dybeck (2) - originality, vollkan
Korlash (1) - dybeck
Not voting: Lucienne, shaft.ed, AlyG, Elias_the_Thief, Korlash, Gemelli
This is what I was assuming at the time, but it really can be read either way. And with originality's game quality to date, I wouldn't leave anything to cryptic.vollkan wrote: In effect, what I was trying to was to tell Orig not to NK in a slightly cryptic way so that I did not have to get rid of the uncertainty element. I knew that it was seen as anti-town of me, but I thought if I maintained that attitude I might be able to stop Orig NKing whilst still being able to keep the facade of it being "uncertain".
So after a big post from Korlash (which was his first actual informative one) you don't even acknowledge it and go ahead and vote him. I have a HOS on you and to me you seem to be the most scummy person in the game sodybeck wrote:OK well let's lynch Korlash. In any event we get originality tomorrow.shaft.ed wrote:No I'm saying if you are so sure he is mafia then you should also account for the fact he is certain to be NK'd.
unvote, vote: Korlash
There's 1 small mistake there, Vollkan is listed voting Dybeck but is also listed as not voting.Streeflo wrote:Day 2, Votecount #28!
dybeck (2) - originality, vollkan
Korlash (1) - dybeck
Not voting: Lucienne, vollkan, shaft.ed, AlyG, Elias_the_Thief, Korlash
With9alive it takes5to lynch!
Day 2 Deadline: November 1
sorry... I need to remember to not take my jokes so far as to actually break rules... Can I just get a warning this time or something? No need to kill me for this right... All fixed now... *hides under bed*Korlash wrote:Disclaimer: Oman takes no credit for the above excuses posted in the preceding. It is the sole right and property of Crap-Logic Korlash and due to his inability to logically get his point across should be ignored. Any advice given by the above named source should be ignored. posts by the above named are illegal in Maine, Wisconsin, Georgia, Europe, and half of the Indian Ocean. If you witness any posts of this nature or know of someone who has you are strongly advised to lock yourself in your room with nothing but a can of Redbull and a bag of Doritos and call your local authorities and tell them "Someone stole my toilet and I have nothing to go on..."
Ad hominem is argument to the person and it is a logical fallacy.Korlash wrote: On a side note: what is the exact meaning of Ad Hominem? I think I tried to look it up in the Wiki once and either didn't find it or have forgot it... I know it means something along the lines of flaming or a personal attack... I just want to know the limitations, and bordering lines to it... also exact definition ><'
Congraturations, you just earned a patented *HEADDESK*!Korlash wrote: So theres my look into Oman's brain.... I would not be surprised if none of this convinces you about anything, and I would not be against votes based on Oman's actions, but I will right now tell you I am town, and logically, with three vanilla's down... I mean...I think my avy says it all...>.> <.<
Korlash, it is not role-fishing for me to tell you not to claim vanilla. Any player with a grain of sense would do exactly the same thing.Korlash wrote: And be careful... I don't think now is a good time to start any sort of role "fishing" now, be it to fish my role, warn me not to say it, or even to try and confuse the mafia by throwing them off the scent... I claimed town, then said I was hungry for ice cream... Leave it at that until I get caught up... Unless your trying to start a WIFOM situation here that only forces me to abandon my reading and instead put all effort into the here and now...
I bolded 3 of the damn things in that quoted bit alone. An ellipsis is one of these ... <---- Those three bloody dotsKorlash wrote: And define Ellipsises...do you mean Parenthesis? Cause if not I have no idea what your talking about...heck even now I still don't...
So much less cluttered and easier to read.Korlash with proper punctuation wrote: And define ellipsises. Do you mean parenthesis? Cause if not I have no idea what you're talking about. Heck, even now I still don't.
Korlash's avatar has an icecream in it as "100% vanilla" but he made no mention of icecream in his post. He just said he was town and then referred to his avatar, which said vanilla.How you got that from his comment, I'm really not sure. Maybe this was a joke or something, but if not...wow.
Look, I fixed it. Doesn't it look prettyKorlash wrote:Actually I said " I didn't say anything... stop looking at me... "
And be careful. I don't think now is a good time to start any sort of role "fishing" now, be it to fish my role, warn me not to say it, or even to try and confuse the mafia by throwing them off the scent.I claimed town, then said I was hungry for ice cream. Leave it at that until I get caught up. Unless your trying to start a WIFOM situation here that only forces me to abandon my reading and instead put all effort into the here and now.
And define Ellipsises.do you mean Parenthesis? Cause if not I have no idea what your talking about. heck even now I still don't.
No. The best defence would be for you to try and rationalise things or, failing that, to just admit you don't have a clue.Korlash wrote: look, Me claiming town is pretty much the only defense I have for Oman's bad playing, so thats what I did......................................
