Newbie 922: Day 3

[Cojin]

Pan1cea if you want to risk a power role lynch you will vote me but thats up to you.

But the fact laws vote hoped to me immediatly suggests that he is scum if im guessing right he thought he was hammering as much as i did. Imo a quickhammer like that is more then enough scummyness to warrent a lynch

Votecount
Cojin - 3 (RayFrost, havingfitz, Lawls)
Lawls - 2 (Cojin, Acosmist
Panacea - 1 (ElementaryFermion)
Nachomamma8 - 1 (BridgesAndBaloons)
BridgesAndBaloons - 1 (Nachomamma8)

Not Voting - 1 (Panacea)

With 9 alive, it's 5 to lynch

[Panacea]

Pan1cea if you want to risk a power role lynch you will vote me but thats up to you.

*blinks and glances around the table* Why are you only talking to me?

And if you're a PR why on earth did you just D-1 claim..? Unless I'm mistaken, you're at L-2, and I didn't say anything about voting you...

[Panacea]

Wow, Mod! That was up for what, three minutes before you clipped on the vote count? Nice!

[Nachomamma8]

Pan, stop sucking up to the mod >.>

Cojin, you're acting... weird. Freaking out and claiming PR when you're at L-2 and no one really wants to lynch you isn't TownCojin play...

I mean, I just read Newbie 908, where you pegged two scum in two days after a successful Doc protect; the only thing that messed up your game was vanilla fakeclaiming cop... The Cojin that's playing in this game definitely isn't the Cojin that's playing in that one...

Unvote, [L-1]Vote: Cojin

[Panacea]

Pan, stop sucking up to the mod >.>

... It was a really fast posting of a vote count. -.- Are you familiar with the art of the compliment?

Reading #908.

[Nachomamma8]

Pan, stop sucking up to the mod >.>

... It was a really fast posting of a vote count. -.- Are you familiar with the art of the compliment?

I was just messing with you, no seriousness intended

[Lawls]

Acosmist, it seems like you're quite gung-ho, not necessarily for a Lawls lynch, but for the diffusion of a Cojin one. All things aside, Lawls's "Oh, wait, never mind" return to the game strikes me as a

whole

helluva lot scummier than a cookie-cut request for replacement. I have to wonder if his intention might have been to buy some time all along?

Lawls, how do you feel about that?

Acosmist, what exactly makes you think, not necessarily that Lawls is scum, but that Cojin isn't? Is it primarily Havingfitz's responses, and if so shouldn't your vote then be on Havingfitz..?

I think its reasonable that you think I'm scum after what I have pulled out. I would be a bit suspicious of what that person was doing as well. But no I'm not scum I just took your post after the one I posted into consideration and decided to give this another shot.

Cojin, no I didn't try to get a quick hammer on you as I checked the last vote count that was given and updated it with any other votes given. You thinking that you got lynched was all just in your head.

[BridgesAndBaloons]

posting in all my games:
unexpected busyness.

[havingfitz]

In the interest of time and less pain for anyone (which unfortunately doesn’t apply to me) who is wading through this exchange…I’ll skip most of your wallpost 302 despite the fact I disagree with much of it. If there is anything I don’t address that you feel needs a reply…feel free to mention it. Deep breath….

How much of my walls addressed Lawls anyway? Very little, ….

Which is a surprise since he is

your

top suspect.

Yes, Google Fermat, as EF pointed out.

I’ve had enough of Fermat in my life…I’ll pass, no thank you.

Philosophers are, in a manner of speaking, in a certain rarefied sense of the term I am about to use, boring.

We agree!

Given that he corrected that grammar long before your post, you were not reading his posts carefully. You voted for Cojin because he wasn't paying attention enough to know his vote was already on Lawls. You are not paying attention enough to understand the person you're doing a post-by-post on. Should we vote you?

This dead horse is entirely your doing. You failed to read. Get over it.

