NY 169: The EPIC XD Mafia Game of Greatness (Game Over)

[Casso the King of Seals]

F-16, Casso thoughts on my zmuffin read

plz don't tell me I revealed it for nothing T_T

The manipulative tone re: me point definitely resonates with me.
I'm glad that you're not townreading him for absolutely no reason like so many others.

I am skimming insanely fast and just want to kill SSK now for a scum lynch and a breather from games.

the issue with nacho is that the way he was sorting me didn't look like anything i'd expect from nacho-town, given his knowledge of my scum game.

you've been repeating this tired old line for a fucking shit ton of pages.
get some better material; you're a better scum player than that.

My vca supposed ssk was scum. I factored that in. I also factored in the known townies.

oh god this hurts my eyes

So my big question is why the fuck did that wagon dissolve? Voila.. More vidence you are scum.

I dissolved that wagon.
And also Sakura looked town; why would the wagon be more likely to disintegrate if she was scum?

Can't really decide between bad or scum

for a minute there I thought you were talking about SSK and I almost imploded

i actually really disliked my play in cash cabd

And yet, it was leagues better than play here.

[Casso the King of Seals]

Vote: SSK

[geists]

Nacho is there anything you want to talk about before the day ends?

[zMuffinMan]

Which other of my reads do you think are wrong?

i think the biggest disagreement is i don't think BRO('s slot) is scum. especially if i'm right about casso. your issue with his D2 play is meh considering he was V/LA for a majority of D2. i liked his posting when he was actually around D2 and i had him as a town read for D1 posting.

other than that, the differences seem pretty minor. what's your actual read on sad atm? and what did you like about norlkaz's recent posts?

can you explain why I moved up a tier in your townlist?

you looked town

[Generic]

People who are probably town:
Me
SH
F16
Geists
Mara?
GM?

IONO:
Pieguy
Generic (Haven't really looked at; slightly sketched out but can he fake his mad?)
SAD (don't remember)
Muffin
BBQ (just did round 1; inconclusive)

Probably a decent number of scum here:
Casso
Prophylaxis
Titus
COWBELL
SSK

But yeah, let's just do SSK. It will probably be easier for me to read for real when an actual choice is being made.

This list is interesting because you are more sure of geists than of the masons... And also more sure of f16 who to be fair to him has not blacklist telled, been gun Smithed or claimed a town PR.

And I think geists also pointed out the list does seem to follow public opinion. I'm not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing.

[Generic]

Prod received, posting sometime today.

18 hours later...

I told you Proph, I would be keeping an eye on you.

Strike two.

[Sakura Hana]

Hey Gen, what's your take on Titus and what do you think of her theory that i'm busing SSK and Bert/Proph slot.

[KoreanBBQ]

Yeah, come on. Look at it from an outsider's perspective...

Suspect claims scum drove up wagon... suspect clears all but the tail end as scum and the weakest player is scum. Suspect claims facts inconsistent with their own theory. The suspect's wagon was skipped by the suspect's own scumread in favor of another townread. It doesn't pass the smell test. Scum didn't drive up your wagon. Town did.

To be fair to Hana, these are the day 1 major wagons in FEA. (sans the wagon on scum)
PeregrineV 7 (chesskid3, Thirdkoopa, talah, ActionDan, Saki, Ellibereth, notscience)

only one team scum on this wagon

Makiavel 6 (Nero Cain, chesskid3, Ellibereth, GoodCop_BadCop, Rift Adrift, notscience)
one scum

Sakura Hana 7 (chesskid3, Ellibereth, T S O, GoodCop_BadCop, ActionDan, Nero Cain, Nat
no scum

talah 6 (BulbaFenix, Maestro, Nero Cain, Natirasha, Makiavel-slot, Sakura Hana)
one scum

This limited data suggests (and I personally have the same theory) that town are more responsible for running up a wagon than scum. I think its a totes natural town reaction to think a wagon is scum lead.

Hana is prob town unless you think she's faking the whole "I quit mafia!"/edit signature thing. I think someone called that the blacklist tell.
Do you think she is faking?