A) You are setting up a false dichotomy here. You do not need to claim anything. A claim is not a defence and you were in no peril of being lynched.Korlash wrote: And claiming vanilla is THE BEST THING i can do as town,
A) I don't have to give up my actual role. (Provided I have one)
B) It means I am less likely to be night killed by the vig and/or mafia, meaning if I actually do have a role it is not in jeopardy.
and C) It is a very hard thing for anyone, town or mafia, to disprove.
No it is not. As a rule, you should never claim vanilla prematurely. Why?Korlash wrote: And whether you like it or not, you bringing up how me claiming vanilla is bad for town is the first step to make me either actually claim, or admit to having a power role.
Claiming is NOT a defence. Furthermore, prematurely claiming vanilla is not a viable strategy in any event because of what I said above.Korlash wrote: If you were actually protown there vollkan you shouldn't be so worried about someone claiming vanilla. We are down 3 vanilla already, thus, theoretically, every single one of us town left could have a power role. (Provided the mafia also got one) Stop trying to kill off a viable defense for an unknown power role.
Why would you want us to stop number-crunching?Korlash wrote: And if it bothers you guys THAT much I will agree to stop with my trademark dots if you never do another number crunching again. Is it worth it to you? Think carefully here... (Just to piss you off <3)
I feel I have fully answered his question, Sorta. And, Provided Vollkan does not come at me again with another lame(To me at least) reason/attack against me I will not be posting until I have fully caught up! YAY!Originality wrote:Why bring it up at all? You were in absolutely zero pressure.
AlyG, can you articulate your reason for voting Dybeck more clearly? Saying "you seem to be the most scummy person in the game" doesn't really explain WHAT about his behavior you find scummy. With a deadline, it is becoming more and more important for all of us to explain our thinking.AlyG wrote:So after a big post from Korlash (which was his first actual informative one) you don't even acknowledge it and go ahead and vote him. I have a HOS on you and to me you seem to be the most scummy person in the game soVote: Dybeck
First off, thank you for responding to the questions I raised in post 1055. As you noted, it's hard to imagine what was going on in Oman's head when he made the arguments he did, but I commend you for at least not dodging my request and having an honest go at it.Korlash wrote:...
Vollkan, I think you are strongly overreacting here.Vollkan wrote:Congraturations, you just earned a patented *HEADDESK*!
Why on earth did you just claim vanilla?! You do realise that if you are town all you are doing is flagging to the mafia precisely where the power roles are likely to be, because you have just told them that you are not one.
Please re-read what you wrote in post 1107. I understand your frustration, but you don't need to resort to fallacious arguments yourself.vollkan wrote:Why would you want us to stop number-crunching?
*sigh* It seems Oman has been replaced by a village idiot.
1) So in short, because I laid a trap against Oman you now suspect me? Is this all an OMGUS thing?Korlash wrote: SCENARIO ONE:
First, I just made an argument about Vollkan's "AlyG blah blah Oman blah blah scum would act blah blah" Excuse he made. Seeing as how his point was against Oman (Me) I feel that me, trying out what he calls a "strategy" against him, would make sense in me understanding the way it worked and if there was any viable claim in its use. If this is the case, I think I would have gotten the exact response I would have wanted, which is Vollkan to respond to it. Now I find this scenario hard to believe, or do I? Who knows. I won't say one way or another.
Main points I expect Vollkan to come back at me over this:
1) "It's nothing like what I did!"
2) "I never called it a strategy, I said 'Technique'! stop putting words in my mouth scum!"
3) "How would you know I would be the one to respond? Your just trying to make an excuse!"
4) "My responce is not scummy! It is blah blah not protown blah blah what you did... etc!"
Prerecorded response to each of these:
1) I could argue similarities and you could argue differences all day, big point, if you just throw this scenario out the window without thinking it over for a second, you prove (TO ME!) that what you did was BS and thus I will not just simply forget about what you did to Oman (Me) and I will not drop my case against you.
2) I swap similar words sometimes, sue me. Defense and excuse can sometimes (Key word) mean the same thing. I also think technique and strategy are similar enough to be used to replace each other once. I am not trying to put words in your mouth (even though I am trying to predict the future ^^)
3) How did you know Oman was going to respond? Perhaps it was a trap to catch anyone and you just fell into it. *shrugs*
4) I have not said my views on your actual response (in this post at least) thus I do not claim it to be scummy or pro town.
This one is still insane, but I at least know what you are generally talking about: the vanilla claim thing.SCENARIO TWO:
Perhaps, I (as town, call me newb if you want. call me stupid, call me a free thinker, call me on my cell phone) did not think that claiming town was a bad thing. I mean, don't we all claim town, without even saying it? Who would not say they were town? "I'm not town! Don't lynch me!" probably won't fly. Also, Note that I did see claiming vanilla as a not so good thing, thus I did not come right out and say it. I hinted at it, I also hinted at the same time to being a power role, yet you conveniently left that part out. So, all in all, all I did was tell you guys I am town so that you might go easy on me over what Oman did pre-me.
