Pledge of Allegiance (Game Over! Page 76)

[farside22]

Hey all. I'm going to

vote DGB

because abr says she likes to be scum.

[farside22]

##vote: Jack

So, which alignment do you guys personally prefer and why did you choose town?

Not sure why parama voted on this? Feels scummy

I pick town because I'm too busy lately. I get more stressed and have to work order being scum

## unvote
##Vote: Parama

town reads so far:

DGB
VP

hesitating read:
uncertain kitty
Jack

scum:

Parama - wants to assure people of his meta and his vote and reasoning look like the biggest load


Not meantion:
Not enough to go on.

[farside22]

so in regards to post 64.

Anyone who understands how I play knows my alignment.

##vote: Gammagooey

because I didn't know you were on MS

Saying people who understand your play (aka meta) but anyone using meta is scummy?
Let me know if I missed something in my scum read of you then.

[farside22]

What was the conclusion?

That he was fishing for possible post restrictions?

xvart.

Are you asking him? Can't you be sure in your own reasoning?

FoS: xvart

Also I forgot to do this earlier

FoS: farside

for timing on jumping on my wagon

God I wish I was a dayvig

That's hysterical considering I was the first to vote for you.

[farside22]

##Vote: Parama

##unvote
##vote:parama

## unvote
##Vote: Parama

Tempted to LaL @ farside

I didn't take xvart as serious. jack I missed his vote and mine had reasoning.
Why does my vote come of the scummiest to you? Or oportunist? Or whatever word you wish to use

RC: I was busy this weekend and I like RVS. I voted to vote and nomrally I don't see condition to voting using a # sign so I just go off what I normally do. How is that scummy?

It's more my personality than anything - has nothing to do with my meta - the meta that I don't think exists.

What is the difference?

Add putting words in someone's mouth here to make a case more then it is.

what? We are supposed to know how you speak online? Then you say he has no backing I call that hypocrisy based on your "personality" comment right about now. Do I know you? No.

what town pm tells you this?

[farside22]

Parama is town

Not seeing it.
The counter wagon is interesting.

[farside22]

Llama post 162 leans me believing he is town and I like his case on xvart.
*note to self look at xvart in iso*
Xvart: Why is it scummy for someone to bring up a QT comment?

I was waiting for this.
I didn't put words in his mouth; I'm describing exactly what he was saying while making his motives more obvious. It's not misrep if everything I said was true.

Can I see that liscense that says you are physic?

Hey look! Rolefishing!

Hey look at the front page. Hey look I checked my own PM
IE go blow it out your ass if you dont' have an explanation.

DGB- I'll wait for the Zor case for the answer to this but why do you say he came in late? His first post was less than 12 hours after the game started and there's still people who haven't ever posted yet.

DDD and to a lesser degree DGB again-Why would you leave a cult leader alive a day and let them get a recruit before killing them instead of lynching them before they have a chance to take someone down with them? And what good will PRs be on him except finding other possible members? I don't get your logic here.

I'd still appreciate a link to a townParama game if anyone is willing to share, I keep hearing about it but I'd like to see it for myself.

I like my vote right now, but I can certainly deal with a xvart lynch.

This comes off scummy. Trying to push on the Jack is cult lynch.
Hasn't said anything about finding parma scum but wants town links. Personally if your not sure I would be asking for both
Would switch votes to xvart but doesn't say why.
Post 192 I think Jack is town. Crap
post 206 DGB is so town it hurts.
Gammy is tunneling hard on jack and needs to take a step back and review all going on.
Phate 216 feels scummy. I don't like the single question that add nothing to the game post.
I'm on the fence with Elli
Seriously 2 post from Phate that say next to nothing and a very minor (one line) case against VP. Either bussing or bw vote either way Phate gives me scum vibes

Why would you lead your case on gut, then follow with shallow logic? Wouldn't you want to lead with your most credible evidence (i.e. shallow posts) and then follow up with the less substantiated personal feelings of his posts?

What difference does this make? How is it scummy?
Xvart: Do you really think the mod would allow a player to directly quote from their QT in game?

unvote
##Vote: Phate

[farside22]

After I make dinner, I plan to drink an entire bottle of wine while catching up in this game. Prepare for words children.

You only need two words (and a ##). Those are "xvart" and "vote"

@farside - Would you prefer a Phate or xvart lynch right now?

I had a few issues with xvart. The biggest issue is him focusing on the QT and trying to make it look scummy. Your case is good and it has xvart talking. I'm going with my gut read of phate based on how little he has said this game (meta) right now.

UK: There are certain things I'm seeing that make me believe Jack is town. I have seen him as scum before and I'm not seeing the same play. He's more lurky as scum. He's whole cult comment reminds me of a play of his in a current game. I just notice he likes to do crazy/stupid things more as town then scum.

[farside22]

DGB: Why am I not on your list and why is nico listed under neutral and town?

[farside22]

Fishy: Is there any reason you attacked Jack for his I would have chose mafia but ignored RC for saying close to the same thing?

DGB I would take phate off of neutral if I were you and add him to the fear your scumdar list.

[farside22]

Next list update I have to put pops squarely in the scum category. He's telling us he chose scum and is making up some nebulous story about how he picked town against his own preference. To boot, he's especially eager to eliminate Jack the Cult Leader.

