NY 169: The EPIC XD Mafia Game of Greatness (Game Over)

[BROseidon]

Kinda. Nacho bussed Doctor Pepper, who was on Muffins team.

That completely doesn't answer my question. Like, at all.

[Empire]

Day 2, Votecount 13

Ser Arthur Dayne (6)

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Casso the King of Seals, Bert, Desperado, Cephrir, DOMO, pieguyn

Cephrir (1)

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Ser Arthur Dayne

Bert (1)

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KoreanBBQ

Desperado (1)

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Sakura Hana

Not Voting (9)

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geists, MC Maraca, F-16_Fighting_Falcon, MafiaSSK, Norlkaz, zMuffinMan, Generic, goodmorning, BROseidon

With 18 alive, it takes 10 to lynch! Deadline is on January 11th at 10:10 AM EST (expired on 2014-01-11 11:10:12)

Mod Notes

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BROseidon is V/LA until January 3rd.

NOTE: Happy New Year from your friendly mod! Prod timer will be delayed until tomorrow to accommodate the celebrations.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Nacho/Thor/Whoever why are you still voting me if I've defended against everything you've put forth? The fact that you seem to like what I say yet still have your vote camped on me makes me quite uneasy.

[KoreanBBQ]

Kinda. Nacho bussed Doctor Pepper, who was on Muffins team.

That completely doesn't answer my question. Like, at all.

Then I don't know what you want. You wanted a black ad white answer, but the truth isn't black and white.

Scum team 1 was Empcho/Muffin/DP.

Empcho got a wagon rolling on DP . So IMO, Muffin didn't bus.

So, if I said that Muffin bussed DP then that wouldn't be factually true 'cause Empcho had more to do with the bussin' of DP then he did. If I said that Muffin didn't bus then that's not factually true either 'cause DP was on Muffin's team and DID get bussed by his team.

I also don't remember if he was on or off the DP wagon and if he said anything to Empcho about maybe not bussing DP.

[zMuffinMan]

i didn't want to bus DP (i was kinda hoping it didn't happen), but i hopped on it early when nacho was making it a thing (i think i was 3rd or 4th on it and nacho was 1st?)

[geists]

there was the whole Nero thing.

[geists]

but you were in different hands. I dunno at what point you knew you were both on the scum team.

[KoreanBBQ]

Kinda. Nacho bussed Doctor Pepper, who was on Muffins team.

That completely doesn't answer my question. Like, at all.

Then I don't know what you want. You wanted a black ad white answer, but the truth isn't black and white.

Scum team 1 was Empcho/Muffin/DP.

Empcho got a wagon rolling on DP . So IMO, Muffin didn't bus.

So, if I said that Muffin bussed DP then that wouldn't be factually true 'cause Empcho had more to do with the bussin' of DP then he did. If I said that Muffin didn't bus then that's not factually true either 'cause DP was on Muffin's team and DID get bussed by his team.

I also don't remember if he was on or off the DP wagon and if he said anything to Empcho about maybe not bussing DP.

What do you think of this Fery? Do you think this is accurate?

[BROseidon]

Then I don't know what you want. You wanted a black ad white answer, but the truth isn't black and white.

Scum team 1 was Empcho/Muffin/DP.

Empcho got a wagon rolling on DP . So IMO, Muffin didn't bus.

So, if I said that Muffin bussed DP then that wouldn't be factually true 'cause Empcho had more to do with the bussin' of DP then he did. If I said that Muffin didn't bus then that's not factually true either 'cause DP was on Muffin's team and DID get bussed by his team.

I also don't remember if he was on or off the DP wagon and if he said anything to Empcho about maybe not bussing DP.

This answers my question.

[geists]

I think it's accurate but it's a hard thing to explain.

I think his interactions with you were more probably what BRO is looking for, but once again, I don't know at what point you guys knew you were both scum.

