NY 150: Mob Money Mafia GAME OVER

[T-Bone]

Seeking replacement for Chkflip

[Oversoul]

In lieu of Twisted's revelation, Nacho, why did you come to Andy's defense so quickly?

Why are you asking me this? I only came in when TS started to string the gambit along and it was painfully obvious that nothing was happening.

Unvote, Vote: BBMolla

I am just trying to parcel out the reasoning for doing something like this. It is interesting that you immediately dismissed TS's gambit despite the albeit low, chance of a deputy.

Is this some kind of code?

Yes it was a code. It was Nacho-scum attacking town twisted spoon (I inverted to throw off people) for attacking Andy-scum.

I'm still not certain whether this is a scum move of trying to white knight a person who has been getting pressure (Andy) or if it defending a buddy, but quick defense looked suspicious in my mind.

When I get a chance I'll make my case on Matt.

[kondi2424]

@Mod: I'm going to have to ask for replacement. My parents are setting MAJOR limitations on my time, and I only have time to be in one game at a time. Sorry for the inconvenience.

If it helps, Overtoast, BB and Andy are my top suspects, with projectmatt, knox, and mastin being minor suspects. Pine and chkflip are DEFINITELY town.

[Nachomamma8]

Yes it was a code. It was Nacho-scum attacking town twisted spoon (I inverted to throw off people) for attacking Andy-scum.

I never attacked TS over anything by that point. I hadn't even acknowledged the gambit at that point.
Please explain.

[knox]

@Twisted Spoon, well surely some part of you must have felt that Andy was scummy otherwise there would be no point to the gambit. So why did you choose Andy?

@PM you make lots of promises

@ Oversoul I don’t understand when this happened. Where did Nacho attack Twisted Spoon and where did he defend Andy apart from calling him town which I wouldn’t call defending.

Why do you think Andy needs to be looked at?

His actions look like posturing.

More on this later

Although I think something is going on between a few players and I'm keeping an eye open...

NS)TST>AS

^ for future reference

Do you have more on Andy?

Could you please explain the BL and Andy town?

BL is town because of Sly's survival-fueled jump on him, which was his only break from tunneling me. If both wagons were on scum, then Bunny would be the more important to keep alive, and thus Sly would not switch.
If Sly didn't know the scumteam, the fact that BL ended up being the counterwagon to Sly still makes Bunny most likely town. If Bunny were scum and Sly was a scum-fueled counterwagon, than there should have been a lot more scum in the middle of the wagon.
I will answer your andy question later, though. There are things from him I am interested in seeing.

Can you answer the Andy question yet?

[Twistedspoon]

@Twisted Spoon, well surely some part of you must have felt that Andy was scummy otherwise there would be no point to the gambit. So why did you choose Andy?

I guess he was just one of my more null reads and I wanted more info on them

If they were obvscum why waste a gambit on them and as obvtown the idea would be pointless again

[projectmatt]

Okay, finally a lot of free time

Let's get this started

[projectmatt]

Give me an hour or two.

An hour or two or twelve?
I'm not going to answer your question if you string me along like this; I'll just make you die.

Actually, I meant about a week

So yeah. BB lynch. Go.

BL or Chkflip also accepted.

Hi Pine

A few questions -

After Sly's scumflip do you have as much as a confident read on BL? You seem to have gone down quite a bit on your tunneling of her

I highly oppose the notion of a chkflip lynch and i'm not sure why we're jumping on BBmolla when the real fish -

the scum

should, at least partly be where the BL wagon was yesterday (I was a part of it as well, I know)

In lieu of Twisted's revelation, Nacho, why did you come to Andy's defense so quickly?

Why are you asking me this? I only came in when TS started to string the gambit along and it was painfully obvious that nothing was happening.

Unvote, Vote: BBMolla

I am just trying to parcel out the reasoning for doing something like this. It is interesting that you immediately dismissed TS's gambit despite the albeit low, chance of a deputy.

Is this some kind of code?

Yes it was a code. It was Nacho-scum attacking town twisted spoon (I inverted to throw off people) for attacking Andy-scum.

I'm still not certain whether this is a scum move of trying to white knight a person who has been getting pressure (Andy) or if it defending a buddy, but quick defense looked suspicious in my mind.

When I get a chance I'll make my case on Matt.

I think I've pointed this out before, but I'm actually rather surprised you're able to call me scum with confidence when I can recall in the game where I actually was scum and you were town, you were a bit wary to lynch me because you thought I often had false connections with the scum, but yes, please make this case

I'm very interested, and it should help me read you

@Mod: I'm going to have to ask for replacement. My parents are setting MAJOR limitations on my time, and I only have time to be in one game at a time. Sorry for the inconvenience.

If it helps, Overtoast, BB and Andy are my top suspects, with projectmatt, knox, and mastin being minor suspects. Pine and chkflip are DEFINITELY town.

