Newbie 976 - Game Over.

[Framm 18]

You are welcome. Looking forward to playing on here.

VOTE: Koch

No real reason other than to cast a vote.

[Framm 18]

1) Are you having fun yet? Always

2) Chocolate or vanilla? Mint Chocolate Chip

3) How many Mafia games have you played (here or elsewhere)? 17 on other sites, bit differently though. (24 hour phases)

4) Lynch all Liars? No

5) Math or Sports? Sports. Better at watching then playing.

6) Lynch all Lurkers? No

7) What do

you

think of the RVS? I personally don't mind it at all.

[Framm 18]

UNVOTE:

VOTE: Startransmission

Sorry, not a big suspicion just yet. I just think that starting to talk might be advantageous to the townies. I still am suspicious of Koch, but I just want the talking to start.

Sorry, if I am being impatient but I am not used to these longer deadlines, it will take me a couple of games.

[Framm 18]

Just posting to show that I am still here, just waiting.

I might be awol this weekend (Fri-Mon night). Travelling and I am not sure about the Internet connection.

[Framm 18]

I am not sure as to who are the scum just yet (still to early and not enough talking), but I think that the two biggest suspects for me are Koch and Aspen. Although, my experience with mafias are beware those who seem to be the least likely baddie.

[Framm 18]

I am not sure as to who are the scum just yet (still to early and not enough talking), but I think that the two biggest suspects for me are Koch and Aspen. Although, my experience with mafias are beware those who seem to be the least likely baddie.

Why Koch?
Why Aspen?
What does that last sentence mean?

Koch: Just because he seemed to accuse Gandalf and then backed off when asked about it.
Aspen: Just that fact that he said that he was not scum, when there was really no reason to say it.
What does that last sentence mean: Just because someone seems like a townie does not mean they are a townie. In my last game (on a different site) one of the scum/baddie was completely off the scum radar for pretty much all of the town/goodies.

So I guess I am saying is based off the intially feel of the game, those are my two suspects even though Aspen is voting for Koch, it is still early and not that much of a threat at the moment to vote for your partner.

[Framm 18]

I would have to say Aspen at the moment, since he has only posted once, and that was after a prod.

[Framm 18]

Secondly, your Aspen vote seems off. You say this:

I think Aspen needs to get in here and contribute

Then, when he does come in and contribute (well not really contribute, but say something) you vote him. So...when he does what you ask him to, it's scummy? If he had continued to lurk, would you have thrown your vote down?

NS, correct me if I am wrong, but I think it was the fact that he replied rather quickly after we started talking about him. I think that it is suspicious that he happens to reply so fast after he is accused of being sort of scummy after having been quiet so long. I am not willing to cast a vote for him/her just yet, but I definitely have a

FOS: Aspen

[Framm 18]

Oh, and this was also bothering me, NS.

It's your blatant attempt at stifling discussion.

I don't know how you can honestly accuse me of stifling discussion - I think I've been pretty damn active in the short time I've been here.

I hate having to keep doubleposting like this but things keep popping into my head and I feel I gotta share 'em. Sorry if it makes the thread hard-to-read or my thought process seem somewhat disjointed.

I can't answer the first part, but I understand where you are coming from on the second part.

I know what you mean, I have a tendency to do try and go through all the possibilities, though I usually end up paying for it (either death or causing a goodie lynch (pardon the terminology, still getting used to it on here) that costs us the game). I have found that sometimes thinking too much is a bad thing for this game.

Oh and for the Aspen thing, I am not going to push it, but it would be nice if (s)he told us if it were a RL thing. It would help to relieve some of the suspicion, since right now we have to go on what has been said or not said in the thread.

[Framm 18]

I have to agree with Startransmission on that. Beinging overlyaggressive can be a good thing, especially if you think that you have caught another player in something. I have seen a baddie/scum get called out and then they say a little defense and people then leave them alone. I have a habit of wanting to believe people in this game and that is normally a big no-no in my book anyways.

I will have to go back and reread some of the posts, to make sure that I have not missed anything.

UNVOTE: Just in case some scum want to take advantage of me possibly not being able to change my vote.

[Framm 18]

I have internet access and will try and check this occassionally throughout the day.
I will try and check up on the posts tomorrow, I am going to sleep now.

[Framm 18]

I have to disagree with you on DavidParker, Friend.

It may have been in a joking manner, but out of his 12 posts, a third of them have been based on what hs happened out side of this game. Granted his case against Koch seems to be well said, just he is a bit heavy with the metagaming. I will be checking on the other's post in a little bit. I just wanted to point that I would put him a bit in the null pile at the moment.

[Framm 18]

I am going to have to change my list a little bit.

