In the Court of the Gods (Game Over)

[farside22]

Damn that is not enough time in a day for me.
@Feysal: Where are you in your read of the game? Do you have any views that you noted from your read? Are you reading in iso? If so who have you read, why did you read them and what is your view on those you iso'ed.

Oh look competing wagon's

Look at his iso 14.

Listen I think they are both scummy in one way or another. But there are a few players on DKR's wagon that rub me the wrong way.

*Mod: I will be on V/LA starting Friday night 02/18 and be back Monday 02/21 (not sure what time figure after 3pm PST)

Noted

[Corvuus]

Feysal: I don't think you've addressed this at any point. Equinox and DTmaster were the main starters/proponents of your wagon (first two votes, Feb 13th votecount) and yet they are at the very top of your list of town (Feb 15th, #14 iso Feysal)?

----

Equinox: I'm not saying you are psychic. I'm saying that DTm 'claimed' PR in game-thread and, according to possible gambit moves for claiming PR in thread, did some sort of claims to his God/Priesthood. I didn't like exactly how he went about it, but I was ok with it since DTm-town would most likely have died horribly eventually because at the bare minimum he claimed PR in thread. That is why I gave him a pass since if he's town, he just outed and killed himself for nebulous rewards; if scum, then he still most likely wouldn't make it until lylo. Then you 'decided' at 5 days pre-deadline to ask for him to gain protection which makes the least amount of sense if you understand 1. his Gambit, 2. his analysis? and comments regarding his code/priesthood Quicktopic?.

I'm not saying you are psychic. I'm saying, if even I can tell that he needs to die, one way or the other, then asking him for protection just doesn't make sense. I'm not sure whether you understand this or not but it wasn't a pro-town move to do especially since DTm ended up responding very badly to it by "*hint hint*", claim, etc. Even then, I thought he was just screwing up possible town-gambit with the *hint* crap until he said that what he needs to do doesn't depend on whether or not he lives today which makes zero sense for all possible town-gambits which is why I voted for him. I didn't expect a 'bluffing' player to fold immediately regardless of alignment nor do I like the aftermath.

At any rate, my question was more on why did you do that or think it was a good idea to ask DGB since your reasons for protecting DTm were anti-thesis of DTm's own play? i.e. his in-thread plan was to die so he obviously isn't counting on his analysis skills, yet you believed in his analysis skills and didn't want him to die.

Corvuus
P.S. you should vote. If you can't vote Feysal due to NS-scum God, then why not DRK?

[nopointinactingup]

@Fish: Why not extend the deadline?
Anyways, I'd probably not be voting Feysal today

Unvote.Vote:DRK

[DrippingGoofball]

I'm liking Corvuus' #1126. Very much.

UNVOTE: Corvuus

We need a claim, and I need to grant the BP to someone before any hammer.

[DrippingGoofball]

COLOR EBWOP

I'm liking Corvuus' #1126. Very much.

UNVOTE: Corvuus

We need a claim, and I need to grant the BP to someone before any hammer.

[Fishythefish]

The deadline can be extended no further; its a maximum of 19 days from the beginning of the day.

[DrippingGoofball]

For strategic reasons.

VOTE: Feysal

[Equinox]

Check your evidence, please, before coming to the courtroom. DTMaster made no power role claims prior to my request for his bulletproof.

I'm sure you can't tell because you suspect me (for the weirdest reasons, I might add), but I'm considered town by a

vast

majority of the players in this game. A few people asked DrippingGoofball to grant me bulletproof. I don't want it. The other obvtarget was DTMaster, so naturally I asked DrippingGoofball to pass it to him instead.

Then you 'decided' at 5 days pre-deadline to ask for him to gain protection which makes the least amount of sense if you understand 1. his Gambit, 2. his analysis? and comments regarding his code/priesthood Quicktopic?.

Incorrect.

