Newbie 965 (Game Over)

[Uite]

In response to your questions, DP, in all cases, I would think very hard about my next move and motivations for it and not go by any suggestions. Unfortunately in this situation, following other people's advice seems to me a scummy thing to do, because it allows you an easy way out, without proving anything.

All right, more questions for our crew!

@DavidParker
You're contradicting yourself in post #33. NS's vote seemed random, which was later confirmed. Yet you used it as an excuse to hop on a bandwagon that didn't really exist. How come?

@dRool89
Where are you?

@mallowgeno
In post #17 you already claimed town, and implied you look generally scummy. A necessary precaution, or trying to throw us off?

@quadz08
Why are you so reluctant to vote?

@silverbullet999
Why did you want me and DP to reconcile? To me that seems like you're trying to protect him.

@Wraith
Why did you want to No Lynch? Even if you're don't think you're good at catching scum, there are eight other players, of whom three are veterans here, who might get at something working together.

[DavidParker]

I said I had already decided what I was going to do, and was asking you what you would do to find out more, my form of "scum hunting". I wasn't going to followin anyone's advice, although chances are what I do will be what someone answers.

My questions were designed to figure out more about you guys and "scum-hunt".

[DavidParker]

@Uite, I knew the bandwagon didn't exist, that was my attempt to start one.

[Uite]

Allright. What are your reasons for thinking him scummy then? You mentioned gut feeling, but that alone isn't enough.

Also, I'd like to say asking for advice like that tends to confuse matters. However, for the sake of the argument, I'll answer your questions.

If VT: Scumhunt like crazy. You're at L-1, odds are good at least one scum put you there.
If Cop: Claim, you really don't want to die.
If Scum: Either fakeclaim or scumhunt, anything to make you look innocent.

So unfortunately, in my case it wouldn't really tell anything until we get more information.

Furthermore:

@mallowgeno
Why are you so eager to get a bandwagon on DP?

@quadz08
You say you'd rather not have DP no matter what. Although I think he's very scummy, if he turns out to be town I'd rather have him with us than other scum we could have lynched.

[silverbullet999]

-Agar

@silverbullet - Why are you pro-RVS exactly?

Not pro-RVS, my first game RVS ended early... which looks like it will end early here too... *sigh*... I wanted to have a few laughs before getting serious

-Uite

@silverbullet999
Why did you want me and DP to reconcile? To me that seems like you're trying to protect him.

Arrogance to me doesn't fit scummy to me at all unless done in a certain way. Last game I called NS scummy from the way he spoke but I don't get a vibe either way from DP scum/town from his "arrogance" as you would probably say. The good thing that's been prevented that I thought might occur was severe tunneling on DP, but you are preventing that, thus it's all good. I also wanted to see what DP's playstyle was going to be like, though it seems his initial plans have changed now.

[quadz08]

@quadz08
Why are you so reluctant to vote?

It's just very soon in the day, is all. I feel like we're moving very, very quickly, especially for Day 1. But I've never played a forum-based game before, so I could be totally off base with that assumption.

@quadz08
You say you'd rather not have DP no matter what. Although I think he's very scummy, if he turns out to be town I'd rather have him with us than other scum we could have lynched.

When did I say that I'd rather not have DP no matter what? If we find a different player who's more clearly scum than DP, then I'm all for him. Right now, I think (and it seems that many agree) that DP seems to be most scummy. And, as I've said before, even if he's not mafia, his playstyle certainly doesn't seem to be good for town.

Also, this sentence: "if he turns out to be town I'd rather have him with us than other scum we could have lynched," will be true every time we lynch someone. We will never want to lynch a townie (barring strategies that I'm unaware of).

Another reason I don't want to vote for DP yet is because we have yet to hear from dRool. I think the input of someone who will hop in now could be helpful, and besides, he could very well turn out to be that "more clearly scum" person than I talked about.

[quadz08]

that* I talked about. Not than. Sorry haha.

[silverbullet999]

It's just very soon in the day, is all. I feel like we're moving very, very quickly, especially for Day 1. But I've never played a forum-based game before, so I could be totally off base with that assumption.

Here's how games typically go, fast for a bit, slows down, fast for a bit again, slows down. The game will probably take a month or more to finish

[DavidParker]

@uite, my reasons include him trying too hard to sit back on the fence. I read his posts from a scum point of view and it makes sense as to how he's trying to play it smart. He knows I'm not scum so he's not jumping onto this bandwagon, he's waiting for other people to justify it, so if he can get involved he's not responsible in any way.