^this. That was the biggest load and I started laughing at the numbers too. I think other may have been the choice on the so called dice but yeah it was scummy.

[farside22]

*adds imagine to scum list*

I voted for Phate long time ago. The following from people on what DGB says is distrubing.

[farside22]

*adds imagine to scum list*

I voted for Phate long time ago. The following from people on what DGB says is distrubing.

I was following you.

ewww get off of me.
Why do you think that xvart isn't scummy?

[farside22]

Why would you not go back over and make sure this is accurate before making claiming this? That seems kind of lazy to me.

Meh it may be lazy but I felt I caught something that others were missing first. I thought I made the first case and vote. I still dont' see xvart's vote as serious.

It's as good as vote as any. Apparently it's becoming a bit of a pattern here, as now you're trying to frame Parama with inaccurate information.

framing someone is a bit strong. It's called reading and coming to a conclusion. I had at least 3 post showing my issues with Para. How is it inaccurate?
You have Para on your scum list aren't you being hypcritcal on my case

This seems kind of like a cop out to me. I mean, I'm one to talk, as I'm the only one voting you, but do you plan to push Phate's wagon, farside, or are you just throwing something out there?

I voted for him and pointed him out to others. What do you think? Seriously.

This just seems misguided to me. I don't like how Parama caught you and it looks like you are trying to back away from that. I can buy you saying that Jack/xvart seem town to you

Really how did Param catch me exactly? And where are you getting that I found xvart town?

[farside22]

Phate: What is your view on the game at hand and everyone so far?

[farside22]

Whats your opinion on RC?

Gut check says RC looks scummy. Could be that when I see people throwing words out without saying why my scumdar goes in overdrive.

As for Phate I'm not impressed as others. d3x little blank vs blank doesn't make me feel all shiny on him. It says very little and leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

[farside22]

You and Parama can't both be scum, is that what you're saying?

No. I'm asking what is wrong with my case if your voting him.

What's inaccurate is you saying that you had the first vote on Parama, accusing Parama of misleading the town, when that is just not true... at all. You can say it was an honest mistake and your looked over it, but that's an extremely bold statement to make. What makes it worse is you didn't even bother to go back and check whether it was true.

yeah it was wrong. Why is it scummy? As scum I'm more careful your counter point? Where did I say he mislead the town? Again I thought I have the first valid case on him in my view with a serious vote.

I meant to say I get you see Jack/xvart as better than Phate, but I didn't see how Phate leapfrogged in front of everyone else.

Phate looks scummy and sliding by scum in a game like this will go unnoticed. I'm still unimpressed with Phate and him just talking about one player isn't enough in my view. He's scum

Back this up. What "words" am I throwing out?

Apparently it's becoming a bit of a pattern here, as now you're trying to frame Parama with inaccurate information.

No proof with accusation

I don't like how Parama caught you and it looks like you are trying to back away from that

same

Anything I had to ask you about I call that throwing out words without following it with proof of accusation. I see scum do that often.

I can buy you saying that Jack/xvart seem town to you, but it's still kind of awkward.

Can I call you a hypocrite for not reading since you are saying I found xvart town when I never did or lazy?

I don't really get what separates Phate from the others, especially to the degree that DGB and farside see it. They both strike me as though they see something that obviously sticks out. I don't, but I'm not opposed to a lurker lynch, especially on D1.

So you will jump on a bw you don't understand? Does this sound like a town thing to do? No

[farside22]

Alright I'm behind and today is mothers day. I just got thru Phate's post and was more impressed with it but would like links for town and scum games for comparison to look at later.

For now

##unvote
##vote: pops

[farside22]

This idea is you're making an implication with the eye roll and the, "I have the first vote, how is this bandwagonning" comment. Only after Parama brings it up do you say, "Oh yeah, ignore the other votes already there". So you're actively looking to throw dirt on Parama with that post rather than looking to see whether he is town or not.

False: It's an easy thing to look up if I'm telling the truth. But thanks for avoiding answering my question. It makes you that much more scummier

If you weren't trying to frame Parama, then you didn't bother to bring Jack or xvart up. You were purposefully omitting that information because you subjectively thought they shouldn't count. I don't buy your Parama push. Period.

I didn't look to see who voted for Parama how was this on purpose?
Lets add WIFOM to your case to make it better shall we.

This is different. I stated that I misspoke when I went back and checked the source. When Parama called you out, you tried to cover it up by saying you were the first "real" voter. It just shows me that you're more interested in throwing dirt on Parama than you are in figuring out whether you have an accurate read or not.

Oh it's something I should look at and double check but your exempt and okay to make mistakes. Nice strawman.
I also stated that I "FELT" I was the first real vote. There is a difference between your statment and mine. After it was pointed out that I was not the first and thought okay well maybe not the first but sure felt like I was the first with a serious vote.
Oh wait there was an RVS stage.

[farside22]

Why didn't you ask for a claim DGB? I would be concerned about DGB being a scum or other power role that can dayvig, with her killing a very popular target without asking for a claim.

I did confirm a suspicious player as town though.

You're welcome.

Bahahahahhahaha

Good times, good times.

##Unvote

I need to catch up but today is bad.

