Mini 1787: Peruvian Nightclub Mafia (Game End!)

[Bins]

Went to spontnuoeus party
Am very drunk
Tmmr
Gimme 12 h max cause hangover

[Bins]

Wait when is do

[Bins]

Oh we good I felt like k was slacking but I'm on pay pt

[Dunnstral]

Am very drunk

We can tell

[Dunnstral]

Alright let me explain my vote: It's not like it was a super strong scum read on bins anyway, and now I've also got a scum read on H_A, someone said they needed more pressure and I agreed with that and so voted them

[Dunnstral]

Also bins isn't really giving much to work with right now so I'm planning to take a look at them again later while I currently intend to push on H_A

Hey since I'm on the topic of comprehension, I'd like everyone to

comprehend

that my general and social ineptness is what makes me the easy lynch and scum will capitalize on this.

kthx

Um???? You did that to yourself buddy you're still not CONTRIBUTING to town here

What do you think of:

Jake
Jaack
H_A
Bins
Floof
Keyser
toolenduso
xyzzy

[Robert2424]

There is quite an objective difference to how mafia and town answer the question to be straight up asked if they are scum.

Town are statistically significantly more likely to just give a simple "no" answer. Scum usually give a more complicated answer or deflect with something. Zach kind of gave a combination of the two.

"statistically"? Felt like a fruitless question/unproductive pressure to me - I can't see how you can read alignment in a response to that question.

Good questions = informative answers

.

When Robert ends up being scum, you will see I'm right. Lucky for you, now my top two suspects are Zach and Robert.

@Zach, are you mafia?

this is spam post at best? Really dude? At least I made it on your list though.

What an entrance to your final return to the game.

So wait, I put you on my potentail scum list, suddenly I'm scummy. Right.

I literally face palmed at some peoples reactions.

Least Dunn explained his/her vote.

[Jake from State Farm]

I misread 229; other than that, as far as I can tell, your entire thing is being belligerent and doing as little as possible to directly contribute to the game as possible, all while occasionally contradicting yourself and telling anyone who disagrees with you that they're stupid. I think that, in the context of how you're acting in this particular game, that you're scum.

Well I don't think this is an accurate statement of my play at all but you are certainly entitled to your opinion.

[Jake from State Farm]

@zyzz - since you like asking questions so much, here's one for you. What are your thoughts about Robert saying he doesn't trust me and he needs to keep his eye on me when in fact by his own admittance the last time we played I was able to catch him (unfortunately not lynch him) as scum? Do you think if Robert was town he wouldn't have any reason to worry about me?

[Jake from State Farm]

wow robert actually made a good point. I decided to fact check and now I want to ask HA a question.

@HA, can you explain why you think it's possible mafia is taking advantage of robert's early vote like you mention in these 2 quotes

irst off, I found it so strange that so many people read Jack so early on as scum or town based on his vote in post 13 against Robert. I think anyone voting him as an easy vote at the beginning makes for possible scum players, (Keyser, tool, floof for example), not that I'm saying that one of them HAVE to be scum.

I don't have any evidence that Jaack is town, and for me I feel like a mafia would be more likely to take advantage of Robert's weak vote at the beginning

to Robert is scum.

Please show me what caused that 180 because while you never actually say robert is town, it is very much implied you think he could be if you are looking for scum on his early voters.

[toolenduso]

^Wow I did not notice that. Interested in hearing the answer to that as well.

[toolenduso]

Also kind of interested in this:

VOTE: H_A

Actually thinking about it this needs to post more.

Actually
UNVOTE:
VOTE: heuristically_alone

Ira is more scummy, but I would like to see some pressure on this player.

@floof: why specifically go after H_A to get him to post more? He's not among the least active players in this game. Why not try to get somebody like Robert to post more?
@jaack: Why did you want pressure on H_A specifically?

[toolenduso]

Also this seems like a contradiction to me:

I must prepare myself for Jake. For he may try to take revenge upon me from a previous game.