He seems to point out some obvious points: ie that statement which is always true, and then adds that we should wait for dRool in case he's that "more scummy" person... He's an "experienced player" (whatver the acronym here is), if he's mafia, you have a 0/100 chance he will come in here and do something suspicious when all the heat is on me. Why you would even think he's going to come in here and turn himself into a target makes no sense.

He's pointing out how many agree with his position, and just can't stick by his own justification.

[DavidParker]

Just browsing through these games, they can just be characterised by people staying as neutral as possible... Which seems to me ridiculous. People all just try analyze critically stuff when there's nothing there. The mafia game at it's core is a guessing game. You have to make guesses and have convictions, if everyone does everything just via neutrality and careful analysis, then you get no where. Every lynch is "justified" and mafia never have any responsibility if they do the same thing the town does. By actually posting a case against someone for little, but doing so that you don't back down, you can learn a lot more than this hurr durr DP is suss for being arrogant etc. This isn't creating any discussion or helping scum hunting at all (unless of course if I am scum). But by focusing on people for reasons people won't agree with you can learn something.

[Uite]

I'm glad to see you've changed your spiel. It's also true that most of the discussion has been between the two of us. Applying pressure, as I've been doing to you, is a good way to find out were people stand by looking at their reactions. Such as how the person under pressure behaves, and how the others go with that.

I'd also like to note that we haven't had much contribution by Wraith, AGar and, to a lesser extent, Nobody Special. I'd like to see more of their opinions.

[quadz08]

my reasons include him trying too hard to sit back on the fence. I read his posts from a scum point of view and it makes sense as to how he's trying to play it smart. He knows I'm not scum so he's not jumping onto this bandwagon, he's waiting for other people to justify it, so if he can get involved he's not responsible in any way.

DP, there's plenty of other people who have "justified" this. That statement holds essentially no bearing; I am merely holding back from hammering this early in the game, before all of our players have even shown up.

He seems to point out some obvious points: ie that statement which is always true, and then adds that we should wait for dRool in case he's that "more scummy" person... He's an "experienced player" (whatver the acronym here is), if he's mafia, you have a 0/100 chance he will come in here and do something suspicious when all the heat is on me. Why you would even think he's going to come in here and turn himself into a target makes no sense.

Just because a point is obvious doesn't mean it shouldn't be made, especially when I'm answering someone else's post, directed specifically at me.

Also, I don't have terribly high hopes he'll come in and be scummy; it's a long-shot, and I'm aware. However, that doesn't mean his input wouldn't be valuable, either way.

He's pointing out how many agree with his position, and just can't stick by his own justification.

Rather, I am pointing out how many agree with my position, meaning that not only do I stick by my reasoning, others do as well.

Just browsing through these games, they can just be characterised by people staying as neutral as possible... Which seems to me ridiculous. People all just try analyze critically stuff when there's nothing there. The mafia game at it's core is a guessing game. You have to make guesses and have convictions, if everyone does everything just via neutrality and careful analysis, then you get no where. Every lynch is "justified" and mafia never have any responsibility if they do the same thing the town does. By actually posting a case against someone for little, but doing so that you don't back down, you can learn a lot more than this hurr durr DP is suss for being arrogant etc. This isn't creating any discussion or helping scum hunting at all (unless of course if I am scum). But by focusing on people for reasons people won't agree with you can learn something.

So... you're saying we shouldn't analyze, and make random guesses? That sounds like a plea from someone who knows their play doesn't stand up to analysis to me.

And clearly, that strategy hasn't worked out terribly well for you, as you admit:

THat aside, I think I was too hasty too point out some of my suspicions. Instead of getting the discussion I wanted (And pointing out that I did find quadz to be most suss, although really it wasn't based on much but the impression I got from him) I've just got people asking me to explain myself. Nothing really to help me with my scrum hunting.

Careful analysis only ever hurts the mafia, DP, as far as I'm aware. And I'm far from neutral on this point; I believe I've made that quite clear. I think you should probably be lynched, barring some crazy new information. I'm simply exercising caution by giving time for that information, if it exists, to come out. I doubt anything will, but there's no fault in patience.

