Micro 365 - ALL YEAR LONG haha see what i did there (over)

[Dr Pants]

Yes. It was the plan since the beginning. And not just this game. Every interaction you have ever had has been preparation for this moment.

[Not_Mafia]

Espresso why is your vote on Sala and what do you think of what Pants is saying about ac?

[Dr Pants]

What do you expect us to get out of this week? It seems we've reached a pretty natural conclusion to the day

by the time you made this post, you had made a single vote. It was on your second post of the game. You voted Sns and said "liking Naz more than Sns right now". You never expanded upon this read. However, you include a lot of points on scum game theory:

We should absolutely be hunting outside of our groups and I am wary of anyone suggesting we shouldn't.

This is a 7:2 mountainous game with a votimg mechanic. It is very comparible to regular game

Most of what you said can be said about any other game. I do not either, think so much of myself that people will sheep me, or, think so little of the others that they can't take others opinions and make their own decison. So I will be giving my reads and opinions on other groups.

Again. This just give scum an excuse to avoid relational tells. 7:2 is inherently scumsided, going in to a 4:1 (woth a conf town) tomorrow where we can't use any sort of associative would not be good for village's chances

And scum wouldn't want to lead? Can you explain what you mean a bit more please?

Scum aren't necessarily going to do what they should be doing and if he is scum he will naturally be more skittish and self-conscious about doing such things

And it was Not_Mafia, not Naz, that was pulling the "My group is all town thing":

Lol wtf. This game is hilarious. Getting the feeling more and more our group is the town group

Like Ac, he was pushing for action within the group of myself, Xay, and Maru, which seems to me to be more and more likely the

actual

town group:

Initial thoughts are that there is almost definitely a scum in Huckleberries. I lile Xayzeck, for the scumbutt I was thinking Pants initially for his seeming paranoia in RVS. Now leaning Maru, hated their opening and their Xayzeck read. Pants and Maru should be cross voting.

I'd still prefer a Pants lynch to a Maru one, I'm not crazy on either but it seems Pants is unlynchable for today.

Now for relational tells! This part is much more speculative, so if you only want to care about the top then thats cool.
Not Mafia is ok with an Ac lynch but would rather see an Espresso lynch:

The final group I have no concrete handle on, ac seems relaxed and natural so I'd say I prefer him to Sala but I also agree that regardless of what alignment Espresso's weird surrendering has come from, he is a WIFOM bomb that needs to be detonated pre-potenial LYLO

Not Mafia prefers an Ac lynch because he's "relaxed and natural". However, Espresso should go to avoid WIFOM. Note that this post was made

before

I had put any pressure on Ac. No one was scum reading his slot, so why did Not Mafia feel the need to bring this up?

The timing fits:
At the time of Ac entering the game, Not Mafia was set to be lynched, and Espresso had just made his "slip". The day could have easily ended there, or shortly after. But! What does Ac do?

Okay.

We have plenty of time til deadline so I am not gonna make a vote until I have solidified my reads.

Then, Naz moves his vote from Not Mafia to Sns in 324.
Ac's next post? His solidified list of reads:

OK
Dr Pants is still scum
Nazarene and Not Mafia are town, so snscompt1 is maybe scum / maybe town.
Salamence is town
Espresso I see as maybe town, maybe scum, but either way the ideal lynch candidate for my group.

Xay please vote for Pants instead of Maruchan. Like Nazarene said, everything Pants has done has been far too deliberate. And he's been subtly buddying up to you now, perhaps because he sees you're one of the few people townreading him.

I'm ready to hammer but I would like to see the Huckleberry group lynch change.

I want Not Mafia to be the lynch from his group

[Not_Mafia]

That case is purely conf. bias and pre flip associative. And how you went down the pre-flip associative road assuming ac was scum and arrived at me over Maru I don't know.

What do you expect us to get out of this week? It seems we've reached a pretty natural conclusion to the day

by the time you made this post, you had made a single vote. It was on your second post of the game. You voted Sns and said "liking Naz more than Sns right now". You never expanded upon this read. However, you include a lot of points on scum game theory:

We should absolutely be hunting outside of our groups and I am wary of anyone suggesting we shouldn't.