I dont even remember playing with you

Thank you, and I imagine you wouldn't. I beat you being mafia with AJ. it was awhile back.

You thought he would try to take revenge based on a previous game, but you're not surprised he doesn't remember that game?

[Jake from State Farm]

^Wow I did not notice that. Interested in hearing the answer to that as well.

See I can be useful when I want to be

[Jake from State Farm]

Also this seems like a contradiction to me:

I must prepare myself for Jake. For he may try to take revenge upon me from a previous game.

I dont even remember playing with you

Thank you, and I imagine you wouldn't. I beat you being mafia with AJ. it was awhile back.

You thought he would try to take revenge based on a previous game, but you're not surprised he doesn't remember that game?

and let's not forget about the fact that if he were town WHY would he be worried about me this game. If anyone can answer that question with rationale that actually makes sense (robert you can try also if you want) i'd love to hear it.

if robert is town, he should be relieved to be on the same side as me if he thinks I am a good player (thank you for the kind words btw)

[toolenduso]

Yeah that too.

[toolenduso]

@floof: why specifically go after H_A to get him to post more? He's not among the least active players in this game. Why not try to get somebody like Robert to post more?

OK scratch that, I thought H_A was more active than he is, but I checked the activity log and by post count H_A is in like the bottom five posters. So specifically I want to ask you, floof, why you wanted to get H_A to post more but not Robert or xyzzy?

[Jaack]

@jaack: Why did you want pressure on H_A specifically?

H_A is my number 2 scumspect after ira, and I didn't feel as if my vote on ira was accomplishing much (there's only so many times I can hear him call himself town).

[Jake from State Farm]

@jaack: Why did you want pressure on H_A specifically?

H_A is my number 2 scumspect after ira, and I didn't feel as if my vote on ira was accomplishing much (there's only so many times I can hear him call himself town).

So I was looking at the reasons you gave for HA and I kind of have some issues with it.

h_a - Do not like his reads in 281 like at all. Says he doesn't have enough content to judge me fully (?), but feels everyone on my wagon is scummy. Reads to me like someone who knows I'm town and wants to leave as many option open in terms of a future lynch on me. (Keyser saw a similar thing in 311) If he doesn't participate on hypothetical future wagon, then he can point back here and say 'told you so' while also not committing to a full town read on me. Also don't like how he doesn't give reads on ira, dunn, or keyser in that post. He did give a read on ira earlier so I can kind of understand leaving that one out, but leaving out dunn and keyser is weird, as neither are exactly inactive, and h_a had even interacted with dunn significantly before that. If one of {h_a, dunn, keyser} flips scum its probably worth going back and checking out the other two based on this post alone, even though I'm townreading the other two players here pretty hard.

Looking over this.

First - His reads and your reads aren't that different. I mean sure there are some people he has scummy and you have as town and vice versa but it looks like a bunch of people you both sort of agree on. I am not sure why him having different reads than you makes him suspicious. Clearly not everyone is going to share your viewpoint so scum reading him for that is just plain stupid. here is what I put together comparing reads between the 2. The bolded names are where the reads are the same or pretty close to each other which makes me wonder if Jaack actually compared ha's reads to his own.

Spoiler:

Tyler - Town (Jaack & HA)

Keyser - Town (jack) scum (ha)

Tyler - both town
Dunn - both town
xyzzy - both town

zach - Town (Jack) Scum (HA)
tool - town (jack) slightly suspicious (ha)
Bins - Decently town (jack) - leaning scum (ha)

JFSF - both townish

Floof - Don't really give a read but I sense scummy vibes from Jack, leaning scum (ha)

Robert - neither really give a strong read but both seem mildly suspicious

ira - scum (jack) town (ira)

Second - I am not sure what about his post makes you think he knows you are town, but he did say he has you in his town pile so i don't see why you have such an issue with him looking at the people voting you for scum. Seems like you should be doing the same thing yourself (no idea if you actually did or not)

Third - yes Kaiser made the same mistake as you did and it actually looks like you just stole Keyser's thought about him knowing you are town. There is absolutely nothing wrong with somebody thinking a player is town and questioning people on that wagon. Keyser calls it conf. bias but so what, people do it all the time and there isn't really anything suspicious about it. How either of you come to the conclusion that he somehow KNOWS you are town is beyond me.

