Mini Normal 1719 - Flavorless Fun! [Game Over!]

[Garmr]

@dwlee why are you so confusing stop it seriously.

Because he didn't mention it specifically but it's in the post his responding to. Saying my points are shit because they aren't supported with evidence when they pretty much can be supported as much as you can in a mafia game and I'm not the only one having these thoughts. My points on mean melter are better than anything his produced this game and he has the audacity to say that.

[Lalendra]

Sorry guys, work. I promise I will try to catch up tomorrow.

[Meanmelter]

Yes you were passively defending haschel.

Mean, you are completely incorrect in saying you didn't defend haschel.

Also, the point Dwlee made about the refusing the defense accusations.

If this is what you guys truly believe, this was not my intention at all. I was not attempting to defend them at all. I think this might make more sense considering in my first post I had more negative town rep on Lale and Haschel. Even then, I don't see how saying "They've ALWAYS been quiet." is some form of defense for someone it's referring to.

you claim to of pushed hascheal hard yet you were so quick to back off your point when hascheal answered you with a sorry I misunderstood.

Where did I claim to push Haschel hard? If you keep doing this Strawman shit I'm just gonna post pictures of Scarecrows for you. You don't even try to quote a post from me or anything Lmao.

You continuously try prove any of my reads as useless despite any reasoning I place in them due to the fact they were scum reading me first. Lale was town reading me when she tried to policy lynch me. ONLY SCUM WOULD TRY TO DISPEL SOMEONES POINTS BY CLAIMING SOMEONES READS ARE INVALID FOR REASONS OTHER THAN THE POINTS THEMSELVES.

Where did I say your reads are useless? Perhaps you are talking about the part where I said you have done nothing D1. Or where I responded to you saying you provided good content D1
Also I do not believe Lale was town reading you considering here she said she was not a fan of your claim & emotional outburst and there is also this part where she says your claim was anti-town AT BEST. I cannot speak for her, but I believe the only reason she unvoted for you here was because you did not replace out and you came back after your 'break.' Even then I still feel she is scum reading you. There is also the part where she considers you and Dier scummy on a wagon later on.

Your point is that I contributed nothing to scum hunting when i in fact did contribute quite a few points thus making you a liar unless your reasoning is no one followed me day 1 which would be false as people did vote lalendra and would be a null point anyway.

You ousted your claim for like no reason, called out Lale for her whole policy lynch thing(Which I still don't even understand why she considered that a policy lynch tbh) and then quickhammered someone without claiming your intent to hammer because you just wanted the day to end. If you wanna be realistic you've done more harm than good for the town. Not only do you make it where scum will seek to target other candidates more likely to be power roles than yourself, but you also made it where you pushed a Doc to claim. This is based on the analogy that Lale really is a doc by the way, which I am still on the fence about. However I believe that your BP claim was merely a method to make it where others will not suspect you of being scum since there is no evidence you have to provide us as proof that your claim is legit. A BP fake claim is quite easy for scum to do because of this, and now you are merely using it to put leverage on what you think the game setup could possibly be.

You anwser some question in a round about way then claim your being strawman ect. This is the mark of someone who is horrible at scum and can't defend themselves because they know they are scum.

You have provided no evidence to prove I have said any of the crap you said I have done. Scum would do this.
And when I call you out on it you literally ignore it.

In the same vein most of your content is pure wrong or twisting how things actually happened. You remain quite about other things and focus on me. Your not really cut out as scum and are pathetic because it's obvious you are scum.

Where/what is wrong?
Where am I twisting how things actually happened?
Where am I being shortsighted?
Where is the evidence that I am scum?
Are we in the same game?

I think that you have tunneled Garmr the entire game, and whether you are town or scum, it has left sort of a blind spot for other things that have been going on. That being said, I can see your push against Garmr as a town push. You have made several good points that I agree with, so that prompted my question to Hieirama when she said "not liking how anti-Garmr Meanmelter is being" in 983. I think there are points in your push against Garmr that appear to be misrepresented

(e.g. the phrase at the end of 466 "You went from AFK one line posts to softclaiming out of the blue..." it's not clear whether you were trying to say Garmr was afk before he claimed, or rather that the style of his posts were afk-one-liners.)

However, I think Garmr is totally overblowing how all of your posts are "shit" and misreps and strawmen and w/e. I think in your interactions with Garmr, Garmr looks way worse. I think Garmr complains about misreps and strawmen, all the while misrepresenting you and making strawman arguments. So I'm not liking Garmr atm.

