Newbie 976 - Game Over.

[Zorblag]

Vote Count 2.4

The numbers by the voters indicate the order in which the vote was cast. If two or more players are tied for the most votes to lynch at the deadline the tiebreaker will be the player who has the earliest active vote.

0x1de: 3: koch (7), theperson (13), Framm 18 (15)
gandalf5166: 3: startransmission (11), Friend (12), DavidParker (14)

Not voting: 0x1de, gandalf5166

With 8 players alive it takes 5 to lynch. Currently 0x1de would be lynched at deadline. Deadline is 5:00 PM EDT/2:00 PM PDT on Thursday, July 29th. Deadline Countdown.

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[Friend]

Yeah, it's mostly gut.

[DavidParker]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Ox1de

I am voting for him to get a read on him. Aspen did not post very much and when he did it was very (let us say) lacking in content. I get that he was playing the Newbie card, but the best way to play is to jump right in, and post. (coming from someone who has a more stay in the background and watch style of play, unless I am positive about something.)

I think that Gandalf could definitely be one of the scum, but I would rather use as much of the time left as possible, before lynching anyone at this moment.

@ST: Just out of curiosity, what about me do you find scummy? And before this is used against me, I am just wondering, so that I know if I will have to change playstyles for this site.

This struck me as a VERY scummy post.

1) Votes ox1de. That in itself is not scummy assuming he posted his case... However, he claimed to not have a case but wanted to get a read.. WHY WOULD YOU SAY THAT??? Now ox1de knows you don't even find him scummy (maybe you found his predecessor a bit scummy), but he should feel comfortable that your vote is not one that will stay.
2) Asks why ST thinks he's scummy. I never like people who do this.. It's a bit of a newb-tell, but at the same time I think newb-scum are more likely to worry about seeming scummy than newb-town. It's a point that a newb-scum may overreact to. It's not a matter of playstyle (well maybe it is, I've been told in almost every game so far, I have a scummy playstyle, and so far all my completed games I have flipped town), but the fact you would change your playstyle because someone finds you scummy? That is anti-town behaviour/thought-process right now. You should just try to be genuine.
3) His case on Aspen.. Basically is just summed up by "aspen lurked and didn't say anything"...

There was no scum-hunting in his post. His vote was counter-productive and anti-town simply beacuse he said he was doing it to get a read on ox1de.. If you want a read on ox1de, ask him questions such as why do you think so-and-so is scummy. What do you think of the cop claim? What do you think of friend getting a town read from everyone? etc. But a simple vote does nothing.

Vote: framm

[Framm 18]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Ox1de

I am voting for him to get a read on him. Aspen did not post very much and when he did it was very (let us say) lacking in content. I get that he was playing the Newbie card, but the best way to play is to jump right in, and post. (coming from someone who has a more stay in the background and watch style of play, unless I am positive about something.)

I think that Gandalf could definitely be one of the scum, but I would rather use as much of the time left as possible, before lynching anyone at this moment.

@ST: Just out of curiosity, what about me do you find scummy? And before this is used against me, I am just wondering, so that I know if I will have to change playstyles for this site.

This struck me as a VERY scummy post.

1) Votes ox1de. That in itself is not scummy assuming he posted his case... However, he claimed to not have a case but wanted to get a read.. WHY WOULD YOU SAY THAT??? Now ox1de knows you don't even find him scummy (maybe you found his predecessor a bit scummy), but he should feel comfortable that your vote is not one that will stay.

Who said that it would not stay? What case can I give against him since he hasn't even said anything really???

2) Asks why ST thinks he's scummy. I never like people who do this.. It's a bit of a newb-tell, but at the same time I think newb-scum are more likely to worry about seeming scummy than newb-town. It's a point that a newb-scum may overreact to. It's not a matter of playstyle (well maybe it is, I've been told in almost every game so far, I have a scummy playstyle, and so far all my completed games I have flipped town), but the fact you would change your playstyle because someone finds you scummy? That is anti-town behaviour/thought-process right now. You should just try to be genuine.

Good to know. He is prodding about me, at least that is what it seems like. So I took the direct approach and asked him why. I am not a newb, I know how to play, just not on here. And no I would not just change it because someone finds me scummy, but I have read the scumtell part of the wiki and several of the scumtells are part of my style of play, so think what you will. Also, it was the second time, that he has indirectly accused either everybody or just me about being scummy, almost as if he really has not cleared anyone of suspicion. FYI: I would not have posted that question if I was scum, I knew very well that it could cause this reaction.

3) His case on Aspen.. Basically is just summed up by "aspen lurked and didn't say anything"...

Is there anything else to really say about his case, since that was all he did???

There was no scum-hunting in his post. His vote was counter-productive and anti-town simply beacuse he said he was doing it to get a read on ox1de.. If you want a read on ox1de, ask him questions such as why do you think so-and-so is scummy. What do you think of the cop claim? What do you think of friend getting a town read from everyone? etc. But a simple vote does nothing.

Vote: framm

Ox1de can you try and explain why your replacee was acting so suspiciously?

P.S. Thank you for at least having somewhat of a case, be it based on one post, but still at least it is more direct then ST's way of accusing me.

[Friend]

@DP: I don't have a town read on everyone -_-

Seriously now.

[theperson]

He said you GOT a town read from everyone, AKA he's asking 0x1de what he thinks about everyone thinking you're scum.

DavidParker: Is that your only evidence? Framm has a lot of posts, do you feel that one post constitutes a vote?

