Scummers Mafia: Greatest Bash? (Game Over, Scum wins?)

[Pomegranate]

Need to catchup. Will do.

[manho]

like it or not this would have happened regardless of whether I pressured Zazie at the start of day one, considering Zazie had a guilty on me anyway.

Anyway you definitely shouldn't lynch me based on the fact that no-one will counterclaim the masons thing, and the fact that my play day one wouldn't make sense as scum (

unless we had a watcher who saw Zaz target me or something

, which is incredibly low probability).

the bolded part is not the only reason, but you've explained that you always target zazie at the start of the game, so you, as a scum, may want to get zazie lynched at day 1.

Considering I always target Zazie at the start of the game, it's a fair presumption that he would target me too.

and you said that you would assume zazie had targetted you. it made more reason for you to try to get zazie lynched.

Seeing as he's an insane cop and I'm a vig whose kill got redirected (or doesn't exist) it was just an unfortunate role combination.

the probability for your kill to be redirected and that zazie is an insane cop is incredibly low.

@ortolan, why did you assume zazie is unnightkillable scum, instead of he being an unnightkillable town or a doc protected him or your kill got redirected or you got roleblocked or whatever?

[ortolan]

@ortolan, why did you assume zazie is unnightkillable scum, instead of he being an unnightkillable town or a doc protected him or your kill got redirected or you got roleblocked or whatever?

Seemed an unlikely doc protection target tbh, also odds of a bulletproof townie role being in this game are incredibly low.

[ortolan]

and plus even if he was or claimed to be a bulletproof townie those sorts of roles can be very irritating to leave in the game if they turn out to be SKs

[manho]

@ortolan, why did you assume zazie is unnightkillable scum, instead of he being an unnightkillable town or a doc protected him or your kill got redirected or you got roleblocked or whatever?

Seemed an unlikely doc protection target tbh, also odds of a bulletproof townie role being in this game are incredibly low.

do you really think an insane cop is more likely to be in this game than a bulletproof? and do you really think you being redirected is more likely than zazie being protected?

[ortolan]

do you really think an insane cop is more likely to be in this game than a bulletproof?

Well based on the fact a cop claimed a guilty on me when I know I'm town, I'd say the chances of that being due to the cop being insane are about 97%, with the only alternate explanation being that a framer happened to exist and target me.

and do you really think you being redirected is more likely than zazie being protected?

You are confusing two different positions here: what I thought at the start of the game when I started pressuring Zazie and what I think now. At the start of the game I jumped to the conclusion that Zazie was probably bulletproof SK, asking for a claim was perfectly reasonable and I interpreted his reaction as scummy. It wasn't even a case of going out all guns blazing, it was only after his reaction that I did so. Now that I know that my kill flavour is "shot", and having seen both night's actions it seems more likely that I was redirected to Netopalis n0 rather than there being another party in the game who also has the kill flavour "shot", as well as another party altogether who has the kill flavour "sledgehammered". Anyway it's all very complicated and I'm still not sure what to think exactly.

[nhammen]

FOS: nhammen

for being a gimp.

Or for being on the wagon and then criticizing it.

Ummm... yeah. I got on the wagon before Zazie claimed Cop. The next time I saw the thread he was lynched. So, yeah.

nhammen, just remember that I was onto something with orto early D1. I believe it was Zito & manho that did a good job of tearing down Zaz's claim.

Yes, but I was looking too who the hell thought it was a good idea to not let the rest of the Town respond to Zazie's Cop claim. And your statement meant that you thought that closing discussion was a good thing.

The more I think of it the less I care about anything else besides that series of interactions: ort played more like a damn cop with a guilty than zaz did off a failed kill. Then, when this wagon starts up just washes his hands of the whole thing.

So, yea, I think I still want ort dead regardless. But, moreso, I'd like players to peep up.

My thoughts exactly. That's why my vote is still on him.

Unvote: Vote nhammen

That tsk, tsk at that wagon while being on it is enough for this.

