Newbie 442 - Game Over

[White]

Alright well, in the interest of seeking mafia and trying to keep up relations i'm willing to start anew.

I'll go ahead and re-read the game too just to get a feeling of how things are going and i'll go from there with you. Are you by any chance Aspergers?

Unvote: LML

[MeMe]

Vote Count

:

Peter Venkman

(1):

cheeky-little-asian

Snix

(1):

IH

not voting

(5):

Chromagnum, LoudmouthLee, Peter Venkman, Snix, White

Lynch at four.

[Snix]

Anybody heard from Cheeky?

[LoudmouthLee]

Alright well, in the interest of seeking mafia and trying to keep up relations i'm willing to start anew.

I'll go ahead and re-read the game too just to get a feeling of how things are going and i'll go from there with you. Are you by any chance Aspergers?

Unvote: LML

Why must you assume there's something wrong with me? I mean, God.. You make me not want to play this game.

For the record, I do NOT have Aspergers.

[Peter Venkman]

@Moderator>

Please prod/replace Cheeky. The game is still young and a replacement can catch up quickly.

-Peter

[Peter Venkman]

Good, glad I have alerted you. I know I'm not exempt from suspicion, BUT using "Hey he's helpful, he could be scum!" is wifom. Of course it doesn't clear me.
...
If you don't think it is a null tell, feel free to go over my other newbie games where I have done this regardless of alignment

Please read Post 24 for my specific thoughts.

While I understand your helpful position, I also am very aware of the ability to hide behind it.

Offering "advice" is a good way to participate in the game without committing to scum hunting. It pads your post count and makes you appear active in the game. I find it interesting that you insist the "adviser" role is a null tell.

IGMEOY

IH

-Peter

[IH]

Ok Peter. Please tell me how it's not equally likely I am town as I am scum for being an advisor.

[MeMe]

cheeky-little-asian has been prodded.

[Peter Venkman]

If my only posts were discussing the merits of delicious cheeseburgers would you find that suspicious?

Discussing game theory is a great way to

appear

involved in the game while avoiding discussing relevant information specific to the game.

I don't play this game looking for "scum tells." Every bit of information gathered from a player is a thread that builds the tapestry of his character. When playing in this way there are no "null tells" because each bit of information works in conjunction to the next. In this fashion I assemble an opinion regarding each player.

Because of my playstyle your "null tell" comment keeps rubbing me raw.

All

information is useful, yet you keep telling me that it isn't.

-Peter

[White]

Why must you assume there's something wrong with me?

What in the world? I don't man! Having Aspergers is a way for me to understand what's going on. It's a mental condition, not a

problem

.

For the rest of you, Apergers is a mental condition that makes it hard for the owner of the mind to see things other than black and white, all or nothing. I have it and it also means we fight for what we believe in very hard and tend to be very logical.

LML, I was simply curious, if I didn't ask i'd never know man.

Now i'm just curious here, in the beginning you were hard and adamant like usual but....now you're being all...victimy...it's just strange. LML, who do you think is the most suspicious person atm?

I have read most of the game and geez, thank you all for not lynching me right off the bat because I asked for it.

[IH]

If my only posts were discussing the merits of delicious cheeseburgers would you find that suspicious?

Discussing game theory is a great way to appear involved in the game while avoiding discussing relevant information specific to the game.

I don't play this game looking for "scum tells." Every bit of information gathered from a player is a thread that builds the tapestry of his character. When playing in this way there are no "null tells" because each bit of information works in conjunction to the next. In this fashion I assemble an opinion regarding each player.

Because of my playstyle your "null tell" comment keeps rubbing me raw. All information is useful, yet you keep telling me that it isn't.

Untrue. It is just simply untrue that every peice of information tells the alignment of a player. Like my newbie intro post. I make a carbon copy of that post in every newbie game. Therefore it indicates NOTHING of alignment.

Also you cannot say I have just been discussing game theory, going over my posts. I have determined that white is closer to being town. Also most of my posts have applied the game theory, not just discussed it I believe.

There is such a thing as a null tell my friend that indicates nothing.

For your statement to be correct we'd have to take EVERY comment, EVERY piece of information as a factor towards someone's alignment. While this sounds nice, it is unrealistic. It's like newbies following someone. It is just as likely to be done from newbie town as newbie scum.

Also you get into some extreme wifom situations playing like that.

I think

slight FoS:Peter

For the rest of you, Apergers is a mental condition that makes it hard for the owner of the mind to see things other than black and white, all or nothing. I have it and it also means we fight for what we believe in very hard and tend to be very logical.