If someone is aware of a tell, you have to be considering the possibility of a fake.

I LOVE fucking with tells as scum. It was my main drive in Fire and Ice.

Except that's kinda not what I asked. I asked if you believe she is faking it. Since you have a scumread on it then I guess you do believe that. I've considered the possibility that it's fake and considering that her scum meta is essentially "fakes town tells" its plenty possible that she's faking here. When she pulled this "OMFG I HATE MS"/"lynch me." crap in FEA I thought it was the scummiest shit but she was somehow town. She's not doing the whole lynch me crap and she refused to claim here as where she did claim in FEA. Do you think her refusal to claim here but claiming as town in FEA makes her scum? This is like 50/50 policy lynch territory me thinks. GIF thinks she's really town though. Talk to me about her play in FEA and here. What are the big differences?

[KoreanBBQ]

Yeah, come on. Look at it from an outsider's perspective...

Suspect claims scum drove up wagon... suspect clears all but the tail end as scum and the weakest player is scum. Suspect claims facts inconsistent with their own theory. The suspect's wagon was skipped by the suspect's own scumread in favor of another townread. It doesn't pass the smell test. Scum didn't drive up your wagon. Town did.

To be fair to Hana, these are the day 1 major wagons in FEA. (sans the wagon on scum)
PeregrineV 7 (chesskid3, Thirdkoopa, talah, ActionDan, Saki, Ellibereth, notscience)

only one team scum on this wagon

Makiavel 6 (Nero Cain, chesskid3, Ellibereth, GoodCop_BadCop, Rift Adrift, notscience)
one scum

Sakura Hana 7 (chesskid3, Ellibereth, T S O, GoodCop_BadCop, ActionDan, Nero Cain, Nat
no scum

talah 6 (BulbaFenix, Maestro, Nero Cain, Natirasha, Makiavel-slot, Sakura Hana)
one scum

This limited data suggests (and I personally have the same theory) that town are more responsible for running up a wagon than scum. I think its a totes natural town reaction to think a wagon is scum lead.

Hana is prob town unless you think she's faking the whole "I quit mafia!"/edit signature thing. I think someone called that the blacklist tell.
Do you think she is faking?

If someone is aware of a tell, you have to be considering the possibility of a fake.

I LOVE fucking with tells as scum. It was my main drive in Fire and Ice.

Except that's kinda not what I asked. I asked if you believe she is faking it. Since you have a scumread on it then I guess you do believe that. I've considered the possibility that it's fake and considering that her scum meta is essentially "fakes town tells" its plenty possible that she's faking here. When she pulled this "OMFG I HATE MS"/"lynch me." crap in FEA I thought it was the scummiest shit but she was somehow town. She's not doing the whole lynch me crap and she refused to claim here as where she did claim in FEA. Do you think her refusal to claim here but claiming as town in FEA makes her scum? This is like 50/50 policy lynch territory me thinks. GIF thinks she's really town though. Talk to me about her play in FEA and here. What are the big differences?

[Titus]

Now that I have a bit more content, I will put together my own wall.

Town
Myself
Masons (they will not both be alive at lylo, so this is self-verification to an extent)
Geists (based on being smithed)
Pieguy
Generic
SAD
Muffin
Norl
Cowbell
F16
KoreanBBQ
Geists (based on play)
Casso (poor reaction to my posts)
SH
SSK
Prophylaxis

[Sakura Hana]

Casso (poor reaction to my posts)

What kind of reaction were you expecting then?

[Titus]

Yeah, come on. Look at it from an outsider's perspective...

Suspect claims scum drove up wagon... suspect clears all but the tail end as scum and the weakest player is scum. Suspect claims facts inconsistent with their own theory. The suspect's wagon was skipped by the suspect's own scumread in favor of another townread. It doesn't pass the smell test. Scum didn't drive up your wagon. Town did.

