Mini 956: The Quayside (Game Over)

[Ectomancer]

It's hard to argue Jahudo as scum when no one is really standing behind it

This doesn't make a great deal of sense. Obviously if I suspect two people the same, I can coinflip where my vote lands and not prioritise either, right? I dunno how saying that I really want to kill one of those two isn't standing behind my views?

False argument. There are 10 players in game that are not Jahudo. The point isn't about

your

vote. The point is about

10 votes

that "just happened" to land somewhere else.

I don't think any case that rests on activity can be taken seriously in the faces of players like McGriddle, Elmo, and to a lesser extent iamausername, all of which I think have been significantly more aloof than Jahudo has

My suspicion doesn't rest on Jahudo's post count, it rests on "I think he's scum". Him posting less than usual supports that. It turns out that I have a town read on Elmo and McGriddle and a scum read on Jahudo, so I am wanting to lynch him more than McGriddle / Elmo. derp derp derp.

Excuse me, whoever you are, but I would appreciate it if you would tell who exactly is using Elmo's account to play this game. I think its a load of crap to pretend you are someone you aren't. Make a new account if you are trying to avoid meta, but using someone else's account without revealing to the game that you are is, if not cheating, at least totally dishonest.

[Ectomancer]

It's hard to argue Jahudo as scum when no one is really standing behind it

This doesn't make a great deal of sense. Obviously if I suspect two people the same, I can coinflip where my vote lands and not prioritise either, right? I dunno how saying that I really want to kill one of those two isn't standing behind my views?

False argument. There are 10 players in game that are not Jahudo. The point isn't about

your

vote. The point is about

10 votes

that "just happened" to land somewhere else.

I don't think any case that rests on activity can be taken seriously in the faces of players like McGriddle, Elmo, and to a lesser extent iamausername, all of which I think have been significantly more aloof than Jahudo has

My suspicion doesn't rest on Jahudo's post count, it rests on "I think he's scum". Him posting less than usual supports that. It turns out that I have a town read on Elmo and McGriddle and a scum read on Jahudo, so I am wanting to lynch him more than McGriddle / Elmo. derp derp derp.

Excuse me, whoever you are, but I would appreciate it if you would tell who exactly is using Elmo's account to play this game. I think its a load of crap to pretend you are someone you aren't. Make a new account if you are trying to avoid meta, but using someone else's account without revealing to the game that you are is, if not cheating, at least totally dishonest.

Having the same problem Incog....site choking

[popsofctown]

unvote, vote Jahudo

We have six days until deadline. I'll claim when we have... eh... 3 days until deadline. I don't want to claim because my wagon is stupid and since it's stupid I'm hoping that the people voting on it realize how stupid they are being and how short their paragraphs are when they summarize the reasons for voting me.

And hopefully ectomancer realizes "oh noes, I'll get in trouble for lynching pops because my vote was totally random and opportunistic and I could get lynched then and what would my friends do without their godfather??"

Got the votes on Jahudo yet? That whole argument is a darn hairsplit. The people arguing for Jahudoscum weren't people who wouldn't hammer Jahudo and so weren't voting him, they were people who needed to use their votes for other things. It is like saying that I am not a ninja because I am using my katana to cut vegetables. I'm still a ninja. I'm just busy cutting vegetables.

@McGriddle: You said you were voting me because you expected more leadership out of me when I'm town aligned. Well what about now? I've been one of the first to attack Jahudo and now others are with me. I've been pretty active day 2. Are you sure you haven't changed your mind?

And I'm sorry I remembered yellow as green or green as yellow. But I think townies do that to if a post was a page ago. Do you want to consider unvoting?

[Jahudo]

Pops, explain why my case on you is stupid.

My case is not about fluffposting anymore and I'm willing to drop that notion entirely since its not reliable given his recent posting with a very un-wishy-washy stance on me.