There was discussion earlier in the game day about controlling DrippingGoofball's rewards. I agreed. Now, would you rather I waited until, say, 2 days before deadline to discuss this in a town that is prone to bickering and indecision? 5 days seems like a reasonable amount of time to me.

At any rate, my question was more on why did you do that or think it was a good idea to ask DGB since your reasons for protecting DTm were anti-thesis of DTm's own play?

Right now, you're working with the full knowledge of DTMaster's gambit and claim. Pretend for a second that you don't have that knowledge. At the time I asked for the bulletproof, DTMaster had made no claims whatsoever, except that he was passing messages around. DTMaster was an obvious kill target (besides me), and I wanted him to survive Night 1 -- he made good analyses, and I know he's a better player than I am.

Preview Edit:

I'm liking Corvuus' #1126. Very much.

...the guy just made an argument for Equinox-scum based on a fucked up timeline of events. I'm not sure what you're getting at.

[Equinox]

Dammit.

Feysal (8) - DTMaster, Lady Lambdadelta, SpyreX, Nobody Special, hitogoroshi, farside22, DeathRowKitty, DrippingGoofball
DeathRowKitty (7) - populartajo, Benmage, Andrius, Fishythefish, Feysal, Jack, Corvuus

Sitting on the fence like Humpty Dumpty (3) - Equinox, Mina, nopointinactingup

Here's my dilemma:

Feysal has been scummy. I've been saying that ever since I caught the slip about which Feysal seems really confused. I trust a number of people on the Feysal wagon. The problem is that the way this wagon has gone about and some of the recent behaviors surrounding this wagon (e.g., DeathRowKitty and hitogoroshi) bother me. The other problem is the connection from Feysal to Nobody Special that makes me think that the two cannot be scum together; I am dead certain of this read, and Nobody Special has been scummy.

DeathRowKitty has been scummy. There's the mental mindframe slip both DTMaster and hitogoroshi have pointed out, which in a way nullifies DTMaster's read of DeathRowKitty from the gambit. There's his Feysal pushing. There's his lazy play toward the middle of the day. The problem is that there are shady folks on the DeathRowKitty wagon; bussing is a possibility, but with competing wagons close to lynch, I think it's unlikely.

I am still reading up on Feysal's metagame. Seriously, give me a bit to figure this out.

[DrippingGoofball]

...the guy just made an argument for Equinox-scum based on a fucked up timeline of events. I'm not sure what you're getting at.

Strangely enough... that means he's scum hunting independently, even though I completely and fully disagree with his conclusion that you're scum. If Corvuus were scum, he wouldn't bother drawing attention to himself by going against the majority, he'd wait for night when you'd be summarily taken care of with a NK.

It's not an absolute town tell, but it's a partially good one. Alternatively, he could be scum spreading suspicion - but for that, there would have to be hope of it working, and against you, it doesn't.

[Equinox]

EBWOP:

Feysal (8) - DTMaster, Lady Lambdadelta, SpyreX, Nobody Special, hitogoroshi, farside22, DeathRowKitty, DrippingGoofball
DeathRowKitty (8) - populartajo, Benmage, Andrius, Fishythefish, Feysal, Jack, Corvuus, nopointinactingup

Sitting on the fence like Humpty Dumpty (2) - Equinox, Mina

Preview edit: ...that actually makes sense. Hmm.

[zoraster]

Day 1 Vote Count

Andrius ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

populartajo ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

hitogoroshi ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

nopointinactingup ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

SpyreX ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

Equinox ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

farside22 ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

Feysal ( 8 ) DTMaster, Lady Lambdadelta, SpyreX,

Nobody Special,

hitogoroshi, farside22, DeathRowKitty,

DrippingGoofball,

(L - 2 )

Mina ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

Corvuus ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

Benmage ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

DeathRowKitty ( 8 ) populartajo, Benmage, Andrius,

Fishythefish,

Feysal, Jack, Corvuus, nopointinactingup,

(L - 2 )

Jack ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

Lady Lambdadelta ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

DTMaster ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

No Lynch ( 0 )

(L - 9 )

Not Voting ( 2 ) Mina, Equinox,
Total Votes ( 18 )

Deadline: February 19th at 17:59 EDT
With 18 able to vote, 10 needed to lynch.

