Mini 427 - Clue Mafia 3 - Game Over - Is this what happened?


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Post Post #275 (ISO) » Fri Aug 24, 2007 5:06 am

Post by Battle Mage »

Ectomancer wrote:Hmm, I thought I did post. I wrote out the response anyhow.

Im not going to provide the information. Battle Mage, you are in no way confirmed, and I don't think anyone assigned you as ring leader. It was never discussed whether we would claim names and flavor after claiming role. Personally I think the role claims should be made and then we decide who needs to come out with the rest of the information in what order. After a discussion is had
between all of the players
, then I will give name and flavor, but certainly not because Battle Mage demands it.
ok, then let me rephrase the question. Are you SURE you are a Vig?Because my dear chum, i have significant information to suggest that you AREN'T. You have until tomorrow to claim PROPERLY, or my vote stays on you.

Oh and thanks for falling into my little trap btw. :D

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Post Post #276 (ISO) » Fri Aug 24, 2007 6:01 am

Post by al_kohaulec »

I can hold my disbelief of ecto until after we finish massclaiming. I'm impartial to flavor and name claims because I see it as moot.

However, claiming targets is another issue to be considered. There are benefits for and against it.
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Post Post #277 (ISO) » Fri Aug 24, 2007 6:09 am

Post by Ectomancer »

You have no trap at all BM. Did you not read where I said "I think"? Is that when you came up with your grand scheme? The entire reason I said "I think" is because my targets, of which you are one of them, are not dead. Why aren't you dead BM? Can you answer that properly? I know Godfather's don't die when you target them. Do you have another explanation for it?
I have a degree in bullshit. I have patents on entire lines of bullshit. So don't sit here and feed me a line of bullshit and think that I'm not going to recognize it as one.

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Post Post #278 (ISO) » Fri Aug 24, 2007 8:45 am

Post by DragonsofSummer »

Ecto you say none of your targets have died? Not one in 3 nights? Are you 100% sure you read your role as a Vig role?
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Post Post #279 (ISO) » Fri Aug 24, 2007 8:46 am

Post by DragonsofSummer »

EBWOP: I don't like the attack on BM here. He is trying to get to the bottom of a situation and you turn around and basically accuse him of being the godfather after saying
None[/b] of your night targets have died.
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Post Post #280 (ISO) » Fri Aug 24, 2007 10:22 am

Post by Ectomancer »

There are 2 SK's and 2 Vig's that I know of so far, the speculation is that everyone has a power role, so I see no reason why there couldn't be a 2nd Godfather or other unnightkillable role for scum. The point of my attack on BM is that he is acting as though he is confirmed, when that isn't the case. And DOS, there have been only 2 nights. Now there are a myriad of other reasons why he might not be dead, but if you dont mind, let him answer it himself.

DOS, I sent in targets, and they didn't die, and I didn't get any message indicating that I may have been roleblocked or anything else. Without quoting my PM, I was to go through the house when it was dark to find the killer and stop them.
And not that it really matters, but I'm Miss Scarlet.
I have a degree in bullshit. I have patents on entire lines of bullshit. So don't sit here and feed me a line of bullshit and think that I'm not going to recognize it as one.

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Post Post #281 (ISO) » Fri Aug 24, 2007 11:17 am

Post by DragonsofSummer »

Any chance you targeted me N1? Cause if thats the case you are most definitely a Roleblocker and not a Vig.
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Post Post #282 (ISO) » Fri Aug 24, 2007 11:18 am

Post by DragonsofSummer »

Ebwop: I gotta stop hitting the post button before I finish what I have to say.

That is a good point about the possibility of another unkillable role. Also I understand what you mean now, and it is completely fair for you to question BM on his "confirmed" townness. I just read your post the wrong way the first time.
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Post Post #283 (ISO) » Fri Aug 24, 2007 9:05 pm

Post by Battle Mage »

Ectomancer wrote:There are 2 SK's and 2 Vig's that I know of so far, the speculation is that everyone has a power role, so I see no reason why there couldn't be a 2nd Godfather or other unnightkillable role for scum. The point of my attack on BM is that he is acting as though he is confirmed, when that isn't the case. And DOS, there have been only 2 nights. Now there are a myriad of other reasons why he might not be dead, but if you dont mind, let him answer it himself.