Pops said he had a gut read on NabNab as strong as these 5 people's votes: (Elmo, Goatrevolt, SerialClergyman, iamausername, McGriddle), which would indicate he had a strong gut read on Nab being scum. He downgrades that to a null read near deadline, based on nothing he can or is willing to explain. Even if its gut, he should be able to point to actual posts that gave him a gut read that strong. Without explanation to the contrary, I feel like he was going with the flow early, and only moved away to setup another mislynch.

What's worse is that he tried to use the same logic against me, saying that I was withholding my reasoning so I could make them up later. I went on to explain my gut reads when it became an issue, while pops has continued to ignore this point against him.

What's even worse than that is he has suspected me for not responding appropriately to votes on myself, even though the vote posts themselves had no questions or reasoning that I could comment on. But when I bring up my case, on how and why he could have ignored NabNab on day 1, he ignores it. His only defense is:

That was six days ago. He did bug my gut back then, doesn't do so now. *shrug*

And I don't buy his nonchalant attitude here. Its the biggest wagon of day 1, and it was a strong gut read for him. It had to disappear for some reason.

And another thing... he says I'm suspicious for not defending, then when I go back and look for reasons why people might be on my wagon he says I'm suspicious when I do address the points against me. That feels like confirmation bias, when you would find someone scummy for doing something OR for not doing it.

This point against me does not have legs, because the reasoning for my wagon was not present in any vote posts: example 1, example 2, example 3, example 4.

And it wasn't given to me after I asked what I was supposed to defend against. But I was able to piece together what I thought was all the reasoning, and I think it happened in a timely manner given that the last 2 real-life days of Day 1 was more important to be talking about Nab, and I defended in the first real-life day of Day 2.

Finally, my activity levels are lower than normal as TOWN AND SCUM. I am aware of this but cannot say why this is so. It has nothing to do with my grasp on this game, because I have a good read on pops and want him to claim.

It would also be nice if Elmo / Incog and hey, even Pops would state what points they think are still valid against me, and what they didn't like from my responses to those points if and when I gave them. I don't mind turning this into the Jah and pops show for a few days while we see where everybody stands on each wagon.

[Elmo]

fuck me the site is absolutely horrible at the moment

%&^$%&$SH%S^US£""!A^@:(&%$£^

[Incognito]

Jahudo, I still think the majority of what I mentioned in my post #418 has some validity. If I were to focus on stuff that I haven't liked from Today though, I'd say that I have trouble with your "solid town" read on iamausername - I seriously can't see how

anyone

can be reading him in that way at this point in the game. SerialClergyman cited meta for his reasoning which baffles me - I too have played games with IAUN and have read others of his, and I haven't in any way been able to say that this definitely feels like iamausername-town. So really, the town read of IAUN coming from the both of you makes me feel like it could be contrived.

The other thing that's troubled me is ok, you've stated why you feel pops is scum. That's cool and everything, but I don't have any idea as to who else you're suspicious of at this time. Assuming pops is scum, who could you see as his potential buddy?

And finally, I just feel like your play here reminds me pretty closely of the type of play you put forth in Mini 692 - Boost Mafia where you were scum. I thought I might be having confirmation bias about that, so I never mentioned it but as this game has gone on, I've just still been having that nagging feeling about it. Admittedly, I've never played with a town-you before to compare to but yeah.

That feels like confirmation bias, when you would find someone scummy for doing something OR for not doing it.

Out of curiosity, do you feel like confirmation bias is more likely to come from town or scum?

It is like saying that I am not a ninja because I am using my katana to cut vegetables. I'm still a ninja. I'm just busy cutting vegetables.

This is one of the funniest analogies I've ever read.

[Incognito]

So apparently, sending posts works if you hit submit once -- keep AT LEAST one additional tab open for the forum index since that seems to be reloading decently and then just click into the Little Italy subforum and then this game to see that your post actually HAS been submitted. It probably just hasn't been refreshed in the actual tab that you submitted it in.

/says five Hail Mary's hoping that THIS post goes through.