I am saying that the style of his posts were afk-one-liners unless you wanna count the reaching vote on myko for reaching.
I would also like to note that I have not been tunnel visioning this game but since everyone seems to keep taking note of this,perhaps I am not committing enough to this game. I will try to sort this out and commit more to my posts.

PEDIT: Goddammit I accidentally pressed the go back tab.

This is actually not true. BBT was pretty sure Garmr is town. Just look at his interaction with Garmr at the end of D2. And his 636, he outright said that the Garmr wagon was bad.

Ah, it appears I have not noticed this. I mostly noticed his numerous posts talking about how he wanted him to stop voting against a claimed doc, which came off as scumleaning to me. I also feel it's worth noting that after the night cycle he did have him in a lynchpool for D2

Didn't feel that good about his tunnel, and I did agree with Garmr that there was a bit of misrep in his case. Also, the point Dwlee made about the refusing the defense accusations.

If I have an opinion, I'll say it. If I don't have evidence to back it up, I'll still say it anyway. Don't need evidence to have an opinion and share it... Though it does help people take you more seriously, I guess.

If you are going to come in every 2 days and giving barely any reason on placing your vote on somebody you might as well go and replace out. This just tells me you clearly lack the resolve to act and devote yourself to this game.

What is inherently scummy about tunneling someone I find scummy?
Where is the misrepresentation?
Is it okay for someone to vote against someone without any sort of evidence or reasoning as long as it's their 'opinion?'

[Meanmelter]

I certainly hope I didn't forget to say anything after accidentally hitting the backspace key.

[herrcombs]

This is an interesting situation that I'm perfectly happy watching unfold.

[Garmr]

I always expect that guys nose to fall off.

[Dwlee99]

Tunnelling isn't scummy but if you don't gave many reads other than one person by day 3.. well..

[Garmr]

don't forget twisting facts and trying to push off the label of passively defending scum.

[Meanmelter]

Tunnelling isn't scummy but if you don't gave many reads other than one person by day 3.. well..

This just comes off that you haven't been reading my posts at all, if you really think I haven't voiced how I feel about other players.

don't forget twisting facts and trying to push off the label of passively defending scum.

[Meanmelter]

Also it would be cool if some of our lurking players would stop by and post something relevant.

[Lalendra]

Garmr reads the emerging Haschel Cedricson wagon as a scum-counter wagon. I can see town-Garmr thinking this:

tbf, I think this could also come from scum trying to protect his buddy.

Garmr REALLY wants the Lalendra lynch: post 829, post 830, post 837, post 842, post 847, post 854.
This does make me feel that Garmr didn't know Haschel Cedricson was scum.

Could you explain this for me Keyser? Are you saying if Garmr and Haschel were scumbuddies, Garmr wouldn't have had an outburst like that trying to get Lala lynched? Not sure I agree.

I agree with both of these points, this seems less like a town who was unaware of Haschel's alignment, and more like scum actively trying to push a counter-wagon.

At this point, I do not think Meanmelter and Garmr are scum together, but I would wager that there's a scum between them.

So just to be clear, you are saying, since you voted Garmr, that you think Mean is town?

Your only scumreads D2 were people who were either voting you or considering it. See 530. I even called you out on this, and you sheepishly dropped your contrived scumread on me like a bad habit. Your scumread on feli D1 was AFTER he had first scumread you (see 270). Same with myko. Why does this matter? Because it looks like you're only interested in lynching people who want to kill you.

I don't know, that seems like awfully blatant scum behavior, and given that Garmr is (I think) more experienced than that, I'm not sure I agree. I'm starting to believe more that Garmr is just anti-town town, as opposed to blatant scum.

I do not think that defending someone who flipped scum is scummy in and of itself. The way he said he didn't (it was a soft defend, you know this Meanmelter) makes him a scumlean for me. He could of said "I made a mistake thinking he was town" but instead got defensive.
I want to see MM's response to this before I make a decision on my vote.

That is my main problem with Mean as well.

So this makes me think two things you went walls derp and didn't read a thing which is not what a townie should do or your scum buddies with mean melter and chainsawing for him.

I don't necessarily think that glazing over walls when you're pressed for time and/or waxing apathetic about a particular slot is alignment-indicative. Is it pro-town? No. But it's not inherently scummy either, imo.

