustration involved, he just wants NM dead and he won't progress with his reads until he achieves this. So, one of them might have to go.

Why will a scum tunnel and then throw a tantrum by self-voting? It's a lose-lose situation.

[alban]

You talking as if it doesn't matter which of the two (if at all) may have to go, points to your indifference to finding out who they really are. Now that's anti-town, isn't it? GMEOY Charl

[alban]

I am surprised you find her self-vote suspicious enough to vote for her when town!you has done it

so many times

out of frustration in our games. Bang can confirm a frustrated town!Spade's predisposition to self-vote.

Who knows what affiliation she is, but I find it suspicious that you won't give her that leeway and acknowledge that a town can be driven to self-vote.

You must he confusing me with someone else. I have never selfvoted ever. And if bang confirms that, he is scum along with you.

I have never played with RC. But I doubt whether a person with his level of experience in MS would resort to such 'frustrated' displays especially when i dont find anything for them to be frustrated about.

RC hasn't even made a proper case against NM other than day NM might be a lyncher.

*i have never selfvoted ever as TOWN

That's a blatant lie or a case of bad memory. I don't understand why scum!you would withhold information like this especially when Bang is there to confirm this. Let's wait for Bang to show up. But wait, if he doesn't say what you want, he is a scum too? So, in essence whoever may disagree with you is scum.

I haven't ISO'd him to see if he was frustrated. I don't remember his game too. But assuming that he wasn't frustrated, and that town!RC will not self-vote out of frustration, it still goes against your conclusion that scum!RC will self-vote, especially given 'his level of experience' and 'when i dont find anything for them to be frustrated about'.

So, it's still an opportunistic vote.

P-edit: I see you have unvoted. But this is still very quite suspicious.

[alban]

First, since there are so many players from the earlier game: I

never ever lied

about the Avatar issue in 657. Yes, I was scum there. And I doled out a lot of shit. However, explanation given in the context of Spade's Avatar was absolutely the truth. You only have my word for it, except a scarce mention in the scum PT (http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 9#p8533449). Read the last couple of lines in

'Who submits the kill'

para.

Page 7 apparent backpedaling: There was none. I didn't suspect Grey till later. But on page 7, I didn't suspect him. I was in fact thinking of him as a town trying to bait scum in his initial post. I asked Grey to explain what was he trying to achieve. Multiple times. I was curious to understand how he was trying to bait the scum. I asked him

4 times

on page 7 alone. Ref. 152, 159, 164 and 167.

He wouldn't reply.

Rather he was replying to me all the time, without any reference to what I was asking. So to pressurise, I voted for him in 167. Pat came the reply from him in 169. Not that he answered my question, but at least he referred to it. That's all that pressure vote was gonna achieve[/color][/b], I realised that, and I removed it in 174.

I asked Grey two questions:

1. What was the motivation in claiming?:

This translates into understanding how was he hoping to trap the scum?

2. Why aren't you questioning Bang?:

Assuming that the motivation was to trap a scum (no Kop, it

wasn't a joke

. I thought that too, but Grey himself said much later that that post was meant to see who bites the bait), and you got someone (in Bang) who did, why are you letting him off easily? I have seen it happening so many times that the original thoughts and motivations of players get lost in the deluge of posts. Should I have worded it differently? Maybe. Maybe I should have asked him politely, and not asked him 'why' coz that questions his motivation. And I didn't doubt his motivation anyway (at least not then). What I meant was, time to deliver what you indirectly promised in the first post.

Grey's melodrama

in 169 which continued thereafter in multiple posts, was totally unnecessary.

[alban]

Charloux's scum but I'm not doing jack while there's this many votes on me.

Agree with you about Charl, but dont agree with you about NM.

[alban]

Vax, the thought is more or less the same as you. I don't trust his claim and find gamma culpable by association.

[alban]

Okay that makes sense

No it doesn't.

He was bitching at me for not pressuring a slot that hadn't even posted since my vote on them.

He's full of shit.

So it's logic vs the lack of it. Ignorant and arrogant. Lethal combination.