[Equinox]

And now I close my eyes...

VOTE: Feysal

L-1

[zoraster]

Day 1 Vote Count

Andrius ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

populartajo ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

hitogoroshi ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

nopointinactingup ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

SpyreX ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

Equinox ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

farside22 ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

*** Feysal ( 9 ) ***

DTMaster, Lady Lambdadelta, SpyreX,

Nobody Special,

hitogoroshi, farside22, DeathRowKitty,

DrippingGoofball,

Equinox,

(L - 1 )

Mina ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

Corvuus ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

Benmage ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

DeathRowKitty ( 8 ) populartajo, Benmage, Andrius,

Fishythefish,

Feysal, Jack, Corvuus, nopointinactingup,

(L - 2 )

Jack ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

Lady Lambdadelta ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

DTMaster ( 0 )

(L - 10 )

No Lynch ( 0 )

(L - 9 )

Not Voting ( 1 ) Mina,
Total Votes ( 18 )

Deadline: February 19th at 17:59 EDT
With 18 able to vote, 10 needed to lynch.

[Nobody Special]

The reason I've been quiet in the QTs is that I've been busy. (Also, the DTM gambit/clusterfuck

really

pissed me off.) I need to catch up here; with two and a half days, I am sure I'll be fine. For now:

UNVOTE:

I promise a vote prior to deadline.

[hitogoroshi]

Feysal has been scummy. I've been saying that ever since I caught the slip about which Feysal seems really confused. I trust a number of people on the Feysal wagon. The problem is that the way this wagon has gone about and some of the recent behaviors surrounding this wagon (e.g., DeathRowKitty and hitogoroshi) bother me. The other problem is the connection from Feysal to Nobody Special that makes me think that the two cannot be scum together; I am dead certain of this read, and Nobody Special has been scummy.

Does that Feysal <--> NS connection cut both ways? If Feysal is scum, NS is a town god?

Jack asked earlier why I'm still on the Feysal wagon. While I'm happy with both DRK or Feysal lynches, I think that DRK will have greater variance tomorrow. If he's scum, he'll probably collapse even harder than he is now - if he's town, he's got a chance to get his shit together. I don't see Feysal suddenly pulling a hail mary and getting into the game, in the way DRK could at least

possibly

do. Yes, DRK looks like hilariously collapsing scum, but we'll see what another day under the microscope does for him. DRK is more transparent; and while I've seen a lot of things I don't like, it it at least means that tomorrow I'll see more.

[Equinox]

Does that Feysal <--> NS connection cut both ways? If Feysal is scum, NS is a town god?

If Feysal is town, it's inconclusive.

If Feysal is scum, Nobody Special is most likely a town god. The only exception to this is a Feysal-Jack-Nobody Special team.

I'm not sure how to take the rest of your post there, hitogoroshi. I can understand the mindset behind giving someone a chance, but that post reads a lot to me like... "Give DeathRowKitty a chance so we can coach him."

[hitogoroshi]

Oh also Equi, while I've got you, you missed this point (it was in my huge wall so I can understand why):

What has your QT with fishy lead you to believe about his alignment?

[Equinox]

What has your QT with fishy lead you to believe about his alignment?

I don't know. We've been more reactive in there than proactive. Fishythefish's suspicions as stated in this thread are consistent with what he's posted in the QuickTopic. I'm not sure what else I could say; I've been paranoid and reluctant to share, and I guess he's also been quiet as a result.

[Mina]

I was about to say that I was secretly happy Equinox had taken the decision out of my hands...but never mind. Um...fair warning, guys. Yeah, yeah, scum trying to cover her ass if she tips the votes toward a townie, fence-sitting, why didn't you vote Tuesday like you said you would, etc., but I tend to freeze up and make sub-par lynch decisions at deadline.