OK, you know what? The next time someone quicklynches a claimed Cop without letting me respond, I'll make sure

not

to look for who was responsible.[/sarcasm]

[MonkeyMan576]

I shake my hands of more town-fail, you're just digging your hole deeper

I guess I will have to wait till after the game to find out what the fuck is going on with my kill flavour, with the redirection and with non-reveal of insane cops

Can you explain why you think you are insane again?

[manho]

i start finding ortolan not scum.

but i don't know, i'm still with the lynch.

[ortolan]

I shake my hands of more town-fail, you're just digging your hole deeper

I guess I will have to wait till after the game to find out what the fuck is going on with my kill flavour, with the redirection and with non-reveal of insane cops

Can you explain why you think you are insane again?

Zazie was (highly likely to be) insane, unless there's a mafia framer in the game or some weird element where my role investigates as guilty, which wouldn't make sense considering I'm not aware of any obvious flavour justification between UncertainKitten/PokerFace for that being the case. I can't really say being "insane" doesn't fit the UK role either

wrt my role: Perhaps I got redirected to Hoops n0, and last night both I and the scum targeted hasdgfas. There are quite a few possibilities. I don't think I'm insane though, at least dramonic has pretty much guaranteed I'm not.

[Niv]

Something tonight or tomorrow morning.

That is all.

[Papa Zito]

Okay seriously?

vote: Ortolan

When the mod comes in and shoots down your bullshit you know it's time for a lynch okay.

[SpyreX]

Okay seriously?

vote: Ortolan

When the mod comes in and shoots down your bullshit you know it's time for a lynch okay.

?/????

[Papa Zito]

In response to me scripting stuff: I do not control anyone's abilities in any way

^^lol

I mean, the number of twists and turns and backtracks and then the final "well crap I dunno lulz" would make Holmes commit suicide.

And then I see people start sagely nodding their heads and saying "yup, that all makes sense ort you're a good guy that just had your kills redirected and your mason partner killed off the bat and you say you had a guilty on the cop that got a guilty on you WAHEY TOWNIE PARTY UP IN HERE" and yeah.

[dramonic]

Votecount 8: Too bad!

Ortolan (6): PopularTajo, Kunkstar, Manho, Nhammen, Ani, Papa Zito
Monkeyman (1): Ortolan
PopularTajo (1): Cuttlefish
Nhammen (2): Diacria, SpyreX

Not Voting (6): Pomegranate, Niv, Monkeyman, The Mask, Zang, Starbuck

With 16 alive it taks nine to lynch!

Deadline is on the 28th!

[kunkstar7]

i start finding ortolan not scum.

but i don't know, i'm still with the lynch.

Horrible, just horrible. You start to find him not scum but are still fine with his lynch, why is that?

FoS: manho

dram says he doesn't randomise my kills

I'm assuming n0 I got redirected from ZazieR to Netopalis, n1 I got roleblocked (possibly by someone who thought I was scum after Zaz's flip)

Why did you not think to check your kill flavor yesterday when you noticed that Zazie didn't die, instead of acting like it incriminated Zazie?

[Pomegranate]

In response to me scripting stuff: I do not control anyone's abilities in any way

^^lol

I mean, the number of twists and turns and backtracks and then the final "well crap I dunno lulz" would make Holmes commit suicide.

And then I see people start sagely nodding their heads and saying "yup, that all makes sense ort you're a good guy that just had your kills redirected and your mason partner killed off the bat and you say you had a guilty on the cop that got a guilty on you WAHEY TOWNIE PARTY UP IN HERE" and yeah.

Definitely

Vote: ortolan

at this point. PZ sums it up nicely.

[manho]

i start finding ortolan not scum.

but i don't know, i'm still with the lynch.

Horrible, just horrible. You start to find him not scum but are still fine with his lynch, why is that?

FoS: manho

i don't know. ortolan is still more likely to be scum, but it's less sure than when zazie flip. and even if ortolan is town, he is VI and bad at decision making and logical thinking. a town-killing town vig is anti-town.

[Zang]

Diacria, SpyreX-Why is Nhammen scum?

[MonkeyMan576]

I must admit I'm totally confused. If someone could explain to me what's going on it would be helpful.