DOS, I sent in targets, and they didn't die, and I didn't get any message indicating that I may have been roleblocked or anything else. Without quoting my PM, I was to go through the house when it was dark to find the killer and stop them.
And not that it really matters, but I'm Miss Scarlet.
Ecto, the only way i could possibly be scum, is if AlKo was also scum. Unless you think i am some sort of UnNKable Mafia Tracker. rofl.
Anyway, i still want your list of targets, though i'm pretty confident with a
Vote: Ectomancer
in the meantime. I'll explain more when he has stopped being so arrogant, and tried to help the town, rather than hinder it. :x

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Nightkilled - 10
Survived to the end and lost - 6
Day-elimmed by majority - 4

winrate as scum: 78%
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Post Post #284 (ISO) » Sat Aug 25, 2007 4:50 am

Post by Ectomancer »

Battle Mage wrote:
Ectomancer wrote:There are 2 SK's and 2 Vig's that I know of so far, the speculation is that everyone has a power role, so I see no reason why there couldn't be a 2nd Godfather or other unnightkillable role for scum. The point of my attack on BM is that he is acting as though he is confirmed, when that isn't the case. And DOS, there have been only 2 nights. Now there are a myriad of other reasons why he might not be dead, but if you dont mind, let him answer it himself.

DOS, I sent in targets, and they didn't die, and I didn't get any message indicating that I may have been roleblocked or anything else. Without quoting my PM, I was to go through the house when it was dark to find the killer and stop them.
And not that it really matters, but I'm Miss Scarlet.
Ecto, the only way i could possibly be scum, is if AlKo was also scum. Unless you think i am some sort of UnNKable Mafia Tracker. rofl.
Anyway, i still want your list of targets, though i'm pretty confident with a
Vote: Ectomancer
in the meantime. I'll explain more when he has stopped being so arrogant, and tried to help the town, rather than hinder it. :x

BM
Im not hindering the town and you are being arrogant yourself with your "Im in charge" attitude.
I want the rest of the claims before you suck me dry. I also have questions I want answered, and Im not going to tell you everything until I hear some things myself.
I have a degree in bullshit. I have patents on entire lines of bullshit. So don't sit here and feed me a line of bullshit and think that I'm not going to recognize it as one.

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Post Post #285 (ISO) » Sat Aug 25, 2007 9:06 am

Post by Battle Mage »

Ecto, must you make things immensely difficult for everyone? The entire reason i asked for a mass claim was so that AlKo and myself could gain the info about particular players, without letting those people know specifically who they were. Now i'm not often in the position of informed minority, so i'm sorry if you think i'm making a hash of it. But if you were in my shoes right now, you would entirely understand what i am doing. I don't want ANYONE else to claim. Its not as if we dont have plenty of targets to choose from today as it is. I think between you and Haschel Cedricson, we have our last remaining scum. If this isnt the case, others can claim at a later date. We still havent outted any protection roles, of which it is obvious there are some. I'd rather we didn't give the scum any more information than necessary. Unfortunately, whether you recognise this or not, you claiming fully and honestly, IS necessary.
I'm going to give you 1 last chance. If you don't claim fully in your next post, i will claim fully, and you will almost certainly be lynched today. Alternatively you can claim honestly now, and give the town something to think over. Claiming will certainly be preferable to outright refusal. Or would you rather not get to see another night?

Now, i want to hear your targets over all nights upto this point, with reasons. If you breadcrumbed your role somewhere, it would be good if you could point that out to us.

In the meantime, the only other person we really need more information from today, is Haschel Cedricson. You claimed a role along the lines of 'Jack of All Trades' correct?
Could you please confirm whether or not you have an investigation result, first and foremost?

In the meantime, nobody else should claim, or offer advice to either suspect. I don't give a toss if any of you think i'm arrogant. The fact is, by the time i make my next post, you should have as much info as me. Its not as if i'm going to be here at endgame, so while i am, i'm going to give as much to this town as possble!