[alban]

I am surprised you find her self-vote suspicious enough to vote for her when town!you has done it

so many times

out of frustration in our games. Bang can confirm a frustrated town!Spade's predisposition to self-vote.

Who knows what affiliation she is, but I find it suspicious that you won't give her that leeway and acknowledge that a town can be driven to self-vote.

You must he confusing me with someone else. I have never selfvoted ever. And if bang confirms that, he is scum along with you.

I have never played with RC. But I doubt whether a person with his level of experience in MS would resort to such 'frustrated' displays especially when i dont find anything for them to be frustrated about.

RC hasn't even made a proper case against NM other than day NM might be a lyncher.

*i have never selfvoted ever as TOWN

That's a blatant lie or a case of bad memory. I don't understand why scum!you would withhold information like this especially when Bang is there to confirm this. Let's wait for Bang to show up. But wait, if he doesn't say what you want, he is a scum too? So, in essence whoever may disagree with you is scum.

I haven't ISO'd him to see if he was frustrated. I don't remember his game too. But assuming that he wasn't frustrated, and that town!RC will not self-vote out of frustration, it still goes against your conclusion that scum!RC will self-vote, especially given 'his level of experience' and 'when i dont find anything for them to be frustrated about'.

So, it's still an opportunistic vote.

P-edit: I see you have unvoted. But this is still very quite suspicious.

Can you back the point up that it's a blatant lie, or do we have to wait for Bangthemafia to come?

Can't do it. Whatsapp based games.

[alban]

Charloux's scum but I'm not doing jack while there's this many votes on me.

Agree with you about Charl, but dont agree with you about NM.

Agree why?

Also, associations day 1?

Explained in 358. It doesn't matter to Charl whom to lynch between RC and NM (355).

[alban]

2. Why aren't you questioning Bang?:

Assuming that the motivation was to trap a scum (no Kop, it

wasn't a joke

. I thought that too, but Grey himself said much later that that post was meant to see who bites the bait), and you got someone (in Bang) who did, why are you letting him off easily? I have seen it happening so many times that the original thoughts and motivations of players get lost in the deluge of posts. Should I have worded it differently? Maybe. Maybe I should have asked him politely, and not asked him 'why' coz that questions his motivation. And I didn't doubt his motivation anyway (at least not then). What I meant was, time to deliver what you indirectly promised in the first post.

You seem to not get what grey is trying to say. He voted for bang in 18. Bang didn't join the game again until 228.

If a player isn't responding the only thing you can do is ask other people to join the wagon which he was did in 40 and 41. Then the wildcard stuff happened. He kept indirectly pushing bang even in 44 and 52. He didnt change his vote until 121.

So yes your question on why he wasn't questioning Bang

doesn't make sense

.

You and Grey could be the kind of players who wait for people to get in the game on their own accord. If I find someone scummy and they are awol, I will keep questioning them, hoping to build up enough pressure (especially if they are lurking) and for them to feel compelled to return to the game.

I rather you did not take up cudgels on behalf of other players, especially explain other people's stands for them. Even if a small possibility according to you, that's still a finite possibility that you are wrong about Grey being a townie. Hearing a defence from him (even if unlikely to be given) could have given me more clarity on him.

[alban]

Charl is known to carry out such stunts as scum. He did that in our last game as scum partners, and I think he is generally trying to take boldness as scum to another level. Playing in a way that's so obviously scummy that people will clear your slot. Plus, his earlier statement about not bothering about who between rc and nm is lynchec was scummy too.
But I still wanna hear more from him. Why of what he did. He always makes cryptic posts. So don't hammer rn.

[alban]

Great

[alban]

Read all the posts.
Will post tonight.

[alban]

My reads so far. More for myself so that I don't have to re-read:
Town
Vax (reasonable, logical), NM (looks like in a tvt with RC)

Null
Bang (mixed reactions on his posts), Dave, Kop & Gamma (no clear reads on them), Grey (illogical, selective blindness towards Spade's scumtells. scumleaning)

Scum
Spade (very opportunistic. especially with buddying and jumping the votes wherever the wagon is going)

VOTE: Spade

Will elaborate in 24 hours.

Pedit: You are an idiot, Grey.

