The Lord of the Rings Mafia - GAME OVER (KABOOM)

[Mariyta]

I don't understand what you mean by this.

LMP was a weak doctor (dies if they protect scum).

Oh, okay. I don't think I've encountered that role before, but it sounds vaguely familiar.

Also, Drippereth's day message seems to indicate that maybe scum got an extra kill? It says that this was too many deaths and that some people just shouldn't die.

I thought it was because it was Sam, who is one of the most pure characters in the series.

@Glork: Sorry to hear that. Hope everyone will be ok.

[zwetschenwasser]

NO OUTGUESSING! NONONONONONO!

[Katsuki]

Wow... Gandalf flipping town to me is a complete surprise. Same with LMP. Let's look at votes...

Day 1 Vote Count 12

gandalf5166

- 4 - Katsuki,

WeirdRa

, SlySly, Katy

Mariyta

- 1 - bv310

Nero Cain

- 2 - jenniwren, Locke Lamora

Katsuki

- 2 - Nero Cain,

MemoriaEsponia

WeirdRa

[/b]- 13 - Mariyta, Edge, Glork, SpyreX, Cogito Ergo Sum, inHimshallibe, VasudeVa, Wraith,

LynchMePls

,

gandalf5166

, Dekes,

Drippereth

, rewq455

rewq4

- 1 - zwetschenwasser

Not Voting

- 1 - a2rudeboy

So, we definately quite a few scum on that weird wagon, with the apparent presence of multiple scum teams. My main scum suspects on wagon are rewq and VV, but hell, my last obv-scum suspect (gandalf) flipped town.

I will be looking back over the thread when I have time. A re-read is obviously needed.

@Glork: Sorry to hear about that.

[Nero Cain]

Somethin tells me LMP died docing the wrong way.

Something about that says LMP was being AWESOME and:

Rewq, Maritya, Katsuki,

Gandalf

.

There's a scum in there.

I agree with this. He was

corrupted

so it does sound like he used his doc skills to scum hunt. I felt like he was most worried about Mari and Kat.

[rewq455]

Yes, I'm sure you're alive because the vig(s) believed you, Zwet.

My suspicion of rewq still carries over from yesterday for all the same reasons, and I still think he looks scummy, even with WeirdRa's flip - maybe even more so with WeirdRa's flip since he tried to push other wagons for a long time and then finally came in with the hammer in a way that looked calculated to appear town if he knew what the flip was going to be.

I also found SlySly kind of suspect near the end of the day. He made a late push to change the lynch away from WeirdRa. But with his interaction with Rewq and his push for Rewq to the be the alternate lynch, I think he and rewq cannot be scumbuddies.

One thing I noted was that Mariyta was that I think the first person to vote Weird, gave some pretty clear reasons for it (and reiterated those reasons later) and stuck to her guns on that. We clearly have more than one scum team so I can't say that makes her town, but she's definitely not on Sauron's scumteam.

Altogether, I found Rewq to be scummiest overall for all the reasons I already gave yesterday. I want to see more from SlySly before I decide. Having looked at the dead parties (aside from gandalf, who I'm pretty sure was vigged), rewq had drawn suspicion from pretty much all of them and ME had called out Sly and to a lesser extent so had LMP.

VOTE: Rewq

Also, Drippereth's day message seems to indicate that maybe scum got an extra kill? It says that this was too many deaths and that some people just shouldn't die.

I understand what you are saying, but why would I hammer Sauron that close to deadline? I could have waited 24 hours and just have given the scum a no-lynch day 1. Also, the only wagon I really tried to push was Gandalf's, and you have to admit he was acting pretty scummy. My conversation with Wraith was about gameplay, because I have never seen someone breadcrumb that heavily. With Zwet, I pointed out a fact, and then when it was pointed out to be invalid I unvoted.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

1) WeirdRa wouldn't have survived the Day and 2) Sauron's mafia isn't the only scum.

[Katsuki]

Vote: rewq

There were numerous players who expressed the desire to hammer. Also, I doubt we would've went 24hrs without a hammer, as you are suggesting could've been possible.
Not to mention, we have multiple scum teams.

P-Edit: CES summed up what I said much more efficiently.

[Dekes]

I understand what you are saying, but why would I hammer Sauron that close to deadline? I could have waited 24 hours and just have given the scum a no-lynch day 1. Also, the only wagon I really tried to push was Gandalf's, and you have to admit he was acting pretty scummy. My conversation with Wraith was about gameplay, because I have never seen someone breadcrumb that heavily. With Zwet, I pointed out a fact, and then when it was pointed out to be invalid I unvoted.

