The Lord of the Rings Mafia - GAME OVER (KABOOM)

[Mariyta]

Sadly (or not?), I have become the boy who cried wolf. I'm actually going to stick to my claim, however. I do have some flavor as to why I'm a miller, but for those of you who disbelieve should know that I have claimed miller day 1 every time I'm actually a miller (xylbot is an example, I think (not sure)). In other news the gandalf wagon is bullshit, lynchmepls seems to be the only person to not have dismissed my point as irrelevant (town read), and the person(s) who have never played with me before and are jumping on the zwethate wagon (which I don't particularly mind) are scummish as of right now (for purely nonOMGUS reasons). Sigh. I would understand Arwen as a neutral character, but not a miller. I'll provide flavor if you guys need it.

Your claim was serious? I can't see any reason for Arwen to be a miller, but then again, with the setup of this game, some of the characters we'd expect to be good may not be. Flavor would be nice, but I'm not demanding it at this point.

Wraith, as Katy mentioned, if you find you're being lynched all the time, you should look at your past games and figure out what happened. It wouldn't hurt to ask some of the most experienced players you were playing with for advice. Most of the veteran players are awesome and wouldn't mind helping you improve your game (if you so choose).

I'll have to re-read ME after my nap to see what all the fuss is about. I have a bad habit of just skimming long posts.

[Locke Lamora]

Oh yes, I demand flavour for Zwet's claim.

[molestargazer]

Even if you were to try and analyze it, scum would not have claimed this huge of a power role, because Gandalf is such a major character in the LOTR series, I would be surprised if he were not in this game.

This is a strange post in defending Gandalf's joke-claim using what can only be described as WIFOM.

@Rewq

- Why did you feel the need to defend this? Do you think that Gandalf's joke claim makes him more likely to be:
a) Scum
b) Town
c) Neither, it's a null-tell.

Zwet persevering in his claim gives me town-vibes, but I would like flavour. What's the usual "policy" on site regarding Millers?

[MemoriaEsponia]

Ok, back from my usual weekend V/LA and reading.

[LimMePls]

@Zwet: Still wondering about that Arwen-miller claim. Any flavor to back that up at all? If you're fake claiming miller (since my experience with you is that you like to fake claim) what town motivation is there to fake claiming miller?

From a strategic standpoint, claming your millerness is the only correct play.

If the Miller were to be investigated and found guilty, they would wind up claiming to be a Miller anyway. By claiming a Miller on D1, they are effectively giving the town a free public investigation, by saying "Everyone has investigated me, and they have found me to be "guilty" (or "scum," or whatever the mod chooses to use for results). However, I am not really scum, I am a Miller."

From that point on, what the town chooses to do is largely out of the Miller's hands. The Miller's job at that point is to continue to hunt scum as best as possible. Ideally, they would prove themselves to be enough of a threat to get nightkilled, but more realistically Millers are usually lynched (if they are suspicious) or Vigged (if they aren't particularly suspicious) sometime in midgame.

I didn't ask why he would claim miller, I asked why he would fake-claim it as town. The reason I asked this question is because he fake claimed Cop as town in a recent game I was in with him (Castlevania mini theme), so I'm wondering if this is another fake claim. But I don't see the town benefit to fake claiming miller.

I don't buy "people didn't like Liv Tyler as Arwen so it explains Arwen-miller". For one, why would our roles be affected by the casting of the movie? That doesn't make any sense flavor wise. Lots of people thought Legolas was a bit ridiculous, does that mean Legolas should be a miller too?

[LimMePls]

ME needs to read more... = =
and is probably scum.

SCUM:

VV
ME
Gandalf

TOWN:

Katsuki
Glork
Inhim
Katy
Mariyta

I'd like an explanation of both these lists. They seem pretty terrible. I also love how you put yourself on your own town list.

And by love, I mean hate.

@Kat: Don't ignore me. I'd like an answer to this please.

[gandalf5166]

There is no way that the real Gandalf would have CC'd. InHim, you're a doublevoter? Also, ME, I have a question. You say that if my role was real, it would be scum. How would town get rid of me?

[MemoriaEsponia]

I’m glad you all have had your fun with my other head while I was away.

On the Gandalf issue –

I’m not quite sure why my other head went so full bore against Gandalf. His claim we clearly a joke (I called it absurd in my greeting post). That said I have some comments to make on the subject –

O HAI MOI. MY CLAIM WAS 100% TRUE, UNLIKE RC'S. I THINK HE WAS SCUM THAT GAME? AND COULD YOU LINK TO THAT CLAIM, CAUSE IF YOU'RE GOING TO COMPARE ME TO SCUM I WANT TO BE ABLE TO SEE THE COMPARISON TOO.