This is a 7:2 mountainous game with a votimg mechanic. It is very comparible to regular game

Most of what you said can be said about any other game. I do not either, think so much of myself that people will sheep me, or, think so little of the others that they can't take others opinions and make their own decison. So I will be giving my reads and opinions on other groups.

Again. This just give scum an excuse to avoid relational tells. 7:2 is inherently scumsided, going in to a 4:1 (woth a conf town) tomorrow where we can't use any sort of associative would not be good for village's chances

And scum wouldn't want to lead? Can you explain what you mean a bit more please?

Scum aren't necessarily going to do what they should be doing and if he is scum he will naturally be more skittish and self-conscious about doing such things

This "game theory" talk was what was solidifying my read as I saw him trying to dissuade discussion and potentially avoid any associative tells. And how is your case on me (formerly on Naz) not "game theory" talk?

And it was Not_Mafia, not Naz, that was pulling the "My group is all town thing":

Lol wtf. This game is hilarious. Getting the feeling more and more our group is the town group

Like Ac, he was pushing for action within the group of myself, Xay, and Maru, which seems to me to be more and more likely the

actual

town group:

Initial thoughts are that there is almost definitely a scum in Huckleberries. I lile Xayzeck, for the scumbutt I was thinking Pants initially for his seeming paranoia in RVS. Now leaning Maru, hated their opening and their Xayzeck read. Pants and Maru should be cross voting.

I'd still prefer a Pants lynch to a Maru one, I'm not crazy on either but it seems Pants is unlynchable for today.

Again, I'm not going to magically exclude my group from being my all town group read or dampen my scumreads within another group just to appease people and how they think this set-up should be played. I've played this set-up twice before and the view that we should all be hunting in all groups and offering who we think should be the lynch was pretty uncontested and I'm surprised it's become such a sticking point this game

Now for relational tells! This part is much more speculative, so if you only want to care about the top then thats cool.
Not Mafia is ok with an Ac lynch but would rather see an Espresso lynch:

The final group I have no concrete handle on, ac seems relaxed and natural so I'd say I prefer him to Sala but I also agree that regardless of what alignment Espresso's weird surrendering has come from, he is a WIFOM bomb that needs to be detonated pre-potenial LYLO

Not Mafia prefers an Ac lynch because he's "relaxed and natural". However, Espresso should go to avoid WIFOM. Note that this post was made

before

I had put any pressure on Ac. No one was scum reading his slot, so why did Not Mafia feel the need to bring this up?

Why did I feel the need to mention everyone in the group when giving my reads on that group? I'd say that question answers itself

The timing fits:
At the time of Ac entering the game, Not Mafia was set to be lynched, and Espresso had just made his "slip". The day could have easily ended there, or shortly after. But! What does Ac do?

For what is at least the third time now. Naz placed an RVS vote, then started attacking SNS immediately in their second post. You keep saying this and completely evade addressing it when I've pointed this out (and I believe Naz may have at one point too)

Okay.

We have plenty of time til deadline so I am not gonna make a vote until I have solidified my reads.

Then, Naz moves his vote from Not Mafia to Sns in 324.
Ac's next post? His solidified list of reads:

OK
Dr Pants is still scum
Nazarene and Not Mafia are town, so snscompt1 is maybe scum / maybe town.
Salamence is town
Espresso I see as maybe town, maybe scum, but either way the ideal lynch candidate for my group.

Xay please vote for Pants instead of Maruchan. Like Nazarene said, everything Pants has done has been far too deliberate. And he's been subtly buddying up to you now, perhaps because he sees you're one of the few people townreading him.

I'm ready to hammer but I would like to see the Huckleberry group lynch change.

I want Not Mafia to be the lynch from his group

If that post didn't highlight to you how Maru is the most likely partner should ac flip scum then... I don't know what to say.

