Mini 425 Generic Western Mafia- Game over!

[mustafa15]

No, I'm saying that if Ichigo just isn't looking at the game, like it seems now, there's no real point in trying to get him to look at the game by posting in the game. He's getting replaced, and you can talk to his replacement about it.

[gorckat]

Still waiting on Avi to respond and for other lurkers to come back/get replaced.

The Guardian/Peter debate got interesting with both saying they were being misrepresented...I need to go back and reread the posts in question to see who's right, being too sensitive or just working stuff up.

[Occult]

The Guardian/Peter debate got interesting with both saying they were being misrepresented...I need to go back and reread the posts in question to see who's right, being too sensitive or just working stuff up.

Both are just attacking each other. Peter says that a day one lynch is most likely going to be townie and says Guardian is suspicious for being too defensive in trying to stay alive. Guardian basicaly says the opposite.

My veiws
-They seem to be trying to distance themselves from each other.
or...
-They're blowing the whole thing out of proportion.

[Raffles]

I would go for the latter. It is a bit off-topic for a distancing to be honest.

Mod

: Any news on replacements?

[Paradoxombie]

/confirm, now to catch up

[Raffles]

Oh goody, I take it you are replacing Ichigo?

[Sefer]

He is. I would have posted to indicate that as soon as I sent his PM, but I got the account suspended page when I tried :-\

Paradoxombie replaces Ichigo, effective immediately

Still looking for a replacement for DLMF.

[Guardian]

unvote

out of respect for Paradoxombie. My vote was more of a prod vote than anything.

I await Peter's reply to my post.

I might do a reread sometime... I am crazy busy, it's silly of me to find time to post here yet I still do.

[Guardian]

From post 235

hippocrit

Random and mostly irrelevant: Mustafa, in post: 214 said hippocrit, not me.

Skimming through last few pages and remembered to address this.

[Paradoxombie]

Okay, it's taken about 3 hours, but i'm read up.

I've lost a little of my mind though. Expect input soon.

[Vel-Rahn Koon]

Yay someone who's going to play! Welcome Paradox, I look forward to your analysis of the goings on.

[Peter Venkman]

I await Peter's reply to my post.

The Guardian/Peter debate got interesting with both saying they were being misrepresented...I need to go back and reread the posts in question to see who's right, being too sensitive or just working stuff up.

Both are just attacking each other. Peter says that a day one lynch is most likely going to be townie and says Guardian is suspicious for being too defensive in trying to stay alive. Guardian basicaly says the opposite.

My veiws
-They seem to be trying to distance themselves from each other.
or...
-They're blowing the whole thing out of proportion.

I would go for the latter. It is a bit off-topic for a distancing to be honest.

Raffles has it right. I feel further discussion on this topic is a distraction to the town. I'm sorry it went on this far.

It is my oppinion that a town player shouldn't play to stay alive. If you simply spend your time trying to oust scum than you shouldn't look suspicious and thus no-one will vote on you. If you play to stay alive, you will look like scum.

This is my position stated several posts ago, and also

part

of the reason I feel Guardian is scummy. Previous posts were a poor attempt at clarity.

--

@Guardian, can you focus your attention on ousting scum, rather than fighting me on semantics? I promise I'll do the same.

-Peter

[Sefer]

Sixth official vote count

:
Guardian (3): Vryklan, Raffles, Peter Venkman
Avinyl (3): John, Vel-Rahn Koon, mustafa15
John (2): Paradoxombie, Avinyl
Occult (1): DLMF

Not voting: Occult, gorckat, Guardian

12 alive, 7 to lynch.
(For clarity, Paradoxombie's vote is where Ichigo left it).

I will be moving this weekend, and I will not have internet access after I move. I have an appointment to get it at the new place on Monday, so I won't be missing long. I added explicit rules about what happens when a player reaches lynch numbers to the rules post just in case it occurs while I'm absent.

[Peter Venkman]

@ Peter> The way you have been playing is what my concern is. To me, you have been on the outside, interjecting your opinion, not lurking, but in my opinion, not saying anything that may shed light on you.

I'm not sure what you could possibly want. I've participated in this game tremendously and voted. Is this a fishing expedition for roles?

Also, i get what yoour saying about how a townie lynch is okay, but it should always be a priority to stay alive, because you being alive ALWAYS helps your side

Assuming you and I are both town, how does you staying alive help the town more than me staying alive? Do you understand that all vanilla town players are equal? Do you see how perhaps if all town players play with their number one priority as

staying alive

a giant problem will arise?