Lot’s of exchange about my use of gibberish in my initial ISO on Cojin. I would like to point out that my ISO did not result in my voting Cojin and that the ISO lines where I accuse Cojin of throwing out gibberish do not factor in to my current decision to vote him. I realize what it is Cojin was intending to say. It does not factor into my thoughts towards Cojin. The fact he continues to respond to any of my questions does however.

A massive, massive warning sign? That sounds ominous.

Misrepresentation is a scum tell, or haven't you heard?

I have not misrepresented anything…unlike at least one blatant example by Cojin towards me…which you agree was inaccurate.

You felt the need to give Cojin a point for making a good comment.

I think that if someone makes a good point, it's a good point. Tautology detected! I hope you don't think that someone shouldn't get credit for making good points.

Are you speaking for me now as well as for Cojin? I never said people should not be given credit for making good points.

I pointed out in his next comment that he should have a point removed for making a bad comment. Totally unrelated to the good comment point you awarded. You gave him a point for good. I took a point away for bad.

And now Cojin has zero points! But, wait, he made a good point. Yet he has zero points as if he's Lawls, and hasn't said anything of substance? That can't be.

It can be. Mafia is an ongoing assessment of players. Opinions are subject to change throughout the game and can move anywhere, IMO, along the range of

[scum read <-> neutral read <-> town read].

If good points can move a player closer to a town read (i.e. to the right in my example)…then bad points, or misreps like Cojin did, should likewise move a player to the left towards a scum read…and if past neutral, essential on the negative side of the range.

How would you know? His first mention of lawls is in the post he votes for Lawls...in which he derives his suspicions from comments I made...which he quotes within that same post. So once again...how would you know Cojin had original thoughts on Lawls? Your comment would require “reading Cojin's mind.”

Because Cojin posts. Posts are in public, havingfitz! So I don't have to read Cojin's mind to see that he said something no one had said before.

That's how that works!

Reading fail on your part. One of the few reasons you have provided for your vote on Lawls is the accusation (right or wrong) that his thought were “the recycled, reworded, and logic-deprived thoughts of other players on those players.“ Then you praise Cojin for his dead on comments and his original thoughts on regarding Lawls…yet I was the first person to associate Lawls with lurking and call him out on his timezone excuse…which was then used by Cojin to vote Lawls for lurking. Essentially doing the same thing with my posts towards Lawls that you accuse Lawls of doing. And on that note…despite the fact Cojin quotes my posts towards Lawls…he continues to accuse me of not holding Lawls to the same standard I am holding him (Cojin) to.

It’s enough we have to wade through multiple screens worth of your long winded, bombastic posts without you adding a dash of smartass.

This from the guy posting the dead horse image repeatedly.

All I can say is: sorry, Internet Tough Guy, I won't stop posting game-relevant things.

Internet Tough Guy? Not sure where that is coming from. If pointing out the painfully obvious is Internet Tough Guy material, great.

My top two suspects remain Cojin and Lawls...though Lawls has dropped a bit down my list with his recent play. In fact..I would would group Lawls and Pan fairly close to each other a bit behind Cojin.

Town throwing in the towel is your second suspect?

Lawls has been my co-top suspect for most of the game…however his recent play has me rethinking my suspicions of him.

<shudder> Is Cojin really worth this much debate?

He's your

top suspect

. I...I figured you thought that meant he was worth the debate.

We aren’t debating the reasons I am voting him so this exchange is not worth it.

It would be nice to get Cojin posting, yep.

And yet you continue to fight for him.

Do you have an objective in this debate? To clear Cojin?

My objective is to shoot to pieces any trumped-up case against anyone. Your case on Cojin is based on misrepresentation, so I'm shooting it to pieces. That's...standard mafia strategy, to force the railroaders to get their railroading thoughts on paper.

You may want to review my reasons are for voting him…since you seem to be confused about them…and tell me what I am misrepresenting?

I can certainly drop this, but I'm surprised you want to. Your Cojin case is in tatters. You cool leaving your vote on him in those circumstances?