[Hoopla]

Day 2, Vote Count 7

With ten alive, it takes

6

votes to lynch. Deadline is schedueled for 10:00AM GMT, May 9th <Countdown>.

popsofctown

-

5

(Jahudo, iamausername, SerialClergyman, Ectomancer, McGriddle)

Jahudo

-

3

(Elmo, Incognito, popsofctown)

Not Voting

-

2

(Goatrevolt, RedCoyote)

[Goatrevolt]

Where are SerialClergyman and Iamusername? Riding out the day?

[popsofctown]

You haven't figured out IAU's guerilla tactics plan yet? Post content in small bursts so no one notices you're behind the curve, tunnel and ignore discussing 3/4s of the thread, and pick popular targets that make you lots of freyends.


Jah, here is my massive superstrong omgiNOESthisguys is scum gutread on Nabakov that required IMMEDIATE action, could NOT BE SHAKEN, and shalt not change.

So Incognito called for more content from me, which is fair, I'm a little behind the curve on content. It's honestly because I'm seeing lots of town this game, I keep checking the thread, seeing town, not posting, and then LoL tells me a match has been found, but my teammate picked Katarina so it's autoloss anyway.

I had to reread ISOs and the thread before I could find much of anything to point fingers at, but I did find a string of stuff I didn't like from SerialClergyman. (I also hate Nabanab as much as everyone else seems to, but it's been gut and I don't get the articulated reasons atm).

I mean, really guy? What's worse is that the whole argument is that I'm scummy because I didn't want to lynch a townie. Really? And that's your case, that's it. V weak.

I think you're scum because you tested out the fluffpost attack on me to see how far it could go when I know you should know better from Mafia Jailbreak, then cancelled it. + your lurking. You're lurking too much to be scum? Too scummy to be scum? Lol. That's silly.

And also you did a lot of clarifying instead of actual scumhunting D1. You would just quote stuff and say "what do you think about this or that", weren't really breaking down fences in what little posting you did. And then there was some waffliness. You seemed a bit too ambidextrous with respect to several players, and seemed prepped to go either way.

And now you're adhomming. Come on now, I'm at L-1, you aren't the one who's gotta bring out your switchblade. If I waffled, then it's something that people from a diff PoV from me should count against me because waffling is globally correlated with the scum alignment. If I see you waffling, it also raises the chance that you are scum from any PoV but your own. Let's not be fallacious, attack the argument, not the player. And if the argument is valid, don't conclude the player is scummy for making valid arguments.

[Incognito]

I know I've definitely seen SerialClergyman online since his name appears on the online list, but I think iamausername keeps his name invisible. Even so, I know IAUN definitely made a post yesterday updating one of his Newbie Games, so they're both definitely around.

[Jahudo]

Ok, I think I've already said all I can think of about #418.

I seriously can't see how

anyone

can be reading him in that way at this point in the game.

And it makes me more likely to be scum because? I just said what I feel.

Assuming pops is scum, who could you see as his potential buddy?

I'm not thinking in those terms, but rather have a list of top suspects individually. But I don't have the same level of confidence in any of those reads, and am not ready to vote any of them yet. So I will not give names before I am ready to vote them.

And finally, I just feel like your play here reminds me pretty closely of the type of play you put forth in Mini 692 - Boost Mafia where you were scum.

I don't remember how I acted in that game.

Out of curiosity, do you feel like confirmation bias is more likely to come from town or scum?

I'd think either, but they'd be there for different reasons. I feel like pops, when talking about me ignoring votes on me, then addressing votes on me, had initially assumed two scenarios (one scum would do, the other town would do), then turned them both into scum scenarios. I think town would stay consistent in what they were looking for.

[Jahudo]

Pops, how else am I supposed to read "I hate NabNab as much as everyone else" when 5 people are on his wagon?

I mean, really guy? What's worse is that the whole argument is that I'm scummy because I didn't want to lynch a townie.