[quadz08]

Do we have any information on dRool? Replacement/showing up anytime soon?

[quadz08]

Sorry for the triple post, haha. Uite, I agree with you about people contributing more, so in that spirit:

@Wraith: If you don't think you have good scumdar, and a no-lynch is a viable option, why didn't you unvote? Is it just becuase of AGar's stats? (Which is reasonable, I think.)

@AGar: Where did you get that information on no-lynch stats? Also, how often was mafia lynched as opposed to town?

@NS: You haven't added a whole lot to the discussion. You random-voted, then asked DP to explain himself, and that's essentially it for actual gameplay. It would be super-cool if you could give us some suspicions of yours, especially since you're the most experienced player here.

@silver: You're much in the same realm as NS. You random-voted, then answered a question from Uite about a piece of advice you had given, and that's basically it. You also have voiced no suspicions. I'd like to hear from you the same thing I asked from NS.

(To prevent unnecessary questions, I know I asked about NL's twice, though I seem opposed to one. That just happens to be the best way I can think of to get information from Agar and Wraith.)

[DavidParker]

Just browsing through these games, they can just be characterised by people staying as neutral as possible... Which seems to me ridiculous. People all just try analyze critically stuff when there's nothing there. The mafia game at it's core is a guessing game. You have to make guesses and have convictions, if everyone does everything just via neutrality and careful analysis, then you get no where. Every lynch is "justified" and mafia never have any responsibility if they do the same thing the town does. By actually posting a case against someone for little, but doing so that you don't back down, you can learn a lot more than this hurr durr DP is suss for being arrogant etc. This isn't creating any discussion or helping scum hunting at all (unless of course if I am scum). But by focusing on people for reasons people won't agree with you can learn something.

So... you're saying we shouldn't analyze, and make random guesses? That sounds like a plea from someone who knows their play doesn't stand up to analysis to me.

[/quote]

HAHAHA this is where I lost myself. Was laughing so hard as I read your post.. You're "GODLIKE ANALYSIS" has led the town into lynching the cop you retarded inbred.

GOOD ANALYSIS MATE

Honestly, I don't think a single person here has any idea what they're doing, no one even puts effort into their analysis. Hence the terrible poopy not making sense etc. This isn't worth my time, just lynch me.

fuck your reasoning, but I just can't take these terrible ideas like voting people for retarded reasons. A ploy? How about this, I'm the detective. Yes, game ruined. We all happy?

[Wraith]

Sorry if I seem to be lurking. I DO have school every day, and Prom was last weekend, so I've been busy. Be back with actual contribution when I'm done catching up.

[Wraith]

To answer DP's questions:

1. Mallow said don't fight it because you're expendable. I say don't fight it because it can draw out the scum. Since we've kind of paused the hammer vote, it can be easy to try to make a scum player slip up.

2. Claim. If you die, you did nothing to help the town. You'll at least get the Doc to help you (there is a Doc in a game with a Cop) or force the scum to NK you.

3. I'm not giving advice to you if you're a scum player.

@Uite: Keeping my options open. Day 1 is always grabbing at straws, as I've said. And I feel especially guilty about contributing to the death of a player on Day 1 of their first game.

@quadz: Basically AGar's statement, which I quoted in my last post if it wasn't already clear. I'd rather take a chance than practically guarantee a scum win.

My own little analysis:

Keeping it basic, we have 2 major feuds - mallow vs DP, and DP vs quadz. DP is currently giving me a scum reading, as stated. Because I am assuming DP is scum, mallow gives me the "reckless townie" vibe, and quadz just the "wrongly accused" read. I get a pro-town feeling for Uite, definitely, since he seems to be trying to scumhunt like crazy. AGar is pro-town IMO, but I don't have much on that end. Haven't seen enough from NS to get a feel for his side.

[Nobody Special]

@Mod: Please prod dRool.

@Everyone who is in a hurry: Please be aware this game has only been open for just over two days. We have three weeks until deadline, and while I'm not advocating that we just twiddle our thumbs until deadline if we've found an irrefutably scummy person, neither do we really need to rush.

Also, be aware that RL does rear its ugly head from time to time, and not all players are able to be near a computer when you want them to be. The rules state a guideline of at least one post per 24 hours. (My last post was about 18 hours ago).

I would strongly disagree with lynching someone just because they have a bad attitude.

