Mini 1505: N is for Normal (game over)

[Albert B. Rampage]

My contention is that Thor isn't interested in finding scum, only in controlling the lynch. I've stated the behaviors that Thor showed to lead me to believe this. Ie: Calling out to the town to lynch Slandaar. In context, this doesn't make sense because no one who read the same posts that Thor did, found anything particularly scummy with it. With the recent revelation about the history between Thor and Slandaar, I'm not sure if that's what influenced him to vote for Slandaar or not, but it's a bad vote, and it's a bad decision to put out an open call to lynch him. That's what I've accused Thor of.

And now his OMGUS. Sad thing is that I was debating if I should unvote him after his rivalry with Slandaar became more apparent, but this throws a nice monkey wrench into that plan.

His posts this page aren't raising any red flags for me, but he may just be a very good actor who is starting to understand the seriousness of his situation. I might have to actually read his scum meta

[ICEninja]

So after reviewing Thor's presented meta, I've decided it's pretty much all completely irrelevant. I don't like that he posted things to say "LOOK THIS IS HOW I PLAY", but I simply don't have Albert's experience with him to really say anything about his alignment.

Considering JUST his play this game, Thor is on a scummier side, but not my preferred lynch so far.

However, this game has a lot of suspects and so I am just going to remove myself from the pool later as I am town and this town needs obvtowns at this point. So, expect lots of content on interesting things.

This put Slandaar higher on my scum list.

Actually that's a really interesting catch, Thor. You're absolutely right, Albert very directly contradicts himself.

I'm liking the zakk votes, though, and I'm still thinking TCold could use some rope.

[Albert B. Rampage]

I'm saying Thor wouldn't do that as scum because it's a generally scummy thing to do. Not that I know Thor so well that him doing that means he's scum. There's no contradiction there.

[Albert B. Rampage]

EBWOP

I'm saying Thor wouldn't do that as town because it's a generally scummy thing to do. Not that I know Thor so well that him doing that means he's scum. There's no contradiction there.

[Maxous]

Also, I like to watch him squirm.

However, this game has a lot of suspects and so I am just going to remove myself from the pool later as I am town and this town needs obvtowns at this point. So, expect lots of content on interesting things.

This put Slandaar higher on my scum list.

I actually had the opposite reaction.

[Thor665]

I never said I know how Thor plays as scum, but I do recognize good play.

And your basis for deciding I would play in your stated concept of 'good play' is?

My contention is that Thor isn't interested in finding scum, only in controlling the lynch.

I am openly on record as actively trying to control the lynch as part of my playstyle. I have made that claim both as town, and also in post games.
I don't see how trying to control the lynch is inherently scummy - I'll agree it benefits scum, but that's like sayin 'he doesn't want to be lynched' as a scumtell. Either alignment has a inbuilt desire to not be lynched and to control the lynch - and anyone who says they don't probably shouldn't be playing the game if their goal is to be a sheep that is lynched.

And now his OMGUS. Sad thing is that I was debating if I should unvote him after his rivalry with Slandaar became more apparent, but this throws a nice monkey wrench into that plan.

How does that make sense?

I don't like that he posted things to say "LOOK THIS IS HOW I PLAY"

Um...you do realize I was *asked* for links to my games.
Then I was told my play was different.
Yes, how utterly strange that as a way to show it isn't I would then go to the linked games that were being called different and show how they were, in fact, not different at all.
What is your issue here?
Be specific.
Because this sounds like very generic nothingness to say.

[Sir Bastion]

any further input max?

[Maxous]

I have town reads at : ICEninja, Sir Bastion, + toolenduso.
Guthrie Gov and Macros were towny from what I remember. zakk seems lazy-ish town.
ABR - slight town.
Axxle - MIA
My interest in lynching Slandaar is cooling, but no i'mt convinced.
Garmr is actually getting kinda scummy and TCold is coming across as lazy scum.

[Maxous]

*i'm not convinced

[Albert B. Rampage]

Thor, the scummy part is where you don't have enough information to think Slandaar is scum, yet you push his lynch with a song on your lips.

[Slandaar]

Slandaar remains worse, but no one notices because they think it's personal.

I love you Thor!

See, noone thinks its personal.

But I do think you are scum. You have given up very easily not even bothering to defend your case after I show its wrong but you just say nu-uh!

The ABR case looks very weak too.

Considering JUST his play this game, Thor is on a scummier side, but not my preferred lynch so far.

However, this game has a lot of suspects and so I am just going to remove myself from the pool later as I am town and this town needs obvtowns at this point. So, expect lots of content on interesting things.

This put Slandaar higher on my scum list.

I see. I seem to move up your scumlist everypost I assume I will be #1 soon?!

Interesting stance to take having both Thor and I as scum.

[Thor665]

Thor, the scummy part is where you don't have enough information to think Slandaar is scum, yet you push his lynch with a song on your lips.

