YagamiLight - 4 (Setael, Jordan, Nelly, Shanba)
Elias - 1 (Gorckat)
Gorckat - 1 (Ckd)
9 alive, 5 to lynch!
DEADLINE:
ok, lets see what happens...he is on my scum dar (above hermit and gorckat)..the fact that neither has voted for him makes me wonder..Setael wrote:I think if Yagami was Town he would be fighting harder to not get lynched, rather than sitting silent at -1 and waiting for someone to hammer.
Doing some rereading, Gorckat is pretty high on my list, just above hermit now....going to back to reread a bit and adjust my scum ratings to reflect Day 2.Nelly632 wrote:In a previous post I stated that I believed SPAG & Hermit to be scum & at this point we have lynched SPAG & he turned out to be scum. So on this note with the game being rushed at a fast pace I am going to go with my previous thoughts & vote for who I suspected before...
Vote: Hermit
I very much agree with this entire post, and if it is true then Elias is scum.vollkan, Post 239 wrote:Yes, it screws you[Elias]if you are town; but you are ignoring the fact that Oman favoured keeping you (and Para) alive. Oman could very easily have rejected my "plan" and then criticised me for making such a ridiculous suggestion. Instead, he approved it. There was no advantage in Oman approving the plan if Elias, Para and Pulse are all pro-town. Indeed, in such a case there was only disadvantage insofar as he would look scummy for supporting it. The only means by which supporting the plan would be desirable would be in keeping his scum buddies alive. Otherwise, he would be doing something ridiculously scummy when it offered him no advantages and substantial disadvantages and opportunity costs (the opportunity being the chance to criticise me).
vollkan, Post 245 wrote:Oman brings Pulse into it (I never mentioned Pulse, nor did anyone else) and says Pulse looks more pro-town than Elias (implying strongly that he favoured Pulse's vigging). It would be very odd for Oman to do this if both Pulse and Elias are pro-town or if Pulse is scum and Elias is torn. This only makes sense if Oman is trying to protect Elias.
I think he knew there was no way to explain his way out of that. Sounds like scum trying to get the subject dropped. I really don't think oman would've given 3 Townie names on his list. I think he gave 2 town names (me and Para) and one scum - Elias, last on the list. If Elias is scum, it definitely makes sense that he'd much rather have seen Pulse (now me) vigged than Elias.Elias, Post 246 wrote:Again, I have no idea why he would say that. All I know is that I am town and he was scum. I dont know what else to say about this particular piece of evidence.
**Elias says this with only 2 votes. Seems extreme.Elias, post 251 wrote:Well great. Nelly is now voting for me. If you guys do decide to lynch me, tell me before hammering so that I may claim and give my final suspicions, and a final defense.
One scum is down - he's not going to want to bus. Makes sense if Elias is scum for him to not draw any attention to SPAG.Elias, post 284 wrote:SPAG: All his posts have given me a town feel, though no one post stands out. Official Opinion: Town
*sounds like scum trying to wriggle out of the spotlightElias, post 310 wrote:Anyways, what I'm trying to say here, is will you people lay off me? I've been responding to your attacks all day, I'm probably the second biggest poster and contributor to the town, and I've posted my thoughts on every single player, something no one else has done. I assure you that if you lynch me I will turn up protown.
I don't see how Elias could've really not understood the case on SPAG/Yagami. I think he was hoping to distract from the Yagami wagon and push attention back to Hermit. Elias has mentioned several times how good he is as scum and his perfect record. If he is scum, it's going to be tough to pin him down and I could be wrong, but I really think Elias is the other scum.Elias, Post 665 wrote:This really isnt fair. I dont really understand what the case against him [Yagami/SPAG] is, but I dont think that he's town. I've already presented strong cases against Hermit in the past, and I dont see why you expect me to vote for yagami, and i dont see why you act as if its wierd when i dont.