To be fair to Hana, these are the day 1 major wagons in FEA. (sans the wagon on scum)
PeregrineV 7 (chesskid3, Thirdkoopa, talah, ActionDan, Saki, Ellibereth, notscience)

only one team scum on this wagon

Makiavel 6 (Nero Cain, chesskid3, Ellibereth, GoodCop_BadCop, Rift Adrift, notscience)
one scum

Sakura Hana 7 (chesskid3, Ellibereth, T S O, GoodCop_BadCop, ActionDan, Nero Cain, Nat
no scum

talah 6 (BulbaFenix, Maestro, Nero Cain, Natirasha, Makiavel-slot, Sakura Hana)
one scum

This limited data suggests (and I personally have the same theory) that town are more responsible for running up a wagon than scum. I think its a totes natural town reaction to think a wagon is scum lead.

Hana is prob town unless you think she's faking the whole "I quit mafia!"/edit signature thing. I think someone called that the blacklist tell.
Do you think she is faking?

If someone is aware of a tell, you have to be considering the possibility of a fake.

I LOVE fucking with tells as scum. It was my main drive in Fire and Ice.

Except that's kinda not what I asked. I asked if you believe she is faking it. Since you have a scumread on it then I guess you do believe that. I've considered the possibility that it's fake and considering that her scum meta is essentially "fakes town tells" its plenty possible that she's faking here. When she pulled this "OMFG I HATE MS"/"lynch me." crap in FEA I thought it was the scummiest shit but she was somehow town. She's not doing the whole lynch me crap and she refused to claim here as where she did claim in FEA. Do you think her refusal to claim here but claiming as town in FEA makes her scum? This is like 50/50 policy lynch territory me thinks. GIF thinks she's really town though.

Talk to me about her play in FEA and here.

What are the big differences?

If you are asking me the bolded, and you are the Nero head, you have not learned much from playing with me. Meta isn't relevant (as it can be emulated like you said). Rather, what people say about meta is important. The way SH uses it to "self-confirm" is scummy as hell.

I did the same, use meta to self-confirm, and it won us the game partially. So if a player vouches for their own towntell, I ignore the argument entirely.

[geists]

Which other of my reads do you think are wrong?

i think the biggest disagreement is i don't think BRO('s slot) is scum. especially if i'm right about casso. your issue with his D2 play is meh considering he was V/LA for a majority of D2. i liked his posting when he was actually around D2 and i had him as a town read for D1 posting.

other than that, the differences seem pretty minor. what's your actual read on sad atm? and what did you like about norlkaz's recent posts?

What about BRO's play seemed town to you?

My SAD read is low end of null, but I basically have zero experiential meta with him. Knowing Tammy's town, I put some credence in her day 1 read of SAD.

[KoreanBBQ]

This list is interesting because you are more sure of geists than of the masons... And also more sure of f16 who to be fair to him has not blacklist telled, been gun Smithed or claimed a town PR.

To be fair, I (and I think GIF too, dunno) don't think the masons are confirmed town either. They could very well be masons (hence why I have no desire to lynch them) but some of Mara and GM's play doesn't fill me with big town vibes.

Why did you not call us on this?

[Titus]

Casso (poor reaction to my posts)

What kind of reaction were you expecting then?

More of a dialogue. Questions. My eyes hurt isn't even clear. Is it the colors or the content? Is Casso just wanting people to ignore the point entirely.

[KoreanBBQ]

Yeah, come on. Look at it from an outsider's perspective...

Suspect claims scum drove up wagon... suspect clears all but the tail end as scum and the weakest player is scum. Suspect claims facts inconsistent with their own theory. The suspect's wagon was skipped by the suspect's own scumread in favor of another townread. It doesn't pass the smell test. Scum didn't drive up your wagon. Town did.

To be fair to Hana, these are the day 1 major wagons in FEA. (sans the wagon on scum)
PeregrineV 7 (chesskid3, Thirdkoopa, talah, ActionDan, Saki, Ellibereth, notscience)

only one team scum on this wagon

Makiavel 6 (Nero Cain, chesskid3, Ellibereth, GoodCop_BadCop, Rift Adrift, notscience)
one scum

Sakura Hana 7 (chesskid3, Ellibereth, T S O, GoodCop_BadCop, ActionDan, Nero Cain, Nat
no scum

talah 6 (BulbaFenix, Maestro, Nero Cain, Natirasha, Makiavel-slot, Sakura Hana)
one scum

This limited data suggests (and I personally have the same theory) that town are more responsible for running up a wagon than scum. I think its a totes natural town reaction to think a wagon is scum lead.