I disagree. And nothing Cojin has done since my ISO on him and my subsequent vote on him has done anything to change my mind.

….this is the most decidedly unenjoyable game of which I've ever taken part

I would have to agree. For me, dealing with pretentious, condescending prigs is very unenjoyable.

I don't know what to do about Lawls. This is the worst time he could possibly be replaced. I still think he's scum - top suspect.

Third choice, close to Nacho: havingfitz. His hard-on for Cojin is making less and less sense.

Not sure I would have gone for that choice of words but ok. My consistent suspicions towards Cojin are equally unwavering to your support/defense of him. He’s at L-1 and yet you continue to fight for people to not have their votes on him and defend his poor play…despite the fact you continue to call him out for what he is bringing to the game. Can you explain?

Cojin needs to post more. It's intolerable how little he's posted. He also needs to explain himself better. I said I wouldn't vote for him today, and I stand by that. When he does post, I usually find myself agreeing with it, and it's helpful stuff.

This comment does not seem to support you current stance on Cojin or my suspicions of him.

[havingfitz]

Having fits i seem to be so hardcore locked in your sights as def scum, what are you going to do when you find out im town? I mean even your FOS seems like a rage post to me. You attack me throughly for the exact same thing laws is doing yet Compleatly ignore him. you said so yourself "His wagon is bigger so he is prob less likely to be scum" Scince when is that a valid statment. If anything lawls is scum and you are his buddy.

META

I draw scum tunnels [/b] End meta

Fos Havingfitz

Why don't you try explaining what you meant to say again and not leave it up to others to make sense of it for you. If you are town I will look for scm from the group of players who are contributing vastly more thoughtful and frequent posts. You yourself have not exactly been the strongest proponent of your play...why should others be different? Since when is my interpretation of the way Lawls' wagon grew not a valid statement (aka consideration)?

What exactly are you trying to point out in your

Meta

attempt? And which FoS (of the two I have made) do you consider a "rage post?" I do not see rage in either of them (or any of my posts IMO).

???????

Acomist is right on what i was going with, Having fits is dead wrong.

Also Cojin...could you provide more detail on what it is I said that you are considering to be dead wrong? And while you are at it...could you answer the questions I had for you here?

???????

Cojin... for real..? What's all this business about meta..?

???????

oh hey im dead lawls is scum

More dead-on content.

if its not a rule now it should be, that after asking for a replacement, you should not be able to decide suddenly you dont want to.

Btw scum list lawls and having fits are obv

As you've explained in such great detail (not.).

[Cojin]

Ugg well im a Doc again and didnt want to claim it in the case i survived the night and scum tried to claim it , i would be able to cc it. but alas i can not, sorry about all the lack of content but posts longer then the the screen REALLY make me lose intrest fast, i here to play a game not read a book. Im going to answer havingscums questions right now.

[Cojin]

Cojin is about in the middle of the pack for me. I wouldn't lynch him. I'd be displeased to see him lynched. He hasn't posted much and it'd be nice if he took the hint to stop lurking, but, unlike Lawls, he posts dead-on content when he does post.

Dead on content? Huh?

Cojin ISO (questions to Cojin in bold):
ISO 0 - Unvotes, gives IC credentials, asks Panacea a good question about her freaking out over the early L-3 votes.
ISO 1 - Freaks out himself over Pan being put at L-3

<--so why was it enough of an issue to question Pan about it?

ISO 2 - Admits to being bad IC, urges discussion, tells others (sans Pan) to flop to a different L-3 and asks why Pan should go.
ISO 3 - Apologizes for grammer fail. Tries to explain his ISO 2 post and makes these two [sarcasm]excellent comments:[/sarcasm]

• "overall its quite a good thing to have her at l-2 at this stage"
  <---If L-3 is so bad....why are you a proponent of an early L-2?
  