Also was hoping you had a guilty on her would of made me the happiest chap.

Can't say I blame you there, we all love being vindicated.

Your confusing me dwells because masons come in twos or unlikey threes so yeh.

Sarcasm is lost on this one.

So your saying there's three masons

LMAO this whole exchange is amazing.

I really want Hieirama to cast a vote.

Ookay.
VOTE: Meanmelter
Didn't feel that good about his tunnel, and I did agree with Garmr that there was a bit of misrep in his case. Also, the point Dwlee made about the refusing the defense accusations.

After all this time, and all that's happened, and being pushed for reads/votes, THAT'S IT??

Mod: Fixed at Lalendra's request.

[Lalendra]

I think today I'd like to go with the theory that garmr and mean are the two remaining scum. It makes sense on a couple of levels.

Alrighty, I was gone most of the weekend but I'm catching up now. Wall incoming

Garmr reads the emerging Haschel Cedricson wagon as a scum-counter wagon. I can see town-Garmr thinking this:

tbf, I think this could also come from scum trying to protect his buddy.

Garmr REALLY wants the Lalendra lynch: post 829, post 830, post 837, post 842, post 847, post 854.
This does make me feel that Garmr didn't know Haschel Cedricson was scum.

Could you explain this for me Keyser? Are you saying if Garmr and Haschel were scumbuddies, Garmr wouldn't have had an outburst like that trying to get Lala lynched? Not sure I agree.

I felt like Haschel Cedricson gave out many views/reads on behaviour of many players, but primarily focused only on Lalendra and Hieirama.
Lalendra wins a town point for being the wagon that Haschel Cedricson pushed D1/D2.
Haschel Cedricson did not vote for anyone else he'd given a negative remark on.
Interestingly, I could not find a read/opinion that Haschel Cedricson gave on Meanmelter.

I agree with these statements. I think Haschel's flip looks good for Lala and Hiei, but it makes me nervous about Meanmelter and Garmr.

I'm trying to set up a situation that will get lale killed if she's town by scum or lynched as scum or forces scum to protect a town power role to keep lale alive if she's scum

Regarding this whole thing, where Garmr tries to out the remaining mason(s), I am going like this O.O We don't know if scum have something like a roleblocker or a strongman, which is likely if Lala is actually the doc and tried to save BBT last night. Garmr gets huge scum points in my book for trying to do this against the remaining mason(s)' will, and for making it easier for scum to hunt them down by pressuring DWL to confirm/deny his role. I'm beginning to feel more strongly that Garmr is scum who's just super ballsy with his anti-town behavior. I just don't see town playing this kind of risk, lemme break it down -- If Garmr's wrong about Lalendra, then his 'plan' directly kills two PRs, one at night, and the other gets lynched the next day. Actually, if Garmr is town and felt so strongly about Lala being scum, he wouldn't bother with this whole runaround. He'd just want to lynch Lala today. That way, we would still have conftown more likely to survive until later.

I do not recall you not feeling townie agbout Keyser? You said he was null-town and that he has been under your radar, but I believe that was the last you mentioned of him. Perhaps you mean you are reassured? Especially with those last two statements who you felt are both town.

Yes, I am reassured that Keyser is likely town.

Garmr's post 973 bothers the crap out of me. It's like Garmr has a finger in each ear going "LALALA I CANT FUKING HEAR YOU" and just trying to drive his narrative home.

At this point, I do not think Meanmelter and Garmr are scum together, but I would wager that there's a scum between them.

A quick diversion -- I'm not a fan of Hieirama's 1002 for the same reason I've not been a fan of most of her play so far. So much vague language, so little desire to reread anything or analyze what has transpired in the game. I wanted real answers to my questions in 984, not just fencesitting without having reread the game and without indicating a desire to figure out the game to any depth. I can't take your reads seriously, Hieirama, if you just make posts like 955 and 983 without substantiation, and continue not to substantiate them after being pressured.

So what are your opinions on me, then?

