Newbie 985 Game over

[Nikanor]

/Confirm.

[Nikanor]

Zachrulez, are you going to do an IC-like introduction? I don't want to end up teaching anybody, as you already know. Don't expect me to pick up your slack.

[Nikanor]

Sure you are (damn it, you've got me teaching people already).
Also, David has claimed that it wasn't a typo. You'll see that a lot of people type /conform instead of /confirm on this site as a joke.

[Nikanor]

Vote: AbeZTEAZ.

Am I pronouncing that right?

[Nikanor]

What do you think about Abe's paragraph, Zach?

[Nikanor]

Zach: I think he's town. If he were scum, I don't think he'd say that he knows you're fishing for reactions before unvoting, and instead just unvote and let you have your reaction.
Could you ride the fence any more with that post, Zach?

Unvote.

[Nikanor]

Now, next in line to bungee jump off the Great Wall, is my good friend and associate, Nikanor! Now, dear Nikanor, why are you so set on not teaching people? In fact, I find it's easier to go about your agenda (whether that be a town-agenda or scum-agenda) if you do so by teaching people and explaining why something is so, and someone is that, and somehow is how. You mentioned zach was fence-setting but chose not to vote him? At this stage, why aren't you using your vote yet?

a) I have an intuitive playstyle that doesn't really lend to me explaining my suspicions well. On top of that, I had a bad experience with my first game as IC. For those reasons, I'm going to shy away from teaching for a while.
b) At the time, I didn't deem anyone yet worthy of my vote. Fence-sitting on page three is hardly a vote-worthy offense, and I figured it'd be better to pressure Zach a little without placing my vote on him.

About your post, David; I think I've found a tell! I'll wait to see if it plays out, though (and this is just a note to self for when I re-read).
Zach: It's the same tell that I've figured out I can catch your wife with, as of the last game I played with her. Don't tell her, though.

Vote: FakeGod.

Yeah, really.

[Nikanor]

Erm no, actually he unvoted Tvellalott which means he's probably going to vote for you and put you on L-1 if he finds something else that's scummy about you. However he will not put you at L-1 because I am Unvote-ing as I don't think you are scum, you are certainly suspicious but as of yet not suspicious enough for me to have innocent blood on my hands (key words here being: as of yet), I don't like the fact that you didn't participate much and I also don't like the fact that you're pointing the finger at Zach after I asked him a simple question, it was an open question and I was merely looking for his professional opinion which was very similar to mine. Buuuuuut, I am more inclined to believe that you are a newbie town who doesn't know how to defend himself (I tried a similar defense to yours...totally backfired, even though I was town, because from what I've learned so far aggression seemingly leads to more aggression).

Is this what I think it is? Yes, it's all one sentence.
Also, you don't like the fact that he points the finger at Zach, even though that's the reason for why you're unvoting him (you did that as newbie town, as you said at the end of this sentence). That, sir, does not compute.

Unvote. Vote: Kalofer.

I'd keep my vote on FakeGod but it looks like Kalofer-scum is defending FakeGod-town for credits to use at the arcade later.

[Nikanor]

No no no, you've got it all wrong, firstly it's 3 sentences (long sentences but 3 nonetheless). Secondly, the only reason I unvoted him is because I don't think he's scummy enough, because in my eyes everything scummy he has done can be excused with being a newbie town (except the lurking bit, which I guess can be real - life occupations or if not is the only thing that can't be excused, but I'm not willing to lynch someone solely based on lurking and not this early anyway). And yes it doesn't compute because you didn't understand it in the way I intended, that newbie town stuff at the end of the quote was about my previous game.

Well, I think I read your words pretty well. You're scummy for trying to defend him and shove suspicion onto him at the same time, and you've done nothing in this most recent post to alleviate that concern.

[Nikanor]

Why is that scummy? I gave my own reasons as to why I think he could be scum and then I gave my reasons as to why he may not be scum, isn't that what we're supposed to do? Then I defended him from Abe's accusations because they didn't make sense to me and since I believe Fake is town I wouldn't want everyone voting for him because of Abe's statements which I don't think were a definite scum read.

No, that's not what you did. You pointed to the same thing and said that you thought him both scummy and town for it. I'll even use quotes for this:

I also don't like the fact that you're pointing the finger at Zach after I asked him a simple question

Buuuuuut, I am more inclined to believe that you are a newbie town who doesn't know how to defend himself (I tried a similar defense to yours...totally backfired, even though I was town, because from what I've learned so far aggression seemingly leads to more aggression).

Those are talking about the same post, as far as I can tell. If they're not, please enlighten me; otherwise you are scum.