  
  
  "her lack of panic makes me feel she is comfortable that she wont be quicklynched (as she may be scum and thus a quicklynch at l-2 impossible)"
  <--so are you saying you think Pan is scum? BTW...your vote is on your fellow lurker.

ISO 4 - Explains ISO 3 post and says he is going to go get an avatar.
ISO 5 - Answers question (says he prefers being town) and gives his interpretation of Lawls timezone excuse post...and then votes Lawls for active lurking.
ISO 6 - Makes this observation re: me,

"What i dont understand is how he blatently ignored how much lawls was lurking yet attacked him for less."

which I later show to be completely inaccurate.
ISO 7 - Answers question re: his opinion of Acosmist and Lawls.
ISO 8 - Asks something about his momma and makes a completely gibberish coment on metas.
ISO 9 - Apologizes for his play (I think), elaborates on his Lawls opinion (more gibberish) and asks RF why he (RF) think Cojin is scum (amongst an odd secretary/batman joke).

I think Lawls is scummier at the moment...but I really don't see anything redeeming about Cojin's game unless you consider his initial questions to Panacea enough to consider the reast of his posts dead-on.

Number 1 I made that comment because everyone was so easy to agree with me that the pan wagon started accelerating to fast to quickly on d1.

number 2 to me seems like the same question

number 3 Yes at the time i thought she was scum now im less inclined to belive this is true


I belive that is all.

[Acosmist]

Acosmist, it seems like you're quite gung-ho, not necessarily for a Lawls lynch, but for the diffusion of a Cojin one. All things aside, Lawls's "Oh, wait, never mind" return to the game strikes me as a

whole

helluva lot scummier than a cookie-cut request for replacement. I have to wonder if his intention might have been to buy some time all along?

Lawls, how do you feel about that?

Acosmist, what exactly makes you think, not necessarily that Lawls is scum, but that Cojin isn't? Is it primarily Havingfitz's responses, and if so shouldn't your vote then be on Havingfitz..?

Cojin said something about soft-claiming. I took that to mean (and it looks like Nacho did too, once upon a time) that he was claiming a power role. If he was doing that to draw out a town power role counterclaim, then I can see his still being the correct lynch, but in the absence of that, he's lying about his claim or telling the truth about his claim. If he's lying, he's locked into a certain lie and we'll have him eventually - the truth will out. If he's telling the truth, uh, obv I don't want to lynch him.

Thus, if his "soft claim" was some sort of scum gambit, it was going to go wrong anyway, so taking him out now is not vital. If he was town, then, yeah, don't lynch him. So I consider the risk of lynching him high (if he's town, that's a big loss), and the risk of not lynching him immediately low (he couldn't sustain the charade very long).

It's weird how Nacho immediately unvoted him, some time around the "soft claim" language, but then put his vote back on him?

I'll check on things more in a bit here.

I just want to clarify, I was never 100% sold on Cojin's towniness, but the "soft claim" thing locked him into a certain channel that would be impossible to maintain as scum. I was middle-of-the-pack on him before all this, now I think he's a horrible, horrible lynch. Like, I'm shocked there are votes on him.

[havingfitz]

Number 1 I made that comment because everyone was so easy to agree with me that the pan wagon started accelerating to fast to quickly on d1.

WTF? In your ISO 1 you were the first person to comment on her being at at L-3 (actually L-2). Your explanation has zero merit.

number 2 to me seems like the same question

To the one you answered above which was based on invalid information? No. It's not the same.

number 3 Yes at the time i thought she was scum now im less inclined to belive this is true

Can't argue with this.

I belive that is all.

Not quite...see below....

Having fits i seem to be so hardcore locked in your sights as def scum, what are you going to do when you find out im town? I mean even your FOS seems like a rage post to me. You attack me throughly for the exact same thing laws is doing yet Compleatly ignore him. you said so yourself "His wagon is bigger so he is prob less likely to be scum" Scince when is that a valid statment. If anything lawls is scum and you are his buddy.

