Mini 1568: Another Awesome Alliteration Adventure (over)

[MTD]

I call Cho as a Marangal alt.

Nvm I take that back, I came to the conclusion, that she is, indeed, not an alt.

[N]

affair

noun
1. anything done or to be done; anything requiring action or effort; business; concern:

an affair of great importance.

2.affairs, matters of commercial or public interest or concern; the transactions of public or private business or finance:

affairs of state; Before taking such a long trip you should put all your affairs in order.

3.an event or a performance; a particular action, operation, or proceeding:

When did this affair happen?

4.thing; matter (applied to anything made or existing, usually with a descriptive or qualifying term):

Our new computer is an amazing affair.

5.a private or personal concern; a special function, business, or duty:

That's none of your affair.

Vote Count 1.04

toolenduso

(0)

The Betting Pool

(0)

caledfwitch

(0)

mnemonicdevice

(0)

Jargonaut

(0)

Dunhamganger

(1) The Betting Pool

MTD

(1) Dunhamganger

Elyse

(0)

T S O

(2) Cho, Jargonaut

Riptide

(2) mnemonicdevice, Burning_Earth

Cho

(4)

MTD, T S O, Riptide, Egg

Burning_Earth

(0)

Egg

(1) caledfwitch

Not Voting

(2) Elyse, toolenduso

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

Deadline is in

(expired on 2014-05-03 21:42:05)

[T S O]

I'm not arrogant. As in, I'm not going to be condescending for no reason (Thor). I just don't have a problem calling shit out.

[T S O]

I can show you my scum meta and my town meta, if you want.

[T S O]

Time for TSO's mighty CHO BACKTRACK POST OF SCUMMINESS.

[T S O]

Also to all my

haters

people calling me out for not having logic: at least copy Elyse and have a fair argument so I can convince you/you convince me (hard to do, I'll admit). How can I be expected to see my own "faulty logic" if you refuse to explain it to me?

[MTD]

Hm, "I am not arrogant" and "I am not afraid of calling shit out" are not connected at all IMO.
Also I said nothing like your logic was faulty in general, just that it is not always sound.

I would discuss this at length, but why should I when it doesn't pose an immediate danger to town? It would just derail the conversation. All I said is that this was my impression from some other of your games I read, and at some degree this one as well. Also this obviously doesn't mean I wouldn't consider your cases as much, just that it wouldn't surprise me to find things not entirely adding up...
One example that does affect me at the moment (although it has already been discussed to some extent) is this:

Why would Town do that? Why would Town put themselves in their own "Unlynchable" pool? It's more likely to come from Scum than from Town, in my opinion, because it's a rather sneaky thing to do.

First you say it is scummy, then Elyse points out that it doesn't make sense as scum, then you say it didn't make sense as town

either

, ending up at it doesn't make sense anyway. So why is it scummy then? But as I said, it has nothing to do with your alignment, in this case just with me disagreeing with that reason for Cho-scum.

Actually I don't think Cho is scum at this point.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: caled
Has really not done anything that remotely resembles scumhunting, and I find that unlynchable-PR-speculation weirder the longer I think about it.
@caled: Who is scum?

[T S O]

There's motivation to do that, we can agree. It's either Town or Scum. I'm very sure it's not Town.

Tonight, I'll post my full case, and you can all critique it and vote Cho, preferably the latter.

[Egg]

Elyse, you're gonna have to explain to me why asking questions is scummy.

Burning, why iis L-1 on Cho "fine" as you put it? Why aren't you voting Cho?

Caled, I wouldn't worry about setup spec this early. Let's just find out who the scummiest player is and run them up within the next 5 to 10 pages.

[T S O]

Egg, who's Charter?

[Egg]

I actually haven't seen Charter in a game in quite a while but I got very familiar with his play and you just happen to be reminding me of him.

[T S O]

Cool.

[Elyse]

First you say it is scummy, then Elyse points out that it doesn't make sense as scum, then you say it didn't make sense as town

either

, ending up at it doesn't make sense anyway. So why is it scummy then? But as I said, it has nothing to do with your alignment, in this case just with me disagreeing with that reason for Cho-scum.

^^
But I will put this to rest until TSO posts his Cho analysis.

Elyse, you're gonna have to explain to me why asking questions is scummy.

Asking irrelevant questions like "why the third vote on Egg on page 3???" is scummy because it makes it look like he's scumhunting when he's actually just asking a dumb question.

[Egg]

I don't see a problem with asking for a reason for a vote regardless of the stage of the game.

[Elyse]

I already explained myself twice so if you still don't understand it I don't know what more I can say.

[Riptide]

Elyse - Why do you think we would want to appear to be scumhunting in our second post?

[Dunhamganger]

Shouldn't two heads theoretically be

less

obtuse than one?

[Burning_Earth]

Moar votes on riptide plz

[Dunhamganger]

Yeah I'm in 2 it.

Unvote

Vote: Riptide

.

[T S O]

Spoiler: The Votes That Made Them Unlynchable

VOTE: toolenduso

VOTE: Riptide

UNVOTE:
VOTE: MTD

That vote looked like you didn't want to step on toes and instead of commenting on another vote (I think mnemonic's Riptide vote was good), you said the first person to post is scum. It's like you're trying to keep us in RVS.