Townies:
Friend- has been talking more than anyone and seems to be looking for answers, definitely not scummy-like.
Startransmission- Just a feeling at the moment.
Framm- Obvious.

Null:
Theperson- not enough information yet.
Gandalf- leaning towards town.
DavidParker- leaning towards scummy, just because of the metagaming comments and seemingly trying to avoid the game.

Scum:
Aspen- somewhat leaning toward null. He kind of comes off as a newer player that is trying to figure out what is going on, still I would like for him to come on and talk a little more.
Nobody Special- Not really doing anything at the moment, other than arguing with Friend about something non-important to the game. Instead of arguing he could have been scumhunting.
Koch- He just comes off extremely scummy.

@Koch: Can you show where gandalf was being agressive towards you?

[Framm 18]

It kind of feels like he tried to make a splash in this game or try and pull something quick, but when confronted definitely backed off and shall we say stumbled while doing it. It could be just not really knowing what he was doing, but it also could be a failed attempt at trying to pull a fast one. I just don't know???

Like you said, it is just a feeling at this point and nothing I say can be set in stone right now. I would like to hear from a few of the players, even though it is a holiday weekend.

[Framm 18]

Oh, and despite the incredible odds in the town's favor if everybody has a power role, scum usually wins.

That is strange, I play where everyone has a role and the distribution of winning is fairly even. It depends on the activity and how balanced the host is when coming up with the roles. [/metagaming]

[Framm 18]

I will not be voting NS on day 1 regardless of whether he is scum or not upon him winning me my either newbie game!

Awaiting on koch's reply.... (or a sub)

OK can you please stop mentioning other games that are going on, in this game thread? It is slightly annoying and why would you not vote for him if you were sure of him being scum???

[Framm 18]

I

will

not be voting NS on day 1 regardless of whether he is scum or not upon him winning me my either newbie game!

Awaiting on koch's reply.... (or a sub)

OK can you please stop mentioning other games that are going on, in this game thread? It is slightly annoying and why would you not vote for him if you were sure of him being scum???

The game is completed.

And there is no plausible way that we will be presented with evidence on day 1 of NS being scum.

Elaborate??? Point 1 - newbie 965. Town Win. NS put the final vote on scum in LYLO.

Point 2 - In this game setup (And almost any game setup), you will never be given 100% proof of a player being scum on day 1. You can be presented evidence that points to a player likely being scum, but never complete proof. And with NS (he was IC in that game), I highly doubt he will even make a big enough slip to be highly-probable scum. With that said, I'm not against a NS lynch, just saying I won't be the one to support it! Common courteousy, think of that what you will.

I am sorry, but VOTE: DavidParker. He sidestepped the question IMO. I get that there will not be 100% proof on day 1, but I asked why you would not vote for him if you were sure he was a baddie. I don't care if NS is the Grand Master of Mafia, slip-ups happen to everyone, especially when you are not able to fully devote time to the game.

Ugh, my Mafia Paranoia is starting to kick in.

[Framm 18]

@NS: Was that an admission of guilt, or what?

[Framm 18]

I guess that we will see what the outcome will be shortly.

[Framm 18]

I guess that we will see what the outcome will be shortly.

If Friend and/or ST are town, look here also. This is a pointless post.

Yes it is sort of pointless, I guess that I should have elaborated.
If you are town then we will have some people that we can look at for the next lynch (Friend and Startransmission mainly), but if you are scum then we can eliminate some of the people that could be scum, based on who was pushing for your lynch.

[Framm 18]

VOTE: Startansmission

The way things played out makes me think that you might be a scum member.

[Framm 18]

Ripe pickings for scum. One of the two will likely be lynched. Interesting, that there was no NK. It indicates that both DP and I were not only not considered an immediate threat, but designed to be targets for town. Somebody was considered a threat, and the doctor felt the same way. I have a guess, but for now I want the people who have voted me and (oops! how clumsy of me! ) put me at L-1 to present an actual case that I can respond to. As opposed to aping the opinion of somebody who felt that I was attacking him after his hammer at the end of D1.

How can the fact that there was a NK clear you or DP of being a scum? It could have been that they chose not to act (highly unlikely) or that the Docter saved the person that the Scum felt was the closest to figuring them out. In the first case, it would be more likely if they felt that they were in trouble so they tried to throw the townies off of their trail. I have not fully ruled out anyone at this time of being scummy, but as I said earlier, I think that the fact that you pushed that last lynch makes you seem scummy. Friend also took a hit with that lynch as well.

UNVOTE:
For the time being, I want to make sure that we have gotten as much info as possible before we lynch someone.