So you had a town read on him? Or are you using hindsight to your advantage? Because if you had a town read on him, it might have been pro-town to say that when he was at L-1 yesterday. And if you are speaking from hindsight, then you sound more like scum who knew he would flip town.

-The fluffpost argument was intended to make a mountain out of a molehill, so the reasoning wasn't meant to be solid. I was not going to limit myself to Jailbreak because I feel you could fluffpost to your advantage as scum too.

-RE: lurking. We've had 20 real life game days. I've had like 33-34 posts. That's better than the "post once a day" mantra that should be acceptable in most communities. If you want to argue content lurking, you need to be more specific.

-Asking questions is how I scumhunt. If I had a good opinion or read, I said them. And I can provide plenty of examples of those.

-Waffling on who again? If you mean Nab, then I guess we have different definitions of waffling because I haven't understood that argument yet.

-There's no adhom here.

-Ok, lets let other people decide who has waffled. I say your null read on Nab was vague enough that you could have helped the wagon over the edge if you needed to, but you didn't and instead setup day 2 mislynch. I also say that my opinion against a Nab wagon far outweighed my support of a Nab wagon.

[popsofctown]

Where's your day 2 mislynch? Unless you are accusing me of trying to wagon Patrick day 2, you can't use that argument. How the sam hill are you gonna appeal to your own town flip to defend yourself? You're being absolutley ridiculous.

A question for all; if you were scum, how would we tell?

I <3 bussing.

Other than that, I don't really know, apparantly I am a bad scum though so this being an experienced game, you would probably know by the end of the day whether I was scum or not lol.

Is that part of your playstyle that you mention in Post 22? I don't think I've played with you before.

Also, your post count seems to indicate you're not a newbie so why would you put down your play?

Stuff like this shouldn't count as a post. I'm not gonna pick out every bit of your posting that is just clarification and not strong content.

Lurking is secondary it's not the main point, the main thing is what a waffle you are.

[RedCoyote]

It turns out that I have a town read on Elmo and McGriddle and a scum read on Jahudo, so I am wanting to lynch him more than McGriddle / Elmo. derp derp derp.

I THINK HE'S TOWN HENCE I DON'T WANT TO LYNCH HIM, yeah?

Well why didn't you say so? All of this changes everything; how convincing!

My retort... let me mull it over... okay... Well...

I think pops is scum...
therefore...
I want to...
to...
lynch him?

Yeah, lynch him!

What a great debate we're having.

---

First, I was using the term "under-the-radar scum" in a generic sense to help support the point that I was making towards you - I wasn't saying that I believe that's what we have here since I definitely feel like pretty much everyone in this game has undergone at least some kind of scrutiny, so that means that absolutely nobody in this game has been under-the-radar in my eyes. Even if that wasn't the case though, I haven't ignored a single person in this game - you can look through all of my posts and notice that I've p much touched on anyone and everyone that I possibly could. Heck, if the mod was a player in this game too, I'd probably call her out about some of the scummier-looking of her vote counts too.

Come on, Incog. I'm not too old, but I wasn't born yesterday. The opening to the post that you link to (post #418) starts with a complaint on how Jahudo's post are too "background-ish", and that was the word you used. Now you want to back away from that? I mean, I don't get it. If you don't think he's playing under-the-radar, what did you mean when you said his posts were too background-ish? I really don't get where you're coming from here, so please help me understand.

If I were to focus on stuff that I haven't liked from Today though, I'd say that I have trouble with your "solid town" read on iamausername - I seriously can't see how

anyone

can be reading him in that way at this point in the game.

I agree with this, although I have more of an issue with the way SC phrased it, as you bring up later in this post. This isn't enough to me though, because despite iamausername's post count, I think he's posts have been generally good.

---

Where are SerialClergyman and Iamusername? Riding out the day?

I would like to hear more from them, and hopefully McGriddle too.

