Event Card Mafia (Game Over)

[zMuffinMan]

if i were a multi-vig, there are about 15 people i'd shoot tonight

[zMuffinMan]

like seriously, if a multivig exists, i want you to go fucking insane on this playlist and shoot everyone in the fucking game with less than 20 posts (with the possible exception of bbmolla who just replaced in but holy fuck why is he already prod dodging?)

and while you're at it, feel free to take shots at most of the people with over 20 posts as well

when the fucking moderator is in the top 10 posters of a large game D1, something is wrong

[talah]

@Talah: Why is BRO scummy? I understand that he called KA scummy, but is there anything else?

I think that to use the reasoning that KA knew TIP's alignment, the normal train of though would be that they must be buddies. That's not what BRO arrived at, however.

Let me put it this way.

KA as scum reads something and presumes it's an example of them as town. BRO as town reads the same thing and presumes it's an example of them as scum. BRO wonders why KA reached a faulty conclusion.

His argument against KA at that point is that KA must have made this mistake because he knows TIP's alignment is town. But the more compelling thought when you think through it that far, would be that KA knows TIP's alignment is

scum

. Because KA as scum would be more likely to be surprised by a scumbuddy posting something where he was scum from another game, rather than a townie posting the same thing.

However BRO doesn't mention anything of the sort which leads me to thinking that BRO is necessarily presuming -something- about TIP's alignment, and in the face of extreme lack of content aside from that one push, I'm tending scum on BRO (and I've already asked him to clarify but apparently he doesn't want to post in this game).

Why the change on AGar?

I've been cautiously townreading AGar for some time now. What change are you talking about and why is this a question worth asking?

How is DeathNote offering to catch a bullet town?

Do scum offer to be vigged when they don't know whether or not there's a vig in the setup?

Why is KK your fallover after BRO?

His posting looks uncomfortable with itself and a bit overly defensive. His votes have been off as well just from memory. I'm not sold on his as scum but if there's support for his lynch I'm happy to go there.

you also have TIP and AD as other slight scum reads?

Yeah that's right, and I'd also be happy enough to lynch Venmar and Deltawave today which I think I mentioned, also slightly agreeing with zMuffin above that there seems to be a fair bit of dead weight in this game which is fine for lynching.

Regarding TIP, I doubt that there's enough support for his lynch today, because generally people find him to be a character and want to keep him around if there's a chance he might be town (which is always the case Day 1). I tend to take the same attitude with people like Nacho and Mastin (and others I guess) Day 1 so I understand that kind of reasoning. I also have an incredibly bad track record of leading lynches and being correct, whereas I have an incredibly good success rate sheeping my townreads onto successful lynches.

Regarding AD - I'm waiting for more content which I doubt is going to eventuate today but I might consider lynching him. It looks pretty unlikely to happen, though.

Why is Reck a bad lynch today?

There's not really enough from him to read him one way or another and he's actually promised more content if he can effectively lurk out today. Whatever. I think there are better options and I think that pressing for his lynch will just cause him to replace so it's a waste of time with deadline only a couple of days out.

[talah]

Let the talah votes pile.
I'll answer questions today.

List of nullreads please.

[Juls]

Just putting it out there...talah 752 is the most town post I have read from her.

Question though, why is reck off the table but AD and Deltawave, who have also had very little activity? I don't think we learn enough from any of the lurkers.

[talah]

I suppose you mean but not AD and Deltawave.

tbqh AD is effectively off the table for me today but if a wagon was to form on him and townreads agreed I wouldn't hesitate just for that marginal inclination that AD isn't doing anything serious in this game. Deltawave would be a lurker lynch plus I think he voted me quite a while ago sheeping TIP who I truly believe is unsheepable at this point. I'm town, scum want to lynch town, he's useless, so nullish will lynch. It's a lot better to have a lynch than not because largely town decide the lynch.

Are we able to push a lynch candidate forward between us? I don't have any huge scumpings from you at this stage and reasonable arguments are reasonable. I intend to remain active throughout this game and for some reason scum hate for me to be alive historically so I'd expect to be dead within the next couple of nights anyway. Do you like zMuffin for town? I'm thinking of switching back to Venmar just because nothing else seems viable.

[Juls]

I do think muffin is town. I feel Venmar is town mainly because he and I have shared opinions on you.

Talah, in all seriousness, you can't possibly be naive enough to think that if someone suspects you as scum they must be scum? If you are town, and you believe that then that is just bad. If your argument were that TIP was tunneling I might get it but I don't understand this position. Have you, as town, ever had town target you? Did you react this same way?

[zMuffinMan]

I feel Venmar is town mainly because he and I have shared opinions on you

you think venmar is town because he thinks talah is scum?

or what "opinions" are you referring to?

[talah]

Well good if you think muffin is town and all other pushes are ineffectual then why isn't sheeping him a good thing? Venmar and you sharing an opinion is no good when his opinion has no meat behind it. He's literally just said post x is scummy, I want to lynch talah. Am I wrong?

Do you think I don't address it when people think I'm scum when I'm not? I mean it seems like you think I have the opinion that anyone that scumreads me must be scum, where I don't. But I am a scum magnet because (I think) I tend to be fairly abrasive and push on things which polite-town don't, plus my reads in general are pretty good recently. It's not naïveté, it's just ignoring a bullshit argument that omgus is scummy - I find town do it more than scum and I think holding back on your inclinations that someone voting you is scummy because they voted you is something which is easily exploitable by scum.

[talah]

And yeah I've been involved in TvT shitfights in every single game I've played as town. What TIP's doing is not a shitfight. He's not engaging at all. He's trolling. I dunno if you're reading that as town, but I'm not.

[talah]

UNVOTE: Papa Zito
VOTE: Venmar

My position for today is clear, and you effectively have a double vote today zMuffin.
Back probably once before deadline.