Hana is prob town unless you think she's faking the whole "I quit mafia!"/edit signature thing. I think someone called that the blacklist tell.
Do you think she is faking?

If someone is aware of a tell, you have to be considering the possibility of a fake.

I LOVE fucking with tells as scum. It was my main drive in Fire and Ice.

Except that's kinda not what I asked. I asked if you believe she is faking it. Since you have a scumread on it then I guess you do believe that. I've considered the possibility that it's fake and considering that her scum meta is essentially "fakes town tells" its plenty possible that she's faking here. When she pulled this "OMFG I HATE MS"/"lynch me." crap in FEA I thought it was the scummiest shit but she was somehow town. She's not doing the whole lynch me crap and she refused to claim here as where she did claim in FEA. Do you think her refusal to claim here but claiming as town in FEA makes her scum? This is like 50/50 policy lynch territory me thinks. GIF thinks she's really town though.

Talk to me about her play in FEA and here.

What are the big differences?

If you are asking me the bolded, and you are the Nero head, you have not learned much from playing with me. Meta isn't relevant (as it can be emulated like you said). Rather, what people say about meta is important. The way SH uses it to "self-confirm" is scummy as hell.

I did the same, use meta to self-confirm, and it won us the game partially. So if a player vouches for their own towntell, I ignore the argument entirely.

I wasn't really asking for meta....I mean the only reason you think she's scum is 'cause she's faking town tells, is that right?

[Titus]

This list is interesting because you are more sure of geists than of the masons... And also more sure of f16 who to be fair to him has not blacklist telled, been gun Smithed or claimed a town PR.

To be fair, I (and I think GIF too, dunno) don't think the masons are confirmed town either. They could very well be masons (hence why I have no desire to lynch them) but some of Mara and GM's play doesn't fill me with big town vibes.

Why did you not call us on this?

Confirmed town tend to be more abrasive in their scumhunting, which is exactly what gm is doing. Scum will resolve the masons soon nough. Let it go.

[KoreanBBQ]

@Hana

Why did you claim in FEA but didn't claim here?

[Sakura Hana]

The way SH uses it to "self-confirm" is scummy as hell.

Am i using it? I was pretty sure I was dead back then on D1. But I didn't and here I am.

PEd: I have my reasons for that, and I have hinted as much during my back and forth with Titus.

[Titus]

KBBQ, you could try reading my posts.

1) Self-vouching she towntold
2) VCA analysis
3) Her play here is much more reactive
4) She implies claims and motives to scum that didn't apply to her own wagon according to her own reads

[goodmorning]

This list is interesting because you are more sure of geists than of the masons... And also more sure of f16 who to be fair to him has not blacklist telled, been gun Smithed or claimed a town PR.

To be fair, I (and I think GIF too, dunno) don't think the masons are confirmed town either. They could very well be masons (hence why I have no desire to lynch them) but some of Mara and GM's play doesn't fill me with big town vibes.

Why did you not call us on this?

shhhhh you're supposed to pretend you think we're ~super town~ so one of us gets NKd and allows for some level of confirmationnn

P-EDIT: I think we should look at the driving up and down of the Sakura wagon. Both directions appear led by Casso. Hm.

[Titus]

SH has overly hinted at her role. I will call her bluff when she gets in lynch range. Hopefully tomorrow. It's anti-town the way she is using her role though if I am right on her hints. Then again, it makes sense if she's scum.

GM, go on. What are you drawing from that?

[KoreanBBQ]

SH has overly hinted at her role. I will call her bluff when she gets in lynch range. Hopefully tomorrow. It's anti-town the way she is using her role though if I am right on her hints. Then again, it makes sense if she's scum.

Says the person that thinks I softclaimed vig.

[Titus]

It appears to me you did. You did it how I would, so it is a logical conclusion to draw.

[KoreanBBQ]

if I am right on her hints.

Why are you using IF language here but so convinced that I softclaimed?