Newbie 1768: Party Mafia - Game over!

[bowdown]

Not voting Nancy.

Taking note of how easy it is to derail EL without a claim.

Why the heck are you not?

[bowdown]

It's not very common, but Town thought

they

caught a scumslip, which aren't very common either.

Hey look I found another one!

[JaeReed]

I'm kind of weirded out by how dramatically the votes have changed in so little time. I fully expected to come back to see myself lynched. Is this a common thing or is this particular to the game?

It's not common (or shouldn't be) and I would advise against flashwagoning close to the deadline as a general rule because that rarely hits scum. (Sometimes even hits PRs such as here to the flip here)

That said, I do believe nancy slipped knowledge of the setup more than she should know, and I don't believe she's our last PR (bowdown also pointed out supporting evidence to my initial evaluation of how a jailkeeper would handle that).

[GuiltyLion]

yeah, given that nancy is not the jailkeeper, I think that's a slip

intent to hammer nancy

I'm not sure how much time we really need left for today but I'll do it in either 2-3 hours before I go to bed or ~10ish or so hours when I wake up. So everyone get your last words in now if you got em

[nancy]

nancy, we don't have time at this stage to flashwagon. There's a reason I defaulted to one of Revan/EL. Please choose whichever of these you feel is more likely to flip scum at this stage.

If you're maf it seems pretty convenient to townread and defend the one person (EL) who is most easily directed, and to lead a flashwagon on me when I "scumslip". Your play in leading the wagon has been uncharacteristicly aggressive and it comes when Lemon was on the verge of being killed. Motive: either saving your partner or saving the person who would be a valuable tool down the track, and getting rid of a player (nancy) who shares thinking styles more with the two people who seem to be opposing you most strongly (Titus and Revan). Your meta read of Titus isn't really valuable because it could easily be you as mafia biding your time and laying the groundwork for a future push.

[GuiltyLion]

This is a scumcase. It's fake, illogical reasoning. They're all huge assumptions independently, and being used together in a way that no townie would push with genuine intentions. If we're flash wagoning anyone today, it's Titus.

Guilty... True or false:

Titus makes assumptions and tunnels based off said assumptions as either alignment.

on this, pushing a contrived case is something I find universally scummy regardless of who the player is. Someone advocating for what looks to be a faked scumread is just about the best scumtell there is - almost by definition, as it is what separates town and scum. Maybe Titus behaves this way as town, but if she's town here I'm not seeing any indicators of it yet.

And I've definitely seen her tunnel as scum for nitpicky semantic bs, in Town of Helen she got into a long drawn out battle with (town)SilverWolf over SW calling her "scum" in a past game when she(Titus) was actually a "Serial Killer" in that game, and the whole argument was reachy and contrived (I linked here to the dual ISO). This thing about EL "bussing" me is pinging me the same way, like she saw some awkward phrasing she could riff on and then coasted on that for today, when the actual argument underneath it is incredibly weak.

[nancy]

It's not very common, but Town thought

they

caught a scumslip, which aren't very common either.

Hey look I found another one!

Congrats! You struck gold! Though it's actually indicative of me thinking from an objective, third person-y perspective.

[nancy]

Or rather, from the perspective of a dead woman.

[nancy]

yeah, given that nancy is not the jailkeeper, I think that's a slip

intent to hammer nancy

Your argument is just as flimsy as you claim Titus' to be. If I were mafia, I would have claimed Jailkeeper. No question. This whole bandwagon against me is an opportunisitic farce, and you're all selectively interpreting evidence to suit your blind push of me.

[JaeReed]

@GL Fair enough. My current thought is that Titus not pushing to advance the gamestate in any way means she's scum. Even with being busy irl I feel like she would have made a decent post to get content flowing rather than sit on her haunches with the EL scumread and push. She hasn't tried to real-time engage as much as I feel she normally would. I just really don't know how much of that is RL being busy to know if I did pick up her scumtell. It could be that it's a mixture of alignment and RL being busy, or it could just be that RL is busy fullstop and there wouldn't have been a real difference on that front regardless because of it.

[JaeReed]

yeah, given that nancy is not the jailkeeper, I think that's a slip

intent to hammer nancy

Your argument is just as flimsy as you claim Titus' to be. If I were mafia, I would have claimed Jailkeeper. No question. This whole bandwagon against me is an opportunisitic farce, and you're all selectively interpreting evidence to suit your blind push of me.