[TheIrishPope]

Reading last two pages to see what questions people gave me.

[Juls]

The opinion that she is scum. Post 527 to 532 in particular led me to think Venmar was town and talah was scum.

[Venmar]

Guys, deadline is a thing, can we lynch Talah?

[zMuffinMan]

The opinion that she is scum. Post 527 to 532 in particular led me to think Venmar was town and talah was scum.

you agree with venmar that 362 was a scummy post?

532 is about the only thing in venmar's ISO that makes sense to me as a town~ish reaction from him, but then talah's vote on him was incredibly meh and i'm not really sure he'd have reacted any differently as scum to something like that

[Juls]

Well good if you think muffin is town and all other pushes are ineffectual then why isn't sheeping him a good thing? Venmar and you sharing an opinion is no good when his opinion has no meat behind it. He's literally just said post x is scummy, I want to lynch talah. Am I wrong?

Do you think I don't address it when people think I'm scum when I'm not? I mean it seems like you think I have the opinion that anyone that scumreads me must be scum, where I don't. But I am a scum magnet because (I think) I tend to be fairly abrasive and push on things which polite-town don't, plus my reads in general are pretty good recently. It's not naïveté, it's just ignoring a bullshit argument that omgus is scummy - I find town do it more than scum and I think holding back on your inclinations that someone voting you is scummy because they voted you is something which is easily exploitable by scum.

I find you focus primarily on things that surround you. If person A thinks you are town, you think they are town. If person B thinks you are scum, you think they are scum. I think you have an inflated opinion of your towniness. You should probably look at the fact that you are in the top 5 in a 25 person game of people thinking you are scum. How does that make you uber towny? You can't think that they are all scum. You can't think that scum are making an effectual argument because, let's face it...I'm your most verbose critic and you don't seem to think I am scum. Tip is tunneling...I don't think he is really swaying any arguments. It appears to me that most people who are voting you are doing it for their own reasons.

I don't particularly like to sheep. I feel I am fairly pragmatic though. I will lynch most anyone by deadline so long as it isn't my strong town reads.

[zMuffinMan]

it also irks me a little that i've been voting him for over a week now and he hasn't really been pushing back on my vote (he questioned it a little in the beginning, but since then nothing)

i dunno exactly what i'm expecting here (maybe for him to call me stupid or tell me i'm really, really wrong or something) but i was expecting at least something

i don't really know what to make of him ignoring stuff and continually pushing talah but not really adding anything to why he thinks talah is scum

[talah]

Alright let me put it this way - Venmar wants to lynch me - why?

[talah]

^yeah that

[Juls]

The opinion that she is scum. Post 527 to 532 in particular led me to think Venmar was town and talah was scum.

you agree with venmar that 362 was a scummy post?

532 is about the only thing in venmar's ISO that makes sense to me as a town~ish reaction from him, but then talah's vote on him was incredibly meh and i'm not really sure he'd have reacted any differently as scum to something like that

It's not particularly scummy but I don't agree with the argument talah makes in the post.

[Juls]

I kinda saw it as Venmar pressuring talah to get a reaction, and he did.

[zMuffinMan]

let's face it...I'm your most verbose critic and you don't seem to think I am scum

that kind of destroys your argument that talah's scum reading people calling him scum, no?

[TheIrishPope]

Holy shit TIP, that looks an awful lot like your cult meta.
Why do you assume that I would be newbscum in this game?

@Reck - do you remember Hip Hop Mafia and how I said in the scum QT that I attacked you because I *knew* you wouldn't be lynched? TIP is acting to my scum meta, what do you think about that?

It actually looks nothing like my cult meta lol
What is my "cult meta"
You're newbscum because this is your second scum game as you said previously

And now you use your scum meta so it applies to me? Hypocrite much

"Everyone who scumreads me is scum waaaaaah"

Except me.

You are irrelevant to this game.

To whoever asked me if I equate Cult (third party) with Mafia, the answer is no. However, in the game TIP posted there was no mafia, only cult and town. So in that instance, yes, I do equate them.

As Cult you have no partners, and as scum you do have partners, so the two are completely different and should not be "equalizisied"
I know it's equated bitch gtfo

What are the reasons for scumreading me?

You came in early game with scumreads based on crap reasoning and then just sat on them and coasted. I could maybe see the first coming from town TIP, but I'd then expect to see you interacting with the game more and to see your reads evolving. They're not, and you're coasting on your earlier posts. That's indicative of TIP-scum.

That's actually pretty good reasoning.
I think the amount of lurkers in this game is really not letting me go to my fullest potential with reads and such, day two or three you'll see more of the revered "best town performance" TIP
If the scum could please kill the lurkers first I'd appreciate it

I am probably inclined to lynch tip at this point on the grounds that I think talah is town.

And thiiiiiis is where I knew Iecerint was scum.


More incoming.

[Juls]

let's face it...I'm your most verbose critic and you don't seem to think I am scum

that kind of destroys your argument that talah's scum reading people calling him scum, no?

It's more that she only focuses on people surrounding her. I tend to think she is not pushing me because it would be a hard sell.

[TheIrishPope]

All right. I just read through the iso's of the top 5 contenders for lynch, and here's a short summary of each (according to Jules), because I haven't really been active in a while.

IN FIFTH PLACE: TIP
-Votes Talah in RVS
-Dislikes Talah and Qwints
-Says Talah is "manufacturing reads"
-Says muffin is town
-Wants reck to be town (but doesn't say that he is scum ?)

Most of his posts are minor pushes in one direction or another, but 400 and 643 both seem pretty town to me.
Not scum to me.

-Yeah
-Definitely
-Correct
-Muffin is indeed town
-I asked why reck couldn't be town, I have him as null for the most part