[farside22]

Sounds more like a scum reaction to me. The 2nd post where he accused DGB of being scum just sounds like he's trying to emphasize that he really believed the kill.

##unvote
##vote:popsofctown

Maybe scumbuddies with DGB, although everyone keeps yammering about DGB being obvtown like she couldn't play like this as scum.

Really? *post degratory comment here*

Sorry I just don't feel better with that.
Are you high? Are you seriously saying that Pops is scum because she believed the kill? Why the hell would that be scummy to you?
*refers to ongoing game here with Jack*
*gives jack a dirty look*

*looks for hope to find time to read today but looks doubtful*

[farside22]

Sorry Llama my rant at Jack is justified. Unfortunetly it's an ongoing game that i would like to rant about to him.
I did unvote pops based on her reaction. I'm just a bit behind evaluating scum but gut was on fishy.
I'm wondering if I'm just reacting to RC badly because his case is just poor. It's the whole mountain out of a molehill thing and I know I have gotten caught up feeling someone is scum based on small things myself so I'm on the fence to feeling he is scum.

[farside22]

Daykill looked pretty obv fake to me, but Pops is town, and so is Jack. Probably stranger too, and not sure on farside.
Whoever earlier said Red is scum is right! Scum. With Fishy.

I believe it was Llama pointing out RedCoyate.
This game gets a review comment with scum list tomorrow.

[farside22]

What question? Sorry I missed it.

[farside22]

Fishy is lying thru his teeth. Please tell everyone why you targetted RC last night.

##Vote Fishy

[farside22]

@farside: what?

Did I stutter?

[farside22]

Are you claiming to have a report that has me visiting RC?

If so, I have nothing to say except that it's false. I didn't visit RC last night.

Well unless someone wants to say the buss drove me elsewhere I do have a report of you having gone to see red coyate.
So since I don't believe your lying ass at all I would rather just lynch you.

[farside22]

I will say on the heels of Chronopie claim this comment is even more scummier

Actually, I'm currently a non-hostile neutral effective townie. Having (mostly) claimed, I get nothing for survival.

This is caught scum trying to swing his wincon into a townie view. He should be lynched.

[farside22]

*mechine picks up*
I'm sorry the number you reached that has a PM in her box saying that you targetted RedCoyote is not a figment of her imagination. If you feel you reached this number in error please explain in details how this error could occur.

Beep!

[farside22]

I decided that Fish does not deserve leeway and asked the mod a question about if I was to be bus driven some how.
In short I would know who I tracked and would be told who I tracked and to whom.
If you have any doubt now.

##confirm vote: Fishy

Please explain doubt to my vote.

[farside22]

*world smallest violin plays for Fish who has yet to explain my track results.*

Please read DGB sig as to what I expect Fishy is stalling for at this point but if people want to wait don't expect me to change my vote.

[farside22]

Wait Fishy must die because he targetted someone during the night after claiming a role that targets? What is this I don't even...

Yeah your not reading. Go back and try again.

[farside22]

What is fishy waiting for exactly? Why does it take a couple of days to explain? Is this game days or RL games?

[farside22]

Gamma did you notice the amount of lurkers/non poster. One could be a scum partner he's waiting on to turn in his actions.

This is if fishy is mafia with a scum team.

[farside22]

Fishy: What was it that you targeted RC with last night?
IE: What ability did you use on him?

[farside22]

Fishy isn't saying what he did last night and I note he didn't say he doesn't do anything at night with his claim.
Why are we leaving him alive?

[farside22]

We do know he's not killing townies.

And......

[farside22]

Listen up people. He didn't say he did anything last night. That is withholding information. That is not town.
He went to Red Coyote and even if that is not his intended target he still did something last night that he is not telling people.
HOW IS THIS TOWN?

[farside22]

Listen up people. He didn't say he did anything last night. That is withholding information. That is not town.
He went to Red Coyote and even if that is not his intended target he still did something last night that he is not telling people.
HOW IS THIS TOWN?

I did visit someone last night

. I doubt I'm going to claim who, because I've no intention of giving away what that action is. It's a protown action, but frankly my points rivals already know plenty about me.

Llama he didn't say that till I talked about my claim and he's keeps throwing out how pro-town he is. He could not say he didn't go anywhere after my claim.

[farside22]

Do you think Llama that scum fish got bus driven somewhere.

*note to the dumb ass town of bleck.
farside predicts she will now be rb. Thanks for not supporting your town tracker.

[farside22]

Red Coyote: Did you receive or get anything else beside being told you were Role Blocked?

[farside22]

Farside, you will probably know what I'm thinking about if you claim "roleblocked" every night.

Well I will be giving the town the finger every day I am role blocked for keeping someone alive that is saying they did something good for the town and was tracked to someone that claimed to be role blocked. In my view they are just being dumb.

[farside22]

Is everyone missing the fact that Fishy admits to having partners? Do you really think he is going to go visit a PGO?
You people are smoking crack.
He did something last night. Doesn't want to say what it is and to me it's not obviously pro-town.
He is not part of the town.

*mutters pissy comments to the town people*

[farside22]

Just look to my sig for the remainer of the day till Fishy is lynched.

[farside22]

OK. Let's take that slowly.