[zMuffinMan]

One of the things that really impressed me in Marketplace was the way you managed to be aware of a meta I assume you had for a while, shed it completely, and make up a new scum meta in what seemed pretty much on the spot.

that's not *actually* what i was doing in marketplace, and you know it. what i was doing in marketplace was deliberately playing to my "town meta" because i knew morph was eventually going to metadive me and i wanted them to read me as town when they did it. everything i did was designed to elicit a town read from them when they metadived me

I was expecting you to come into the game with a bit more motivation and drive

*shrug* i was planning to be a bigger part of this game, but the site being down at awkward times for me and some stuff IRL leading up to christmas meant i couldn't really follow the game at the pace it was going

This approach of muffin being lazy as hell feels like you manipulating your meta to something that you know people will view as different from that terrifying scumgame of yours because it doesn't make sense that you're behaving this way as town

riiiiight. so you see my lack of engagement in the game and instead of trying to understand why i'm not engaged, you think, "hmm, maybe muffin not looking town is something he's trying to do as scum because he likes not looking town as scum!"

but you were in different hands. I dunno at what point you knew you were both on the scum team.

i think we knew pretty early. i don't remember the exact point. it was whenever i made that gameplan image

but i don't really know if that counts as bussing

[KoreanBBQ]

I don't think Muff and Empcho realized I was scum until near the end but they might say they knew so w/e

[KoreanBBQ]

Also Bert I want your reads on

Bro
Pie
Cephir
norl

[pieguyn]

- i liked his entrance to the game. everything about it, from the tone of his initial posts, to the way he was forming reads

so you like how he misrepped me by saying that I was doing 0 scumhunting and then made a weird push on me? and idk wht the hell is up with his read on me

i kinda agree with him that the stuffed crust wagon is difficult to analyse because of the way it happened, so i don't have a problem with the fact he hasn't put much effort into analysing it

here's the problem. even if it's difficult to analyze, Generic tried to analyze it. so I'd expect him to be all over said analysis, but instead he found it to be weird? what the fuck 0.0

this is what happened
1. deadline wagon on SC that has all of his scumreads on it
2. he's interested in analyzing the information from the lynch as shown by his comments re: SSK
3. generic goes and tries to analyze the wagon, that is, information from the lynch
4. he pokes at generic for doing that

tell me what thought process would take a wagon with all his scumreads on it, and noticing someone else analyzing said wagon, and give out the conclusion that the person ANALYZING said wagon is weird 0.0

there's more to analyze than just that one wagon too, there was another wagon on him earlier in the day and a shitton of discussion. basically what BRO said

[pieguyn]

looking back on it, why was my reaction one of the most boringest reactions in the world?

Because I had the same exact read as before I pushed you - which is boring because it wasted my time and really didn't effect my read at all.

nope you were townreading me earlier

Pie wtf.

I thought you were actually town.

How do you go back to making me think you're scum in a span of 2 pages.

where'd this come from?

there was plenty of discussion about SC so I'd imagine you should be going back and looking at his wagon and people's stances on him etc.

You want me to analyze a wagon that formed in a half a day for who's scum on it? Are you serious? I'm sorry for not being that good?

wow this is a blatant misrep

it's not just about the wagon. I said IN THAT SAME POST there was other information, e.g. people's stances on him, and then there was another wagon on him earlier D1, and so on. even if you found the wagon hard to analyze I'd expect you to at least have expressed that but you didn't even talk about said wagon at all. it makes me think you're scum BS'ing your stances and forgot all about the wagon

and instead you ATTACK THE GUY WHO'S SCRUTINIZING HOW YOUR NULL READ HAMMERED?

I "attack". If you think that's me "attacking" then are you in for a surprise. That was me pointing at something that irked me and found silly.

how is that even relevant to anything?

it doesn't change the fact that you're supposedly interested in looking at the information from the lynch. but then when Generic tried to do that exact same thing, you apparently found it to be silly. either way, your thought process is contradictory as fuck

also answer my point about OMGUS plz

[zMuffinMan]

so you like how he misrepped me by saying that I was doing 0 scumhunting and then made a weird push on me?

not really. i think we've already talked about this at some point

there's more to analyze than just that one wagon too, there was another wagon on him earlier in the day and a shitton of discussion

yeah, and this would be the only thing that's really worthwhile analysing, not the wagon at the very end of the day

btw i don't know why you and bro are mentioning this as important and then not really doing any analysis on it yourselves

[zMuffinMan]

Muffin can start raking up some scumpoints for his recent posts.

cool. why?

also why geists scum and why casso town?