Not sure if I mentioned it or not but Kondi (and his replacement) are very, very likely town

Originally, I was planning to come in and attack Knox but after looking at her ISO I'm actually tempted to give her some free space right now because of her strong attack on SlySly and my inablity to actually get a solid scum tell on her, aside from a fairly bad unjustifiable gut read

quote="In post 91 , Andycyca"]Quick summary:

1. Unfortunately my (offline) notes are forever lost, i only have my memory to work right now.
   
2. If my memory is right:
   
   1. Mastin was slightly suspicious because of him handing out his POV on several players and starting to "group" them in order to find the mafia, without giving much reasoning behind it. Town points for stirring discussion, tho
      
   2. Nacho was slightly suspicious because of him following Mastin's reasoning without much of a questioning.
      
   3. I had a read on OS and McQueen but I can't remember it, so they're back to neutral
      
   4. Bunny was suspicious because of lurking
      
      
   5. Sly is townlean because of him continuing the discussion, even though I don't completely agree with his position
   
   
3. The rest of you are neutral, I don't remember anymore
   
4. Welcome chkflip. I don't remember Alex, but you're leaning town.

---

@Others:

Is Town-chkflip or Scum-chkflip more likely to make an awful case like the above? I've only played with him as scum, and one time he lurked while the other he actually pushed some pretty solid cases, which is why this misrep is confusing me.

I've never played with him or anyone of you. I don't have meta.

---

MOD please note: my thesis defense comes sometime in the next 2 weeks. I have to move to a new apt. sometime in the first half of April and my graduation papers/official photo shoot/general shenanigans happen sometime in the 2nd or 3rd week of April. I can't stay around here for extended periods of time, but I'll come whenever I can, read, reply and go. My time schedule is a little tight right now. I hope you and my fellow players will understand[/quote]

Reads in this post are

awful

and specifically some of the bolded raises an eyebrow

Someone

should explain why Andyca is being read as generally town because many, many posts and a lot of what he says honestly makes me think he's quite scum although I'll need to look deep into him before I do an in-depth anylysis

God, I am terrible at forum mafia

Right now, Nacho and chkflip are the only reads that I can actually

trust

to be town

I want to vote Andy but I'm not sure if he has support

Will look into BBmolla

[Oversoul]

It's annoying trying to remember what to do.

Normally I would not be against a side statement like this as it looks mostly harmless but I have to examine what it could mean coming from scum. Scum would say something like this because they have forgotten what they had said before the game was nuked and want to retain those same opinions for fear of looking discordant.

Trying to remember what to do looks like a scum without a plan because there are no longer any posts to try and trick the town into lynching the wrong person.

Mastin was a town lean because the whole "i'm gonna catch the whole scum team d1 with my crazy analysis" is what he does as town, although I've never actually seen his scum play.

So you cannot really say that is his town play then? Why attribute something to Mastin so loosely when even you realize it cannot be completely trusted. This looks like scum trying to call someone town so that they do not need to have other reasons for calling said person town.

Oh and Mastin, what's making you read me as scum? I'm not sure what it's based on given you've read me incorrectly in the past and I feel my play is pretty much the same <.<

He acknowledges that this is just normal Mastin play, and acknowledges that it was wrong last time, but is still curious as to why Mastin thinks he is scum.

In my opinion, Matt is playing scum due to a heightened sense of self awareness and he is conscientious of his play and doesn't want to look scummy.

Hi guys. While you're arguing about whether or not it's wise to lynch a claimed cop day one because he has "connections" (tip: it's not) and making town vs town cases on each other (I'm looking at you, Chkflip and Twistedspoon, although I must admit I'm not as sure on Twistedtown anymore but still pretty sure on Chktown), I'll be lynching the person who is scum or has the likeliest chance to be. I would make a case, but I can't without the old game.

*sigh* I hate my own ambivalence. I'm going to need to remain confident about my feelings toward Matt, though.

Matt stating that Chk vs. TS is town v town is again scum attributing towniness to other players so that he does not need to come up with another read. He says that TS is town but remarks that his TS read could be wrong, so then how could he be so sure that Chk vs TS is a waste of time because it is a T v T argument?

His last comment about the old game answers my questions about his first comment "I don't know what to do", but only partially and I would really like Matt to answer the question in full.

Why did you say "I don't know what to do" in your second post?

Twistedspoon,your jumping on BBmolla's wagon was insanely, insanely awkward but I'll disregard that given you towntold a bit before.

You used akward to describe BBmolla's vote as scummy. What exactly do you mean when you say awkward? Right now I see you using awkward as a synonym for scummy.

Pine -

I forgot to ask, is it possible to paraphrase or quote things from the QT or is that against the guidelines? I can't find anything regarding it in the game rules. I think it would be a gigantic help if you could paraphrase some of the things Bunny said, but yeah

If both Pine and BL are town then this post possibly means Matt is looking for something to play on a BL lynch. However, if one of the two is scum then this does point toward Matt being town as he would know what BL already said in the QT.

Post #465 by Kondi is an awkwardly formal and sincere side I have never seen from him. I've only seen him play laid back and not nearly as confident/analytic as he does now. I'll keep on eye on him, I guess.

I agree with this sentiment that Kondi deserves a second look.

Why do you think that Kondi is town now, Matt?

Mastin, is Mcqueen town?