1. The track on me does not conflict in any way with my claim. I have said why I'm not revealing that action.

2. There's no proof I'm helping the town. Equally, there's no proof that you are town. What, exactly, is the difference? Lack of evidence is not evidence of lack. If you think I should be dead, you have a duty to explain why. The burden of proof is on you.

3. You can't trust my word because I admit to playing for my faction. Are you playing for your faction? I'm betting the answer is yes. You claim that faction is the town, I claim mine has the same motives as the town. Where is the difference? Why does that automatically make me less trustworthy than you?

1. You didn't claim going anywhere till I caught you in withholding information. How is that town?
2. Yeah let me out myself that looks so scummy. Hey all did you note I'm a tracker and fishy didn't deny after the fact that he didn't go somewhere.
The cop got a not town results. The person you went to says he was roleblocked and your doing something at night that is for your faction not in town's interest in my view
3) because you with held information which means there is more to what you are not saying that = not trustworthy.

[farside22]

@Fishy: You are not town. That is why the town should lynch you. Are you as dumb? Seriously what type of question is that.
Fishy not town = lynch.
How do I know what you did was in the best interest of the town. RC who I clearly tracked you to says nothing happened to him but a RB.
Nothing I see feel about you and my results and the facts at hand says you should be spared another living day.

[farside22]

A question: if I was tracked to RC, who was roleblocked, and then claimed some other (town) power role when that came out, would you want me lynched?

If you actually claimed hey I went somewhere last night before I caught you in a lie then maybe I might have let it slide but since you with held info. Consider me not changing my vote.

[farside22]

Literally half of farside's posts are solely about how fishy should be lynched. She has said nothing else today.

Nope I'm being stubborn and childish.
I believe he is lying scum deal with it.

[farside22]

Since DGB is wrong about me I'm pretty much on not listening but hey you want to lynch a town tracker to prove that fishy is scum knock yourselves out. I think this town is screwed for not listening to 2 people that just got outted that fishy is not town.

[farside22]

Someone proposed to lynch you???
(3) I do believe there is a nonzero chance that you are Fishy's competitor, and I don't think you can blame me for considering the possibility.

Let me ask you something.
How much sense does it make to keep a player that claims he's doing something that bennifits the town. When (1) he got a non town results from a claimed cop (2) hid information about doing anything last night to the point the tracked came out and called him on it (3) is still hiding information that most likely has to do with his faction win condition then the town win condition.
You answer how that makes sense to keep him and not lynch him. And go after someone you "think" may be SK.

[farside22]

We already KNOW that Jack is a cult that failed to recruit me.

Why are you not voting for Jack then?

[farside22]

@farside: Woah awesome defensiveness there.
Second post questioning DGB is marginally better though.

It's the bitch in me that enjoys seeing people get their comeuppance.

You call it defensive I feel quite bitchy thank you.

[farside22]

That's a nice justification but doesn't really help me determine your alignment. So, please excuse me for not excusing your actions which are borderline scummy.

Then answer the question in 907 that DGB ignored

[farside22]

I'm sorry you believe scum so easily to be followed by talks of doing something pro-town that is vague and underminding that you can bypass everything else he decided not to say Llama.

[farside22]

If farside22 can convince me that there

ISN'T

better information on the table, then I may change my opinion of her, but for now her recent actions are unsettling.

Huh? From what I can tell farside wants an admitted non-town lynched because she thinks fishy is lying mafia (possibly roleblocker) with an awesome safe/fakeclaim. What does that have to do with "better information on the table"?

OMG someone actual gets my view on the subject.

*gives cookie to Gamma*

Seriously the only way I'm jumping off this wagon is if the vig kills fishy.

[farside22]

If farside22 can convince me that there

ISN'T

better information on the table, then I may change my opinion of her, but for now her recent actions are unsettling.

Huh? From what I can tell farside wants an admitted non-town lynched because she thinks fishy is lying mafia (possibly roleblocker) with an awesome safe/fakeclaim. What does that have to do with "better information on the table"?

If she thinks Fishythefish is Mafia, she should have pushed that rather than the fact that he admitted he wasn't town.

So you admit to knowing he stated he was not town. And think he should be spared lynch because he admitted to not being town.
Let me ask you something here.

[farside22]

But but my gut is hating on Troll so much harder :O He IS a better lynch than fishy though.

TROLL AND NICO CAN BOTH DIE!
WIN WIN WIN!

EXCELLENT. I'M SO UP FOR THIS.

FARSIDE, are you explicitly claiming non-Other? Would you do so at if you'd be lynched if we found out you lied? You laying your life on the line claiming that you're definitely NOT OTHER?

I never claimed non-other. I claimed town tracker. Get your facts straight

[farside22]

We can begin by lynching Troll.

Then we can vig Nico.

It's very simple, kids.

Jack, StrangerCoug, imaginality, pops, d3x, Phate, Nico >>> unproductive voters.

GET ON WITH THE BIZNIS

Meh... Phate is prob town, SC too. That list needs more RC.

@farside - I understand what you are saying. Do you at least get where I am coming from with my arguements?