[pieguyn]

I have a slight dislike for the overall coldness even though it's probably a playstyle issue; breaking from it was annoying as well.

the problem is that you're saying it's weird no matter what kind of post I make. if I make a logical post, it's too cold. if I make an emotional post it's weird bc I'm breaking from my logical style. you set up this false dichotomy (logical vs emotional) and then no matter which one I pick you paint it as scummy. if you're town this is confbiased as fuck and not to mention I know you said you try to avoid this when I was questioning you on D1. if you're scum it gives you an easy way to throw suspicion at me

also, 170+ pages in and one of your main scumreads is probably a playstyle issue? srsly

[pieguyn]

not really. i think we've already talked about this at some point

do you disagree that's what he did or do you not like it?

btw i don't know why you and bro are mentioning this as important and then not really doing any analysis on it yourselves

it's not important to me atm. but I'd expect Arthur to have been more interested in it 0.0

[zMuffinMan]

i don't think it was an intentional "misrep", more like his interpretation

i'm prone to exaggerating in a similar way when i call someone out for doing no scum hunting

i didn't like it, but i didn't think it was scummy

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

I am leaning towards SSK being scum doc because it fits in so well but I think the more prudent move is to wait so that DOMO can get in more investigations.

Desperado, I agree that Pie, Generic, and Bert are likely town. I am not entirely sure about BRO. I am not convinced that a misunderstanding of the gamestate is more likely to come from town.

ffery, I am really looking up to you to step up and the lead. I've been thinking about what Lllamarble said: "

In a game this large I believe it is difficult to lynch scum without a couple of town leaders

" and I remembered Hunterx mafia where we lynched scum on our consecutive days mostly because there always was someone leading the game. For instance, the Gammagooey wagon happened D1 because Vi pushed through the lynch despite a lot of distractions. Without someone leading the game, the influence of the mafia will be strong and I feel it unlikely we are actually going to lynch scum because most likely only town wagons will go through with scum opposing the scum wagons. You being a competent player and probably as close to conf-town as we have right now are our best shot at getting a scum lynch and I'll happily vote with you if I find your reasons convincing. Hoping to hear Nat's thoughts as well since his posting has faded away for a while now. Who do you feel most confident about being scum and why? I am not positive about anyone being scum, even Cephrir. I am starting to doubt that my leftovers pile actually contains the majority of scum. I am getting cold feet about Arthur being scum as well.

DOMO, I was suspicious of you at that time I asked for your reasoning on Geists and wanted to delve into your thought process so I hopefully understand your motivations better. I didn't think it very unlikely for scum to breadcrumb PRs and your breadcrumb wasn't exactly flawlessly executed. This is an interesting interpretation and it is true that I don't feel great about your choice of investigation. I think you should have checked someone less readable - like Casso or Muffin for instance.

[KoreanBBQ]

F-16 explain Bert town.

[geists]

Yeah, I know I need to roll up my sleeves and choose a direction. I haven't been good at leading in recent games - at least not with a good target in hand.

What I really want to do is some PoE with strong town reads. But, I feel like my strong town reads aren't feeling any more strongly about their scumreads/PoE than I am.

It's going to wait a day or so.

[Bert]

I think I might have to replace out of this game soon because this is way to big of a game to keep track of (18 players remaining), but I'm waiting till I get back to school where I can see if I can handle 18 separate players and stay somewhat competent. Has nothing to do with the playerlist or the game state or anything.

[Bert]

Also Bert I want your reads on

Bro
Pie
Cephir
norl

Also Bert I want your reads on

Bro
Pie
Cephir
norl

I gave my reads the last time I was caught up - at the tail end of D1, hours before it ended. Happy new year everyone...moving on to 2014 <3