I would appreciate if you actually like, you know, quoted these and explained why you think theyre scummy. I cant defend myself if you dont explain why I'm scummy.Setael wrote:
223, 231, 232, 236, 293, 302, 303, 308 – Elias scummy
Alright. Youre claiming that Oman has no advantage from doing this. Dont you see this is completely wifom? If everyone thinks that, thinks im scum because of it, and mislynches me, theres his advantage right there. I mean, I could easily combat what youre saying with "itd be dumb for scum to put his buddy last, because it would get his buddy lynched" but cant you see how thats equally wifom? The whole fucking list is wifom.Setael wrote: I still think Oman’s list is key.I very much agree with this entire post, and if it is true then Elias is scum.vollkan, Post 239 wrote:Yes, it screws you[Elias]if you are town; but you are ignoring the fact that Oman favoured keeping you (and Para) alive. Oman could very easily have rejected my "plan" and then criticised me for making such a ridiculous suggestion. Instead, he approved it. There was no advantage in Oman approving the plan if Elias, Para and Pulse are all pro-town. Indeed, in such a case there was only disadvantage insofar as he would look scummy for supporting it. The only means by which supporting the plan would be desirable would be in keeping his scum buddies alive. Otherwise, he would be doing something ridiculously scummy when it offered him no advantages and substantial disadvantages and opportunity costs (the opportunity being the chance to criticise me).
Again, wifom.Setael wrote:vollkan, Post 245 wrote:Oman brings Pulse into it (I never mentioned Pulse, nor did anyone else) and says Pulse looks more pro-town than Elias (implying strongly that he favoured Pulse's vigging). It would be very odd for Oman to do this if both Pulse and Elias are pro-town or if Pulse is scum and Elias is torn. This only makes sense if Oman is trying to protect Elias.
I really,Setael wrote:I think he knew there was no way to explain his way out of that. Sounds like scum trying to get the subject dropped. I really don't think oman would've given 3 Townie names on his list. I think he gave 2 town names (me and Para) and one scum - Elias, last on the list. If Elias is scum, it definitely makes sense that he'd much rather have seen Pulse (now me) vigged than Elias.Elias, Post 246 wrote:Again, I have no idea why he would say that. All I know is that I am town and he was scum. I dont know what else to say about this particular piece of evidence.
Various people were agreeing with Vollkan, and Vollkan was still making massive post attacks on me. Not extreme at all. You get Vollkan on your ass when youre town and we'll see how you respond.Setael wrote:**Elias says this with only 2 votes. Seems extreme.Elias, post 251 wrote:Well great. Nelly is now voting for me. If you guys do decide to lynch me, tell me before hammering so that I may claim and give my final suspicions, and a final defense.
I wasnt really focused on the people that I didnt think were scum when I made that post, ie, I didnt really reread him. Nothing stuck out to me as scummySetael wrote:One scum is down - he's not going to want to bus. Makes sense if Elias is scum for him to not draw any attention to SPAG.Elias, post 284 wrote:SPAG: All his posts have given me a town feel, though no one post stands out. Official Opinion: Town
ahem? I was very active in attacking hermit day 2, and then attacking para later on. Also, posts I have made: 108. Posts Set has made: 17. posts hermit has made: 37. posts gork has made: 65. posts nelly has made: 33. I dont care that youre a replacement, shut the fuck up because I've been one of the most active players all game.Setael wrote: Elias was very active Day 1, posting a lot when suspected – if he had continued it could be seen as townie, but he’s so much more quiet when not under the microscope that it looks scummy. I think townies would remain consistently active and helpful (or unhelpful) but not be such opposite extremes as Elias has been.
How is pushing this a scumtell? No one has explained it to me yet.Setael wrote: Also, after vollkan day-vigged Oman, Elias had downplayed how much he had pushed that vollkan might be scum – para calls him on it in post 308.
If you were town in my situation, wouldnt you be just as likely to be trying to wriggle out of the spotlight as I am? I am town. My death constitutes a near LYLO situation tomorrow. I have been in the spotlight all game, and the fact that I keep responding to everyones BS arguments is the reason I'm alive.Setael wrote:*sounds like scum trying to wriggle out of the spotlightElias, post 310 wrote:Anyways, what I'm trying to say here, is will you people lay off me? I've been responding to your attacks all day, I'm probably the second biggest poster and contributor to the town, and I've posted my thoughts on every single player, something no one else has done. I assure you that if you lynch me I will turn up protown.
So, now I'm scum because of a playstyle difference? I didnt believe that what he did was a scumtell. Also, if you remember, para was a fucking townie. Why in hell would I downplay tells against a townie when he was already the leading lynch candidate if I was scum?Setael wrote: Then in Post 427 when Para made something which seemed to be a pretty obvious scum tell, Elias' only response on it was "I dont think its too strong a tell." This is much more likely to be said by scum who knows Para is Town rather than by Town who is unsure.