Not really. I find it hard to believe a person who with hold information to be anything that helps the town.
I find it hard to believe a person that got a not town results from a claimed cop to be town or non-other working for the town.
I find it hard to believe that I should blindly trust someone that lied the first time when they say I swear I'm working with the town. And everyone just says Oh I believe it. Dee, dee, dee.

[farside22]

I don't know what to believe from you fishy. I could see you as scum with a really good fake claim.
You could be an other who's win condition has nothing to do with a town win.
I don't know and frankly you haven't given me a reason to believe you when what you did in the beginning is anti-town.
Your not part of the town. There is no reason to trust, believe or want to see you continue in this game in my view.

[farside22]

ALL THE PEOPLE NOT ON TROLL OR NICO MOVE YOUR VOTE TO ONE OF THEM.
Then we get them to both claim etc. etc.

Can you give me the short version of why you believe they are scum?
Nico in a current game going on I could see not picking scum because he really does play it poorly.

[farside22]

I don't know what to believe from you fishy. I could see you as scum with a really good fake claim.
You could be an other who's win condition has nothing to do with a town win.
I don't know and frankly you haven't given me a reason to believe you when what you did in the beginning is anti-town.
Your not part of the town. There is no reason to trust, believe or want to see you continue in this game in my view.

The thing is, if you think my claim might be mostly true (ie. the points system is real), the last sentence isn't good enough. You might want me gone, but you don't have enough lynches to kill off a large number of non-hostile others.

If you believe my claim, I'm a terrible lynch. If you don't, I'm a good lynch. Exactly the same situation as a claimed town power role. The difference - that even if I'm telling the truth I'm not town - isn't actually important at all. In both cases, what matters is how well my claim fits the facts and my play. The argument "you're not town, so we can't trust you" is a silly one - because you can't trust anyone before you know their alignment. My alignment - again if you believe me about the points system - is effectively unknown. There is no reason to think I'm mostly protown, or that I'm not. The situation is really very similar to any other claim.

I'm going with facts. That's what your missing.
I'm not going to repeat those facts over and over again. But all the facts = anti-town. I don't know if your scum or other but I know your actions and the facts I have tell me your scum.

[farside22]

@ RC

Purdy sure Fishy is still lying about stuff. But he's not killing people at night.

Or recruiting players into a cult, like Jack. I hope someone is roleblocking Jack. EVERY. NIGHT.

Or we can lynch him, too.

Listen here are the issues. Fishy is claiming he went to someone he thought was town to do something. (not saying what it was). He is claiming he was bus driven to RC and that was not his intended target.
RC says he didn't get anything except info that he was role blocked.
So whatever fish says he may be doing or not doing is not provable.
As far as I'm concerned he could have a RB ability that he is not saying to others. You want to keep someone who may be a role blocker alive?
You want to keep someone alive that is hiding info because the target he picked didn't die?
Do you know if his group is responsible for kills?

[farside22]

Pretty sure I haven't said that I targetted someone I thought was town.

There are lots of actions people have at night. Almost none of them alert the target to being targetted. The fact that RC doesn't know I visited him for another action is no indicator at all that I didn't.

If you tracked me to RC, who got roleblocked, and then I claimed a non-confirmable town role of some kind, what would be your position on how likely my claim was to be real? Because AFAIC, that's pretty much the situation we are in.

Again. You didn't claim you went anywhere till you were trapped into saying you were so doing a hyperbole acting like what you did is in some way equivant is not factual and makes you more scummy.

Why don't you actually ask a question that has facts behind what you did and how it should be read by hiding information and me saying damn your right that makes sense.
Oh right you can't because your not town.

[farside22]

I don't know if the point system is real. I have no reason to believe you.
I have said that over and over. But in case you missed it.

I HAVE NO REASON TO BELIEVE FISHY AS HE HAS LIED BEFORE WHICH MEANS THERE IS NO REASON FOR HIM TO NOT LIE AGAIN.

[farside22]

You don't have a reason to believe anybody, about anything, until you know they are town. You judge people's claims on how well they fit their actions.

Anyhow, this argument is clearly going nowhere. I don't intend to make another post on the subject, if I can hold myself back.

Lets count the scummy actions so far
1) claimed cop has a not town results
2) with held information about being able to go out to do something
3) wont say what that something is and RC has no knowledge of anything but a RB.

Explain actions that fit your claim. I wait with baited breath.

[farside22]

UK: I'm judging him on his actions so far as of right now.
The only thing that has swayed me the slightest is that town's objective is to not be killed. The hey you followed fishy to player X who didn't die isn't a moving case when that player was roleblocked. I don't consider RB = Protown when a person who I followed is well I did something but I'm not saying what is giving me anything but bather about how his win condition is some point system that I don't know exsist.
I don't know if he went to block someone and was bus driven somewhere else. Do you?

[farside22]

Sigh. I wish I was a vig this game.
UK: if you read fishy he never said his main goal was to go to RC. He won't say who is intial target was.

[farside22]

If you think my points are flawed in some way DGB please point them out.

[farside22]

Why the legislature? Very interesting choice.

xvart was in the legislature. Later I checked back to see if farside was linked in an incrimating way, but nothing better than weakly possible distancing.