[Nikanor]

And I'd also want to know what this metaphor or whatever it is means.

I'm saying that it looks like you're defending FakeGod-town so that you can point back and say "I was opposed to FakeGod's lynch, and he was town, so I must also be town," while trying to add suspicion to the wagon to push through a lynch.

[Nikanor]

soo Nik's saying that by defending me, who Kal (if scum) knows is town, it will seem suspicious to the rest of the town so that I get lynched, at the same time giving Kal town cred for the future.

No, I'm saying that he's trying to say, "Look at what he did here, it's bad and suspicious!" to create more of an air of suspicion around you, while at the same time using his unvote to defend you in the case that you are town and he is scum.

And the fact that you've pretty much only been casting suspicions on others without committing a position to a vote.

That's the tell! Well, almost.
Basically, the tell is that someone who makes more questions than statements is probably scum. It doesn't work so great on page seven, so I was going to wait for a bit, but I'm glad to see we're on the same page, I guess.

[Nikanor]

I started discussion by joking about my /conform
I then provided a vote on zombeh for doing a 100% random vote, defeating the purpose of RVS to some extent, or at least how I see it (if a vote is 100% random it serves no point, even if a vote has a joke reason it can at least help get discussion/scum-hunting started)
I then quasi-defended zach when nikanor made some bogus claim of him fence sitting on page 3 or 4 or something.
I then counter'd nashi who thought I was wary of a quick-lynch/throwing around my vote because of our previous game with 2 quicklynches.. I'm not wary of a quick lynch, I think people should be voting for something, and not feel they have to use caution all the time.

a) I'm sure that starting discussion was not your intent when you made that joke.
b) That's crap. Random random-voting is not a scumtell, and voting for someone because they random-voted randomly is not pro-town. You including this and a) in the big list of things you have done makes me think you're scrounging.
c) You defended someone. Good job. It's too bad that's not pro-town, either.
d) This is you trying to appear pro-town for the sake of appearing pro-town.

Right now I find FakeGod and David to be most suspicious (though not in that order)

VOTE: FakeGod

You find David more suspicious, but you vote FakeGod. I think we have a scumteam on our hands here gais.

195/198/202 all seem like him agreeing to being scum... I don't get it.. I want to believe his town (in fact in trying to force a scum claim, i actually believed he was town....) but his response was pure scummy. I'm convinced zach is scum, that's the only thing stopping me from voting Kalofer atm... (and him finally semi-denying being scum in 203)

You realize that he has all but claimed scum and yet you're opposed to his lynch.
NOT BUYING IT.

I'm liking my Kalofer vote more and more. Could we get a claim and a hammer soonish please?

[Nikanor]

Kalofer - Almost certainly newb townie: If you're scum, you've got me fooled. Don't panic so much under pressure.

Now is the time to bus, not coach.

[Nikanor]

Bussing is voting for your scumbuddy.
In your case, that would be Kalofer.

[Nikanor]

What do you think be scummy about tvell?

He was coaching Kalofer, someone who I find suspicious.

Zombeh, you look like a man who is willing to lynch Kalofer. Are you willing to put him at L-1?

[Nikanor]

Something, intuitively about him, makes me think scum. Yet because I can’t pin point down why, this is conflicting. In the past I have passed pressing a “gut feeling” who later proved to be the winning scum, so this time I’m not going to ignore this.
Nikanor. Why should I vote Zombie-Pug over you?

Well I can say that it's because I'm not scum, but I doubt you'll believe that.
The best I can do is tell you to look at my meta. Look at a town game of mine and a scum game of mine, compare them to each other, then compare them to my play in this game. That should clear up your gut read on me.
Also, vote for Kalofer, not Zombeh-Pug.

He even asks “where did I screw up”(#195) within the game. I found this far too suicidal for a scum who knows what they are doing.

Does he look like he knows what he's doing, regardless of alignment?

And seriously Nik, why so merciless, isn't there at least a little bit of something gnawing at you in the back of your head telling you "he could be town", cause there certainly is in me for whoever I vote.

It's called "confidence."
Although you saying this makes me think that you could be town, ironically enough. You raise a good point on Zach, too. I'll look into his posts, because I don't remember him being particularly scummy.

[Nikanor]

I thought this degree of cluelessness is more likely to be a new town, as new scums would have an informed scum buddy who could coach him in private. Posts like #195 would've been asked in private if he's a scum IMO.

You know that scum can't talk during the day, right?

I've looked through Zach's posts and I can't see why he's the leading wagon.
Not taking an active teaching role and instead leading by example is actually more of a town trait, because teaching people would make him appear more pro-town. He seems a bit more active than normal, but other than that I just see normal Zachrulez.