[Friend]

Oh, I see, thanks

theperson, now that Aspen has been replaced by 0x1de, do you still feel his slot is the scummiest? Also, what are your thoughts on ST's claim?

[theperson]

I'm going to have to wait for 0x1de to post a little more before I decide what I think of that slot.

The ST claim, it's kind of hard to tell. If mafia is 2 mafia goons, and ST is one of them, then a cop thing would be the obvious thing to do when he's about to be lynched. On the other hand, if he's cop, it's also the obvious thing to do. Looking at his ISO, he seems kind of scummy to me but his defense was pretty good. So I'm not really sure on this.

Starttransmission's behaviour seems consistent with his cop claim

What makes you feel that way? Can you point out posts that make you think that?

[Friend]

I also wanted to see what you thought of a Gandalf lynch today.

[theperson]

Well, we have plenty of time. If 0x1de doesn't do anything scummy and is really helpful to town, then I guess gandalf is most likely to be scum just due to process of elimination. I also think that koch played rather scummy. I'm waiting for his replacement too.

Right now, with two replacements, I really have no clue who I want to lynch. Hopefully we'll get to know more about the replacements by deadline. (Which isn't for another two weeks, so we're good for now.)

[startransmission]

P.S. Thank you for at least having somewhat of a case, be it based on one post, but still at least it is more direct then ST's way of accusing me.

When did I accuse you? I referred to you as a wild card, as I don't really have much insight into your alignment right now. I'm not really even focusing on you. My line of questioning towards Friend was intended to see what his insight was, not to necessarily disagree with him in his views towards you. Just because I'm curious as to why he feels so strongly that you're town doesn't mean that I feel otherwise. Believe me, if I'm accusing you you'll know.

What's happened to Gandalf? When the pressure was on me he was posting very regularly to join in.

[Zorblag]

Mod Note: RazorStar replaces koch. Thank you very much RazorStar!

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[RazorStar]

Thanks for the intro Zorblag. This looks like fun.

[RazorStar]

I want to see Oxide post a bit more, before I change my predecessors' vote. The one I'm most suspicious of is Gandalf, but that's more of a baseless hunch at this moment.

[theperson]

Have you already read through the thread...?

[RazorStar]

I started reading from when I was introduced by Zorblag. That's why it took me so long to get a post in, but yeah I've gone through the whole thing.

[theperson]

What do you have to say for koch? Can you explain his actions?

[RazorStar]

There really isn't much to defend, he was barely around and wasn't really an active part of discussion. It's really hard to say what a lurker is, but for his few posts he explained himself somewhat well. I'd be suspicious of him, but he's not really being as suspicious or as threatening as Gandalf is to me.

[Friend]

Why is Gandalf threatening to you?

[RazorStar]

He strikes me as someone hungry for a lynch. He's using the discussion in the day phase to weed out the players who would be the biggest threat to him and wants to take them out. It could be why he's waiting for 0x1 to make a 4th vote so he get a quick lynch in.

[DavidParker]

He said you GOT a town read from everyone, AKA he's asking 0x1de what he thinks about everyone thinking you're scum.

DavidParker: Is that your only evidence? Framm has a lot of posts, do you feel that one post constitutes a vote?

It only takes one scummy post "slip-up" for me to think someone deserves a vote. A scum can play a perfect game, but one post can give them away. I remember there was some quote about that somewhere.

[Friend]

He's using the discussion in the day phase to weed out the players who would be the biggest threat to him and wants to take them out.

Can you show examples of this?

[RazorStar]

On Page 9 you can see he's voted for NS, even though he's said his belief is that someone else is part of the scum team. The excuse he used is that he was a little paranoid. If he wanted to get rid of scum, why wasn't he voting for scum?

That's all I've got, it's not much but it makes me incredibly suspicious of his motivations.

[Friend]

This continued suspicion makes me feel like a Gandalf/Koch scumteam is near impossible. Same with a Gandalf/ST team. So, that leaves us with:

Gandalf/0x1de
ST/Koch
ST/0x1de

It's gotta be between those three for me. So, thinking about it, lynching ST might not be such a bad idea for today. He's nothing but a glorified VT to us anyways, due to the roleblocking. The only problem is if we happen to hit roleblocker on our lynch today, ST would be very useful cause of the doc. Ugh. It's all too confusing. I'm just trying to figure out what lynch would give us the best information for tomorrow.

Anyways, thoughts?

[DavidParker]

Well, if we lynch say, ox1de, and he flips scum, and there is no doctor, that would presumably force the scum to nightkill ST as they have no roleblocker and we can afford a mislynch to see if ST is lying about his cop claim.

Basically, if we lynch a goon today, and we are in a setup with no roleblocker, then the optimal scum play would be to kill the claimed cop as we can afford a mislynch to test if he's telling the truth. Only problem is if ST is scum, and left alive, he will just feed us bad results, ie: claim he checked the person who was night killed. Regardless, assuming we lynch a mafioso today, I'd support keeping ST alive. As lynching a mafioso is not guaranteed, I'm reluctant to get off his wagon. Also, I know it's a huge stretch, but you should really still be considering that I may be scum with Friend... I seem to have gone completely under the radar, which does make me happy, but I'm just pointing out the scenario that you are missing as I assume someone will bring it up eventually.

Also, continued suspicion should be expected from scum pairings on each other, as they know each other are scum so it's easier to find scum tells, and that makes them seem more pro-town if/when their scum partner gets lynched.. I really think it's more a no-tell, and while it may make those possible combinations less likely, they are still definitely likely.