Lets not forget xvart attacking me during the time I stated I had issues.
Right lets see he's bussing while I'm distancing? Sure it makes as much sense as people believe fishy right about now.
Lets vote farside for being obvious town who claimed her target and is harping on him as a liar because that is so scummy to do.
DGB still has neglected to answer my question.
Good times.

[farside22]

Jack: You think I'm bussing someone in my own faction? Are you high?
If you believe fishy which your vote does seem to indicate. And fishy is claiming his faction is non-hostile other why would I be bussing him?
How much sense does that even make in your tiny little brain?

[farside22]

Oh lets do more shit and giggles at this point
Oh fishy do you know the people that are in your group? If so will you answer honestly if people asked you if player X was part of your group? If not why? If so why?

[farside22]

Jack: You think I'm bussing someone in my own faction? Are you high?

What other kind of bus'ing is there? (referring to xvart)

And fishy is claiming his faction is non-hostile other why would I be bussing him?

I think you are an opposing faction to Fishy. Otherwise you wouldn't have investigated him.

Yeah it has nothing to do with what I said on day one when I said I had a read that didn't seem town.

[farside22]

Whatever. If I find out I'm right and fishy gets flipped as scum or a RB other I will seriously go off on so many people it will not be funny and tell you all to kiss my ass.
All I know the last time someone lied they were scum and I don't let go of liars afterwards.

##Unvote
##Vote: Troll

[farside22]

Farsides vote switch is hilarious though.

[farside22]

@farside22, why are you voting for me at this point? Is it because you
think I'm likely to be scum in general or are you going with the Serial Killer in particular argument?

Because the more vocal players that don't have the common sense that God gave a billy goat don't want to listen to anyone else that has a view that differs from their own. Instead they want to put a label on people who dare to have an oppinion and a voice, tell them to stick it up their butt and make the game unfun for anyone that dares to speak against them.
In short I dont' care unless fishy gets lynched who gets lynched. I expect to be RB'ed/killed or get information that will help the town again and be ignored tomorrow again. DGB wants to claim some super secret ability that people will mindless sheep to who am I to be listened to. Apparently I'm some other because no one is telling me how my logic is flawed expect they can see a point system and think for reason's that just make no sense to me believe that a player is working for the town. Sure lets forget he lied. Lets forget the claimed cop's result and mindless sheep to DGB.
Weeeeee I'm have so much fun.

And yes for anyone who read this far I already told the mod all this but more bluntely and less nicely. I asked to be replaced at one point was asked to think and give it time but nothing has changed and I'm just waiting for night. See if I get anything news wise tonight or hope I'm dead instead.

[farside22]

My issue with the Nico wagon is (current game reference moment) Nico doesn't play scum well. I can't imagine someone who got (current game reference here) would chose to play scum in this game.
Sure it's a bit meta and what would you chose in this group theory more then saying OMG Nico is so town post. But it's a valid point in my mind.
Since I don't see people wanting to lynch fishy otherwise they will be bullied by others in the game I'm just going to go with this vote. See how it flips and if DGB is wrong I can tell her to stick a fork in it and let someone else's view be a driving point.
yeah it's that bitch in me again moment.

[farside22]

Let me get back to you on the meta on Nico. I haven't seen him as town so let me get a fresh view in my head and I'll be back to give my analysis on it over all.

[farside22]

okay so I did a brief look a nico in a game he was town newb town
unfortunetly searching around the only place he is scum is currently ongoing. I didn't not find another game here at MS as him scum so this is going to be difficult without letting others see his scum game but let me describe his town vs scum.

First thing I noticed
more scum hunting has town.
hestitating, asking questions as scum
When he scum hunts as scum he's all over the place with no real good case and he's trips on his own tongue.
As town goes more with gut feeling, meta and analysis.
I note this game seems to show more town then scum qualities in my view.

[farside22]

@farside22, thanks for taking some time to look at that. I guess I think that 5 votes for 5 different players over the course of 10 posts feels like it's all over the place to me and it does feel like he's hesitating as a reaction to the information about Fishythefish but perhaps you're taking those into account.

What I mean by all over the place is that he will post something that is just one post that is all over the place and votes for someone for some oblique reason here. He hesitates more on voting and like you almost get a self aware vibe when reading a player when their newb scum. I know it's sounds weird but it's sometimes a feel you get when you read a player.
As for other scum suspects. Meh I have better town reads then scum reads right now. I could name more town reads and just narrow down from there the remaining players.

[farside22]

@farside22, actually, while I'm asking questions, given what you know of her views on scum hunting what do you think of DrippingGoofball's focus on someone she thinks is a Serial Killer at the start of the game?

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

I see nothing wrong with it. The town win condition is stated to get rid of threats that want you dead. Sure mafia have to worry as much as town about a SK. However in most games there is only one SK and a mafia is a group. You get rid of a SK you get rid of one kill going off in the night. You get rid of one mafia you still have a mafia group that performs the kills along with a SK.

[farside22]

My issue with the Nico wagon is (current game reference moment) Nico doesn't play scum well. I can't imagine someone who got (current game reference here) would chose to play scum in this game.

That is so townie. Or in this game, townie/nh-other

True........it's just well for example I didn't both nh-other because I had no clue what it meant so I stuck with something I knew and do well, less stress, blah, blah, blah.
I'm thinking a newb who's ususally playing town on MS and really bad scum so far taking on something he may never have done would take big balls and no offense to Nico he doesn't strike me as that type.