I am 100% confident that Cho, Elyse, and mnemonicdevice are Town for their votes. Accordingly, they are now Town Day 1 Unlynchables.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: MTD

The first thing to note about post #27 is that Cho has inserted herself in there. This is not a Town thing to do. The Theory of Mind states that Cho understands she doesn't need to place herself in that group, primarily because, excluding her, nobody else thinks she should be in it on her current actions, but also because she knows she doesn't have to do it - it's overcompensating to appear Town. There is no need to call herself Unlynchable on page 2. Elyse and I are at odds at this one, but even she can't explain the motivation or rationale behind someone needing to do that as Town. There is none.

Something else that no-one seems to understand is the placing of mnemonicdevice in the Unlynchable section. The only post he'd had up until then was a naked vote on Riptide - not the stuff I would expect of someone I was calling Unlynchable. However, after reading through, I understand why mnemonicdevice was placed in this category.

Cho seems to have placed great faith in Elyse very quickly. It's easy to overlook, but in Elyse's #25 she compliments mnemonic's vote. This is the reason he's been placed in this exclusive section. Not any observation of Cho's, but a passing remark by Elyse.

Cho is hardsheeping a RVS read by someone with 2 posts, on page 2.

Spoiler: Reaction to Pressure

T S O

, how are we out of RVS now? Wasn't it already so earlier?

This is another example of her unwarranted iron-clad confidence in Elyse. She believes that Elyse alone brought the game out of RVS on page 2, and thus she seems to believe my comment is irrelevant. She doesn't address me calling her non-Unlynchable either, meaning she never really believed it herself. She just opportunistically put it in there and hoped people wouldn't comment. There is no Town motivation in this.

MTD

, I feel wonderfully comfortable with Elyse and mnemonicdevice's RVS votes! Of course those votes don't mean they're town, but I found them much more pleasant than anything caledfwitch or Burning_Earth said.

Cho has previously told us the votes made those three players "Unlynchable". I think we'll all agree it's a strong term.

Now, the statement has been so completely edited that it's unrecognisable from the previous. She's townreading them because they make her feel "comfortable". She the continues, telling us these votes DON'T mean they're Town (this is such an incredible regression I had to double-check it to be sure I was right), but they do mean that they were pleasant.

Let's start off by noting once more she doesn't mention herself. This again proves that she was being opportunistic, without a doubt. Secondly, WHAT? She is trying to explain that when she uses the term "Unlynchable", it is because people make her comfortable and pleasant.

Comfortable and pleasant.

These are, in the world of Cho, quite synonymous with each other.

As a result, Cho, Elyse, and mnemonicdevice are exempt from much of my suspicion for today, provided that they don't royally fuck up, of course!

Look at how much this has regressed since I pressured it.

Originally, the statement was "Town Day 1 Unlynchables". No uncertainty, no hesitance. It's an absolute stance.

After I called her out on it, the statement changed dramatically. Now, we have "Exempt from

much

of

my

suspicion for today,

provided that they don't royally fuck up

, of course!"

There are multiple qualifiers in that post which weren't there previously, and which weaken the conviction of the post. I've italicized them for easy viewing. It doesn't make sense that these have showed up now, unless Cho realised how bad it was and began to subtly backtrack. And a subtle backtrack is the hallmark of scum play.

Spoiler: Voting of TSO

T S O

, you're quite a "force of nature", as some might say! The louder your thunder, the deafer we become~

But if that's your intent, then so be it!

UNVOTE:
VOTE: T S O

I don't have to be nice to be Town.

You should explain why you're voting me, because you think I'm scum, so now you have to provide your reasoning.

T S O

, I've already explained, dear! You clearly want this game to bend to your layers of self-confidence and false scumtells, but the more you speak out, screaming "look at how loud and consequently how open I'm being; you cannot hope to do anything

but

townread me for my arrogance!", the more you detract from us being able to focus on the game and playerlist as a whole.

Cho then votes me, on the pretext that I'm attempting to manipulate the game with my self-confidence and arrogance, and that because this nefarious deed is simply unacceptable, she's voting me in order to restore order and law as they were.

This is utter hogwash, and it's clear that Cho wants a reason to vote me back, and so has concocted one out of nothing at all. There isn't any solid reason she has for voting me, and it's painfully obvious.

Aside from that bull, I think the phrase "focus on the game and playerlist as a

whole

" is incredibly incongruent with Cho's apparent mindset while posting that. She was the one who set players like Elyse aside and told us we shouldn't be considering them as lynch candidates on the basis of 2 posts, and then she lectures us with rhetoric which is meant to sound Town but just showcases further holes and lies in her posts.

[T S O]

It's natural that your suspicion of Cho is fading; she's lurking out the pressure like a true scumfuck.

[Burning_Earth]

"Stuff that is irrational from both alignments"

"Reaction to shit pressure"

And

"OMGUS"

[Burning_Earth]

It's natural that your suspicion of Cho is fading; she's lurking out the pressure like a true scumfuck.

Also "moar things that could come from scum or town"

[T S O]

Yeah, your reading comprehension's even worse than I thought; you're not just somewhat stupid, you're borderline illiterate.

[T S O]

omg am I a mean TSO?????

scumz are always meanz, derefore im scum right b_E?

NOW DIS IS LOGIC!