[Nikanor]

I've been here, Abe. I've been trying to get Kalofer lynched for the longest time.
Right now I'm pretty sure that tvell is town. He's been doing nothing but using wikitells to do his scumhunting, which is something that I find townish.
If people are unwilling to lynch Kalofer, I'd be down for a Davidlynch.

[Nikanor]

And if Nik manages to convince everyone with his erroneous beliefs that I'm scum, befoer I go can someone please just tell me whats a quasi something such as a quasi - scum claim and Nik, when you play like this and focus down one person, how usually are you correct?

On day one, I'm usually wrong. However, process of elimination leads me to be right in lylo most of the time.
Anyway, this'll make you happy:

Unvote. Vote: DavidParker.

Do you at least have thoughts on the other players if either of these turn out to be town?

Well, I've got town reads on Abe, Nashi, tvell and Zach. If Kalofer or David turn out to be town, I'd be up to lynch anyone who is not on my town list, starting with Zombeh-Pug.

[Nikanor]

He's saying with that post that you claimed scum without actually saying you're scum.

Also, bears are amazing creatures, second only to cephalopods. You should respect them.

[Nikanor]

It's a sloth bear. It is indigenous to India, Sri Lanka, and South-East Asia. They are named as sloth bears because of the flapping, clumsy sound they make with their feet as they walk, and also because they are able to (and often) hang upside-down from trees, like a sloth.
They are also known for being a man-killer, and for being enslaved by men for use in shows.

And yeah cephalopods are amazing especially the one that predicted Germany's play in the World Cup.

That was me.

[Nikanor]

I'm ready for someone to drop the hammer and dispense some indiscriminate justice.

[Nikanor]

Yes, I was hoping someone would catch on to that.
Are you willing to hammer David, FakeGod?

[Nikanor]

I would also like to hear why Kalofer thinks the night-kill implicates Zach.

[Nikanor]

To quickly address the issue with Zach

I basically suspect him (Zach) because of his (Zombeh's) arguments with Zach

, my past gut feeling, and my arguments with him and his somehow "peculiar" so to say, way of playing at the time. When I come back I will re-read to see if there is really that much big a reason for the vote and if I truly have anything on him. Np about the butchering of my name though lol

If the bolded is the case, then half the possible kills last night would point at Zach, since lots of people wanted Zach lynched yesterday.

I'm going to withhold my vote for now. I need some time to redevelop my reads, since I was wrong about a Kalofer-David scumteam yesterday.

[Nikanor]

FakeGod, what do you think of Nashi^2?
Nashi^2, what do you think of FakeGod?

[Nikanor]

Hey, I need to take care of some other stuff tonight so I'll try to get back to you guys tomorrow with content.
Shit just got real (in real life, at least).

[Nikanor]

Sorry about RL nik.

Nah, I ended up getting a job suddenly and it's really cut down on my free time (obviously). I even had to flake from a game, which I am definitely not happy about. But at least now I can eat this month, hooray!

Anyway, FakeGod, how do you feel about NashiNashi's alignment? I don't think you answered the question.

[Nikanor]

We need a big, chunky post from you Nik and soon.

Don't count on it.

FakeGod, when did your town read of Nashi came into play? I'm thinking the same thing as Kalofer here: you're spending an inordinate amount of time asking questions of someone you think is town.

[Nikanor]

For the record, I just played my first couple of games on EM and they were horrendous. The #mafia channel on globalgamers.net is a much better mafia-playing community. You might even witness people scumhunting on #mafia!

Anyway, I don't buy that FakeGod and Nashi were simply working out misunderstandings today, because if FakeGod thought Nashi was town there should have been no misunderstandings. I could see a NashiNashi-FakeGod scumteam with their whole spat as distancing.

Vote: FakeGod.

[Nikanor]

Ehhh.
Good luck town. For some reason I think you're going to need it.

[Nikanor]

Come and play EM with me sometime.

No way, come and play with Excedrin and I on IRC!

I think the hammer on me was the right choice as I was going down one way or another, but if there were any power roles we'd have been screwed.
The best thing town did in this game, in my opinion, was to keep active and hound anyone who didn't. You also did a good job figuring out that FakeGod was town, which really hurt us (me in particular, considering I was lynched because of it >_>).

I've found that gut is a better scum-compass than evidence, but maybe that's just because I am terrible at finding any evidence.

[Nikanor]

For the record, if the bear team had actually been scum I would not have been able to contain my excitement and would have spammed the thread with nonsense.

[Nikanor]

And nik, sorry we weren't a scumteam

It's okay man. I'm sure I'll find some way to forgive you... someday.