Anyways, I dedicate this to my buddy GoatRevolt:

The Scoop on pops

• Overreaction/Buddying with Goat
  
  
• Jahudo, I think, was spot-on to call pops a NabNab fence sitter.
  
  
• "IIoA is a great tell... but not for Elmo it isn't "
  
  
• ...but, as iamausername would bring up, pops has no problem holding McGriddle to task for IIoA.
  • (Now it seems like McGriddle is on pops' wagon, yet Elmo isn't? What a coincidence. Cue Elmo to say, "I've got a gut town read on pops and that's that!" Yeah, I'll bet he does.)
• Artifical case against Jahudo is formed on the basis that Jahudo is positioning himself to hammer NabNab (where he got this from, I still have no clue... this is just thrown in for padding), and that Jahudo is ignoring the "votes" on him... when, surprise surprise, pops was only the second vote on Jahudo's wagon. Jahudo probably hadn't have even logged in to see Incog had voted him, and already pops is calling him out for ignoring it.
  
  
• Lastly, he doesn't believe in his latest Jahudo vote. I don't know if we can blame him for being opportunistic and following orders, but I think pops is stretching himself too thin on Jahudo. He wants to appear as though he's giving Jahudo an honest shake, but his hands are tied. I don't think pops really sees scum in Jahudo, and I don't think he ever did. If he ever did, it was something that pinged his gut once, and he's been sort of limply going along with it to appease Elmo, Goat, and Incog ever since.

[Jahudo]

@Goat: have you finished reading yet? Is the pops wagon still crap?

Where's your day 2 mislynch? Unless you are accusing me of trying to wagon Patrick day 2, you can't use that argument. How the sam hill are you gonna appeal to your own town flip to defend yourself? You're being absolutley ridiculous.

Early on it might have been SC, since NabNab was at L-2 when you voted. Later on it looked more like myself or McGriddle. We know where you are today, but the point was that tomorrow you were looking in alot of places for scum, except NabNab and his wagon. And I don't buy you saying that you didn't know why everyone was attacking NabNab.

Stuff like this shouldn't count as a post. I'm not gonna pick out every bit of your posting that is just clarification and not strong content.

That was naer the top of page 2. Go and look at the other posts next to me and they line up pretty much the same content-wise: iamausername's 27, Red's 28, pops' 29, incog's 30 and patrick's 31 are mostly small questions and clarifications. I don't see player reads and legitimate accusations until a little bit later on. Yours in 29 just looks like another Random-vote stage post, so you really shouldn't be talking to me about what should count as a post on page 2.

Lurking is secondary it's not the main point, the main thing is what a waffle you are.

I'll ask once again: who did I waffle on and where? Don't be dismissive now.

[Ectomancer]

Stuff like this shouldn't count as a post. I'm not gonna pick out every bit of your posting that is just clarification and not strong content.

That was naer the top of page 2. Go and look at the other posts next to me and they line up pretty much the same content-wise: iamausername's 27, Red's 28, pops' 29, incog's 30 and patrick's 31 are mostly small questions and clarifications. I don't see player reads and legitimate accusations until a little bit later on. Yours in 29 just looks like another Random-vote stage post, so you really shouldn't be talking to me about what should count as a post on page 2.

I concur.

Pop's, you know this is just scrambling, couldn't you try something better than weaksaucing a page 2 post? (and it really wasn't fluff for page 2 as it was probing with a question) You should at least be making random proclamations about players so we can WIFOM them to death when you flip

[Elmo]

I want to give Incog credit for not letting pops go through without question, but I think he's looking in the wrong direction. Elmo doesn't get this same credit, certainly not for his, "What a coincidence SC, Jahudo, and iamausername are all my scum picks!"

Well this is horrible. I'm not letting him go "without question", I THINK HE'S TOWN HENCE I DON'T WANT TO LYNCH HIM, yeah? This is like really, really close to "pops is suspicious and Elmo doesn't suspect him so Elmo's suspicious" which is like exactly what you protested so strongly against on Day 1?