Vote: Bunny

Excuse me?

Matt in his previous posts says that he can see BL being town and states that BL's wagon is okay. Up to this point I don't think Matt has even announced any scumreads as he has vocally said BL could be town while voting for him.

In addition, he tries to make his post look more adequate by asking Mastin the most pointless question in the history of the universe. Matt has said numerous times that Mcqueen is obvious town. Multiple people have stated that they think Mcqueen is obvious town so why the hell would he ask Mastin what he thinks of Mcqueen?

Hm.

Oversoul, why is it me? Let's talk.

Having some doubts about Bunnylover myself - not that I ever scum read her hard in the first place, but I'm also not sure who I could switch a wagon on in the course of one day. Eh...

I am ready to talk. I have been busy and I guess so have you, but your play has been extremely suspect.

The last part of this post looks horrible as only scum are concerned who they should switch to do when push comes to shove. I give you towncredit as it doesn't make sense for scum to publicly announce this feeling, but damn this post.

1. Someone explain to me why Kise is town

2. Knox is a fairly good vote.

3. I have a few fairly solid town reads but I need to check up something quickly. However Mastin/Nacho seriously need to realize that I'm town. <.<

Why is Knox a good vote?

Why are you so concerned about Mastin and Nacho thinking that you are scum? Why is my name not mentioned? What makes you think that other people should view you as town in this game? You haven't anything, been confirmed by anything, or have someone confirm you as town.

Originally, I was planning to come in and attack Knox but after looking at her ISO I'm actually tempted to give her some free space right now because of her strong attack on SlySly and my inablity to actually get a solid scum tell on her, aside from a fairly bad unjustifiable gut read

What does her attack on Sly have to do with anything? Sly was a traitor... therefore main group scum would not have known he was mafia. Sly could have potentially known who maingroup scum were, though.

What game have we played together where you were scum and I was town?

[Pine]

@Matt: Sly flipping Traitor has zero effect on my confidence in BLscum, for obvious reasons that Oversoul mentioned. However, I'm not pushing hard on him right now because I'm having independent, errant doubts about BL. The net result is still BL=scum, but I'm very concerned about confirmation bias.

Besides, if BL is scum, he's basically a goon. I have other strong scumreads, and it's very likely they'll flip scum PR. Also, we've already identified BL as a prime candidate. He's not going anywhere

[Oversoul]

Thinking about the night flips and such, I am kinda concerned about town's power.

Why wasn't Damon protected via any sort of protective power? :\

I am going to try and look for crumbs from Sly or odd interactions with potential teammates.

[Bunnylover]

Apologies for the absent.
Finals this week and been more focus on studying then internet.

[Nachomamma8]

OVERSOUL DONT YOU FUCKING IGNORE ME

[knox]

^

[mastin2]

Since it's coming up in a couple of weeks (actually will be over in two weeks, starting a week and around four days from now ), should announce it here:

Mod: V/LA first Friday of May 'til Monday

. That should be the 4th to the 7th or 8th or so. (My calendar math sucks. ) Annual Square Dance Festival. (

Don't look at me like that!

)

[BBmolla]

Post

kind of forgot about this game

[Oversoul]

@ Oversoul I don’t understand when this happened. Where did Nacho attack Twisted Spoon and where did he defend Andy apart from calling him town which I wouldn’t call defending.

Again, I should have used a different verb, but from my point of view Nacho immediately stepping up and dismissing the potential cop read on Andy was what looked like an attack on TS and a defend for Andy.

Apart from a gut read, nothing really on Andy.

Does anyone have any comments about my case on Matt? I feel like I completely failed in trying to present his scumminess.

I never attacked TS over anything by that point. I hadn't even acknowledged the gambit at that point.
Please explain.

I took your aggressive dismissal of TS's gambit as attacking. I should have used another verb, but that is what it looked like from my point of view.

[T-Bone]

Still seeking replacements...some players are going to get Mod-killed at deadline if replacements cannot be found.

[Pine]

/prodded

Getting a bit impatient with this game.

[knox]

@Nacho now Oversoul has answered your question can you answer mine in #679?
@Mastin are you going to weigh in on the game before your VLA?
@Oversoul I will reread your case and give you my thoughts.
@Everyone where are you at now?

[mastin2]

@Mastin are you going to weigh in on the game before your VLA?

I already have, pretty much.

[knox]

So you have no response to my #649?

[Bunnylover]

@Nacho now Oversoul has answered your question can you answer mine in #679?
@Mastin are you going to weigh in on the game before your VLA?
@Oversoul I will reread your case and give you my thoughts.
@Everyone where are you at now?

I'm sold on Chkflip been scum, but seeing as he is going to be mod kill if a replacement fails to be found I will be happy to move my vote.
I am not sold on BBMolla been scum.
I would be more inclined to vote Pine over BBMolla unless something smacks me in the face with why BB is scum.

[Twistedspoon]

I agree with Bl somewhat (though I still find pine rather townish)

I wish I knew why Kondi think chkflip is 'definately town'

[Nachomamma8]

I had a strong town read on andy pre-crash, I don't really remember why.