@uite, my reasons include him trying too hard to sit back on the fence. I read his posts from a scum point of view and it makes sense as to how he's trying to play it smart. He knows I'm not scum so he's not jumping onto this bandwagon, he's waiting for other people to justify it, so if he can get involved he's not responsible in any way.

He seems to point out some obvious points: ie that statement which is always true, and then adds that we should wait for dRool in case he's that "more scummy" person... He's an "experienced player" (whatver the acronym here is), if he's mafia, you have a 0/100 chance he will come in here and do something suspicious when all the heat is on me. Why you would even think he's going to come in here and turn himself into a target makes no sense.

He's pointing out how many agree with his position, and just can't stick by his own justification.

It can be clearer for all if you include quotes from players that you are responding to. In the above, are you talking about me? I can see that, if I squint and look kinda sideways, but it's just not terribly clear.

Also, are you seriously claiming Cop? Not a terrific idea, as now the mafia have a PR they can kill.

To answer your questions, DP, if I were in your position right now ...I honestly am not sure what I would do. Mainly because I wouldn't

be

in your position. Nonetheless, if I were, I'd probably take a short break, go outside, breathe. I'd sleep on this game, and come back tomorrow with a clearer head. (I'm not telling you what to do. You asked what I would do. I'm answering. See my sig.)

@quadz: I am not the most experienced player here, and you shouldn't strictly rely on another player to feed you information anyway (not saying you are; but I'm leery of your intimation that since I'm 'more experienced' that my opinion should hold more weight. That's a fallacy.)

Also, quadz, you'd know I wasn't the most experienced player here if you'd read the thread.

I think we're sufficiently out of RVS, so

unvote

I'd like to hear opinions on DP's rage-induced claim. Anyone believe him?

[Wraith]

DP claimed? I thought that was hypothetical.

[silverbullet999]

TLDR
I answer question and ask you all questions, if you are super lazy just look for your part. Answer please thanks!

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-quadz

@silver: You're much in the same realm as NS. You random-voted, then answered a question from Uite about a piece of advice you had given, and that's basically it. You also have voiced no suspicions. I'd like to hear from you the same thing I asked from NS.

I agree for the most part. However I am not super-cool. Also i'm not the most experienced player here. As for suspicions, I feel a few things.

1. Deadline is not til far away so lots more time to get reads on people.
2. I have slight reads on people but nothing cement like yet.

Mallow - leaning town
Uite - leaning town
David Parker - super raging frustrated town (though my bet is he ends up getting lynched one way or the other... game ruiner you : ( )
Wraith - neutral
Quadz- leaning scum
Nobody- SCUM!!!! Just kidding, leaning town
Drool- neutral
Agar- neutral

Guess it's time to start getting seroius *puts on business suit, breathes deeply*

-DP
Why are you losing your temper so easily? Yes pressure always puts people on edge but your anger seems surprising. You came in full of confidence and a little pressure added to you and bam this occurs. Is it because you were excited to be mafia for once in a game and are angry that you'll most likely be losing first day?

-Mallow
If you had an extra vote would you hammer now?

-Uite
Same as mallow

-Wraith
Same as mallow

-Agar
Same as mallow

-Nobody
Whats your read on the situation with DP.

-Droolz
Get the frack on here and post or else! Lurking = no good.

-quadz
Why no vote on anyone? Why so much reluctance to hammer DP?

[mallowgeno]

Apart from that, I'm still most suspicious of quadz.

Why?

Still haven't answered me

[mallowgeno]

@mallowgeno
Why are you so eager to get a bandwagon on DP?

Because he's sooo scummy it hurts

[mallowgeno]

@Mod: Please prod dRool.

I'd like to hear opinions on DP's rage-induced claim. Anyone believe him?

Not one bit.

[DavidParker]

this game is actually filled with illiterate retards.. i really dont care i ruined it, read up and you might see me responding to the same question uite posted... but i dont even care. go ahead and lynch me, i dont even care i ruined this game by telling ppl im the cop because you guys are complete utter inbred downys..

[DavidParker]

@silverbullet (possibly the only person who hasn't eloped with his cousin during the course of this game so far): well i was confident cuz i did have a role, a town role, and it was my first game i was hopin i could do something. the players in this game have sucked that enthusiasm away like they suck their little brothers pin-dicks.