META

I draw scum tunnels [/b] End meta

Fos Havingfitz

Why don't you try explaining what you meant to say again and not leave it up to others to make sense of it for you. If you are town I will look for scm from the group of players who are contributing vastly more thoughtful and frequent posts. You yourself have not exactly been the strongest proponent of your play...why should others be different? Since when is my interpretation of the way Lawls' wagon grew not a valid statement (aka consideration)?

What exactly are you trying to point out in your

Meta

attempt? And which FoS (of the two I have made) do you consider a "rage post?" I do not see rage in either of them (or any of my posts IMO).

???????

Cojin... for real..? What's all this business about meta..?

???????

[havingfitz]

For those who want to use wrong votecounts as an excuse for hammering....

Cojin is currently at L-1

. I'm keeping my vote on him because his game is rubbish. He has lurked, provide cr@p responses to question when he's bothered to answer them, and sought approval for his actions from the rest of the players. Could he be town? Sure. But if he is a doc as he claims to be.....I'm not even sure scum would bother killing him at night since surviving would make his claim even more doubtful. His play just warrants a lynch. Then maybe scum would have mercy and NK one of the town wallposters.

BTW...Ray and Bridges are doing a great job of making Cojin and Lawls look like active participants.

[Acosmist]

That will tend to make tomorrow's lynch easier, thank you for your thoughtful action.

[Elementary Fermion]

Then maybe scum would have mercy and NK one of the town wallposters.

You included? Would that help your win condition? Acosmist is going out of his way--obviously spending many hours per day on this game (whether that is actually healthy or not is a question for another day!)--in order to analyze every single thing that is said by everyone; would it help your win condition for him and his energetic contributions to be silenced?

I personally believe my win condition would be strengthened by non-contributing townies' being night killed. (Unless, of course, scum are stupid enough to off one of their own!)

[Cojin]

The meta is the fact i tend to be a D-1 lynch and its not uncommen that scum is the main tunneler on this wagon

man you are still on me after i claim doc, wow you are terribad scum, its gonna suck if scum hammers and i flip town, but scince both lawls AND havingfitz are voting me im not to much worried about being hammerd atm

Laws today havingfitz tommorow

[havingfitz]

Then maybe scum would have mercy and NK one of the town wallposters.

You included? Would that help your win condition? Acosmist is going out of his way--obviously spending many hours per day on this game (whether that is actually healthy or not is a question for another day!)--in order to analyze every single thing that is said by everyone; would it help your win condition for him and his energetic contributions to be silenced?

I personally believe my win condition would be strengthened by non-contributing townies' being night killed. (Unless, of course, scum are stupid enough to off one of their own!)

I like to think of myself as a collateral wallposter. Sure...me included. A townie is going to get NK'd no matter what. In my experience, scum do not tend to eliminate people considered scummy so while getting rid of non-contributing townies would be nice, how does that help scum? I don't need to make it to the end of the game to satisfy my win condition and I wasn't necessarily advocating anyone in particular to be the NK.

@Cojin...thank you for the meta explanation. Why do you think you tend to be a D1 lynch? Do you have other examples from games where you have been tunnelled by scum? And if those tend to be on D1...does that mean you are tunnelled more often by other town than by scum?

As for your doc claim...why should anyone believe you? There's no gaurantee there is even a doc in this game. And with the way you have played..there is no gaurantee you would be the N1 NK. If you are scum....why not claim doc? You have a 50% chance of not getting counterclaimed and your odds of getting lynched look/ed to be a lot higher than 50%.

[havingfitz]

posting in all my games:
unexpected busyness.

Four posts in the last 7+ days. Are you lurking intentionally or just blowing off this game?

@Ray....Are you unable to be of use due to too many other game commitments or, same question I posed to BaB (though you have posted once or twice more in the last week).

[havingfitz]

That will tend to make tomorrow's lynch easier, thank you for your thoughtful action.

Please elaborate on which 'that' you are referring to.