Fourth -

Also don't like how he doesn't give reads on ira, dunn, or keyser in that post.

why didn't you ask him for them? Anyways as you mention he does give a read on ira previously (town). he also gave a read on Dunn (town), and also for keyser (while he doesn't actually come out and say town or scum, he basically adds on to Dunn's read of Keyser from post 82 where dunn says he thinks keyser is mafia. I believe he also thinks keyser is mafia because he provides reasons for why dunn has come to that conclusion.

So in a nutshell - You and ha have very similar reads, I see nothing that makes it seem like he KNOWS you are town but has you as a town read, and he does basically give a read on everyone.

[Jake from State Farm]

(1) do you think I am useless/spam/non-productive/active-lurking posting?
(2) Highlight any posts where you think heuristically_alone could think I am useless/spam/non-productive/active-lurking posting.

1. You do have a couple of useless/spam/non-productive/active-lurking posts but not as much as ha would lead people to believe
2. http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 3#p7865133 is really the only one but i don't find it suspicious.

ha's view of your posts definitely seems off base.

[Jake from State Farm]

I will say the more reading I do, my town read on ha has gone away. I'm not ready to call him scum but he definitely gives me some concern

[heuristically_alone]

wow robert actually made a good point. I decided to fact check and now I want to ask HA a question.

@HA, can you explain why you think it's possible mafia is taking advantage of robert's early vote like you mention in these 2 quotes

irst off, I found it so strange that so many people read Jack so early on as scum or town based on his vote in post 13 against Robert. I think anyone voting him as an easy vote at the beginning makes for possible scum players, (Keyser, tool, floof for example), not that I'm saying that one of them HAVE to be scum.

I don't have any evidence that Jaack is town, and for me I feel like a mafia would be more likely to take advantage of Robert's weak vote at the beginning

to Robert is scum.

Please show me what caused that 180 because while you never actually say robert is town, it is very much implied you think he could be if you are looking for scum on his early voters.

I feel like it would be more of a mafic tactic than town, since a town putting a vote at that point is rather pointless and absolutely no evidence to back it up. That's why I felt like for a player voting because of Robert's early vote, it is a greatest chance they are mafia by my book. Granted, I make assumptions sometimes based off of what I would do in situations if I were mafia or town, and it's true that not all think alike.

@Robert I already explained my reasoning for why I added you to my scum board, and if you were paying attention you would see that it has nothing to do with what you think of me, but of how you answered my question when I asked if you were mafia. Now, because of how hard you're pushing back, it just increases my suspicions of you.

[Jake from State Farm]

I just looked through your iso and don't see any post where you mention his response to your question. I find it interesting that you would do a 180 just because his response so could you please link me to that explanation and go into detail why his response was scummy vs a townie response.

Thanks

[Zachstralkita]

383 (Zachstralkita) - what do you think about me and my vote on you?

You 8 pages from now as you're being lynched day 1: "If I was mafia do you really think I'd be attracting all this attention to myself!"

Sorry. He already called it. I can't say it.

[toolenduso]

I feel like it would be more of a mafic tactic than town, since a town putting a vote at that point is rather pointless and absolutely no evidence to back it up. That's why I felt like for a player voting because of Robert's early vote, it is a greatest chance they are mafia by my book.

OK, but earlier you defended Jaack by saying that you don't understand why Jaack's vote on Robert made Jaack scum. Then you come back later and say that voting Robert for what he did is scummy. So what changed your mind?