Newbie 965 (Game Over)

[silverbullet999]

@Ns

Since we played before I can explain it to you in a not so clear matter to everyone else.

Remember what I did to you last game? Well I'm attempting to do the same thing with him just about.


@wraith

Speaking of misinterpretations, there's silver's comment on the earlier questions about the "extra vote hammer." Either you're not reading or you're digging for scumduggery, my bet's on the latter. Let's talk about that vote and that question. I initially voted DP because he was the scummiest player at the time. I said I would hammer if I had the extra vote because he was being a jerk at the time. I switched my vote because not only has DP stopped being a jerk (blatantly at least, he still jabs at people subtly, but don't we all?) but also because mallow has emerged as a scummier player. That answer your analysis?

Perhaps I was being overly critical, I was going with your specific words. When you answered first you did say you would hammer him now, but then you later claimed you didn't want the day to end early. Your answer now is fine and good though for now.

[Jeffcole1]

Vote Count 1.5:

quadz08 (2): silverbullet999, DavidParker
DavidParker (2): quadz08, AGar
mallowgeno (1): Wraith
silverbullet999 (1): Nobody Special
Nobody Special (1): mallowgeno

Not Voting (2): Uite, dRool89

With 9 players alive, it takes 5 votes to lynch.
dRool89 has one more day to post before I replace him. AGar is getting close to a prod.

[mallowgeno]

@SB: Here's the thing: If a player truly is scummy, even when you point out what they're doing that's perceived as scummy, and they stop that, there will be more (usually).

All we have to do is find the next scummy thing they do.

For wanting to keep his information to himself,

unvote

Vote: silverbullet999

Since when is keeping info to yourself a scummy thing to do?!? You cannot trust anyone unless they're clear. Keeping info to yourself is a smart thing to do especially if you're on the lead of a scum. Pointing out their mistakes makes them stop doing that mistake.

[mallowgeno]

Also a little off topic

@SB
what does Heroes-1 mean?

[silverbullet999]

[off topic]

@Mallow
My first game, I bet someone to make a picture their avatar and in return they would be my hero. They did so and thus they are now my hero

Also you should get mallow from super mario rpg as your avatar. dooo itt

[/off topic]

[mallowgeno]

[off topic]

I have one of mallow and geno, but I have to readjust it to fit to size

[/off topic]

[Wraith]

@SB: Here's the thing: If a player truly is scummy, even when you point out what they're doing that's perceived as scummy, and they stop that, there will be more (usually).

All we have to do is find the next scummy thing they do.

For wanting to keep his information to himself,

unvote

Vote: silverbullet999

Since when is keeping info to yourself a scummy thing to do?!? You cannot trust anyone unless they're clear. Keeping info to yourself is a smart thing to do especially if you're on the lead of a scum. Pointing out their mistakes makes them stop doing that mistake.

People asked why I hate Day Ones. This is why. We're already arguing against arguments than were made against arguments.

[silverbullet999]

@wraith

Whatt....

[Wraith]

Exactly.

[quadz08]

@silver (and all, really):

1. I don't want to say why I find you scummy yet because I don't want you to change up anything to try to avoid continuously doing that.
2. I might just be putting pressure on you to get a better read for all you know, so I may not have any initial evidence. Isn't that what scumhunting is all about?
3. You want me to explain what has made you scummy because you state yourself that you want to act less scummy. You want people to clear you as town from day 1. You want people to scumhunt others and not you. Your question is a scummy question and if I give you the truthful answer it enables you to learn and try to be more townie. Why the frack would I want scum to act more townie?

(This is like the uber noob who in the first game goes, hey everyone I'm town, Tell me if I am acting scummy so I will stop acting scummy).

4. 5 votes to lynch... I highly doubt that will occur in a quick fashion. You are so heavily affected by one vote (I think 2 now with DP) and I find that incredibly interesting. Seems like your very afraid to get lynched with 2 votes on you...
If this was lylo I would completely agree with your last point... but really? Suspicious of a vote on Day 1? Also don't understand how it's a kicker as I haven't called you outright scum and I haven't yet said I'd be super happy with a quadz lynch today.