BM


Ectomancer wrote:
Battle Mage wrote:
Ectomancer wrote:There are 2 SK's and 2 Vig's that I know of so far, the speculation is that everyone has a power role, so I see no reason why there couldn't be a 2nd Godfather or other unnightkillable role for scum. The point of my attack on BM is that he is acting as though he is confirmed, when that isn't the case. And DOS, there have been only 2 nights. Now there are a myriad of other reasons why he might not be dead, but if you dont mind, let him answer it himself.

DOS, I sent in targets, and they didn't die, and I didn't get any message indicating that I may have been roleblocked or anything else. Without quoting my PM, I was to go through the house when it was dark to find the killer and stop them.
And not that it really matters, but I'm Miss Scarlet.
Ecto, the only way i could possibly be scum, is if AlKo was also scum. Unless you think i am some sort of UnNKable Mafia Tracker. rofl.
Anyway, i still want your list of targets, though i'm pretty confident with a
Vote: Ectomancer
in the meantime. I'll explain more when he has stopped being so arrogant, and tried to help the town, rather than hinder it. :x

BM
Im not hindering the town and you are being arrogant yourself with your "Im in charge" attitude.
I want the rest of the claims before you suck me dry. I also have questions I want answered, and Im not going to tell you everything until I hear some things myself.
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Survived to the end and lost - 6
Day-elimmed by majority - 4

winrate as scum: 78%
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Post Post #286 (ISO) » Sat Aug 25, 2007 12:45 pm

Post by Ectomancer »

I said my piece. You asked for a mass claim and we agreed. Going back on that word now and saying that my ENTIRE CLAIM is the only one that matters is a load of crap.

I role claimed and name claimed,
now Mass Claim like we agreed
, or do whatever it is you think you can do on your own BM. I'm not giving you the entire package. It was never agreed upon, and I could care less about your threats.
I have a degree in bullshit. I have patents on entire lines of bullshit. So don't sit here and feed me a line of bullshit and think that I'm not going to recognize it as one.

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Post Post #287 (ISO) » Sun Aug 26, 2007 2:07 am

Post by Battle Mage »

right, i'm getting bored of this charade. I'm claiming.

Last night i tracked Ectomancer. No great reason in particular, but there was 1 post which made me a bit suspicious of him (the one in which he said something along the lines of "I'm going to give credit to BM's gambit"). It looked like an attempt to suck up to me, to try to gain my trust, so he could perform the kill that night. So anyway, i tracked Ecto, and the result shocked me. Not only was he up and about last night, but he was HEADING FOR ME. So i knew Ecto had targetted me last night. Not a big deal in itself, seeing as i could see several protown power roles doing so. However when i found out that no kill had taken place, i was more than a little suspicious. I figured that the scum kill had failed last night, and that i had most probably been the target. That suggested not only that i had at least 2 people targetting me last night (Doctor, and scum) but it also gave me the opportunity to test AlKo, in an attempt to confirm him 100%.

Hence my interest in his target last night. I was pleased to hear that he targetted me-anything else would have been completely idiotic. I was hoping that, if we both organised a mass-claim, i would at worst, be able to validate him, and in addition, we could helpfully find out who was the killer last night. So anyway, i offered AlKo to go first, on the assumption that he would probably request the claim from either 1 of his targets, or the obvious choice- Haschel Cedricson. In honesty, i was expecting the latter, especially when he claimed that he had been RBed. I'm still not entirely sure whether this was true. Him choosing Ectomancer first seems a remarkable coincidence, and it might have been an attempt to lull him into a false sense of security.
I'd like to hear from AlKo on that one.

Anyway, the first choice to claim was Ecto, which was perfect for me. His claim was highly suspicious. Not only did he claim 'Vig' which went no way to explaining his whereabouts last night, but he was obviously reluctant to commit himself, hence his 'I think' with his roleclaim. But, i still wanted more information. Just to confirm my suspicions, i wanted to hear his claim of targets over the preceding nights. Either he would lie, in which case i would know he was scum, or he would claim to have targetted me last night, which makes no sense, but i might have cut him a bit of slack for coming clean.
Instead however, Ecto didn't want to reveal anything else. Even though he had claimed, he didnt want to claim who his targets were. Obviously, this stank of scum, as once he had claimed Vig, there was absolutely no reason not to claim his targets. But he was obviously edgy. Unfortunately his unhelpfulness meant i had to let slip that i had information about him, at which point he softclaimed that he had targetted me at some point. Again, not helpful, because no only did he not go into detail with his reasons, he also didnt claim a specific night, and HE ONLY CLAIMED AFTER HE KNEW I HAD TRACKED HIM. Thats the key point to remember here.