Huh?Setael wrote: Gorckat’s post 608 re: Elias makes perfect sense.
Because no one ever really represented the case besides saying "OMG HES LURKING OMG LYNCH LYNCH LYNCH" as far as I saw.Setael wrote:I don't see how Elias could've really not understood the case on SPAG/Yagami.Elias, Post 665 wrote:This really isnt fair. I dont really understand what the case against him [Yagami/SPAG] is, but I dont think that he's town. I've already presented strong cases against Hermit in the past, and I dont see why you expect me to vote for yagami, and i dont see why you act as if its wierd when i dont.
Think is the key word here. This doesnt make any sense because I tried to steer the Para (proven townie) wagon to Hermit too. All this shows is that I genuinely think that Hermit is scum.Setael wrote: I think he was hoping to distract from the Yagami wagon and push attention back to Hermit.
I've also mentioned how I'm very bad at town and thus its easy for me to get caught in binds a lot. I also like to defend myself, its really the reason I play this game. So how do you know whether this is a case of me being bad town, or good scum? Thats right; you dont.Setael wrote: Elias has mentioned several times how good he is as scum and his perfect record.
So most of your suspicions on me are based on an interpretation of an entirely wifom issue? honestly, its like, the definition of wifom. its like this:TheHermit wrote: Elias is still my front-runner for suspicion, mostly for the reasons that Setael went into concerning vollkan's dissection of Oman's list. His Nelly vote may have a townie explanation, but it's hard to defend against what seems to be scum sticking their neck out on his behalf.
Elias wrote:Because no one ever really represented the case besides saying "OMG HES LURKING OMG LYNCH LYNCH LYNCH" as far as I saw.Setael wrote:I don't see how Elias could've really not understood the case on SPAG/Yagami.Elias, Post 665 wrote: This really isnt fair. I dont really understand what the case against him [Yagami/SPAG] is, but I dont think that he's town. I've already presented strong cases against Hermit in the past, and I dont see why you expect me to vote for yagami, and i dont see why you act as if its wierd when i dont.
Why did you never address that post or refer to it at all? Did you just decide to ignore it? Or did you think it was a bad case? Can you show me where you ever acknowledged this post? It seems to me that you totally avoided addressing SPAG's scummy play, and even now you're downplaying the case on him. I think you were hoping you could get the vote moved off of SPAG and onto Hermit so you tried to trivialize the SPAG case and didn't bother to address it. I can't see any reason for you to have disregarded how scummy SPAG had been if you were Town. The only way it makes sense is if you are SPAG's scumbuddy.Setael wrote:At 8:39 am:
SPAG wrote:
I would like to hear from PX himself before i place a vote.
Less than an hour later, WITHOUT waiting for Para to say anything, SPAG hammers.
Why didn't you wait to hear from him? There was plenty of time until deadline. Under the circumstances, any Townie would’ve waited to hear from Para. Let me guess… you’re going to say it was because I suspected you for removing your vote. Unfortunately for you, everyone here recognized that as perfectly reasonable suspicion. Vollkan agreed that it was a good strategy to wait to see what those who'd removed their votes would do, and you now know that he was a mason.
The ONLY thing that changed between your expression of desire to wait for Para and your hammer was that Vollkan said he thought you had shown a reasonable level of caution. As such, you hammered safe in the knowledge that Vollkan (a confirmed mason) believed you had shown reasonable caution to that point; coupled with Vollkan's apparent belief that the time was ripe for a lynch.
Let me stress this: You hammered despite declaring that you wouldn't when the only thing that had changed was that Vollkan had posted so as to potentially redeem you. This utterly reeks of someone who pre-empts that they are lynching a townie since it gives you an easy way out.
I think you knew Para would come up town because you’re mafia, so you removed your vote knowing he was going to die with or without your help. Then, when I pointed out that it looked fishy, you jumped on it saying I was pushing you into voting for him. That coupled with vollkan telling you it wouldn’t look suspicious, made you feel safe hammering Para, knowing that you could throw the blame on me when he came up Town. In fact, you said as much:
Quote:
However, if he turned out town it will particularly show out Setael, who seemed to push me and gorckat into voting for him on suspision that we were protecting a fellow scumbuddy, and those two votes would secure his lynch. Also vollkan and CKD have been dominant in wanting to lynch him.