I think that you have tunneled Garmr the entire game, and whether you are town or scum, it has left sort of a blind spot for other things that have been going on. That being said, I can see your push against Garmr as a town push. You have made several good points that I agree with, so that prompted my question to Hieirama when she said "not liking how anti-Garmr Meanmelter is being" in 983. I think there are points in your push against Garmr that appear to be misrepresented (e.g. the phrase at the end of 466 "You went from AFK one line posts to softclaiming out of the blue..." it's not clear whether you were trying to say Garmr was afk before he claimed, or rather that the style of his posts were afk-one-liners.) However, I think Garmr is totally overblowing how all of your posts are "shit" and misreps and strawmen and w/e. I think in your interactions with Garmr, Garmr looks way worse. I think Garmr complains about misreps and strawmen, all the while misrepresenting you and making strawman arguments. So I'm not liking Garmr atm.

Note to self: I should come back to myko's 1027 once I have some more time.

I think today I'd like to go with the theory that garmr and mean are the two remaining scum. It makes sense on a couple of levels.

Could you explain the levels on which this association makes sense? I'm not seeing this conclusion as readily as you are atm. Ever since meanmelter replaced in, do you think the aggression that he's shown towards Garmr is not unlikely to occur between two scum?

Reading Garmr's 1040, ok he's actually making a few decent points here. Like his point about the line from MM's 466. However (let's look at the FACT THAT WASN"T TRUE line), Garmr, you have it wrong. Your only scumreads D2 were people who were either voting you or considering it. See 530. I even called you out on this, and you sheepishly dropped your contrived scumread on me like a bad habit. Your scumread on feli D1 was AFTER he had first scumread you (see 270). Same with myko. Why does this matter? Because it looks like you're only interested in lynching people who want to kill you. Your scumhunting revolves around yourself. It looks like you're looking inward, not outward, and that is scummy.

The mafia are NOT killing people who see you as town. I do not recall BBT calling you town,

This is actually not true. BBT was pretty sure Garmr is town. Just look at his interaction with Garmr at the end of D2. And his 636, he outright said that the Garmr wagon was bad.

Holy crap this back-and-forth between Garmr and Mean is painful. It's basically Garmr going, "Mean did this," mean replies "No I didn't," then Garmr goes "Yeah you did." For the record Garmr, if you make claims about someone, the burden is on YOU to prove their validity. If you claim that Mean "says i provided no reads or anything," and he denies saying that, then it's your responsibility to show where he in fact said it. If you claim that Mean "tried to dispel my reads as only people that scum read me," and mean says he did no such thing, it is your responsibility to either show where he in fact said it, or admit that you're lying. Your 1045 just looks like you're trying to back yourself out of responsibility of claims you've made against mean. "really can't be bothered with these anwsers as they do nothing to change my points," well your points don't mean much if they're false to begin with. As scum, this makes complete sense, because you're using hyperbole to fabricate a case to get someone lynched. If you're town, it just means that you are lazy in how you throw shit around, making claims that aren't verifiable, exaggerating because you feel a certain way about a slot. I'm leaning towards the former.

VOTE: Garmr

Ugh, Mod, please fix the formatting. That was a quote, not a vote.

[Lalendra]

Also wasn't supposed to be a big quote there. Driving the struggle-bus tonight.

[Dwlee99]

Garmr reads the emerging Haschel Cedricson wagon as a scum-counter wagon. I can see town-Garmr thinking this:

tbf, I think this could also come from scum trying to protect his buddy.

Garmr REALLY wants the Lalendra lynch: post 829, post 830, post 837, post 842, post 847, post 854.
This does make me feel that Garmr didn't know Haschel Cedricson was scum.

Could you explain this for me Keyser? Are you saying if Garmr and Haschel were scumbuddies, Garmr wouldn't have had an outburst like that trying to get Lala lynched? Not sure I agree.

I agree with both of these points, this seems less like a town who was unaware of Haschel's alignment, and more like scum actively trying to push a counter-wagon.

At this point, I do not think Meanmelter and Garmr are scum together, but I would wager that there's a scum between them.

So just to be clear, you are saying, since you voted Garmr, that you think Mean is town?

Your only scumreads D2 were people who were either voting you or considering it. See 530. I even called you out on this, and you sheepishly dropped your contrived scumread on me like a bad habit. Your scumread on feli D1 was AFTER he had first scumread you (see 270). Same with myko. Why does this matter? Because it looks like you're only interested in lynching people who want to kill you.

I don't know, that seems like awfully blatant scum behavior, and given that Garmr is (I think) more experienced than that, I'm not sure I agree. I'm starting to believe more that Garmr is just anti-town town, as opposed to blatant scum.