Lol, first you're trying to gain townie points for being responsible that we didn't no-lynch yesterday. And then you go on and admit you didn't scumhunt at all yesterday except for pushing the already suspicious wagon on gandalf.

I said yesterday that every post of you reeks of scum, so consider this post a vote on you until I Iso'd you.

[rewq455]

Well, assuming that there are 2 scum teams, both scum teams made a night kill, accounting for 2 deaths, LynchMePls died by docing the wrong person, making him die, and the last kill is left to a vig with an unknown alignment. Does anyone disagree with this logic? Also, I noticed that ME and Gandalf were both killed with arrows. I am going to assume that that means that they were both night killed by scum's nightkills. I realize that this part is a stretch.

So according to my logic, there are 2 scum teams, each with a night kill; a serial killer, from earlier, that kills during the day; and a night vig, with an undefined alignment, who may or may not only have one kill. This portion was more for me getting my thoughts straight, so don't get mad at me because it is not useful (that is the best word I could think to use).

[rewq455]

I understand what you are saying, but why would I hammer Sauron that close to deadline? I could have waited 24 hours and just have given the scum a no-lynch day 1. Also, the only wagon I really tried to push was Gandalf's, and you have to admit he was acting pretty scummy. My conversation with Wraith was about gameplay, because I have never seen someone breadcrumb that heavily. With Zwet, I pointed out a fact, and then when it was pointed out to be invalid I unvoted.

Lol, first you're trying to gain townie points for being responsible that we didn't no-lynch yesterday. And then you go on and admit you didn't scumhunt at all yesterday except for pushing the already suspicious wagon on gandalf.

I said yesterday that every post of you reeks of scum, so consider this post a vote on you until I Iso'd you.

The "suspicious" wagon on Gandalf? All of my argument against him was valid, and I ISOed you, you didn't object to the wagon at all before now. You also called me scummy twice in your ISOs before today, and did not explain.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Gandalf was most definitely killed by a vigilante, not the scum. The arrow from afar makes plenty of sense as a kill method for Legolas or most other elves.

[rewq455]

Gandalf was most definitely killed by a vigilante, not the scum. The arrow from afar makes plenty of sense as a kill method for Legolas or most other elves.

That makes sense.

[SlySly]

Yes, I'm sure you're alive because the vig(s) believed you, Zwet.

^^^

--------------

My suspicion of rewq still carries over from yesterday for all the same reasons, and I still think he looks scummy, even with WeirdRa's flip - maybe even more so with WeirdRa's flip since he tried to push other wagons for a long time and then finally came in with the hammer in a way that looked calculated to appear town if he knew what the flip was going to be.

^^^

--------------

I also found SlySly kind of suspect near the end of the day. He made a late push to change the lynch away from WeirdRa. But with his interaction with Rewq and his push for Rewq to the be the alternate lynch, I think he and rewq cannot be scumbuddies.

I was convinced that gandalf was scum. At one point yesterday, he appeared to be heading for the lynch. At the end of the day, I, like you, considering the post you made expressing basically the same opinion, didn't see a valid case against WeirdRa, so I called for votes I thought were being misplaced to be moved back to the lynch I felt was the proper one. Zwet being alive combined with the arrow found through gandalf's neck suggests that I was not the only one that felt that way.

--------------

gandalf's subtraction from the living has moved rewq to the top of my lynch list.

VOTE: rewq

[Mariyta]

Somethin tells me LMP died docing the wrong way.

Something about that says LMP was being AWESOME and:

Rewq, Maritya, Katsuki,

Gandalf

.

There's a scum in there.

I agree with this. He was

corrupted

so it does sound like he used his doc skills to scum hunt. I felt like he was most worried about Mari and Kat.

Tonight, because we had a lot of posts for D1, I'll be doing lots of ISOs. Choosing who to target is going to be the difficult part, there have been a veritable shit-ton of scummy things in this thread. Rewq, Maritya, Katsuki, Gandalf.

Kats and I were definitely the ones he was most perturbed by, I think. He also listed rewq and gandalf in his suspicion list (as Spyrex pointed out). We know gandalf didn't do it. And Dekes expressed suspicion of him, as well. Now the question is did he use his one-shot to scum hunt, as Nero suggests, or was he convinced someone was town and wanted to protect them? I don't know LMP enough to delve into his thought process there. Maybe others do.

I'll try to do my re-read tomorrow evening, but based on the action from today, I'm definitely leaning toward rewq. And I think I'll take a look at Kats's lists. Maybe LMP was on to something.