So I read through the game once more, this time with an eye towards my play, and I realize that what you said here is very, very true.

In addition, I realized I over-reacted to several things, and I've been playing very uptight all-around. I chalk it up to newbie jitters. I realize that doing this may immediately throw more suspicion on me, but I feel that I can ride that out until it passes.

I'm going to do my best to play looser, and not take stuff quite so... personally, for lack of a better word. I think not only will it improve my play, but it will help with scum-hunting.

On that note,

unVote: DavidParker

.

Why, you ask? Mallow made generally good points in this post, and I agree with him.

Here's my reasoning for not wanting to vote for DP anymore:
-He's not the only scum, if he is scum. There's at least one more out there.
-I see no reason to lynch an ucced cop claim. If someone else wants to cc then go for it.
-Mafia will kill him tonight most likely if there is no roleblocker. If there is a roleblocker they will block him to make him look scummier. If there is no roleblocker, he's dead tonight.

I still have suspicions of DP and mallow, but I'm going to wait and see how things play out for a bit.

[Nobody Special]

@Ns

Since we played before I can explain it to you in a not so clear matter to everyone else.

Remember what I did to you last game? Well I'm attempting to do the same thing with him just about.

This is dangerously close to talking about an ongoing game, and it makes me a bit uncomfortable.

Since when is keeping info to yourself a scummy thing to do?!? You cannot trust anyone unless they're clear. Keeping info to yourself is a smart thing to do especially if you're on the lead of a scum. Pointing out their mistakes makes them stop doing that mistake.

I was sure there was an article in the Wiki that covered this, but I can't find it. (Note to self: Either find it or write one.)

IC Hat on

Anyway, mafia is, first and foremost, a game of communication. There are (generally, and specifically in this game) two groups, or factions: Town (the uninformed majority) and Mafia (the informed minority).

As Town, all we have, aside from our Vote, is analysis. Since we have no inside information, we could do analysis two ways: each individual Townie could analyze everything themselves, and potentially come to seven different conclusions, OR we can communicate with each other and strive to arrive at a somewhat cohesive consensus.

When a player keeps information to himself or herself, that is depriving the Town of information that we may not otherwise have. Since this is a game of communication, keeping things from Town is anti-Town. (Anti-Town actions are somewhat different than scummy actions, but that's a story for another bedtime.)

IC Hat off

@quadz: So, you're unvote one suspicious (to you) player based on the postings of another suspicious (to you) player? Hmmm. That's really odd.

[silverbullet999]

@ns

Why does mentioning the last game make you nervous... I was nked and you got lynched. That game will be ended tomorrow by Thor anyway.

Since you keep pushing it and since quadz is making a transformation I'll explain it I guess. Do you want my whole method or just simply the reactions I found scummy?

[Nobody Special]

It's still an ongoing game, regardless.

Let's start with the reactions. I like keeping things simple.

[Uite]

I see no reason to lynch an ucced cop claim. If someone else wants to cc then go for it.

Are you trying to determine who the real cop is here?

Also, you keep referring to our upcoming night phase and roleblockers. How did you get that knowledge?

I think you've been making mistake after mistake, so:

Vote: mallowgeno

[mallowgeno]

I see no reason to lynch an ucced cop claim. If someone else wants to cc then go for it.

Are you trying to determine who the real cop is here?

Also, you keep referring to our upcoming night phase and roleblockers. How did you get that knowledge?

I think you've been making mistake after mistake, so:

Vote: mallowgeno

Wow, all I said was there MAY be a roleblocker. IF there is or DP is scum, he WILL live.

[silverbullet999]

@NS
Yes it's still ongoing... but the two players (me and you) that were in it are dead... so I don't understand your worrying. Do you think Thor will explore the forums and see us talking about it and get more info from that somehow? I guess that's possible but highly highly unlikely. Me thinks you just wanna win that one real bad and that's why you don't even want to take that incredibly light risk...
*you get a wag of the finger* (Stephen Colbert)

Anyway reactions, I this will be a short simple list. Also did a quick iso on quadz to refresh my memory and found one or two things more interesting.