[Panacea]

I was just messing with you, no seriousness intended.

Oh, I'm sorry, Nacho!

First off... Eek... The Cojin business has me nervous as hell. We're either one vote away from lynching scum, or from lynching doc... No one has counterclaimed his doc claim. The only way for a scum-Cojin and his partner to know that there's a Doc in-game would be to know 1) if there's a Roleblocker or not (which they do), and 2) if there is a Cop or not (which, through my reread, I cannot see how they could yet). With that in mind, a false Cojin-doc claim is exponentially ballsy. I just don't see it from scum.

Also, my gut tells me this isn't a VT claim, either. No breadcrumbs (that I can see) this far into the game in which he could have invested.

I'd prefer we not lynch him today; if there isn't a Roleblocker in-game, I want Cojin's protect before they NK him Tonight. (Sorry, Cojin! If we don't lynch you and you really are doc, chances are good you'll be taking one for the team Tonight. )

:arrow: But! There is the business about no counterclaim. We do have players away from the table. I suggest that we do not hammer him until we've heard what they have to say (provided they come back before deadline). Also, is there a chance that, because Cojin is so close to the noose anyway, that the real doc might just be banking on us lynching him so he can stay hidden into the game? After all, the counterclaim serves as an outlet with which to lynch the liar while outing the real PR... If they think he's going to die anyway, why out themselves?

Oh, WIFOM...

[havingfitz]

First off... Eek... The Cojin business has me nervous as hell. We're either one vote away from lynching scum, or from lynching doc... No one has counterclaimed his doc claim. The only way for a scum-Cojin and his partner to know that there's a Doc in-game would be to know 1) if there's a Roleblocker or not (which they do), and 2) if there is a Cop or not (which, through my reread, I cannot see how they could yet). With that in mind, a false Cojin-doc claim is exponentially ballsy. I just don't see it from scum.

There are scenarios where there can be RBers without a Doc and Doc's without a RB. If Cojin is scum...whether there is a RB or not...there would be no way of knowing for sure if there is a Doc. Either way...there's a 50% chance for scum to claim Doc and not get counterclaimed. Cojin is a L-1 now, and iirc was at L-2 when he claimed, so there is nothing to lose for scum to claim Doc. They either get lucky and not get countered because there is no Doc...or they get countered...get lynched like the scum the predominance of town thought they were...and scum gets to then get rid of the town PR that countered the Doc fakeclaim.

Also, my gut tells me this isn't a VT claim, either. No breadcrumbs (that I can see) this far into the game in which he could have invested.

Well...why would it be a VT claim if it's a Doc claim? What do you mean it's not a VT claim? Do you mean it's not a VT claiming Doc?

I'd prefer we not lynch him today; if there isn't a Roleblocker in-game, I want Cojin's protect before they NK him Tonight.

What do you mean you want Cojin's protect before they NK him?

:arrow: But! There is the business about no counterclaim. We do have players away from the table. I suggest that we do not hammer him until we've heard what they have to say (provided they come back before deadline). Also, is there a chance that, because Cojin is so close to the noose anyway, that the real doc might just be banking on us lynching him so he can stay hidden into the game? After all, the counterclaim serves as an outlet with which to lynch the liar while outing the real PR... If they think he's going to die anyway, why out themselves?

Like I said...there is only a 50% chance that we even have a Doc...and you bring up a good point. Why counter if it looks like the person who is potentially fakeclaiming is going to get lynched anyway?

@Pan...you haven't had a vote out since your 2nd inadvertent L-3 vote very early in the game. Who are your top suspects again and do you envision placing a vote today? Or are you trying to stay off bandwagons during D1?

[Panacea]

First off... Eek... The Cojin business has me nervous as hell. We're either one vote away from lynching scum, or from lynching doc... No one has counterclaimed his doc claim. The only way for a scum-Cojin and his partner to know that there's a Doc in-game would be to know 1) if there's a Roleblocker or not (which they do), and 2) if there is a Cop or not (which, through my reread, I cannot see how they could yet). With that in mind, a false Cojin-doc claim is exponentially ballsy. I just don't see it from scum.