[Wraith]

I agree that vig-Legolas killing gandalf sounds very plausible. Also, I'm sticking with my read from yesterday.

Vote: Katsuki

[VasudeVa]

I am not of opinion that LMP weak-doc protected scum.

Firstly, there are 2 vig-ilicious Arrow kills (Memoria, gandalf) and 2 kills of scummy flavor('Corrupted' and 'Bled to death'). There are two scum teams. It's easy here. Second off, do you honestly believe that a weak-doc who didn't claim would up and protect their prime suspect like that? Weak docs don't think that way. Not N1, at least.

Vote: Katsuki

[Mariyta]

I am not of opinion that LMP weak-doc protected scum.

Firstly, there are 2 vig-ilicious Arrow kills (Memoria, gandalf) and 2 kills of scummy flavor('Corrupted' and 'Bled to death'). There are two scum teams. It's easy here. Second off, do you honestly believe that a weak-doc who didn't claim would up and protect their prime suspect like that? Weak docs don't think that way. Not N1, at least.

Vote: Katsuki

"Filled with arrows" screams orc (or Urak-hai), IMO, which would be scum, not vig. Bleeding to death could be scum or vig, depending on who did it. I haven't figured that one out yet. If it was a Morgul blade, it would cauterize immediately.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Drippereth doesn't make sense as a vig kill.

[rewq455]

Drippereth doesn't make sense as a vig kill.

Could be a scum kill though. Just by meta, I know the DGB, one of the heads of the hydra, is a great player. Ellibereth, the other player, isn't all that bad either.

[rewq455]

I am not of opinion that LMP weak-doc protected scum.

Firstly, there are 2 vig-ilicious Arrow kills (Memoria, gandalf) and 2 kills of scummy flavor('Corrupted' and 'Bled to death'). There are two scum teams. It's easy here. Second off, do you honestly believe that a weak-doc who didn't claim would up and protect their prime suspect like that? Weak docs don't think that way. Not N1, at least.

Vote: Katsuki

"Filled with arrows" screams orc (or Urak-hai), IMO, which would be scum, not vig. Bleeding to death could be scum or vig, depending on who did it. I haven't figured that one out yet. If it was a Morgul blade, it would cauterize immediately.

Couldn't the whole bled to death thing still just be uruk or uruk-hai?

[Glork]

Okay.

Gandalf was Vigged obviously, prolly by Legolas. Scum have no reason to go after Gandalf last night. Knowing there are two scumgroups, and with what several players thought was a "slip," Gandalf would still have been lynchbait today.
The Daykiller is probably an SK, Gollum, and may have been attempting to pose as a Vig D1 by killing Haylen.
Drippereth + MemEsp look like scumgroup kills, with LMP having tried to protect a scumbag.
Mordor Mafia is Mordor Mafia. Other Mafia is probably Saruman/Uruk-Hai or somesuch, which fits with the hail of arrows that killed MemEsp.

Looking at LMP's iso, he spent basically all of his time going after his suspects. No mention of who he thought was protown, so we won't be able to glean potential scums that way. Literally the only thing I see is relatively early in the day, when he said MemEsp's 465 and 471 give him "warm fuzzies." But MemEsp turned out to be protown.

One thing I do

NOT

like is Nero's hypothesis that LMP used his ability to scumhunt. Targeting somebody you think is likely scum is, from one's own perspective, likely to get yourself killed. And without some kind of breadcrumbing (which I cannot find), that just doesn't make sense to me. Furthermore, I don't see how "corrupted" would indicate that LMP was looking for scum when he used his ability. Nero's reason to support going after Mari/Kats is rather artificial here.

That said, I do not have terribly good feelings about Kats anymore.
Mari doesn't strike me as scum. She's definitely not scum

with

WeirdRa (D1 wagoning in a two-scumgroup game is pretty terribad, and Mari was really early on Weird).

I'd say that WeirdRa's lynch had at most one scumbuddy (probably middle of the road on the lynch), and 2-3 scums from the other group on it.


VOTE: Nero Cain

[VasudeVa]

To be clear on what I think:

'Sauron' Mafia kill: LMP
Other Mafia kill: Drippereth
Vigs: gandalf, Memoria.

--

Wagon Katsuki for me plx? <3.

-p-edit: Why Nero Cain?

[Glork]

-p-edit: Why Nero Cain?

Try reading my post, champ.

[Glork]

EBWO: Also, VV, what do you think of the kill on Haylen yesterday?

[VasudeVa]

I did. SpyreX suggested it first though. Why aren't you going after him?

Haylen kill is SK getting lucky. My on-the-spot SK choice would be Mariyta.