[alban]

You not analysing the

glaring inconsistencies

in Spade's behaviour is the main reason why I am scumleaning on you right now. Your scumhunt is appearing only selectively 'correct'. You are affronting

selectively

, and letting others go scot-free. The natural response when faced with an aggressive maniac like you is that people become defensive and forget what they were asking you in the first place. You have always escaped (in this game) answering questions by posing a tirade on the questioner, creating melodrama, or ignoring and deflecting it entirely by questioning someone else.

To summarise my case on you (and by association on Spade):
1. On day 1, I asked you a question. You

evaded

it multiple times. You got back to me only after I voted for you. You didn't even bother to answer. You just created drama. Have already mentioned this in 375.

2. 533: Towards the end of day 1, I made a comment of a few lines. Your response?

TL;DR

.

3. On day 2, 559, 619: Bang has already asked you a question multiple times, and you haven't even bothered to answer. You are talking about him to others like Vax, Spade and Gamma, but you

aren't answering

him.

4. 565: You didn't read Bang's posts. But you

voted for Spade

for not reading Bang's post 561. And on top of everything, you are declaring that as if that bravado is something that only a townie can project.

5.

Spade's behaviour

around Charl's wagon and beginning of day 2 doesn't sit right with me. I was gonna elaborate on this tonight. But let's briefly go over it.
- He votes for me in 395. Read his reason. Coz I am suspecting you and I didn't give links to the posts.
- He doesn't say anything for next 90 posts. Resurfaces in 485 in which he votes for Charl. No questions asked, no clarifications sought. Is it a coincidence that this is immediately after your vote on Charl in 484? Another thing. He votes first. And then he asks a question. If he is not sure, he should wait for the answer. If he is sure, he shouldn't feel the need to ask the question. My guess, he is keeping a door open to escape the wagon in case it doesn't reach majority.
- His next post is on day 2, an innocuous question in 549. Directed to you. By this time, this must be clear to you that he is trying desperately to buddy you. You vote for Dave in 540. Spade shheps you in 553.

6. So yeah,

Spade sheeps you multiple times

(votes or contemplating votes on Charl, Dave, Bang, me). When you ask him, he says he trusts you. Knowing Spade in real life, let me tell you this. Spade has a mind of his own. He would not say that he sheeped someone coz he believes their reads. So his behaviour is quite unlike himself.
That's on him. Forget that. If someone sheeps you like that, you should question them back. Why don't you ask him why does he think you are right? You have time to go through my p-edits, but you don't have brains to see through his probable agenda? So yeah, something is appearing more and more

fake in your scumhunting

.

And yet I have put you in the null zone coz I think there's a possibility that

you could be a VI

.

At this point in the game, given your style of play and the way you are tunnelled about certain people including me, I don't think it even matters. You are most likely to say TL;DR and skip this post. On my end, if this continues, I am most likely to vote for you (from the null pile) if it came to that.

[alban]

589 is not that surprising by itself, but just 10 posts after 579, it's definitely surprising. He puts you and me in the same category as scums. And then something happens, and he appeals to you, but not to me. I am wondering what was it? Was it coz you were posting and I was absent since day 2. Dunno. He should explain that though.

I am confused about Spade coz the more I think, the more I think this is not at all how he plays. My overall impression of Spade is this (and this is not necessarily negative): I think he has researched a lot about how to play on mafiascum and his style is also shaped a lot by the games he has played here. I also think he is playing a lot by the book, trying to play more as is expected of a player and less as himself, and has generated a style for himself that is markedly different from the way he used to play with us (which I think was way too effective than the way he is playing now). That means I (and you too I am guessing) have no handle on him. It's possible that that's the reason I am finding him scummy.

On the other hand, there are still many points about him this game that have nothing to do with style, and more to do with the content and intent of his posts. For example, starting with his initial vote on RC (for his self-vote) in 346, trying to implicate me in 353 for suggesting RC could be frustrated, the language of denial of self-voting in 359, and blatantly sheeping Grey throughout. He finding me scummy coz of the reasons he mentions in the earlier posts as well as in 393 and 394 are too simplistic for him. Just as I know him, he knows my game.