There are scenarios where there can be RBers without a Doc and Doc's without a RB. If Cojin is scum...whether there is a RB or not...there would be no way of knowing for sure if there is a Doc. Either way...there's a 50% chance for scum to claim Doc and not get counterclaimed. Cojin is a L-1 now, and iirc was at L-2 when he claimed, so there is nothing to lose for scum to claim Doc. They either get lucky and not get countered because there is no Doc...or they get countered...get lynched like the scum the predominance of town thought they were...and scum gets to then get rid of the town PR that countered the Doc fakeclaim.

Right, sorry; the 50% chance of doc-certainty is what I was starting to drive at.

Also, my gut tells me this isn't a VT claim, either. No breadcrumbs (that I can see) this far into the game in which he could have invested.

Well...why would it be a VT claim if it's a Doc claim? What do you mean it's not a VT claim? Do you mean it's not a VT claiming Doc?

Yes, I do. I don't think Cojin is a VT claiming Doc.

I'd prefer we not lynch him today; if there isn't a Roleblocker in-game, I want Cojin's protect before they NK him Tonight.

What do you mean you want Cojin's protect before they NK him?

Well, that depends on the NK process, I suppose. If the Doc protects a player in the same Night phase scum kills them, does the protect still hold?

:arrow: But! There is the business about no counterclaim. We do have players away from the table. I suggest that we do not hammer him until we've heard what they have to say (provided they come back before deadline). Also, is there a chance that, because Cojin is so close to the noose anyway, that the real doc might just be banking on us lynching him so he can stay hidden into the game? After all, the counterclaim serves as an outlet with which to lynch the liar while outing the real PR... If they think he's going to die anyway, why out themselves?

Like I said...there is only a 50% chance that we even have a Doc...and you bring up a good point. Why counter if it looks like the person who is potentially fakeclaiming is going to get lynched anyway?

@Pan...you haven't had a vote out since your 2nd inadvertent L-3 vote very early in the game. Who are your top suspects again and do you envision placing a vote today? Or are you trying to stay off bandwagons during D1?

I'm having a particularly difficult time narrowing down my suspect pool in this game; I've never seen so many veritable wagons in one Day. It seems like every time we have a legitimate case against a player, another player does something infinitely scummier. I can tell you this:

I only see myself voting today if I feel with relative confidence that I'm hanging scum. So far, everyone's pretty much at equal scumminess, and that muddles things.

Lawls and Cojin are still dead-even potential lynchees for me Today. Lawls's request for replacement, while townish at the time, lost it's townie-vibe when he

stayed

at the table, and

then

requested to remain, in that order.

Cojin I'm tiptoeing around for just a few hours longer. I'd like to hear what everyone (including Cojin) has to say about the possibility of the real Doc laying low?

Also... Acosmist. I don't have a case at all (which, in and of itself is disturbing) to support this, but the fact that he's really received little to no suspicion Today doesn't bode well. He's one hell of a good player, to the point that he commands instant respect. People disagree with him for posts and posts, and yet no one calls him scummy. Also, sometimes it seems like random things get injected into his textwalls. If Acosmist is scum, he's in a position to give us one mighty runaround. Hmm. "Curiouser and curiouser." I just definitely don't feel we should be clearing him via groupthink as we seem to have been thus far.

[Cojin]

IMO it would be to risky for scum to make a power role claim this early in the game but as a result of me being the scummiest atm (i acttualy dont belive this due to my beleaf there is 2 town and 2 scum on my wagon meaning only 2 of the town belive i am scum) the scum being Havingfits and laws of course im not really afraid of someone ccing me because it would confirm after my lynch at least 1 scum (aka the guy who claimed doc) when i flip doc it would be too obv who is scum.

Yes my protect will go through i have had who i was going to prot in my head for quite a while now.