[Framm 18]

Ripe pickings for scum. One of the two will likely be lynched. Interesting, that there was no NK. It indicates that both DP and I were not only not considered an immediate threat, but designed to be targets for town. Somebody was considered a threat, and the doctor felt the same way. I have a guess, but for now I want the people who have voted me and (oops! how clumsy of me! ) put me at L-1 to present an actual case that I can respond to. As opposed to aping the opinion of somebody who felt that I was attacking him after his hammer at the end of D1.

How can the fact that there was

EDIT: no

NK clear you or DP of being a scum? It could have been that they chose not to act (highly unlikely) or that the Docter saved the person that the Scum felt was the closest to figuring them out. In the first case, it would be more likely if they felt that they were in trouble so they tried to throw the townies off of their trail. I have not fully ruled out anyone at this time of being scummy, but as I said earlier, I think that the fact that you pushed that last lynch makes you seem scummy. Friend also took a hit with that lynch as well.

Please answer. I am just trying to get all the information that I can right now, since obviously we made a mistake D1. I just want to try and make the correct move this time.

Oh, and Aspen and Theperson, I would appreciate it if y'all would join in on the conversation.

EDIT: Fixed the typo I made.

[Framm 18]

vote]theperson[/vote]

I want him to talk plain and simple. He has not said hardly anything, granted he was V/LA for a while, but he has only posted twice since the 4th and neither of them were very informative.

[Framm 18]

EBWOP: VOTE: theperson

[Framm 18]

I am wuestioning ST, and as of yet he has not answered my question. I am suspicious of him, but I am waiting on that answer before commiting a vote to him. I am planning on reposting that question on every page till it is answered. I do find him scummy, but I also want to try and minimize the amount of work we have to do during the next lynch as well. I have experienced that if we stay on one target that tends to stifle some of the information that could have been revealed by targeting multiple people. That is part of the reason that I did not revote for him at the moment. I have not ignored him, I am just trying to find out as much information as I can.

@Mod: Can you prod/replace Aspen as well. He has not posted since Tuesday.

[Framm 18]

Ripe pickings for scum. One of the two will likely be lynched.

Interesting, that there was no NK. It indicates that both DP and I were not only not considered an immediate threat, but designed to be targets for town.

Somebody was considered a threat, and the doctor felt the same way. I have a guess, but for now I want the people who have voted me and (oops! how clumsy of me! ) put me at L-1 to present an actual case that I can respond to. As opposed to aping the opinion of somebody who felt that I was attacking him after his hammer at the end of D1.

If I am understanding the bolded part right, he is saying that because there was no NK that you two are being set up to be lynched this time. That is why I am questioning him on this, it does not make since that just because there is no NK, that it makes you two townies.
I will hopefully say more when ST comes back on.

[Framm 18]

And I'll get into why I think Gandalf is scum other than just being on the NS wagon, and I'll also address DP's opinion that killing an uncountered PR claim is a good course of action. Hopefully I'll get the tags right this time...

Oh, and Framm18 and Koch and Friend and ThePerson could all be scum, (I would lean towards Koch were a gun to my head) but I'd like to focus on the scum that's on the NS wagon, as I'm sure they are there.

Why did you include Friend in with Koch, theperson, and me? He was the one that pushed probably the hardest for NS to be lynched.

[Framm 18]

Oh, and Framm18 and Koch and Friend and ThePerson could all be scum, (I would lean towards Koch were a gun to my head)

but I'd like to focus on the scum that's on the NS wagon, as I'm sure they are there.

I agree that NS did come off as scummy, but I was just asking since the bolded part comes off as saying that Friend was not on that bandwagon while in fact he was the one leading that wagon.

[Framm 18]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Ox1de

I am voting for him to get a read on him. Aspen did not post very much and when he did it was very (let us say) lacking in content. I get that he was playing the Newbie card, but the best way to play is to jump right in, and post. (coming from someone who has a more stay in the background and watch style of play, unless I am positive about something.)

I think that Gandalf could definitely be one of the scum, but I would rather use as much of the time left as possible, before lynching anyone at this moment.

@ST: Just out of curiosity, what about me do you find scummy? And before this is used against me, I am just wondering, so that I know if I will have to change playstyles for this site.

[Framm 18]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Ox1de

I am voting for him to get a read on him. Aspen did not post very much and when he did it was very (let us say) lacking in content. I get that he was playing the Newbie card, but the best way to play is to jump right in, and post. (coming from someone who has a more stay in the background and watch style of play, unless I am positive about something.)

I think that Gandalf could definitely be one of the scum, but I would rather use as much of the time left as possible, before lynching anyone at this moment.

@ST: Just out of curiosity, what about me do you find scummy? And before this is used against me, I am just wondering, so that I know if I will have to change playstyles for this site.