This sounds an awful lot like someone who knows Para is going to come up Town, and is setting up his arguments for the next day.
vote: SPAG
if you think Elias is town, why does he need a partner?Shanba wrote:I still reckon Elias is town, and am firmly opposed to his lynch today. I need to finish my analyses, as I'm not really sure who might be his partner. Will re-read his posts.
Setael wrote: So... did you miss THIS post?yes, actually.Setael wrote:At 8:39 am:
SPAG wrote:
I would like to hear from PX himself before i place a vote.
Less than an hour later, WITHOUT waiting for Para to say anything, SPAG hammers.
Why didn't you wait to hear from him? There was plenty of time until deadline. Under the circumstances, any Townie would’ve waited to hear from Para. Let me guess… you’re going to say it was because I suspected you for removing your vote. Unfortunately for you, everyone here recognized that as perfectly reasonable suspicion. Vollkan agreed that it was a good strategy to wait to see what those who'd removed their votes would do, and you now know that he was a mason.
The ONLY thing that changed between your expression of desire to wait for Para and your hammer was that Vollkan said he thought you had shown a reasonable level of caution. As such, you hammered safe in the knowledge that Vollkan (a confirmed mason) believed you had shown reasonable caution to that point; coupled with Vollkan's apparent belief that the time was ripe for a lynch.
Let me stress this: You hammered despite declaring that you wouldn't when the only thing that had changed was that Vollkan had posted so as to potentially redeem you. This utterly reeks of someone who pre-empts that they are lynching a townie since it gives you an easy way out.
I think you knew Para would come up town because you’re mafia, so you removed your vote knowing he was going to die with or without your help. Then, when I pointed out that it looked fishy, you jumped on it saying I was pushing you into voting for him. That coupled with vollkan telling you it wouldn’t look suspicious, made you feel safe hammering Para, knowing that you could throw the blame on me when he came up Town. In fact, you said as much:
Quote:
However, if he turned out town it will particularly show out Setael, who seemed to push me and gorckat into voting for him on suspision that we were protecting a fellow scumbuddy, and those two votes would secure his lynch. Also vollkan and CKD have been dominant in wanting to lynch him.
This sounds an awful lot like someone who knows Para is going to come up Town, and is setting up his arguments for the next day.
vote: SPAG
I never saw it.Setael wrote: Why did you never address that post or refer to it at all?
No. I never saw it. Trust me, I wouldnt lie about this. The fact that I missed it makes me look worse. I would never have said so blatantly that I didnt think there was a case at all if I had seen that.Setael wrote: Did you just decide to ignore it? Or did you think it was a bad case? Can you show me where you ever acknowledged this post?
This isnt true. The hammer looked bad, but to me it looked like an isolated incident, and i didnt think it was immediately indicative of him being scum. Bad town players have done it in the past.Setael wrote: It seems to me that you totally avoided addressing SPAG's scummy play, and even now you're downplaying the case on him.
Havent I gone over how much I LOVE opinion as fact? Geez. It doesnt matter what you "think" i was doing. Its not true, so stop trying to present it as a reasonable or even useful part of a case. I mean, how do i defend against that? say "nuh uh"? thats why opinions of players motives should not be in cases. 1) its opinion. 2) its completely wifom.Setael wrote: I think you were hoping you could get the vote moved off of SPAG and onto Hermit so you tried to trivialize the SPAG case and didn't bother to address it.
How bout I've been under pressure the entire game? All i saw as scummy was the hammer, which is in my opinion, not enough to lynch. also, the second sentence is another one of those AWESOME opinion as fact things.Setael wrote: I can't see any reason for you to have disregarded how scummy SPAG had been if you were Town. The only way it makes sense is if you are SPAG's scumbuddy.
By the way; This is a gameSetael wrote: By the way, calm down and watch your language. This is, after all, still just a game.that id like to win.If swearing is the only way that you guys are gonna listen to what I have to say and not make a mistake by lynching me, then godammit, im gonna swear, and I dont care whether you like it or not.
So in conclusion, yes, I missed that post. Although from what I can tell, all it was doing was saying "SPAG hammered early" over and over again, with various opinion-as-facts thrown in. I already was aware of SPAGs hammer. The evidence against Hermit was (and still is) greater then there was against SPAG. In my opinion, we caught scum out of luck on his lynch, not skill.
By the way, now that I successfully shot down your entire case, are you going to unvote me? or are you just going to pretend I didnt refute your entire argument in my previous post?