This is why I am confused about him. But I am still voting for him coz I would expect more from a player of his level, regardless of whether he is scum or town. For someone to playing a markedly different (and simplistic) game, there's more possibility of him being a scum than town.

[alban]

Courtesy? Rich coming from you, who refused to engage in a conversation till a few days back. Leaving aside the content of your posts, your language is courteous? You can't make random statements about courtesy to suit your narrative. Everyone knows that I tried it with you, you refused to show it to me, so now idfc. Stop playing the victim here. tbh, it doesn't matter. Get to the game. Let's get the job done.

[alban]

Mention reasons for your top scum and townreads.

[alban]

Howz it that everyone who has claimed so far has come up with fantastic roles that are impossible to verify? Gamma, Spade and Grey are all lying imo.

Especially, Spade's claim. The melodrama in the beginning makes sense now. You wanted to post something that everyone will remember you by and which you could also revisit in future in case your roleclaim needed to be verified. You could just say, 'I had told you so long back'. Which you actually did cite, when someone asked you why didn't you claim in the beginning.

Gamma, why did you claim now? There was no pressure to reveal. In fact, if you are a survivor, you were doing a pretty good job till the revelation. Also, why would you give up a mild investigative role and want to be a survivor? If the idea was to play alone or a small faction, why did you give up now?

Did anyone notice Dave's strategy over Spade wagon (jumping onto it in the middle of sickness, abandoning it as soon as Spade claimed and then disappearing again)? Damn suspicious.

[alban]

Gamma, why did you claim now? There was no pressure to reveal. In fact, if you are a survivor, you were doing a pretty good job till the revelation. Also, why would you give up a mild investigative role and want to be a survivor? If the idea was to play alone or a small faction, why did you give up now?

My guess is he chose lyncher.

If a lyncher's target is killed via means other than lynch, the lyncher is converted into a Survivor.

Even if he changed alignment, why reveal role at this point in the game? He was doing a good job as a survivor. I don't know where he goes from here now that he has claimed. And how does one know if he is telling the truth. For all of Spade's liabilities, he played it correctly. That part gives him some credence. You and Gamma have revealed your roles at random points in the game.
So, two questions for you Gamma.
1. Why would you discard Consp Theorist for Survivor?
2. Why did you reveal your role now?

[alban]

I make a statement. You disagree with it. Give a reason and clear my ignorance.
Seriously, how difficult is that?

[alban]

Answers are still better than defensive posts.

And as if you yield to questions. You need people ready to suck up to you, and when that's established, you hold the court. You don't need and want me questioning you.

[alban]

Do you find anything odd in Gamma's claim? In context of the timing of it and the card he retained for the card he discarded? For me, doesn't fit. It's better you answer it only after gamma has answered it himself. But think about it.

[alban]

Spade,
Not ambiguous. Still suspect you. Your claim appears fake. My vote stays on you.

[alban]

He hasn't yet replied to your case on him. I will wait for that before making up my mind. At this point, Spade is my top suspect.

[alban]

L-2 is pressure.

[alban]

We are stalling. Take a decision and stick to it. I think everyone needs to present their list. Either make compromises, or go for no lynch. Waiting another week for some miracle to happen is a passive strategy. Not comfy with that.

My reads right now are (claims not withstanding coz they all seem fake):

Town
Vax (come back to the game)

Null
-

Scum/other faction lean
Not Mafia (opportunistic, deliberate absence, prodging),
Bang (too defensive, less contribution),
Grey (more interested in the lynch than the reasons for lynching),
Dave (Spade's wagon, pops up whenever mentioned, more interested in status quo than moving the game fwd),
Gamma (fake claim, discarded card),
Kop (deliberate absence, more interested in status quo than moving the game fwd)

Scum/Other factions
Spade (opportunistic, buddying and sheeping, interrogating others, divulging less, too defensive, less contribution even with so many posts, behavioural change from earlier games).

[alban]

ok

[alban]

Not laughing at you. It's just funny that I unintentionally annoyed you and you are swearing at me for that

[alban]

Stop repeating. Already said enough number of times.