I do not think that defending someone who flipped scum is scummy in and of itself. The way he said he didn't (it was a soft defend, you know this Meanmelter) makes him a scumlean for me. He could of said "I made a mistake thinking he was town" but instead got defensive.
I want to see MM's response to this before I make a decision on my vote.

That is my main problem with Mean as well.

So this makes me think two things you went walls derp and didn't read a thing which is not what a townie should do or your scum buddies with mean melter and chainsawing for him.

I don't necessarily think that glazing over walls when you're pressed for time and/or waxing apathetic about a particular slot is alignment-indicative. Is it pro-town? No. But it's not inherently scummy either, imo.

Also was hoping you had a guilty on her would of made me the happiest chap.

Can't say I blame you there, we all love being vindicated.

Your confusing me dwells because masons come in twos or unlikey threes so yeh.

Sarcasm is lost on this one.

So your saying there's three masons

LMAO this whole exchange is amazing.

[quote="In

I really want Hieirama to cast a vote.

Ookay.
VOTE: Meanmelter
Didn't feel that good about his tunnel, and I did agree with Garmr that there was a bit of misrep in his case. Also, the point Dwlee made about the refusing the defense accusations.

After all this time, and all that's happened, and being pushed for reads/votes, THAT'S IT??[/quote]
The thing I bolded and made larger doesn't really agree with your vote, imo. You cast suspicion onto garmr but then vote mean when one of them is most likely scum.
I agree that the scum out of those two is meanmelter but you contradict yourself in a small way.

[Dwlee99]

@MeanMelter: From a quick skim of your ISO you have interactions with a lot of people (mainly questions) but not really saying how you feel on the slots. Can you quote an example of you posting how you feel on a slot?

And where is like half our player base for this game???

[Dierfire]

I'll post tomorrow; tonight, I can't.

[A Simple Plan]

Vote Count 3.4

3

Garmr - mykonian, Meanmelter, herrcombs [L-2]

3

Meanmelter - Garmr, Dierfire, Hieirama [L-2]

Not Voting -

Dwlee99, Lalendra, Keyser Söze

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline - (expired on 2015-11-04 08:00:00)

Based upon coding error and subsequent edit request, Lalendra's 1110 has not been counted as a vote.

Hieirama is being prodded for the second time.

[Keyser Söze]

Page 42

@Dier you mean My scum eead since day 2 Don't give myko that credit.

I had feli as a scum read before melta even came here myko don't act as if I didn't.

Garmr taking ownership of the Meanmelter wagon - this illustrates Garmr's confidence of his Meanmelter-scum-read.

He did state he was tired, however. I feel he might have came and posted a more in-detail read on everybody.

@Haschel Cedricson Do you not feel that others who have posted a small amount of reads are also worth voting for? AKA Me and Garmr

.This sounds like a scum buddy trying to convience another scum buddy to join a wagon. This is not how two town talk to each other. Considering how much of a noob meanmelter is I can see him making these type of slip ups.

Interestingly, Haschel Cedricson does not comment/reply to Meanmelter's question. I believe the Meanmelter-Haschel Cedricson interactions were one-way. It makes me wonder:

was Haschel Cedricson aware of this?

@Garmr, in that same post, Meanmelter posted a direct question to me too:

@Keyser Söze: How would you feel if D1 Myko tunneled Garmr? Or perhaps, if Myko started tunneling Garmr D2? Would either change your stance on your opinion on the scum-team hypothesis?

Does your "This is not how two town talk to each other" comment apply here too?

Vote mean with me with me then because

the longer this game goes on the easier I become to lynch.

If Mean is scum no matter who else you think is scum then vote him with me and lets lynch scum together.

Does the following not really seem to

bother anyone

?
First off, how are you easier to lynch the longer the game goes on?

Garmr is very self-aware of his 'lynch-bait' status. I do not like that he is highlighting it (possible WIFOM defence-tactic)

[Lalendra]

Garmr reads the emerging Haschel Cedricson wagon as a scum-counter wagon. I can see town-Garmr thinking this:

tbf, I think this could also come from scum trying to protect his buddy.

Garmr REALLY wants the Lalendra lynch: post 829, post 830, post 837, post 842, post 847, post 854.
This does make me feel that Garmr didn't know Haschel Cedricson was scum.

Could you explain this for me Keyser? Are you saying if Garmr and Haschel were scumbuddies, Garmr wouldn't have had an outburst like that trying to get Lala lynched? Not sure I agree.