This is hard, because Feysal and DRK are both suspicious in different ways. At this point, I wouldn't fight either lynch. Aargh, and I keep procrastinating this because I haven't felt like writing a huge post from my phone. Also, DRK's posting style makes me want to skim over his posts.

But non-voters lower the threshhold for a lynch at deadline, so at least I won't lower the threshhold for a lynch if I don't vote in time.

Jack: I'm not fond of hito's reasoning for his vote on Feysal, but I find that I often disagree with a lot of what town Hito says. Overall, his posts have felt honest.
FWIW, I have a stronger town read on several players, now.

(EBWOPreview: so hito, you think Feysal is a policy lynch VI who we need to get rid of today because we'll never be able to read him...but DRK--whom you think is scummier, should be left alive because you think he's going to act even scummier or more townish? Why do you think DRK might look more townish tomorrow when today he's flailing and looking like "collapsing scum." Come to think of it, can you elaborate on what you mean by "collapsing scum", with examples? On the contrary, I'd think Feysal--who promises he's MUCH more effective after D1--would be easier to read within the next few days, while DRK comes across as more of a scattered, unfocused VI to me. The latter is the one for whom I'm really making "scum or dumb" excuses in my head because he's so hard to read.)

Re: Andrius...hmm....

zoraster: can you prod Andrius? Hasn't it been more than seventy-two hours since his last post?

Mod response: His last post was Wed Feb 16, 2011 14:09 pm

SpyreX: I'd still like an answer on Feysal vs. DRK vs. Corvuus. Because your vote really did not ring true to me. I mean, I get wanting to get things started, but considering your comments about the other two viable wagons in your ISOs were vague and confusing, I'd like a clearer picture of your hierarchy of suspicions. I still have no clue what you were talking about when you said one of tmh and Jack had to be scum, but you didn't want to vote for either.

[SpyreX]

SpyreX: I'd still like an answer on Feysal vs. DRK vs. Corvuus. Because your vote really did not ring true to me. I mean, I get wanting to get things started, but considering your comments about the other two viable wagons in your ISOs were vague and confusing, I'd like a clearer picture of your hierarchy of suspicions. I still have no clue what you were talking about when you said one of tmh and Jack had to be scum, but you didn't want to vote for either.

I thought I was clear on the Feysal DRK Corvuus bit.

Feysal >> Corvus >>>>>> DRK.

Fesyal I've answered directly.
Corvus is high on the moon juice in that bad way.
DRK was, frankly, to make something happen and of the three (and ESPECIALLY if either is scum) is probably town fueling this fire that will never go out.

[DeathRowKitty]

Well, I'm caught up on the past couple of pages, but I don't really see much to comment on. If there's anything anyone wants me to address, now is the time. Aside from that, nopointinactingup needs to give some sort of useful content before day ends. Two days before deadline and 3 different players and all we have out of that slot is a bunch of opinions with no given reason.

[Jack]

The more I look at who's voting who the more I think that must both be town. Very unfortunate.

[Andrius]

Yeah I posted yesterday I think.
Reading now. (Fuck Aristotle.)

[DTMaster]

NS if you're done being pissed off, and since the only update is you think I'm scum then like I said in the QT has I flood your e-mail please answer my question: Do you have critiques to my cases/arguments?

Considering that you never once brought it up when I asked you to passed the messages and just passed the messages for me puts your stance to be poor. I take responsibility for what happened, but if you were always of thought that it was a failure then you should have attacked me during the claiming I did in QT. Jack and DRK both did. LL even said that she didn't trust me via you.

But you were the only one who expressed the popular idea only in the aftermath. So yeah, I gave my reasonings to why I chose the 3 reads: DRK, Benmage, nopointinacting up (Hito counts as 4 but as a town read rather then a scum/neutral read). I look forward to your case good sir.

Now on to the comments.