No, I’m not your secretary. It’s not hard to find the thread and ISO Reaper. His claim is in the first day.

Your claim is similar on two front –

It’s a claim of a very powerful, central figure in the game. One that is going to be heavily considered Town, regardless of how often people bring up the fact that source flavor does not have to equal game flavor.

The claim is that of a pretty powerful JOAT figure.

Of course the claims are very different n other fronts because your was you playing VI while Reaper's was serious.

Unfortunately, they're ongoing >.> I have two larges complete, but way back then, I didn't act so stupid in RVS. However, I do it as scum and town, so it's a null-tell, not a towntell. I've found that it draws attention to me, tending to end the RVS, but does so without SERIOUS pressure being drawn to me, resulting in me getting lynched >.>

Ooba’s Mad World is hardly ancient history so I find the statement that you always do it to be a stretch. You certainly didn’t there.

If you know acting in a stupid manner draws attention to you that often results in you getting lynched why do you persist in playing in that manner? It’s playing against your Win-condition, regardless of your role.

I doubt there are many players foolish enough to counter-claim your ‘joke’ but if it was a fake-claim I don’t see why you have any reason to do so as Town.

On the issue of early game ‘gambits’ –

I’ll only go so far as to say the effectiveness of said gambits is greatly reduced by

A. The known perchant for the gambiter to do that sort of thing (claim scum, etc)
B. The number of gambits going on.

@Memoria:Do you honestly still believe in OMGUS? Did you discuss your #64 post with your hydra-mate before posting that, or is it purely of your belief?

As stated by my other head we have not discussed this. I don’t think OMGUS is in any way a scum or Town tell. Using it as scum-hunting is highly overrated. So I think it’s a fairly useless point to have been made.

Drippereth is joke-claiming. Otherwise he would be breaking Rules 14 and 15. Jester, maybe?

The absurdity of the Jester speculation aside – do you think claiming scum would be a great way to play the Jester role?

I don't know. I'm still trying to figure out why someone would possibly read that claim and think it was true. Could be scum, could be VI, could be nothing.

If you don’t think it is a scum-tell at this juncture why go to the trouble of quoting the whole post and say it is terrible. It obviously was terrible. Without further conclusions that post was simply filler.

Katsuki, why am I not on your town list? All the other cool kids are on it.

The better question would be – why do you care so much about whether you make it onto a randomly thrown together list?

Now that I have all that out of the way –

UNVOTE: Gandalf

I’ll have to discuss with my other head over the next few days where our vote is going.

[gandalf5166]

While Mad World wasn't a long TIME ago, I've been in several games since, and my meta has changed. And my grammar in that post was horrendous. What I meant was that it draws pressure to me, ending the RVS, without getting me lynched. Or at least, it hasn't gotten me lynched yet.

[Fate]

Ah THATS JUST GOLDEN.

THE TWO LEADING WAGON TARGETS JUST POSTED BACK TO BACK.

GUESS WHICH POST I LIKE BETTER

VOTE: GANDALF

DIE. SCUM. DIE.

[Wraith]

@ME: Yes, because it can get you lynched if you pull it off well enough. However, now that I think about it Jester-Drippereth would be unlikely considering how hard he would be trying to get lynched and how obvious it was a jokeclaim.

[Fate]

Wraith, move your vote to gandalf/ME you useless sack

[Wraith]

Wraith, move your vote to gandalf/ME you useless sack

What, so you can use your CAPS LOCK-GIC on my "parroting and bandwagoning" later on? Sorry, no, I'm going to read things first.

[Katsuki]

ME needs to read more... = =
and is probably scum.

SCUM:

VV
ME
Gandalf

TOWN:

Katsuki
Glork
Inhim
Katy
Mariyta

I'd like an explanation of both these lists. They seem pretty terrible. I also love how you put yourself on your own town list.

And by love, I mean hate.

@Kat: Don't ignore me. I'd like an answer to this please.

No, I don't think either parts of those lists need explaining.

Also, ofc I am on my town list.

Updating:

SCUM:

VV
ME
Gandalf
Nero

TOWN:

Katsuki
Glork
Inhim
Katy
Mariyta
Jenn
LockeL
Fate

SPECIAL:

CES

This is as of my re-read last night.

[Katsuki]

Wraith, move your vote to gandalf/ME you useless sack

What, so you can use your CAPS LOCK-GIC on my "parroting and bandwagoning" later on? Sorry, no, I'm going to read things first.