Also, gorc:
tomorrow = 4 town 1 scum. mislynch turns it to 2 town 1 scum day after.
so the day after tomorrow will be LYLO if its two mislynches. Thats as close as you can get to your death causing LYLO the very next day. So how would my mislynch not cause a near LYLO situation?
Further, do you have anything else to add? I mean, come the hell on. There is tons to discuss, but the most you can come up with is to attack my interpretation of what near lylo is? that comment is so irrelevant its not even funny. even if you could prove that I was wrong in what i said, is that a scumtell? hell no. Please try harder next time.
Also, I will apologize if im pissed off in my posts, but im not going to stop swearing. EVERY FUCKIN DAY starts out with me being pressured from all sides as the lead candidate. And EVERY FUCKIN DAY I get out of it by pointing out that all your arguments are BS. Honestly, I'm tired of it at this point (this from a guy who usually likes defending himself). So dont blame me for being a tad pissed off. If you were in my situation ( a protown player nearly lynched 3 times and constantly under pressure), you might be a little pissed off too.
Elias wrote:So in conclusion, yes, I missed that post. Although from what I can tell, all it was doing was saying "SPAG hammered early" over and over again, with various opinion-as-facts thrown in. I already was aware of SPAGs hammer. The evidence against Hermit was (and still is) greater then there was against SPAG. In my opinion, we caught scum out of luck on his lynch, not skill.
I disagree. This is what you want people to believe, but what actually seems to happen is every day you get out of it by providing a well-constructed defense. This does not mean you are Town, or that you have proved that the arguments brought against you are BS. All it means is you are good at defending yourself, whether you are scum or Town.Elias wrote:And EVERY *** DAY I get out of it by pointing out that all your arguments are BS.
vollkan wrote:Furthermore, Oman APPROVED of my "plan" to vig pulse and then to lynch Para (the latter of which he may well have thought avoidable). The other important detail to this plan, which I have not revealed until now, is the person who was NOT mentioned: You, Elias.
We know that Oman was scum. We can see Oman trying to protect you. At that point, Oman was NOT under threat. Hence, he had no reason to assume his role would be revealed.
gorckat wrote:Sorry if I'm requoting the exact same thing from earlier (I think its just an excerpt of the earlier quote- its been on the clipboard awhile before I finally sat down to break it down)elias wrote:By jumping on Hermit, i would have done nothing. There would essentially be no pressure on him, and if you [Nelly] turned up scum and I had in the heat of your wagon voted for him instead, it would have appeared that I was simply distracting from your wagon purposefully.
If Nelly came up scum and you were seen voting Hermit, you'd be looked at as distracting the Nelly wagon. That's what I saw as being afraid of distancing, although distracting is the word you used.
The basic point I tried to make is the same- if you are acting in a manner you believe pro-town, why are you afraid of being called anti-town? By saying a townie should avoid scum tells, you imply they should the do so even if they are convinced that the wrong wagon is being pushed, if making their vote is a scum tell (a distraction).
Nelly wrote:Oman voted a random vote in the beginning for OJ (Paradox) then changed it to Ninja and then once again changed it back to OJ (Pardox)... He placed a 4th vote on Paradox and then jumped at your suggestion that we lynch Paradox and VIG Pulse... So now with us knowing that Oman was Scum it wouldnt make sense for him to be so careless with Paradoxombie if they were scum buddies... So I have to believe that both Paradoxombie and Pulse are both Townie. At this point the list of people who voted for me are...
Gorckat
Oman
Paradoxombie
Elias
Nelly632
Lets see... Nelly632 is Town... Oman is dead and proven Scum... So odds are we might be able to find a scum bag on my bandwagon...
Paradoxombie was voted and never defended by Oman and since Oman is scum we assume Paradoxombie is NOT...
Gorckat & Elias...
Gorckat jumps on me before a wagon even exsist and has legitament comments and questions...
Elias votes for me after I have TWO saying he is placing pressure on me and avoiding being looked at as scum...,
Your defense to this was particularly unconvincing, when in the next post you deflected attention and pushed all blame onto Hermit, while attacking Para for FOSing you.Para wrote:My biggest problem with Elias(and I'll admit it's not huge) is that he made such a big deal about the possibility of Volkan being scum and I believe he was first to do it followed by Hermit.