Main points I expect Vollkan to come back at me over this:
1) "How can you not see that claiming vanilla is a bad thing?"
2) "If you thought claiming vanilla was not a good thing why did you do it?"
3) "Where did you claim power role?"
4) "Why even claim anything? You were not in danger/under pressure!"
Prerecorded response to each of these:
1) well, while it may bring pressure towards me and a vote or two, no town would lynch someone for claiming vanilla townie. So by doing it you are mostly guaranteed to not be NKed AND not be lynched. So I think, coming in right now, not being lynched or NKed would benefit me so I can catch up.
2) I didn't do it. I only said "my avy says it all." Where in that sentence do you see the words "I, am, or vanilla townie"?
3) "...and logically, with three vanilla's down..." To me, this should set off red flags. Logically, three VTs down, more chance to be a power role! Does me not claiming a power role incriminate me as much as me not claiming Vanilla townie Vollkan? Should I just go ahead and claim Mafia and let you and your scum partners win? [/sarcasm]
4) I claimed town for two reasons. 1) I had just come from trying to defend/excuse Oman's stupidity. So I wanted to clarify that I was actually town. And 2) it opened up me "not claiming vanilla or power role" leaving me to agree with whatever Oman said he was. (Such as if on page 30 he said he was a vanilla townie I would not have contradicted that, while if he had said he was a power role, hinted he was, or actually claimed something, Doc/Cop/RB/Vig etc, I could continue that.)
And I know someone will bring it up so don't take that as me saying "I am mafia and I needed to know what lie Oman said!!!!"
Don't tell me a vanilla townie wouldn't hint at a power role so he had a chance of being the NK instead of the actual role. At the same time don't tell me a power role would not say vanilla if asked/forced to claim.
Call me whatever the hell you like; I make a point of never being offended by anything.Korlash wrote: Another Scenario?
Perhaps I am just a village idiot as you called me, you moron, (I can take a few insults, but expect them back eventually. You don't make friends by name calling! Tsk tsk!) and made a simple newbie mistake!
No. I am fully confident what I did was in no way anti-town or pro-mafia. It may not be full blownBEST FOR TOWN, but it is a GOOD FOR ME in the end.And, while I care about the town, I am not reading 43 F***ing pages just to be F***ing NKed by the damn Vig.
Main points I expect Vollkan to come back at me over this:
1) "How is this GOOD FOR YOU?"
2) Why would you do anything that was not best for town?"
3) "So you are not afraid to be killed by the mafia?"
4) "How does this make you a sure win for not being lynched?"
Prerecorded response to each of these:
1) Its good on these points:
a) I can confirm whatever Oman said, b) I have officially claimed "Town!" If you tell me how this is bad(As in either a scum tell, or a surefire way to be lynched/NKed) for me I will vote myself. and c) I already told you how I THINK it makes it less likely I am killed.
2) Because, sometimes, it is a lot better to sacrifice the RB/Vig to protect someone else. Not to mention I am modest and think I am best for town being left alive.
3) No. I have no fear that you will kill me tonight Vollkan. I think you would much rather kill off Orig. and if not that, I guarantee you would kill off Shaft.ed just in case the VIg kills one of your partners You look completely innocent tomorrow. Killing me tonight would stop me being a good candidate for a lynch tomorrow.
4) You seem to think its suspicious yet no vote. Orig agrees yet no vote. Elias didn't even comment on it so no vote. See a pattern? This one little detail did not net me a single vote. Thus, no pressure, no fear of a lynch, and above all some active discussion so you all get to know me. I hate unknowns and, even with all of Oman's comments, I am still somewhat unknown to you guys as I play differently, and do not have all the answers he did.
I know what you are saying, but he said:Gemelli wrote: Vollkan, I think you are strongly overreacting here.
If you had bolded the portion of the sentence that read "I am town, and logically, with three vanilla's down..." you could have just as easily made the case that he was implying a power role. I mean, the avatar includes the words "100% vanilla," but it also includes a picture of an evil demon thing waggling its eyebrows. I detect a certain amount of sarcasm from the combination.
and the avatar says vanilla.Korlash wrote: I think my avy says it all.
The proper response would simply be to say: "I did not claim vanilla. You may have misunderstood"And while I would agree with you that it is NOT rolefishing to tell someone not to claim vanilla, asking the question "why did you claim vanilla?" when he hadn't done so IS rolefishing a bit, of the "have you stopped beating your wife" school. It's almost impossible to answer your question without giving away some information about whether you are vanilla or not.
I wasn't using ad hom. I attacked each of his arguments from a purely logical basis. I just called him VI at the end because I thought his logic was so wonky at points.Gemelli wrote: Please re-read what you wrote in post 1107. I understand your frustration, but you don't need to resort to fallacious arguments yourself.