[farside22]

@farside22, OK, and one last question. How likely do you think it is that I'm town at this point? If you're getting more town reads than scum reads should I take it that I'm not falling into that town read category for you?

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

Do you give me town vibes. No. I know i have seen you in a game as town and it's been awhile (not including on going game here) and that game you talk logical circles to the point I realized I would never be able to get a read on you no matter your allignment.
When you talk logical for me it's like a defense against scum hunting. It makes you immune to those who look for those little details or talk from their heart. It keeps you at a distance that makes you difficult to really ever get a good read on.

[farside22]

@farside22, I think that I've been doing more than just talking logic in circles so far this game. I think that I've been giving opinions about players based on their actions pretty much from the get go. Do you not have an impression of me based on those (others seem to have come to conclusions)? Are you really trying to say that it's not worth trying to get a read on me based on what you've seen of my play?

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

You willing to link me to games you were town, scum, sk for reference?

[farside22]

Alright well I will have to look through al this either tonight or tomorrow sometime when I have a chance. Weekends are a bit harder to get through things online.

[farside22]

I would like that shot to got to fishy personally. I"m taking bets he's lying is ass off to save himself from a lynch. And I have a bet he is a RB type.
Taking a 10-1 bet I'm right on this.

unvote:
vote: Nico

[farside22]

ugh weekend forgetfulness

##unvote:
## vote: Nico

[farside22]

Hi I'm still reading a few things here but I can verify that Plum went to Shotty. I wasn't going to say anything since I didn't see anything scummy in view of Plum seeing Shotty.
I need 3 pages to catch up on but more read of people is necessary.

too many things being thrown at me at work as well.

[farside22]

vote: charter

I would like to hear more on what you targetted Llama with right now.

[farside22]

I'm not telling what I targeted him with, unless we massclaim. I didn't kill him.

Llama is dead. He came off as town. I'm not seeing a clear case on why you targetting him and wishing for a mass claim now says townie goodness.

##vote: charter

damn stupid voting rule.

[farside22]

So you think I'm scum then?

My vote says you are.

Possible role you could have but doubtful
1) tracker (why would a town tracker, track llama)
2) cop (doubtful in this game with those outted already)
3) RB (again why would you target Llama)
4) doctor (highly impossible as llama is dead)

In short nothing I come up with results in town motive.

[farside22]

i don't like this setup at all.

Is that REALLY all you have to say? REALLY?

@farside: Why is it impossible for charter to have targetted llama with something pro town that would be more pro town if it were not revealed at this juncture? I did not read his statement as wanting massclaim.

Well, let's see what else there is:

Neighborizer (sure makes sense to me)
Watcher (Definitely makes sense)

Hell, in fact, the fact you brought up Tracker and NOT watcher bugs the shit out of me farside. What gives?

If he was a watcher he would have claimed who killed Llama.
Neighborizer is a possible one I could see and forgot about. It's not something I see in every game. There could be a 1 shot mason role. But I would expect someone with that role to use it day 1. Wouldn't you?

[farside22]

@UK it had to do with this post from RC.

I'm ready to claim... as soon as charter tells us all what he did last night.

[farside22]

I'm starting to read SC as scum. Call it OMGUS but definately something off when reading SC.
Anyone want to take a crack at reading SC and tell me if I'm off my read?
Imagine is falling around me too much and is giving me scummy vibes.
charter: Can't say he didn't read town to be at the start. I'm just wondering why someone would be so casual about saying I targetted someone and they died but I'm not scum for targetting that player.
It just rubs me wrong. And by the way i don't WIFOM night kills it leads to more miss lynches.

I'm going with my gut from here on in.

##unvote:

##vote: imagine.
fos: SC

[farside22]

That's a good point, Gamma.

Also, farside, didn't you say at one point you were just a one-shot Tracker? I think we are allowed to claim role names (I hope we are!), did yours have something to do with, like, a police force or agency or anything?

No I never said 1 shot tracker. I said town tracker. I had a flavor title that says C-Span Executive

[farside22]

missed that motive claim

Motive: I want to increase my ratings, hopefully and help the union.

[farside22]

Why do we have two people claiming tracker and we are lynching me? Out of the two of them, I'd say farside is probably scum.

Why would you track Llama if you thought he was town?

##unvote:
##Vote: charter

Also those playing at home I claimed tracker day 1 and charter never said boo about it then.

[farside22]

Sorry day 2 I claimed but you get what I mean.

[farside22]

I'm really confused now.

##unvote

I thought charter was saying he was a tracker. Not RC was a tracker.

[farside22]

Zorg: Who do you believe is scum at this point? You asked me yesterday of my views but I dont' recall you stating your scum suspects.

[farside22]

I saw the DGB from yesterday and thought it was OMGUS. I see people pointing to DGB as scum and I'm more not sure on that.
Also why is pops scum? He reacted pretty town to the fake shot unless you think scum planned that together?
Thanks for the feed back. It gets me to think more and gives me a place to analysis some people.

[farside22]

@imagine: Are you thinking of the game that we were in and I claimed a cop role with another cop in the game and was scum?
Just wondering if that entered your head when you see the claims going on.
I have a part of me trying not to WIFOM this game to death.