Well why didn't you say so? All of this changes everything; how convincing! What a great debate we're having.

So how does this even come in contact with what I asked? What the hell do you mean that I'm "letting him go without question" as opposed to Incog like I'm supposed to be really suspicious but I've just somehow totally ignored his play?

• "IIoA is a great tell... but not for Elmo it isn't "
  
• ...but, as iamausername would bring up, pops has no problem holding McGriddle to task for IIoA.
  • (Now it seems like McGriddle is on pops' wagon, yet Elmo isn't? What a coincidence. Cue Elmo to say, "I've got a gut town read on pops and that's that!" Yeah, I'll bet he does.)

So how is this not linking people before they've flipped which you objected to hugely before? I mean, what exactly makes this less speculative?

Except the way McGriddle has been behaving it upsets me more, compared to Elmo.

IioA is an excellent tell, but everything matters in context. In context of all of Elmo's play, taken together, I don't think it was a scumtell for her. If the previous posts were "Quit lurking Elmo" or "<a bunch of people with equal involvement in a game where contribution levels are a total nonissue>" or "<Elmo avoiding direct questions>" (she always seems to comply afaik) then the same exact post would be an issue but that wasn't the case.

So here's what pops actually said. But obviously instead of ask pops more about why he thinks my play is different to McGriddle's, you're effectively saying that because YOU think they look similar then they MUST look similar to pops and the only reason he'd think differently is because we're scum together. Do you not see a problem with that?

So so so.

*bored*

[SerialClergyman]

Pesponding to prod, will post content within 24 hours.

[iamausername]

I have no prod to respond to, but I'm also gonna do that.

[Elmo]

URGE TO KILL RISING

[Elmo]

Bits have been added to some quotes for hopefully obv reasons.

Overreaction/Buddying with Goat

amounts to

Goatrevolt's [weak sauce] reasons are independent of Nabakanov's alignment tbh. He's still hung up on the early game joke and thinks I was lying about not noticing an unvote, and doesn't like when I post fluff.

Wrong doesn't equal scum. GR doesn't scumhunt the way you would but he's trying as hard/harder than you are. Wouldn't you rather lynch a troll sleeping in the back of the nabakov haywagon?

This is a first for me. pops coming to bat for the player that just voted him, clarifying why it is Goat finds him scummy.

It turns out that this makes it easier to defend himself, which you snipped off when you quoted him. It's easy to defend yourself against Goat's stated reasons, it's hard to defend links someone's drawn partially based on what

they

did. Alongside that, he thinks Goat's town and expressly said so, and I don't see any reason presented to think it's buddying rather than genuinely thinking he's got it wrong. If anything it makes somewhat more sense for scum to OMGUS here.

Jahudo, I think, was spot-on to call pops a NabNab fence sitter.

It's not even that NabNab is a bad lynch (especially after the claim), it's that there has been no deviation from NabNab, and the NabNab wagon is completely comfortable with this. What's more, they're actively discouraging it, as is the case with our friends Goat and Elmo (in different ways). Goat is discouraging it by lining up future scum/town reads based on NabNab's alignment, and Elmo is doing so by simply not participating in the game.

Goat says that he can just simply drop all his reads if something doesn't go as planned, but that's not really the point. The point is D1's are very much a sketchy proposition for the town, and it's usually no more than dumb luck if they score a direct hit on a scum member. NabNab is no different, you know, there is not this huge case against NabNab. And yet, it's like, we've got these players who are so sure, so confident, that it's already a fixture in their minds. This mentality could really hurt us later in the game, I think.

Now, if I was in a bad mood, I'd just call you a hypocrite for the sake of it, but I won't because I had my cheerios today and I've been in roughly your position before and think it's a perfectly reasonable stance. But the problem is that you haven't evidenced a strong opinion either way, as far as I can see, and therefore I think both your play and pop's play is comparable in that respect. There needs to be more than "didn't clearly support and didn't clearly oppose" to be scummy to my eyes; if there is more than that, you'll need to elaborate because that's the most common meaning of fence-sitting. (Your play aside, I don't think it's scummy either, since being essentially neutral on that wagon seems perfectly reasonable to me for basically the reasons you stated.)