1) You may be giving ideas to scum. Hermit basically laid out the entire plan for the scum when I see no need to, atm. Especially in a game with several fairly new players, it's possible scum would completely miss the opporunity presented in not NKing Volkan.
2) You make it more obvious to scum that we aren't sure that volkan is town. Although volkan IS slightly leading the town, there's no reason to point out the possibility of scumminess unless he survives tonight. Even if scum thought of not NKing Volkan, if we made it look as though the entire town trusts completely that he is town, then he might as well be confirmed; he is also a very proficient scumhunter, imo. Basically, by showing that we don't trust him or at least make it look so, it tells the scum that such a tactic is more likely to suceed.
3) Scum might also fear that even if they let volkan live, the town will ignore the possibility that he is scum, so they put the idea out there now.
In conclusion the most protown and intelligent action would've been to silently consider the possibility of Volkan being scum to yourself, and only bring it up if Volkan or anyone else actually tried to utilize Volkans semi-confirmed townie status to get a lynch on someone else or if Volkan did somthing fairly suspicious. While ckd DID call Volkan confirmed townie, he didn't use it for any purpose such as to get a lynch or protect Volkan, therefore I see it as unreasonable to point out his still-possible-scum status because it benefits scum overall for the reason above.
Town more likely to be careful about what they “give away” to scum. If Elias is scum, he has no need to worry about
I'm sure there is a reason you have a perfect scum record. Clearly when you are scum, you don't tend to make obvious mistakes or many scumtells and it's hard to find obvious cases where we can be sure you bussed or buddied up. The best we would have to go on is sloppy play by your scum buddies (such as Oman's list). You are going to be able to refute anything we say, but you would be able to do so just as well if not better if you were mafia.Para wrote:Para - This is actually the post that made me make a mental note and suspect you over it, I simply forgot it when I was laying everything out. In the part I italicized you suggest that Oman mentioned you as a way to get you lynched. Well this admits that you think Oman mentioning you is damning evidence, SO damning that he must've been out to get you. This is BS, Oman was confused and acting slightly sycophantic to volkan. He could've just been making up suspicions and prefferences. Maybe he actually realized his own suspect status(it's not that hard to see that volkan was out to get him) and want you to get mislynched later.Elias wrote:I need to reread before I say anything, but I'm suspicious of Hermit[.....] and Vollkan, since I'm town, the fact that Oman indicated me last on his list seems to be too convenient to be a coincidence. I seriously think that Oman and Vollkan (mafia aligned dayvig) had this worked out as a planned gambit.
But you go as far as to use Volkan's unconfirmed-ness as a defense. It's stupid. You think Oman's preference of you is so significant that you now suspect Volkan. Volkan has done nothing seriously suspect! There's no reason to "seriously think" that the whole thing was a plan to get you.
I'll tell you what it looks like to me, it looks like you've gone from denial to playing on everybody's suspicions, redirecting them at Volkan. It's weak, it's contrived, and it's scummy
Elias wrote:By the way; This is a gamethat id like to win. If swearing is the only way that you guys are gonna listen to what I have to say and not make a mistake by lynching me, then ***, im gonna swear, and I dont care whether you like it or not.
Claims that no made a case against Elias, I presented a case too, you didn’t see that either? I didn’t like much of elias’s defense to seteal’s attack. Seemed to be going out of the way to ignore SPAG/yag I think he too is a good candidate for scum.Elias_the_thief wrote:Because no one ever really represented the case besides saying "OMG HES LURKING OMG LYNCH LYNCH LYNCH" as far as I saw.Setael wrote:I don't see how Elias could've really not understood the case on SPAG/Yagami.Elias, Post 665 wrote:This really isnt fair. I dont really understand what the case against him [Yagami/SPAG] is, but I dont think that he's town. I've already presented strong cases against Hermit in the past, and I dont see why you expect me to vote for yagami, and i dont see why you act as if its wierd when i dont.
SPAG has been replaced or killed for looking in all of his games...even the game he was modding a back up mod has taken over..
This isn;t exceptional in itself, but earlier, when SPAG hadn't been under so much pressure he had been calling SPAG out for posting in other games but not this one. This is very minor though, until we get to ckd's analysis:
"Hello guys,
I don't often post on the forums other than in the legends and in the mafia games, but I would just like to enlighten the situation with Sean, aka SPAG.