I tried one last time to get him to claim. I knew that, once i had revealed my information, it would be too late for him to save himself, so now he has to be lynched. However i am happy beyond reasonable doubt that he is scum. Further problems with his claim, not aforementioned, are the fact that the only way in which a Vig would possibly target a claimed, and virtually confirmed, power role, is if they were insanely suspicious of me, something which Ecto did not suggest atall yesterday. In fact, read his play yesterday, and he couldnt really have done a better job of sucking up to me. :roll:
And besides, even if Ecto WAS a Vig, i would certainly be dead by now. we probably dont have multiple killing roles, as if we did, we would also have multiple protection roles, which is highly unlikely.

Oh yes, and thats without going into the 'Broken Vig' claim by Ecto. So, none of your targets have died right? Yet, you don't sound like somebody who has multiple nights of failed attacks. Rather, in his post 280, he seems to focus on his failed attack upon me. Why, if he had faced at least 2 nights of failed kills, should he only wonder at why
I
survived?
It just doesn't make any sense. I think Ecto did tell the truth about 1 thing though. He did try to kill me last night, and he failed.
Now, you can see why a mass-claim further is totally stupid. You can also see Ecto's rolefishing by pushing the issue, to be another strong scumtell. However if you aren't convinced, it might be good if whoever prevented the kill last night claimed. I'd rather not reveal a Doc, only for them to be killed tonight, but i'm hoping, we have only 1 or 2 scum left, and as such, getting confirmation today, might be wise.

So, we have 2 suspects today. fyi, i believe DoS wholeheartedly, because, until we have a Cop-counter claim, he must be telling the truth. On the other hand, i'm not entirely convinced that HC is scum. I would certainly like to hear details of his claim, before i make a decision on who i think is the best play for today.

In the meantime, i'm happy with my vote on Ectomancer, and reccommend a healthy BW while we wait for HC.

BM
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Survived to the end and won - 11
Nightkilled - 10
Survived to the end and lost - 6
Day-elimmed by majority - 4

winrate as scum: 78%
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Post Post #288 (ISO) » Sun Aug 26, 2007 3:47 pm

Post by Ectomancer »

You aren't half as clever as you think you are BM. I am still awaiting the rest of the claims. No, I dont trust you in the least, and you flatter yourself if you think I will ever "suck up" to you. In fact, you were singled out in my question about why you werent dead specifically because I didn't trust you. Why? You screwed up.

Lets look at claims after knowledge was divulged shall we?

Remember BM claiming a Guilty investigation?

Then he claimed that he wasnt a cop, he was a tracker and then he divulged his target and who they targeted
after Alko had already divulged that information
.
Battle Mage wrote:speaking of avoiding things, why are you avoiding the question posed to you?
Believe me, i have a VERY good reason for asking for this information. If you are a Watcher, you can be 99.9% sure that i am town,
simply because i knew who you targetted 2 nights back.
Please trust me, and say who you WATCHED last night.
Remember, i don't want your result, just the name of your target.

thanks,
BM
I bolded the relevant part. Uhh say what? Alko said who he targeted, NOT BM.

And then suddenly we have BM claiming that he is confirmed by Alko and starts trying to dominate the direction of our game.

Dude, you dont have to be a tracker to tell people who they targeted after they tell you who it was. It also doesn't take a genius to say they targeted me after I said I tried to kill you. I doubted you being a tracker to begin with, so your "I've got information that you arent a Vig didnt bother me at all".
However, everyone else notice that he used Alko's statement and target to claim tracker, then browbeat me until I got irritated at him and spilled the beans that I targeted him last night, and the LOW AND BEHOLD! HE TARGETED ME!
Why do you think I wanted claims out before we got around to the rest of the information? You are trying to bully a victory BM, and Im not having it.


vote Battle Mage
I have a degree in bullshit. I have patents on entire lines of bullshit. So don't sit here and feed me a line of bullshit and think that I'm not going to recognize it as one.