I agree with both of these points, this seems less like a town who was unaware of Haschel's alignment, and more like scum actively trying to push a counter-wagon.

At this point, I do not think Meanmelter and Garmr are scum together, but I would wager that there's a scum between them.

So just to be clear, you are saying, since you voted Garmr, that you think Mean is town?

Your only scumreads D2 were people who were either voting you or considering it. See 530. I even called you out on this, and you sheepishly dropped your contrived scumread on me like a bad habit. Your scumread on feli D1 was AFTER he had first scumread you (see 270). Same with myko. Why does this matter? Because it looks like you're only interested in lynching people who want to kill you.

I don't know, that seems like awfully blatant scum behavior, and given that Garmr is (I think) more experienced than that, I'm not sure I agree. I'm starting to believe more that Garmr is just anti-town town, as opposed to blatant scum.

I do not think that defending someone who flipped scum is scummy in and of itself. The way he said he didn't (it was a soft defend, you know this Meanmelter) makes him a scumlean for me. He could of said "I made a mistake thinking he was town" but instead got defensive.
I want to see MM's response to this before I make a decision on my vote.

That is my main problem with Mean as well.

So this makes me think two things you went walls derp and didn't read a thing which is not what a townie should do or your scum buddies with mean melter and chainsawing for him.

I don't necessarily think that glazing over walls when you're pressed for time and/or waxing apathetic about a particular slot is alignment-indicative. Is it pro-town? No. But it's not inherently scummy either, imo.

Also was hoping you had a guilty on her would of made me the happiest chap.

Can't say I blame you there, we all love being vindicated.

Your confusing me dwells because masons come in twos or unlikey threes so yeh.

Sarcasm is lost on this one.

So your saying there's three masons

LMAO this whole exchange is amazing.

[quote="In

I really want Hieirama to cast a vote.

Ookay.
VOTE: Meanmelter
Didn't feel that good about his tunnel, and I did agree with Garmr that there was a bit of misrep in his case. Also, the point Dwlee made about the refusing the defense accusations.

After all this time, and all that's happened, and being pushed for reads/votes, THAT'S IT??

The thing I bolded and made larger doesn't really agree with your vote, imo. You cast suspicion onto garmr but then vote mean when one of them is most likely scum.
I agree that the scum out of those two is meanmelter but you contradict yourself in a small way.[/quote]
That wasn't a vote, I pointed that out in my next post.

[Dwlee99]

Oh, I did not see that it wasn't a vote lalendra.
I knew it made no sense.

[Keyser Söze]

Page 43

Garmr reads the emerging Haschel Cedricson wagon as a scum-counter wagon. I can see town-Garmr thinking this:

tbf, I think this could also come from scum trying to protect his buddy.

Garmr REALLY wants the Lalendra lynch: post 829, post 830, post 837, post 842, post 847, post 854.
This does make me feel that Garmr didn't know Haschel Cedricson was scum.

Could you explain this for me Keyser? Are you saying if Garmr and Haschel were scumbuddies, Garmr wouldn't have had an outburst like that trying to get Lala lynched? Not sure I agree.

Here was my logic:

Would Scum-Garmr push the Lalendra lynch so hard, and in effect counter/oppose the Haschel Cedricson lynch so hard?
If both Haschel Cedricson/Lalendra are scum - possibly.
But if Lalendra is town, I think scum-Garmr was taking a huge risk in being on the wrong side of the Haschel Cedricson wagon (indirectly opposing it).
I thought scum-Garmr could have won more town-cred being open to a Haschel Cedricson lynch.

[

"laleandra or no lynch"
"fucking lynch scum lynch lalendra."
"If lalendra isn't lynched today I'm replacing out then I'll come back end game and rub it in your faces she was scum."
"Whats the case on hasechal being active that's a fucking shit case as he could have real life issues but lalendra has done no hunting,willing to lynch town over scum ect."
"so vote lale I want scum lynched it's aggravating since I been pushing her all day and I'm so close to getting the fake scum lynched."

]

Scum-Garmr was leaving no room for Haschel Cedricson being scum (i.e if Garmr knew Haschel Cedricson was scum, Garmr has actively practised the

opposite of scum-distancing

). But I can see how you could see this as a hard-defence from 'mafia-Garmr'. I was looking at how Garmr may have been

trying to project himself

- instead of looking at his actual actions.


herrcombs' summary of Meanmelter's-Garmr's interactions does well to sum up my thoughts too (post 1050).