I'm unsure about being very logical, as you can have an extremely skewed version of something if there are no shades of grey.

[White]

LML, i've been thinking about your offer and i'd really like to know something.

You seemed to bandwagon me at the beginning. Now i'm not offended or anything but just thinking, you voted me to put me at -3 but then as the bandwagon lost steam....you offered a fresh start. Now this as a whole seems to be great.

But what were your motives? I know you said, "If you are pro-town (as I know that I am), I think we're both probably doing the town a major disservice here." which works for me but you never ever gave me those reasons for why you voted me.

Now i'm not going to rail on that case but to give you a fresh start and just

ignore

your previous posts would be incredibly stupid.

So i'm not going to FoS you or anything but

what were your reasons for voting me earlier??

IH, what do you think of LML's kind proposal to me?

[IH]

I'm unsure about LML's proposal myself. I think at first LML was treading normally, and White took it heavily, but now you both seem like you're walking on eggshells after your "truce".

I think all I have deduced is that your not scumbuddies together.

[cheeky-little-asian]

What is prod?

[LoudmouthLee]

I have tried to keep the peace here, and it doesn't seem to be working.

Mod, please PM me at your earliest convienence.

[Snix]

It's like a cattle prod, to the face. It means to post, maybe.

[Peter Venkman]

Red =

Peter Venkman.

Untrue. It is just simply untrue that every peice of information tells the alignment of a player.

You misunderstand. Every post builds my understanding of you as a player. While that information might not be pertinent to alignment, it preps me for later. For example, I know White isn't to be trusted with his admitted attempts to undermine players. While he may actively be hunting scum I cannot know if his motives are based on his perception of scum or an attempt to discredit someone simply because he disagrees with them. I think that is very important information, even if it isn't relevant to his role.

Like my newbie intro post. I make a carbon copy of that post in every newbie game. Therefore it indicates NOTHING of alignment.

That post might indicate nothing, however, this discussion is illuminating. I want to hear you shoot from the hip, not cut and paste your posts from other games

Also you cannot say I have just been discussing game theory,

(I have not)

going over my posts. I have determined that white is closer to being town. Also most of my posts have applied the game theory, not just discussed it I believe.

There is such a thing as a null tell my friend that indicates nothing.

I don't play looking for "scum tells." In fact, I think you play more like me than you are willing to admit. It is rare to find a useful "scum tell." Rather, you learn the nuances of a player than judge his actions based on those nuances. I see you doing it already with people you are familiar with.

For your statement to be correct we'd have to take EVERY comment, EVERY piece of information as a factor towards someone's alignment.

I try to. I find it rare that scum players do something so stupid that a single post in isolation is an indicator of their alignment.

While this sounds nice, it is unrealistic. It's like newbies following someone. It is just as likely to be done from newbie town as newbie scum.

What works for you and what works for me are different. I'll concede that my method might not be for everyone. If you really are interested in teaching newbies you might consider letting them hear another playstyle.

Also you get into some extreme wifom situations playing like that.

I think

slight FoS:Peter

[Peter Venkman]

What is prod?

Surely you have more questions of this game?

By the rules you agreed to, being gone for more than 48 hours requires notifying Meme. A prod is a way of notifying you that you have failed to meet the minimal requirements of this game. It is a polite warning.

Now that we have your attention, would you like to share your thoughts so far?

-Peter

[Peter Venkman]

IH, what do you think of LML's kind proposal to me?

Why do you keep deferring to IH?

There is another IC, you appear to just not like him. At this point in the game, I find it puzzling that you accept one's word at face value and reject the other's.

-Peter

[Peter Venkman]

Apergers is a mental condition that makes it hard for the owner of the mind to see things other than black and white, all or nothing. I have it and it also means we fight for what we believe in very hard and tend to be very logical.

LML, I was simply curious, if I didn't ask i'd never know man.

Do you suffer from asshole-itis?

What? If I didn't ask, I'd never know! Man, you sure are sensitive if you take that as an insult.

-Peter

[White]

Why do you keep deferring to IH?

There is another IC, you appear to just not like him. At this point in the game, I find it puzzling that you accept one's word at face value and reject the other's.

Because he's the other most experienced player and I think he'd know more about LML's tendancies than any of the newbies. Peter, what do

you

think of his proposal?

What? If I didn't ask, I'd never know! Man, you sure are sensitive if you take that as an insult.