This struck me as a VERY scummy post.

1) Votes ox1de. That in itself is not scummy assuming he posted his case... However, he claimed to not have a case but wanted to get a read.. WHY WOULD YOU SAY THAT??? Now ox1de knows you don't even find him scummy (maybe you found his predecessor a bit scummy), but he should feel comfortable that your vote is not one that will stay.

Who said that it would not stay? What case can I give against him since he hasn't even said anything really???

2) Asks why ST thinks he's scummy. I never like people who do this.. It's a bit of a newb-tell, but at the same time I think newb-scum are more likely to worry about seeming scummy than newb-town. It's a point that a newb-scum may overreact to. It's not a matter of playstyle (well maybe it is, I've been told in almost every game so far, I have a scummy playstyle, and so far all my completed games I have flipped town), but the fact you would change your playstyle because someone finds you scummy? That is anti-town behaviour/thought-process right now. You should just try to be genuine.

Good to know. He is prodding about me, at least that is what it seems like. So I took the direct approach and asked him why. I am not a newb, I know how to play, just not on here. And no I would not just change it because someone finds me scummy, but I have read the scumtell part of the wiki and several of the scumtells are part of my style of play, so think what you will. Also, it was the second time, that he has indirectly accused either everybody or just me about being scummy, almost as if he really has not cleared anyone of suspicion. FYI: I would not have posted that question if I was scum, I knew very well that it could cause this reaction.

3) His case on Aspen.. Basically is just summed up by "aspen lurked and didn't say anything"...

Is there anything else to really say about his case, since that was all he did???

There was no scum-hunting in his post. His vote was counter-productive and anti-town simply beacuse he said he was doing it to get a read on ox1de.. If you want a read on ox1de, ask him questions such as why do you think so-and-so is scummy. What do you think of the cop claim? What do you think of friend getting a town read from everyone? etc. But a simple vote does nothing.

Vote: framm

Ox1de can you try and explain why your replacee was acting so suspiciously?

P.S. Thank you for at least having somewhat of a case, be it based on one post, but still at least it is more direct then ST's way of accusing me.

[Framm 18]

Well that hurts on both the lynch and the night.

Now that I can type, I will be echoing the other people, why did you do that RazorStar??? We still had time to get more information and could have used that time to get more information that would not only have been useful during the last lynch, but this lynch as well. I will cast a vote later, right now I want to look back over the rest of the game, but I have to say that hammering that quickly was really suspicious.

[Framm 18]

Oh damn, he's at L-1 now... wow yeah sorry.

UNVOTE:

After realizing that his vote for Gandalf puts him at L-1, he unvotes. No problem with that as I can understand not wanting to have scum come behind you and quick lynch a goodie. Don't think that would have happened, since I think that Gandalf is one of the two scum, but never the less I can understand this, but about 3 hours later...

Well alright David...

VOTE: 0x1de

He cast the lynching vote for 0x1de, this is what I have a problem with. If you weren't willing to quick lynch Gandalf who I think that everybody has as a leading Scum candidate, then why were you willing to lynch a person that while people were suspicious of, was not one of the major scum reads. I may be stuck on this, but it is just something that is screaming scummy to me.

VOTE: RazorStar

[Framm 18]

I just realized that I had not posted in almost three days.

Okay, I really need to look back at the remaining players ISO, but I would really like to hear from Gandalf since I don't think that he has posted since before the night phase.

@ST: What else do you have? I get having a life outside of this game, but it feels like you keep saying that you have something to comment on and that you will get it later and then you seem to forget about it.

@Everybody: If you had to hammer one person at this moment, who would it be and why?

Right now it would be a toss-up between Gandalf and RazorStar, I think that Gandalf has all but given up on this game, and what RazorStar did last lynch was a BIG no-no, and there was no reason for it.

[Framm 18]

@MOD: Please prod Gandalf

[Framm 18]

I am almost to the point that I am willing to lynch Gandalf even if he was the most confirmed townie.
I am trying not to use facts outside the game, but it is like he has chosen to totally ignore this game.

Ugh, I cannot stand blatant inactivity.

[Framm 18]

@Framm 18, you must have played a fine game. You drew the night kill and doctor protection the first night so both town and scum thought you looked town. It felt like you were active and trying to figure things out. I'd say keep it up.

Thanks and it seems that even on here, I will be a magnet for night actions.
A couple of my suspicious post were because I was trying to make a post in the time requirement and I could not think of anything to say.

I still have to get used to how it is played on here. I play on a site call MafiaManiac and it is nearly a completely different game. Time limit and roles are really different so I hope that I can get used to it.

I cannot believe that RazorStar was not lynched, I should have pushed it a little harder for that, though.