[alban]

Conflict of interest.

[alban]

@alban gamma didnt claim yet.

Didn't he say he is a survivor?

[alban]

Grey, now you are buddying with Bang? Interesting.

This game has three alive players. Grey, Bang and me. 3rd day, and I still don't have a proper read on Gamma, NM and Kop. Post more.

Mod, how about carrying fwd prod times from day 2?
Gamma hasn't posted in 24 hours and Kop hasn't in 48 hours prior to the deadline. Please prod them if possible.

[alban]

VOTE: Kop
Pressurise them with votes.

[alban]

Very busy. Just skimmed through. No conclusive thoughts. Lots of questions though. Mostly regarding veracity. Will get back to it tomorrow.

[alban]

Sorry. I have been waiting for time to write it in an elaborate manner. But that's not happening. So will summarise my thoughts quickly.
1. NM could be lying. Even if he is correct about Vax, he has no incentive to tell the truth about his faction.
2. NM may still have a point about not lynching him. If we kill him, game has a high possibility of getting over in the coming night. I have not thought about it, but the only decent chance for the town might be to keep the non-town factions equally strong, and succeed hoping that crossfire may prolong the game for town. Need to think more. Preoccupied right now.
Maybe these points are already covered. I have not read the long posts some of you have put in. Will do that soon.

[alban]

My reads:
Grey, Bang
Vax
NM, Kop, Carnelian

[alban]

That faction won which was the least active, and received constant prods useless.

It was so obvious kop and gamma were scums, especially on day 3. I wish I was a townie. Being a scum, I couldn't be too vocal about it.

And what do I say about my own faction? People played without thinking. Self annihilation, unnecessary self votes, and bad choice of night kills. I kept saying we need to kill gamma, kop or vax.

Sore grapes, but truth too.

[alban]

Sour*

[alban]

Not scums. Other faction*

[alban]

Grey's judas flip was the highlight of the game though. What a web of lie. Well played.

[alban]

Spade, you and I should stop playing together

[alban]

Vax, what a game on day 3!! But not happy with your activity level overall.

[alban]

Mod PT is a great read. Especially the last page where they were predicting the winner.

[alban]

Should have accepted Mafia Cupid. The only reason I didn't coz I was banking on being considered a town based on my discard. Which helped to a certain extent. But wiser now. Will not let MC go ever again.

[alban]

Alban, your tunnelling on me was same as the last time u were scum. Should have put more pressure on you.

That was my cover. 'Am I stupid enough to play with the same style as the same alignment?'
I had originally planned to completely avoid framing you this game, but those early posts by you were too easily frame-able to ignore. The role you got was cherry on top.

[alban]

Bang, I was going to claim JK, if it came to that

About your point about believing Grey: Till day 2, I was sure that Grey would be our lynch target on day 3, since one could never verify his claim. I was gonna pitch it to the city. On night 2, however, there was a surprise entry to the Scum PT, guess who

I was so sure that you guys will catch my U-turn regarding Grey. I was completely antagonistic till day 2, and ignored him on day 3. But thankfully I wasn't caught. It would have been difficult for me to explain that, which is where JK claim (suggested by Grey) would have been useful. I was planning to claim that both nights, I JK'd Grey.

[alban]

Role madness games are so much more fun than regular ones!
Going back to normal games is way too tame now.

[alban]

Grey, for any of your future greatest idea games as a mod, consider this a pre-in

[alban]

I have turned into an addict after this game.

[alban]

What beats me is why you guys gave up so easily? Grey and alban cud hav persuaded people not to lynch NM. And NM self hammered!!! U guys were equal (3:3) on day 3!!

Beats me too. Was facepalming all the way. Read the scum PT.

[alban]

There's something called Worst Idea too?
Howz it different from greatest?

[alban]

I didn't. Breadcrumbing like that is not at all visible. It could be any of the 100s of lines in any of the 1200 posts in a game such as this.

I was myself thinking of breadcrumbing in a post and point to it later to claim innocence. But didn't do it.

[alban]

A game like worst idea could be fun if we stop thinking about the wincon. Just playing for the sake of fun.