I didn't take it as an insult, it seemed to me that LML took it the wrong way. It was a simple inquiry that he seemed to take as a personal "What's wrong with you" thing. I wanted to clarify my intentions.

Cheeky seems to me to really just not care about the game, I think if he got on here and posted something more about the game i'd be more suspicious about him being a lurker mafia but it just seems like he doesn't care.

LML, will you PLEASE answer my question? It's really not that hard!

[Peter Venkman]

Because he's the other most experienced player and I think he'd know more about LML's tendancies than any of the newbies.

So?

What information do you have about IH's role, and LML's role? How do you know what one says about the other will be truth? accurate?

Assume both are Town: Neither knows anything in-game about the other.
Assume one is Scum: One will lie to you, the other will know nothing.
Assume both are Scum: Both will lie to you.

I don't know what information you could hope to gain from any of those scenarios that you couldn't gain from doing your own homework. If you want to know about anyone in this game you can search the forums by user name.

IH, how do you feel about White looking to you for cues?

Peter, what do

you

think of his proposal?

Uh, you said you were going to start fresh and he attempted to do the same for you? Than you insulted him and he is currently pouting. I dunno... you both are hard to read.

---

I really don't like how Cheeky isn't participating in this game. If he is town, than 33% of the participating players are scum and thus have a greater ability to manipulate the game. If he is scum, than we have no means to discern that. It has been about 24 hours since his last post. If he chooses to go another 24 hours without posting I ask he immediately be replaced, as he has directly broken the rules of the game twice.

-Peter

[Snix]

Do you suffer from asshole-itis?

What? If I didn't ask, I'd never know! Man, you sure are sensitive if you take that as an insult.

Wow, that was a bit unnecessary wouldn't you think? It didn't get anyone anywhere and was just a personal attack on White. He asked a serious-ish question and then explained that he had Aspergers and was just trying to figure things out. Sure it wasn't very tactful, but it wasn't an all out verbal assault like your's was.

You sorta give me the ''I'm angry at the world'' feel.

[LoudmouthLee]

Is there any way that I can handle this correctly? Am I to give you a free pass for everything you've done?

I'm a teacher. I work with various types of Autism on a regular basis. Without you expressing the fact that you have Aspergers, your comment came across as:

1) Insensitive to people with Autism.
2) Insensitive to me.

Without the knowledge you failed to deliver until after the fact, I took it the only way I know how.

Here's my problem with the game. White has been so damn confontational with me (with ad-hom attacks, appeal to emotion, et al) I have not had the ability to sort through this thread. White has taken over the thread. If White is pro-town, he has allowed the scum to hide in the background. I dislike it.

Vote: C-L-A

as he/she/it has not posted a single bit of content in this game. I wonder if CLA is just hanging out, watching White and Myself fight.

[White]

I don't know what information you could hope to gain from any of those scenarios that you couldn't gain from doing your own homework

Because no matter how much homework I do I can't get other peoples reactions to something unless either they volunteer them or they are requested of them. Now i'm requesting of the most experienced person and the one more likely to know LML or his play style.

Am I to give you a free pass for everything you've done?

No, absolutely not. I don't want a free pass at all. You offered a chance to start from scratch, that means to me to drop the votes but I completely believe there should be explanations where they weren't given previously. Now LML you're testing my patience, give me some darn reasons or gosh i'm going to have to vote you. Starting anew means I dropped my vote and started a new case from then on, based

from when we started anew

you have deliberately

refused

and ignored my inquiry for VERY SIMPLE DATA. Now if you feel so opposed to giving me reasons for why you voted me early on then give me reasons for NOT giving me reasons for why you voted me early on.

White has been so damn confontational with me

Oh? Do you mind your own "play style" being used against you? You love to be all confrontational but should I shoot your words back in your face?

I do come on strong. I put people's backs to the wall.

ANSWER THE BLOODY QUESTION!!

Vote: C-L-A as he/she/it has not posted a single bit of content in this game.

This here is very true, i'm not sure where they think they can be so neutral and get off with it but I still don't think it's worthy of a vote because they may have no idea what's going on and just not care and lynching them just for not caring seems to be a mistake to me. I'd rather lynch the right person (mafia) rather than a person that doesn't care and could very easily be a townie.

Now, i'd like to apologize right up front as i'm sure most of this post looks very agressive, insulting and confrontational. I'm in a sour mood as my life is really falling apart. It feels good to vent some so LML, i'm sorry if this came across rude. I'm sorry for using you as a punching bag, I just needed to get some of that out, please forgive me.