[farside22]

Chrono: I'm a Universal backup, and except for rolename/Motive flavor most things went exactly as Charter described them. And last Night I targeted Shotty and got a result of 'Other'.

I think chron is commenting on the fact that he is very much alive and you gain his ability seems a bit strange since he's alive an all.
Also I would think with 2 universal back up's one would get Param's motive cop while the other waits till another PR dies. 2 motive cops seem a bit one sided for town.
Question: Is there a town, other, and mafia result you will get when investigating a player? (this is to all motive cop people who claimed)

[farside22]

farside, do you have any limitations to your tracking?

No.

Not sorry to see those people shot or dead truthfully. It was the most confusing thing in this game for me.

[farside22]

I'm going to do this till I really get my barings in this game.

##vote: Pops

[farside22]

Okay so I just realized something while looking at those that claimed. Before I bring out my someone is scum between DGB and RC comment I need to know if DDD claimed his full role

*checks*
Yup he claimed vanilla townie.
Okay so here is the issue. The person who targetted RC (fishy) stated he never RB'ed RC. Now whether that is true or not is up for debate but DGB is claiming that she has been RB for 2 nights in a row but no one is claiming to be a RB.
So this means one scum has a roleblocking ability and is lying, but if this true why was RC blocked and DGB blocked both N1 and no one is claiming to do either block? Blocking RC N1 would not have looked scummy either.
So is RC lying or is DGB lying? Or do we think there is 2 anti-town RB's?
Again RC was under some pressure and some found not town so why wouldn't someone claim to have RB'ed him?

Thoughts on this view would be appriecated.

[farside22]

Ummm the flaw with what your saying is that zorblag only shots a certain type where as UK is a normal vig from what I'm reading. Also although there is no "night" when I track someone it's not for an action that they take during the day it's what they do during that twilight period.

[farside22]

mod: V/LA from May 29th - May 30th. Will be back June 1st

[farside22]

##unvote
##vote: DGB

[farside22]

If you don't mind I would like to ask a question from SC first.
StrangeCoug is there any reason you didn't target anyone yesterday if you are a neighborizer?

[farside22]

Also UK are you the one that does the 999 damage? If so who did you target last night?

[farside22]

with a neighborize if you target scum does anything happen?
I know a masonize if they target scum you fail at gaining a mason. But that was a one shot ability I saw in a game.

[farside22]

Because I have a strong scum read on SC. Him not using is ability is odd to me.

[farside22]

May I please ask what reason you have for not believe the government?

Rather, in this game? Considering I can think of tons of reasons not to believe the real government.

Mostly it's the non hostile otherness and the fact that three different factions confirmed each other's data that causes me to believe that Chronopie is the same alignment as DGB.

I do hope SC has a good explanation though. I do agree that I don't understand why you tracked him when I could easily have told you if someone was neighborized, and had them confirm it.

I didn't feel like I trusted you either, but frankly it was just more gut driving me to track SC then anything. I was going back and forth and sent 3 PM's to the mod changing my mind on who to track. From tracking you to tracking charter to tracking SC.
Besides there was no garentee you were going to be alive today in my view.

[farside22]

UK: I have a list of people I would like to follow and keep to myself.
Someone is obviously lying about their role and is a RB.
As long as people have that WIFOM about the claims I suspect neither myself or RC will be killed and will continue to have people thinking one is scum and the other is town.
Frankly I don't blame them as I have the same thought in my head as well.

[farside22]

Listen UK unless we find the scum RB. You or me or whoever else is town will be blocked.
I believe RC is not a blocker. Is he scum?? I'm still on the fence but two town trackers is hard to believe.
I got a town vibe from charter day 1 and despite things that make you look at him twice he didn't have a reason to claim unless he was concerned RC tracked him again.
Waiting for RC on this.

[farside22]

And, apparently I was roleblocked.

How disturbing.

anyway, obv

##Vote: Chronopie

given points bullshit, IIRC?

##Vote: UK

You are sooo not town biatch. get lynched.

Explain. I'm assuming results but give details at least.

[farside22]

Maybe UK but this is better then the WIFOM of dual roles. One claiming you scum and the other saying no you are scum.
I'm going to go this way because it reminds me too much of the DGB debate yesterday.

##Vote: Chronopie

[farside22]

Why did you investigate UK chron?

[farside22]

Hi this is farsides 2 cents

UK has informed the town of the kills she made and no one has counter claimed this kill. She states vig that talks a player to death (dear lord that's too funny for words) Anyways clearly DGB (flipped mafia goon) tried to get her lynched yesterday and failed do to bad evidence. So either UK is a SK type role (possible) but since the RB is most likely scum and no one has said hey I was RB I'm leaning kitty the person responisble for those kills. She knows after chrono flip that if chron flips town she is screwed tomorrow.
If there is another scum team I would expect DGB when flipped something more then mafia goon next to her name. So either UK is a SK at this point or town vig.
I would rather lynch chrono see what happens and if chron is telling the truth know that UK is SK that got blocked by the scum and by all means scum team do so again to help the town out

Sincerly
fars

[farside22]

No. Not just no but hell no.