I'm afraid it's bad news. He was involved in a footballing accident during a match which resulted in him damaging his back. He is still currently in hospital and is partially paralysed from the waist down, though it's thought to only be temporary and through physiotherapy he should be able to be active again at some point.
He will be carrying on with PFF and Mafia when he gets back from hospital, but as you can guess he will have other priorities. I hope he has a speedy recovery.
Paul"
YagamiLight, formerly SPAG
Might I add I despise SPAG. I was in 3 other games that he was in and he had to be replaced in them all. Even the game is was modding (which I replaced into) had to go to a back up mod. In this game, SPAG lurked. When he did remerge he skimmed through posts and placed a vote. When attacked for this he unvoted. Said he would not hammer until he heard more from Para. Appears to set up anyone who pushed the Para lynch and then 38 minutes later he hammers for no reason. This has already been pointed out. The fact that SPAG left the site entirely shows that he didn’t really give a crap. In reference to this game, he could be a lazy bad townie or an obvious scum. Yag has not provided much info either (BUT more than SPAG). Breaks down Elias and I, sort of implies we look scummy (I think). Promises more content to come.
The fact that SPAG didn’t really give a crap (and eventually leaves the site completely) works in his favor when it comes to scumminess. If it weren’t for that I think the rating would be higher…however he is still pretty high on the scumdar. Rating 8
Gorckat
hmmm, another one I am back and forth on. Couple things early on had me feeling that Gorckat is scum. In Post 84, Oman gave Gorckat his seal of approval (for really no reason). Go back and read the argument (starting 80) knowing that oj was town and Oman was scum. Votes nelly 106 and revotes nelly 126 and goes on vacation. Personally I hate it when people vote and let us know they are leaving. So when the get back if someone has hung, they can always fall back on, well, I couldn’t removed my vote because I was gone. 9 posts later Oman puts Nelly at –2. Gorckat comes back from vacation post 181. (187) Gorckat challenges vollkan’s vig claim and town status. This rubbed me the wrong way, and still does. Post 197, puts Para at –2, but then unvotes (199) reasoning was strange. 213, questions why mafia would kill vollkan (this was obvious, thought this was a strange question). 215, ask Nelly why it is important to direct a doctor to protect vollkan, (again what)? Votes Elias at 268 (again –2) removes vote on 280 (not 270 as my pbp says) Gorckat sort of falls off my radar at this point. (442) FoSes me for “making a big show” about pushing the Para lynch. (443) I ask why he is FoSing me, almost appears that Gorckat knows Para’s alignment (retrospect) sort of beats around the bush for a couple posts when I ask him why my pushing for Para’s lynch is not pro town? Gives me some sort of answer (451). “its not?”? Post 482, says he will hammer Para is needed. (533) gorckat puts Para at –1. Hasn’t done too much since the NK. When seems to keep an attack on Elias and SPAG.
You know after writing this out and rereading it..you do look pretty scummy. When I started this post (on you) I thought maybe I would end up arguing that you were more neutral than anything (scum and town moves balancing each other out)…but now, I think you might be scum…Rating 7
It seems very strange me that he should come to the conclusion that SPAG is scummier than than gorckat but then votes gorckat over SPAG. He cites SPAG's wagon growing quickly as a reason not to vote for him, and subtly defends SPAG by continually bringing up the excuse that he's lurking (despite having provided himself some fairly decent reasons to vote for him). He then hammers Yagamilight, contrary to his own opinion on the wagon (and cutting off other analyses which hadn't yet been finished, after specifically asking that noone hammer SPAG until he had finished his analysis.
-----------------Ok so that is my break down.
Top three SPAG/Hermit/Gorckat..however, there can be only 2.
I don’t like how this SPAG wagon is just flying by at warp speeds. Currently neither gorckat or hermit are on those wagons. Though Gorckat has stated that he might be putting SPAG to –1. Once I state we should not exceed –1, he mentions that he has no desire to end the day so fast…
After my two rereads…I am not liking Gorckat
Vote gorckat
Maybe we should start (conversation) by addressing my break down of you.
And yet Hermit hasn't changed on his scumlist, and elias has suddenly gained on him. This post could also very well be a last ditch attempt to get something out of his partner's lynch by linking a couple of players to him.
ok, lets see what happens...he is on my scum dar (above hermit and gorckat)..the fact that neither has voted for him makes me wonder..
I will hammer..
unvote, vote Yagami