If you're town (which I very much doubt at this stage but we'll see with the flip either way) the best thing you can do right now is try to find who you believe is interacting with your wagon in a non-genuine way. Give a reads list based off that, with a summary of why the reads are that way for people to look back over the next day. Everyone on your wagon can't be scum. There's 2 scum in the game at most. Find the ones you believe are genuine in their push, and the ones you believe are being opportunistic.

The way I've seen it you've slipped then really messily tried to cover your tracks.
If you're town then that was a really unfortunate use of wording and I promise I'll look into your reads if I survive to tomorrow to see if I agree/disagree on any of those with the flip.

As it stands I just don't think you're town, though.

[nancy]

After going through Titus' ISO, I don't find your case against her convincing. She has been passively scumhunting all game and has apparently not seen anything to change her opinion of Lemon or GL. That's called conviction, not scum. People have at various points disliked her for tunneling Lemon since early in the game, but they've also disliked me for adapting too swiftly to new information (not just recently), so it seems like people are just picking and choosing what they want to pay attention to. Anything outside the norm is scummy.

Revan you were initially scumreading Jae - can you elaborate on that please? If not today, tomorrow. I dislike their recent behavior and at times I also got pings from them but I didn't think much of them because most of their content seemed so pro-town.

[bowdown]

Nancy, regardless of how you try to spin it, you posted from a perspective of knowing a jailkeeper exists when the only people that could know that are scum and the actual jailkeeper, which you aren't.

[JaeReed]

She has been passively scumhunting

Titus doesn't passively scumhunt unless she's scum or busy irl.

[nancy]

If you're town (which I very much doubt at this stage but we'll see with the flip either way) the best thing you can do right now is try to find who you believe is interacting with your wagon in a non-genuine way. Give a reads list based off that, with a summary of why the reads are that way for people to look back over the next day. Everyone on your wagon can't be scum. There's 2 scum in the game at most. Find the ones you believe are genuine in their push, and the ones you believe are being opportunistic.

I've been doing that, and I think one of them is you. The other would be bowdown, who I've had a weak scumread on for most of the game. I've never voiced that read because I keep second guessing myself into thinking that I just dislike their personality/posting style, but maybe there is something to it. Revan is an obvious one to look into. I stand by my refusal to join that wagon based off only a portion of a day's worth of content when - I'm sorry I don't know how to say this any other way - his ego is making him seem automatically scummy, but his content absolutely sucks. GL is careful and smart and his hammer doesn't imply anything about his motives or alignment, but I think he's scum.

In order of strongest to weakest read:
Scum: GL, Agent Sparkles, Revan
Not-town: bowdown, Titus, Jae
Town: tojam, EL

If GL isn't scum, Titus is very likely scum. I believe I have a good read on Titus because I knew that she wouldn't vote me and she didn't.

[nancy]

By the way, do I have to wait for this game to end before rejoining queue?

[JaeReed]

Once you're dead in this game you can rejoin the queue.

[JaeReed]

(sorry if I sound short I just realized I didn't do the work I had to do today so I'm rushing to do that <3 nothing against you)

[nancy]

I probably shouldn't leave out EL from the opportunist list, since her vote was essentially a self-save, even though I was never going to hammer her (she didn't know this, of course, so I can't blame her).

[nancy]

Thanks! And thanks again for the IC-ness, I learned loads and had lots of fun, especially the past few pages or so!

[nancy]

Not voting Nancy.

Taking note of how easy it is to derail EL without a claim.

Why the heck are you not?

I can't speak for her but I'd say it's because she has a good enough read on me to disbelieve that it could've been a genuine scumslip, and because her primary scumread may have slipped knowledge of me being town.

[nancy]

Also, she isn't blind. See 533.

[nancy]

Have to admit, it is kind of amusing to get lynched for a non-slip after spending all game giving Lemon the benefit of the doubt despite all of her apparent slips.

[nancy]

Not to say that it isn't my own fault for landing me here. It's facepalm-worthy mistake if I ever saw one.

[nancy]

Sorry if I gave you sads for not TRing you, Titus.