Yes.
Let's even go with you presume this is scummy because town wouldn't do it.
Now we also need to point out that town do this sort of thing all the time.
So why do you think I am one of those players who, when town wouldn't, and when scum would change my playstyle and do exactly that?

But I do think you are scum. You have given up very easily not even bothering to defend your case after I show its wrong but you just say nu-uh!

I have shown the misrep.
It exists.
This is a fact.
You have said that it wasn't intended to be a misrep, and thus it is not.
At that point the only value is arguing your motivation, and I am already on record that I don't see a town motivation for it, and you have failed to even try to show one and are getting poncey about how I'm not debating your lack of logic after showing it exists.
Learn 2 play.

[Maxous]

Thor, the scummy part is where you don't have enough information to think Slandaar is scum, yet you push his lynch with a song on your lips.

I feel like he done this very early with Guthrie and Sir bastion on the first couple of pages(i.e. calling for quicklynches) but has since dropped his suspicion of them, which suggests to me that he was calling for their immediate lynches *without* being overly sure of their scumminess.

Which is why I found it interesting when you (ABR) brought up the Slandaar thing

I'll elaborate on Thor more after dinner

[Sir Bastion]

eat quickly

[Albert B. Rampage]

Now we also need to point out that town do this sort of thing all the time.
So why do you think I am one of those players who, when town wouldn't, and when scum would change my playstyle and do exactly that?

So you can lynch Slandaar with minimal contribution from most players on Day 1.

[Thor665]

Now we also need to point out that town do this sort of thing all the time.
So why do you think I am one of those players who, when town wouldn't, and when scum would change my playstyle and do exactly that?

So you can lynch Slandaar with minimal contribution from most players on Day 1.

That doesn't address the question, much less answer it.

[Thor665]

I guess unless maybe your logic is, as scum, Thor is absolutely so horrified of Slandaar town he has to try to lynch him at all costs - that would make sense if it's what you were claiming.
I sorta don't think it is though.
You know I have you here. That's why you're getting cagey.

[Albert B. Rampage]

It addresses it completely. You would change your strategy to achieve a different objective. As town, you're trying to put the pieces of the puzzle together, which you need a lot contribution from players for, whereas as scum, you just need them to sheep you so you can control the lynch.

[Thor665]

Yes, but why would you presume I'd change my strategy in that way, and why do you know my town style enough to recognize it as a change considering you don't even remember me?

...busted!

[Albert B. Rampage]

I'm pointing out what you just did in this thread, then I'm taking a guess at your alignment from the information available. It's called scumhunting, Thor, you should try it sometime.

As I said, I don't need to know your playstyle to understand that someone is sabotaging the town. I wouldn't bother to go through your games if you didn't use your meta as an excuse to defend yourself.

[Thor665]

So when you said it was something Thor wouldn't do, you just rectally extracted that part of your case but presented it anyway.
Hey - look, that is scummy.
Shock.

[Maxous]

The argument on Thor from what I seen was that he is handpicking lynches to push rather than pushing people and seeing what reaction he gets out of them.(the player)
And I can see where that's coming from.
With GG, SB and slandaar he was treating them like 'open and shut' cases too much,(look at post #18 for example)

That was why I went along and voted when I did. (plus ABR just generally came across as knowing what he was talking about)

He seems to say he done this in the recent newbie game (I assume #1435) but upon overlooking it, he did'nt. So the meta defence is'nt valid.
Thor moving the goalposts and claiming people are attacking him

because he is playing to a different meta than he usually does

, does'nt endear him to me further.
Neither did his accusation of ABR chainsaw defending Slandaar.
And I don't think Thor gave a satisfactory answer to one of the central questions of the issue: Why was he not interested in hearing input from the three lurker players before ending the day.(by lynching Slandaar)

[Thor665]

Thor moving the goalposts and claiming people are attacking him because he is playing to a different meta than he usually does,

I never claimed that.

And I don't think Thor gave a satisfactory answer to one of the central questions of the issue: Why was he not interested in hearing input from the three lurker players before ending the day.(by lynching Slandaar)

I also never claimed that.
And the only way to even suggest I vaguely desired it is if you believe by me saying 'let's speedlynch him' I honestly expected all conversation to end and a speed lynch to happen.

[Albert B. Rampage]

flailing is a tell that basically means 'looking desperate and trying to latch onto anything to prove they don't look scummy'

Oh, look what I found. Were you describing yourself from the future?

[Slandaar]

But I do
I have shown the misrep.
It exists.
This is a fact.
You have said that it wasn't intended to be a misrep, and thus it is not.
At that point the only value is arguing your motivation, and I am already on record that I don't see a town motivation for it, and you have failed to even try to show one and are getting poncey about how I'm not debating your lack of logic after showing it exists.
Learn 2 play.

I have literally no clue what you are even talking about; there is no misrep, I even showed post by post the exact conversation from my perspective to prove it. I never said anything about intending or not intending it to be one there wasn't one.

Everything past that is therefore irrelevant because you are just making things up it seems.