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Post Post #289 (ISO) » Sun Aug 26, 2007 4:59 pm

Post by al_kohaulec »

That is an interesting point to bring up, Ecto, but I'm not sure it's enough in my eyes.

Anyways, to answer you BM, I won't go too in-depth into a reason, but I found myself very suspicious of Ecto and wanted him to claim first so he would be much more likely to screw up his claim. Which it seems he may have done.

I still want everybody else to claim first though. And we need to come to an agreement on when we want to claim targets as well, whether while we claim or after we claim.
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Post Post #290 (ISO) » Sun Aug 26, 2007 6:17 pm

Post by Haschel Cedricson »

I was gone this weekend because I was at PAX. It looks like a lot has gone down since then, so I'm gonna get caught up now. Don't replace me!
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Post Post #291 (ISO) » Sun Aug 26, 2007 6:51 pm

Post by Haschel Cedricson »

Alright. I replaced in the middle of last night, so I was told that I had previously used my investigative one-shot on BM and got an innocent. I also was told that I had used up my rb power, but was not told who CES used it on. I do not know which nights either of these occured on.

Ecto's claim makes no sense; as BM stated, the only scenario where BM is scum requires the alko is also scum, and that's just too many scum roles for a 12-player game. Also, isn't vig a standard claim for scum since it can "explain" why they targeted a dead player?

Unvote, Vote: Ectomancer


Things are starting to make sense here.
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Post Post #292 (ISO) » Mon Aug 27, 2007 12:20 am

Post by Battle Mage »

roflmao. :lol:
it is true that AlKo revealed his target before i actually specified it, but you are misrepresenting me here.
In fact, i claimed a GUILTY INVESTIGATION on AlKo. I did this to try and trap AlKo into claiming Miller or something similar. However the guilty investigation i got on him, was actually that he targetted the victim on the previous night, and his claim fitted that. Now, i can see why you might think this isn't 100% foolproof confirmation of me being town, but srsly, do you really think i would blag that, and not even get AlKo lynched. You are basically suggesting that i'm not only the stupidest guy ever to have lived, but also the luckiest.

In case you hadn't noticed Ecto, i said i had evidence to suggest AlKo was scum. He had targetted the victim of NK ffs. I KNEW he had done that, and if you had read what i said, it is consistent with that.

But i dont need to explain myself to you. You now have FURTHER CONFIRMATION that i am a Tracker, because you have admitted that you did target me last night (something which you hadnt admitted to directly upto the point of my claim). So, you think i am a Mafia Tracker?
BS.
Who did you target on the first night?

Oh and on the topic of mass-claiming, i really dont think it is necessary, today at least. we have revealed 2 potential lynches. We havent outted the person who prevented the kill last night, and i'd rather we continued to keep him hidden, so we have some security at night.

I'm happy to let HC live until tomorrow at least. He still has 1-shot protection left, and so he could be very useful tonight. Besides, even if Ecto WAS telling the truth, his role is significantly inferior to HC's claim, and as such, Ecto is the play today.

BM
Ectomancer wrote:You aren't half as clever as you think you are BM. I am still awaiting the rest of the claims. No, I dont trust you in the least, and you flatter yourself if you think I will ever "suck up" to you. In fact, you were singled out in my question about why you werent dead specifically because I didn't trust you. Why? You screwed up.

Lets look at claims after knowledge was divulged shall we?

Remember BM claiming a Guilty investigation?

Then he claimed that he wasnt a cop, he was a tracker and then he divulged his target and who they targeted
after Alko had already divulged that information
.
Battle Mage wrote:speaking of avoiding things, why are you avoiding the question posed to you?
Believe me, i have a VERY good reason for asking for this information. If you are a Watcher, you can be 99.9% sure that i am town,
simply because i knew who you targetted 2 nights back.
Please trust me, and say who you WATCHED last night.
Remember, i don't want your result, just the name of your target.

thanks,
BM
I bolded the relevant part. Uhh say what? Alko said who he targeted, NOT BM.