You did highlight how weak a readslist that was though

[N]

Vote Count 1.16

Grape

Nazarene

(0)

Not_Mafia

(1) snscompt1

snscompt1

(2)

Not_Mafia, Nazarene

Not Voting

(0)

Huckleberry

Dr Pants

(0)

Maruchan

(1)

Xayzeck

Xayzeck

(1)

Maruchan

Not Voting

(1) Dr Pants

Ilama

ac1983fan

(0)

Espressojet

(1)

Salamence20

Salamence20

(1)

Espressojet

Not Voting

(1) ac1983fan

Deadline is in

(expired on 2014-08-05 00:21:55)

[ac1983fan]

Why do people want this day to end prematurely? I could end it at anytime but we have over a week left.
Xay, what could I do to convince you that Pants is scum?

Scum motivation.

Forced towniness is not scum motivation.

Dr Pants hasn't done anything that even looks like forced towniness. It's not that he's trying to act more town to avoid being mislynched - it's that he's trying to LOOK like he's acting pro-town when he isn't.

--
Dr Pants' proposal on page 17 is ridiculous. I'd be okay with trading lynching myself in exchange for Pants - but lynching obvtown/better player than me Naz in exchange would be pretty foolish. And why should we let scum dictate lynches?

Why is everyone townreading Pants for something that is so obviously engineered to create the townread? Seriously?!? He knew it would never actually happen...Come on folks.

Anyway.
VOTE: Espressojet.

[Xayzeck]

Dr Pants' proposal on page 17 is ridiculous. I'd be okay with trading lynching myself in exchange for Pants - but lynching obvtown/better player than me Naz in exchange would be pretty foolish. And why should we let scum dictate lynches?

Why is everyone townreading Pants for something that is so obviously engineered to create the townread? Seriously?!? He knew it would never actually happen...Come on folks.

Except this plan makes absolutely NO FUCKING SENSE if Pants is scum.

How blind are you? Heck, if you still stubbornly think Pants is scum, you should be ALL FOR the plan

[Not_Mafia]

Why do people want this day to end prematurely? I could end it at anytime but we have over a week left.
Xay, what could I do to convince you that Pants is scum?

Scum motivation.

Forced towniness is not scum motivation.

Dr Pants hasn't done anything that even looks like forced towniness. It's not that he's trying to act more town to avoid being mislynched - it's that he's trying to LOOK like he's acting pro-town when he isn't.

--
Dr Pants' proposal on page 17 is ridiculous. I'd be okay with trading lynching myself in exchange for Pants - but lynching obvtown/better player than me Naz in exchange would be pretty foolish. And why should we let scum dictate lynches?

Why is everyone townreading Pants for something that is so obviously engineered to create the townread? Seriously?!? He knew it would never actually happen...Come on folks.

Anyway.
VOTE: Espressojet.

You're willing to negotiate your lynch for Pants' yet you give him control of the hammer?

[Xayzeck]

You say you'd trade your head for Pants'

Why are you voting Espresso then? Shouldn't you wait for your group to vote you?

[Not_Mafia]

Dr Pants hasn't done anything that even looks like forced towniness. It's not that he's trying to act more town to avoid being mislynched - it's that he's trying to LOOK like he's acting pro-town when he isn't.

Also define what the extreme difference between is between these two that you can class his behaviour as all of one none of the other.

[ac1983fan]

No quotes here. Phoneposting. Sorry. Responding to posts 481-484 I think.

Of course the plan makes no sense for scum. But the town would also NEVER do it. Because regardless of who you think is town, you mut have a town read on at least one of those players. And unless you believed that player was in the all-town group, making that lynch deal is foolish. Plus, Pants was initially saying he would self vote as the hammer - knowing that Xay would never vote him and hoping that his unvoting of Maru combined with his "plan" would make him look town This was an act of a player who was desperate to look town. I don't believe for a second Pants actually wanted to go through with his plan.

Okay. I am not self voting, simple enough. Everyone has Pants squarely in the town corner now so nobody wants to lynch him. If others want to trade me for him then I am OK with that - I am not a good player so losing me is not a major loss. I don't wanna let scum dictate the lynch though.

So okay the difference between Pants behavior and actual town behavior is that actual town gambits result in authentic reads. Pants tossed his reads out the window immediately after each of the player's following posts - so he got
no information from his "gambit." And now his plan just solidifies his fakeness to me.

Anyway. Dr Pants needs to die.