Artifical case against Jahudo is formed on the basis that Jahudo is positioning himself to hammer NabNab (where he got this from, I still have no clue... this is just thrown in for padding),

I don't really like the Nabakov wagon, except for one point that I do like. Hopefully this makes me look good if the wagon pull through on its own, but gives me an excuse to vote if it needs help.

obv not? I mean that doesn't even look close.

and that Jahudo is ignoring the "votes" on him... when, surprise surprise, pops was only the second vote on Jahudo's wagon.

I'm gonna totally ignore people voting or attacking me, I'll just ride it out and hope others get more attention.

I'd voiced some disapproval at that point, I'm not sure what other people had said. Of all the points this is probably the least thin, but I don't think it's at all unreasonable to expect Jahudo to address what people said and hence a lack of that to be a continuation of an attempt to evade scrutiny. I think one likely wouldn't convince anyone else by that, but it seems okay as a "I suspect X because Y" reason.

Jahudo probably hadn't have even logged in to see Incog had voted him, and already pops is calling him out for ignoring it.

Except Jahudo posted right above pops, in 276 to pops' 277? And Incog voted in 266? wtf?

I don't know if we can blame him for being opportunistic and following orders, but I think pops is stretching himself too thin on Jahudo.

Self-preservation is entirely rational regardless of his alignment. This is just obviously not scummy in itself, I mean if you want I can show you a game where a townie didn't vote the other viable wagon who turned out to be the SK and I wanted to rip their head off.

I mean I dunno why I bother writing this shit, it won't change anyone's mind, but there, WORD SALAD SERVED WITH A SIDE OF PASTA FOR YOU GOOD SIR.

[popsofctown]

Sorry. That quote was pulled from ISO, I didn't know what page it was on. It was the only post I could find that was entirely clarification. Most of his posts would be half clarification, half content.

Lastly, he doesn't believe in his latest Jahudo vote. I don't know if we can blame him for being opportunistic and following orders, but I think pops is stretching himself too thin on Jahudo. He wants to appear as though he's giving Jahudo an honest shake, but his hands are tied. I don't think pops really sees scum in Jahudo, and I don't think he ever did. If he ever did, it was something that pinged his gut once, and he's been sort of limply going along with it to appease Elmo, Goat, and Incog ever since.

No, I don't believe so strongly in my latest Jahudo vote. And you know that you can't blame me for being opportunistic and following orders. And you know I have to give Jahudo an honest shake to see if I can get a counterwagon to happen on him so I can survive today.

If he ever did, it was something that pinged his gut once, and he's been sort of limply going along with it to appease Elmo, Goat, and Incog ever since.

This... you put it inside a "case". But this hypathetical situation is townPops. Scumpops doesn't have his gut pinged at all. Why is this in your case?

I'm feeling yet again like you know better, and are pretending not to know better, and am worried about your alignment once again.


I'd be much happier voting Ectomancer or RedCoyote, but I have to choose a counterwagon that is viable.

[popsofctown]

Where are Goat and Red leaning on a top suspect at the moment? Besides each other if that's still the case in any way.

Because of my reasons yesterday, and the fact that nab and pops couldn't have been working together at all.

Vote: Pops

What do you mean "working together"?

Here's another one. There's stuff like that. That's the "backgroundish" stuff. He's as bad as IAU if you take that stuff out.

My feelings haven't really changed. I still think pops looks scummy. I don't really like the Nabakov wagon, except for one point that I do like.

Besides that I have bad feelings about Goat and Patrick, I'll elaborate if I think they're scummy or just playstyle things I've noticed. Ima, Ecto and Red look pretty town.

Jahudo requested an opportunity to view his waffling again so here it is.

[Hoopla]

~Bump~