And then suddenly we have BM claiming that he is confirmed by Alko and starts trying to dominate the direction of our game.

Dude, you dont have to be a tracker to tell people who they targeted after they tell you who it was. It also doesn't take a genius to say they targeted me after I said I tried to kill you. I doubted you being a tracker to begin with, so your "I've got information that you arent a Vig didnt bother me at all".
However, everyone else notice that he used Alko's statement and target to claim tracker, then browbeat me until I got irritated at him and spilled the beans that I targeted him last night, and the LOW AND BEHOLD! HE TARGETED ME!
Why do you think I wanted claims out before we got around to the rest of the information? You are trying to bully a victory BM, and Im not having it.


vote Battle Mage
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Survived to the end and won - 11
Nightkilled - 10
Survived to the end and lost - 6
Day-elimmed by majority - 4

winrate as scum: 78%
winrate as town: 55%
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Post Post #293 (ISO) » Mon Aug 27, 2007 5:39 am

Post by Ectomancer »

I targeted Chaotic Diablo. He didn't die, and I got no message back indicating that I was roleblocked.
And you are right. Im not a Vig. Im a 3rd SK (I think, remembering nobody died. I need the rest of the claims and targets to figure wtf is going on with my role).
Im supposed to be offing Mr Boddy and his informants so I can safely resume my escort business.

I'm wondering how many other SK'd we have.
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Post Post #294 (ISO) » Mon Aug 27, 2007 9:25 am

Post by al_kohaulec »

Yay! a claim. This is getting to be easy.

Thinking about what BM said, he's right, we don't need to force a massclaim from everybody right now since the end result, finding scum, has already occured :P.


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Post Post #295 (ISO) » Mon Aug 27, 2007 11:23 am

Post by Ectomancer »

Im not scum. Im an SK. That means I contribute to the number that opposes scum. You would be better off finding the main group against the town. It's already been proven that you arent up against an entire cluster of SK's because we managed to get a Godfather. I'd look at the numbers again if I were you.
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Post Post #296 (ISO) » Mon Aug 27, 2007 11:41 am

Post by al_kohaulec »

And there must be one or two goons under him. With the number of SKs, should we really expect there to be two goons as well?

It's possible, but I find it highly unlikely.
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Post Post #297 (ISO) » Mon Aug 27, 2007 11:49 am

Post by DragonsofSummer »

BM you act as if you believe HC is claiming his actual role... Let me ask you... In your opinion, with a game this full of power roles so far... why the hell would there be a Jack of all Trades? It doesn't really make that much sense to me. Plus it feels like a claim that definite scum would make to just try to blend in a little bit. Plus if you notice he was perfectly happy to melt into the background and let you push ecto, and as he says with vig... wouldn't Jack of all Trades be easy to say as scum. You can basically claim anything you want with who you targeted, and your buddies won't out you on an investigation, no one will ever know if you protected or not, and for the rb its the same story as the investigation. Not to mention the fact that him knowing who was targeted with the investigation, but not the roleblock, and not knowing which was used on which night is rather peculiar in my opinion... Every game I've ever replaced into the mod has given me every piece of information that they have... night choices for each night, and their targets and results... His claim is extremely fishy in my opinion... even worse than ecto's claim, and what really strikes me is no one is even questioning anything about him except me.

I do realize Ecto has changed his claim, but since we cannot be certain he is lying even now, and I know that HC is scum (even if he is telling the truth about his claim which I doubt) I am still more comfortable killing him today.
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Post Post #298 (ISO) » Mon Aug 27, 2007 12:31 pm

Post by al_kohaulec »

DoS, I have had reserved suspicions of HC's claim as well. And I also have some things to respond to in that after we hear more from DoS, but how can you choose to question an SK claim? What would he be trying to cover up if he's lying? The only thing I can think of is Jester, which sounds proposterous in this type of game.

BTW, I'm one of those players who considers SK a scum role.
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Post Post #299 (ISO) » Mon Aug 27, 2007 2:23 pm

Post by Ectomancer »

al_kohaulec wrote:BTW, I'm one of those players who considers SK a scum role.
I see.
I'm still not the play.
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