What about power roles? Should a vanilla town player do everything in his power to stay alive if he suspects the town might have a cop?

My biggest complaint with Guardian is he takes every single qualifier out of my statements when he quotes me.

For example:

You misread. The death of a scum player is significantly more important early game than the death of a town player. At this point

town shouldn't be scared of death

, whereas Scum are.

All emphasis mine. Peter, these are the only posts (or at least the great majority of them) where you addressed your reasoning about how towns should play and how they should think about town deaths...

You directly say that town shouldn't be scared of death, yet you say that my paraphrasing you by saying that

townies should not being afraid of dying

is a misrepresentation of your logic?

I clearly said "at this point" refering to day one. Yet Guardian cannot see the qualifierss, and continues to quote me in terms of absolutes. I understand there are grey areas, and obviously different actions are appropriate at different times. Read Post 266 again and see if you notice Guardian miss any other qualifiers.

-Peter

[Guardian]

Raffles has it right. I feel further discussion on this topic is a distraction to the town. I'm sorry it went on this far.

Peter, I disagree that this has been blown out of proportion or is a distraction. You seem to as well, though, despite saying otherwise, as you did see a need to respond to my post. Thanks for that.

I obviously didn't bold all your qualifiers. What's the point of adding emphasis if all I am going to do is let you be wishy washy. I removed all the qualifying stuff and expressed the illogical conclusions that result from your line of thinking.

One thing I want to point out though - you said I misrepresented you. However, let me again quote you and then quote me and let people judge.

From post 228

Peter, your posts seem to be obsessed with reasoning that it is OK for a pro-town player to die...

You misread. The death of a scum player is significantly more important early game than the death of a town player.

At this point town shouldn't be scared of death, whereas Scum are.

From post 261

Occult Avi and Peter still top my list... I did a post point by point analysis on Peter that got erased and I really don't have the motivation to do it again, but I'll summarize by saying that

Peter, your repeated reasoning that townies should not be afraid of dying is at best misguided.

Others have explained why, basically, if there is no vig and townies all just lynch other townies... they lose. Each townie should be trying very hard to stay alive, because if they get mislynched that is one mislynch closer to winning for the scum. It is always preferable for the town to lynch scum, and not town.

Emphasis added.

I obviously mean "at this point in the game", too. We both are referring to this game, and specifically my not wanting to die at this point in the game. In what other context could I possibly be taking your statements?

My statement about your logic is no more than rephrasing your wording - I find it egregiously erroneous to say that in that post I was misrepresenting your line of thinking.

Like I said, it could definitely be seen as you trying to build momentum to lynch me, and then when it's revealed that I'm town, be able to say "Oh but darn, I was so convinced of his guilt."

[Avinyl]

I apologize, i had internet problems. I will post soon.

[Occult]

I apologize, i had internet problems. I will post soon.

*shakes head disapointedly*

[Peter Venkman]

Man, Avi, is your connection just a string connected to a tin can in Växjö??

Soon isn't soon enough.

-Peter

[Peter Venkman]

@Guardian>

Others have made it clear this discussion isn't helping the town, and I agree. I'm willing to drop it.

-Peter

[Paradoxombie]

unvote

[Paradoxombie]

vote guardian

I'm starting to go totally WIFOM. My reasons for voting Guardian are n different from any of yours'.

[Paradoxombie]

EBWOP: My reasons for voting Guardian are

no

different from any of yours'.

[John]

@ peter> I agree that if all people tried to survive just for themselfs, it would not be good for town. all im saying is that if you just give up and die, the town loses a vote, which is the towns greatest, and basicly only, power. I'm not saying vanilla townies have equal power, but they still have power, and are the backbone to any(well, most any) mafia game.

An no, im not fishing, and you can't do anything for me. i simply stated an observation, one that far from merits a vote or FoS in my opinion, which is why i placed neither on you.

[John]

EBWOP: My reasons for voting Guardian are

no

different from any of yours'.

well, could you please name them? i personaly dont have a suspicion of guardian, so the statement confuses me.

[Peter Venkman]

What, you have a problem with people voting Guardian? Why are you so concerned with his survival? He's pretty vocal in this thread, and can certainly ask the very question you just asked...

-Peter