1. When he received votes, he immediately got worried, your random and my vote on him.
2.

So... you're saying we shouldn't analyze, and make random guesses? That sounds like a plea from someone who knows their play doesn't stand up to analysis to me.

And clearly, that strategy hasn't worked out terribly well for you, as you admit:

Just noticed this now, he states this, but again when I did the same to him he got nervous and demanded to know what he was doing that made him so scummy.
3.

Ummm... No. That's not what I'm saying, at all. What I'm saying is "Hey, I'm town, but apparently I'm giving scum signals. What are they, so I know how to defend myself/fix them, so people will get off my back, so we can keep the focus on people who may actually be scum?"

The way this is worded just lit up signals in my gut strangely enough. Maybe it's a slip maybe not, but here his wording is, i seem scummish, i want to stop seeing scummish, i want to be cleared as town already so people won't question me, i want other people questioned.
4.

@silver: I'm finding it interesting that you haven't answered my question, yet still vote for me. You refute my questions, using circular logic, and provide no evidence of your suspicion.

He kept bringing this up too and while I'll agree that it's suspicious if you keep ignoring a question *cough cough* you being the culprit in umm... pie (pie meaning that thing you are so worried to talk about...) *cough cough*, we had addressed the question in one way or another.

Anyway he's made a transformation now which I can't help but blame you for, for some odd reason.

And since you may bother me about this, initially I didn't have any read on him, he was just the first person I decided to poke.

is that sufficient ns?

[Nobody Special]

is that sufficient ns?

Sufficient.

[silverbullet999]

@NS

So.... what do you think of the case, and who are your top two suspects thus far?

[Nobody Special]

I think it's a case.

My top suspect right now is mallow. I need to ruminate upon quadtz for the moment.

unvote

Vote: mallow

[mallowgeno]

I think it's a case.

My top suspect right now is mallow. I need to ruminate upon quadtz for the moment.

unvote

Vote: mallow

OMGUS vote...

@SB

You bring up some good points. I think that makes a pretty sound case and I"m interested as to how quadz will answer.

[mallowgeno]

Are you trying to determine who the real cop is here?

So you're saying that DP is scum? Or are soft claiming?

[quadz08]

@silver: As I said, I was playing very defensively, and over-reacting to a lot of things. Perfectly normal paranoia, as Slartibartfast might say.

@NS: My thoughts there are just that even though I find someone suspicious, it doesn't mean that a) I'm right or b) he can't still make good points.

[AGar]

@AGar: Where did you get that information on no-lynch stats? Also, how often was mafia lynched as opposed to town?

Link

I had a hand in the early stages of that (researching the F11 setup) datamine. The town-to-mafia day 1 lynch ratio is about 77% town, 21% mafia with the other 2% being no-lynch.

---

-Agar
Same as mallow

This is a loaded question beyond belief. If I say 'yes', I'm scum trying to quicken the game. If I say 'no', I'm scum trying to not look scummy by not rushing the tempo.

---

I've only just finished gleaning the thread, I'm going back to do a more thorough read-through after this, but I'm not buying into DP's cop claim.

Also, I implore people to stop posting complete suspicion lists. It's a very handy tool for the mafia to use during their night phases, as they can figure out who they will and won't be able to sway the town towards lynching during the next day and they can dictate their night kill based off of it.

[Uite]

Are you trying to determine who the real cop is here?

So you're saying that DP is scum? Or are soft claiming?

I'm saying I don't know and neither do you, or anybody but the cop himself, for that matter. What I meant with that sentence specifically was that I thought you were trying to confirm whether DP's claim was true, and in the case it was not, who it would then be. What I was implying was that you were trying to figure out who to off. I don't know who the cop is. DP could be, but I'm not convinced. And frankly, I don't

want

to know who the cop is, and neither should you.

[Wraith]

I have nothing useful to contribute at the moment, just maintaining my vote against mallow. I think Uite and NS make sound cases against him and further justify my suspicions.