OR, IF YOU DON'T START BUSSING NOW, YOU TOO WILL GET ROPE.

I totally forgot to add you onto my scum list for trying to duck out of stuff... = = (Were on my list last night)

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Katsuki, why am I not on your town list? All the other cool kids are on it.

The better question would be – why do you care so much about whether you make it onto a randomly thrown together list?

Did you not read the second sentence of that quote?

[Wraith]

Wraith, move your vote to gandalf/ME you useless sack

What, so you can use your CAPS LOCK-GIC on my "parroting and bandwagoning" later on? Sorry, no, I'm going to read things first.

OR, IF YOU DON'T START BUSSING NOW, YOU TOO WILL GET ROPE.

I totally forgot to add you onto my scum list for trying to duck out of stuff... = = (Were on my list last night)

According to this logic, I'm scum if I vote, and I'm also scum if I don't. Love the lose-lose situation I'm in here.

[Katsuki]

Well, I'm not against the bandwagoning. I wouldn't give you flak for that.

[LimMePls]

Does Kat's list seem really arbitrary to anyone else? His unwillingness to explain them only makes them seem more so.

[Glork]

This game needs significantly more ME votes.

[Katsuki]

Does Kat's list seem really arbitrary to anyone else? His unwillingness to explain them only makes them seem more so.

It was not randomly put together, if that is what you're implying (which you are).

[Nero Cain]

Nero: Nothing Zwet claims should ever be taken seriously. VV linked to the Castlevania game as proof. (Zwet, VV, LMP, Katsuki, and I were all in that game together, and MoI was the back-up mod.) On D1 Zwet claimed Townie Lyncher (false) named Jonathan Morris (true). He later fake-claimed being a cop with a guilty verdict on the claimed tracker, who was summarily lynched. Zwet was not a lyncher, a jester, or scum, and he confessed his crime of fakeclaiming only after the hammer fell.

Most of us in that game have at this point referenced it already, so it kind of makes your post about Zwet's claim (and no mention of what anyone else has said) look like you're not paying attention, or that you're just trying to look active. Either way, bad.

Unvote
Vote: Nero Cain

for the most part I find meta a null tell. If a player does something over and over (like fakeclaim) just 'cause they flip town doesn't mean that they haven't received a scum role this time. He said he'd provide flavor and I'd like to hear it.


Glork's 142 makes sense and I understand it but the opposite is just as possible.

Hey everybody if I come up guilty its NOT 'cause I'm scum but a miller.

While I doubt a scum could win the game based on a fake miller claim they could certianly skate by for a few days. But to be fair to Zwet he did admit to fake claiming long before he was hammered. But in that same game you used your RVS vote on your scum buddy. Did you do it this game as well? So here's a

THEROY

You and Zwet are scumbuddies. Zwet fake claims miller 'cause you know that b/c of his past he woun't get lynched.

but other than that strange lil' theory I don't find you scummy.

Unvote; Vote: Nero Cain

Don't like the timing of that vote at all. Seems like he avoided voting Zwet in the first place, suspicion didn't really take off because multiple people said 'it's just Zwet, ignore him' and so he then pressed on with the vote to try and build Zwet pressure.

I think ME's Gandalf attack is pretty much just SSBF taking things too literally. As far as I remember, I get the impression he takes everything quite seriously when he plays.

Or maybe 'cause I wanted Wraith to answer my question first. BTW thank you for no selling my question to you in ISO #1. I'm sorry that I find Zwet the scummiest?

According to this logic, I'm scum if I vote, and I'm also scum if I don't. Love the lose-lose situation I'm in here.

I know the feeling. I'm scum if I shamelessly banwagon and I'm also scum if I vote for who I think is scum.

[Nero Cain]

[/quote]But in that same game you used your RVS vote on your scum buddy.[/quote]

disregard that part, I was looking at the wrong name.

[Wraith]

Okay, looking over ME's ISO I don't find anything particularly scummy at the moment other than his vote for gandalf, which is baseless. Is meta the only thing you have on him?

Also, someone earlier told me to take a look at the games in which I was quickly mislynch as town, and I don't even need to look to know the process:

1. Someone nitpicks one of my early posts, using strawman to make it look like my word choice is scummy
2. Town immediately beings piling onto the wagon.

It's happened to me in multiple games simultaneously before, so I know the damn process.

[Katsuki]

STOP BITCHING AND "WOE IS ME"-ING. Think half your posts have been so if I'm not mistaken.

Just the first paragraph would've sufficed.