Size vote mean melter man you been putting it off for no reason

We have 5 days, no need to rush this

So this makes me think two things you went

walls derp

and didn't read a thing which is not what a townie should do or

your scum buddies with mean melter and chainsawing for him

.

Overreaction much?

The 'mason' conversation between Dwlee99-Garmr...


Let's not play

'hunt the mason'

gents.

[mykonian]

soze has some points that I'm happy finally get voiced. Took long enough.

[Keyser Söze]

What the heck was that, Dwlee...?

Are you claiming something other than VT?

What the hell is this Hieirama?

p.s. not liking how anti-Garmr Meanmelter is being

VOTE: Meanmelter
Didn't feel that good about his tunnel, and I did agree with Garmr that there was a bit of misrep in his case. Also, the point Dwlee made about the refusing the defense accusations.

I actually like this last post from Hieirama because it finally has some continuity.

Yes, making a vote on a scum-read is pro-active, but I'm not dishing out a town-point here to Hieirama because it is delayed (again).

I don't know, that seems like awfully blatant scum behavior, and given that Garmr is (I think) more experienced than that, I'm not sure I agree. I'm starting to believe more that Garmr is just anti-town town, as opposed to blatant scum.

@Lalendra, I applied the above logic to the counter-wagon pushing addressed below:

Garmr reads the emerging Haschel Cedricson wagon as a scum-counter wagon. I can see town-Garmr thinking this:

tbf, I think this could also come from scum trying to protect his buddy.

Garmr REALLY wants the Lalendra lynch: post 829, post 830, post 837, post 842, post 847, post 854.
This does make me feel that Garmr didn't know Haschel Cedricson was scum.

Could you explain this for me Keyser? Are you saying if Garmr and Haschel were scumbuddies, Garmr wouldn't have had an outburst like that trying to get Lala lynched? Not sure I agree.

I agree with both of these points, this seems less like a town who was unaware of Haschel's alignment, and more like scum actively trying to push a counter-wagon.

I.e. It would be "awfully blatant scum behaviour" to passionately push a counter wagon away from your scum-partner.

[

Can we please use spoilers and snips, ladies and gents. All these wall quotes are impossible to digest.

]

[Dwlee99]

No. No more spoilers. I can't open them on my phooone

[Keyser Söze]

This is where I am:

I do not like Hieirama or Meanmelter's posting/movement/activity around the Haschel Cedricson lynch

Interestingly, I could not find a read/opinion that Haschel Cedricson gave on Meanmelter.

Moreover, if Lalendra is town and we have 3 mafia, I doubt all three were on Lalendra's wagon:

Dierfire, Garmr, Keyser Söze, herrcombs,

Haschel Cedricson

.

BlueBloodedToffee was putting serious pressure on Dierfire D2. His town-read on Dwlee99 was strong. BlueBloodedToffee had a scum-to-town change of read on both Gamr then Lalendre during D2. I'm going to re-look at both Dwlee99's and Dierfire's ISO's tomorrow morning (I'm not getting a strong town/scum read on either of them like BlueBloodedToffee was).

- Lalendra is not getting lynched
- My immediate suspicion would be on Meanmelter/Hieirama surrounding the Haschel Cedricson wagon/lynch
- I want to take a closer look at Dwlee99/Dierfire, but in particular Dierfire.
- But I very much doubt Dierfire-Garmr is scum-scum. Either one town or both town.
- Haschel Cedricson primarily scum read both Lalendra and Hieirama but only pushed a Lalendra lynch. There is more chance of scum-distancing via Hieirama, rather than Lalendra.

Here are the two D3 wagons:
[3] Garmr - mykonian, Meanmelter, herrcombs [L-2]
[3] Meanmelter - Garmr, Dierfire, Hieirama [L-2]

The Meanmelter wagon is supported by; Dierfire (who was BlueBloodedToffee's strongest scum-read, but I currently null-town-lean), Garmr (his playstyle and overreactions have created 'noise' around the wagon, similar to the noise he created around the Lalandre wagon which makes me hesitate to jump on, current town-lean) and Hieirama (a null-scum-lean read).

herrcombs and mykonian (my two strongest town-reads) are on the Garmr wagon.

I will vote tomorrow, not 100% happy putting Meanmelter at L-1 just yet.