[Papa Zito]

Sure Monkey. People are somehow believing this ungodly mess:

full claim: PokerFace, slightly overeager mason dayvig (with Hoopla, any scum want to fake counterclaim? go right ahead). My ability is "night vigilante". I can shoot as long as Vi did not shoot the previous day. Passive abilities are "trigger-happy" (forced to use night vig on night 0) and "gun sharing" which is the fact I am a mason with Vi (Hoopla).

the "slightly racist" element of Hoopla's role was the fact that Vi hates cops, so she would automatically daykill any claimed cop (seriously, I'm not making this up)

I targetted Zazie n0 (not only because Hoops wanted me to but because I always kill Zazie n0 anyway, independent of my alignment). He didn't die and acted scummy when I put pressure on so I assumed he was an un-nkable SK. n1 I tried to kill hasdgfas because I wanted to take that wildcard out of the game, my other suspects (e.g. MonkeyMan) I saw as decently likely to get lynched (and I'm not all that sold on MonkeyMan anyhow).

So apparently my kill doesn't even work, which makes my role rather crap. If ani tracked me I assume he can confirm the claim (if not the mason part should be enough anyway).

oh wait, my kill did work. I read that as the fact SpyreX had died, not the role SpyreX. So yes, I killed hasdgfas. Apparently I killed Hoopla night one as well. Uh, ye. Ok then. Either that was scripted by the mod or I got redirected to Hoops night one, I don't know what the case is.

Oh also either Zazie is insane (which makes the vanilla "cop" flip pretty spurious for a supposedly not totally bastardly game) or there is a mafia framer who happened to target me n0 (which would be amazingly fortuitous for the scum), or else somehow my roles investigates as guilty. Personally I'm opting for the first possibility (Zazie is insane), based on Hoopla's "kill all cops" role. If there's only other cop left in the game, chances are they are sane.

In response to me scripting stuff: I do not control anyone's abilities in any way

then there is a redirector/bus driver role in the game.

I still have no idea why my kill flavour is apparently "sledgehammered" when it clearly says in my role PM that I "shoot someone down". Unless my original theory was right and I don't in fact have a kill.

If I am the one with kill flavour "sledgehammered" (which doesn't make sense since my role PM says I shoot people) then, yes I did kill Hoopla n0, and hasdgfas n1. I targeted Zazie n0 though, so I'm assuming my kill was redirected.

I have a night vig ability, Hoopla had a dayvig ability.

he's obsessed with vigs and vigging n0, and he does/used to have in his sig "I like to vig n0" IIRC

I'm not a dayvig, I wrote that wrong. My exact role is "Slightly Overeager Mason Nightvig". No eye for detail and all that. But obviously I kill at night, because that's what I claimed to do.

Well in my role PM it says I shoot people. Actually maybe I could just ask the mod if the sledgehammered flavour is mine.

ok dramonic instantly replied and he said my kill flavour is "shot". Wtf?

dram says he doesn't randomise my kills

I'm assuming n0 I got redirected from ZazieR to Netopalis, n1 I got roleblocked (possibly by someone who thought I was scum after Zaz's flip)

[SpyreX]

Touche'

Unvote, Vote: Ort

Although I am seriously tinfoil about how stupid yesterday was this somehow being town.

I am also, if that happened, going to be deadweight. Just an fyi.

[MonkeyMan576]

Yeah, wasn't ortalon the hammer on a town lynch(correct me if i'm wrong)? This combined with the unlikely night action scenario is enough for a vote as far as I am concerned...

Vote: Ortalan

[ortolan]

why would you lynch me at this point? the mason thing never got counterclaimed.

anyway fail-role interactions are fail, as is fail-town. I have nothing more to say

[ortolan]

Touche'

Unvote, Vote: Ort

Although I am seriously tinfoil about how stupid yesterday was this somehow being town.

I am also, if that happened, going to be deadweight. Just an fyi.

If you're having a go at me my play wasn't stupid. It was a gamble, which I just happened to lose; but in an irrelevant way anyway. Even if I hadn't attacked Zazie he would have repeatedly tried to make cases against me and I would have called him out on whatever he was arguing, especially with my own result on him. So role interaction fail > anything else really.