[Maruchan]

ac.

you're spouting that Pants is scum and he needs to die.

and you JUST gave him the hammer in a cross vote between me and xayzeck.



Because I don't like pants having a hammer at the moment and ac was stupid giving it to him

[Maruchan]

UNVOTE: (tagfail)

[Dr Pants]

VOTE: Dr Pants

A big round of applause to Ac, and Not Mafia, for confirming my suspicions of them.

Not Mafia, here's why Maru cant be scum: Scum wouldn't town read their partner as they are about to get lynched. Much more likely, scum town reads town as they are about to get lynched, and sets up another town as a goat.

Ac. You have the all town group right? Im scum right? Then this should be easy for you. Its a no risk proposal if you are telling the truth.

[Maruchan]

somebody fucking unvote and get xayzeck off of the hammer.

[Not_Mafia]

Not Mafia, here's why Maru cant be scum: Scum wouldn't town read their partner as they are about to get lynched. Much more likely, scum town reads town as they are about to get lynched, and sets up another town as a goat.

Scum don't try to negotiate a lynch off their partner? Just because he's not doing what you view as optimal scum play in his situation doesn't mean anything.

[Dr Pants]

Xay wouldn't hammer. He's been town reading me all game, and for him to change now would be ludicrous.

Espresso and Salamance need to vote for Ac.

Dr Pants' proposal on page 17 is ridiculous. I'd be okay with trading lynching myself in exchange for Pants - but lynching obvtown/better player than me Naz in exchange would be pretty foolish.

So Ac will do it but doesnt want it to be Naz. Good thing I changed my mind there! What does he say when he finds out I no longer want Naz? Is he still cool with it?

Okay. I am not self voting, simple enough. Everyone has Pants squarely in the town corner now so nobody wants to lynch him. If others want to trade me for him then I am OK with that - I am not a good player so losing me is not a major loss. I don't wanna let scum dictate the lynch though.

Turns out I was the one with the balls to follow through, and Ac was the one who was too scared. What's wrong Ac?

[Dr Pants]

Not Mafia, here's why Maru cant be scum: Scum wouldn't town read their partner as they are about to get lynched. Much more likely, scum town reads town as they are about to get lynched, and sets up another town as a goat.

Scum don't try to negotiate a lynch off their partner? Just because he's not doing what you view as optimal scum play in his situation doesn't mean anything.

Scum loves to bus. Scum hates to be the focus of a town lynch. Shouting "Dr Pants is scum, Maru is town", then having Maru flip scum, confirming me as town, would be a terrible situation for scum to be in.

[Not_Mafia]

Again, just because that's what you would do in his situation is meaningless. Blanket statements about bussing is pointless as not everyone is bus happy and a lot of people are very bus averse.

And what will be your reads if AC flips town?

[ac1983fan]

Fine.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: ac1983fan.

[Dr Pants]

And what will be your reads if AC flips town?

If Ac flips town, Salamance is the best lynch from this group. If NM flips town, he likely has the town group. If both flip town, its probably Xay over Maru, but I'm not positive.

However, I am very confident in my read on Ac

[Salamence20]

VOTE: AC

Why are we still on D1?

[Maruchan]

Salamence why are you that quick to switch your vote off of espresso? Seems kind of wishy washy to me

[Nazarene]

I am here. My thoughts have not changed.

There is no way in hell I would ever vote for NM, who is one of my strong townreads. In case the reasons why are not obvious to you, I will gladly elaborate upon request.

I fail to see any benefit whatsoever in the kind of association speculation being presented as arguments in the last two pages. NM explained why that is dumb already, so I will not.

I want Day 1 to end, and I maintain that the groups should decide within themselves who gets lynched. This is the only way to guarantee that scum does not influence the lynch in the all-town group and idiocy within one group does not infect the others, which is clearly happening.

I am happy to answer any specific questions or provide thoughts or reads on any players, but I am, frankly, bored.

BTW I still have not looked at Ilama group that closely since the espressojet slip debacle, but I can if someone wants me too. Just from reading the last two pages, I would say that I would not resolve the indecision that has plagued it since the beginning of the game, though.

[Dr Pants]

What has Not Mafia done that makes you town read him?