Newbie 848 - The Bunny Mafia Family - over finally!

[Haylen]

cough you are no longer modding newbie 848, Incog cough

[Netopalis]

Haylen: Honestly, I have two things that I would recommend that you look into.

1) Familiarize yourself better with numbers strategy and tactical play. Jeep had some good articles on these in the Wiki. You might want to try constructing "What-if" scenarios for each round, either as scum or as town, to identify the number of incorrect lynches are still remaining and whether or not a no-lynch is preferable. For example, given a game with 9 players and 1 kill per night, the basic worst-case-scenario numbers look like this:

Day Town Scum
1 7 2
2 5 2
3 3 2 - LYLO


However, if it's no-lynch, it looks something like this:

Day Town Scum
1 7 2
2 6 2
3 4 2 - MYLO

While the no-lynch plan may look better at first glance, the problem is that you need to incorporate the number of flips. In the lynching scenario, the town gets 1 additional flip, which provides crucial information for learning more about the alignment of each player. In my opinion, the more flips the better, so long as those flips are on players that are either reasonably scummy or are such a hindrance to the town that their continued existence alone hurts the game. The same can be done with scum kills as well - there are certain situations in which scum find it best to no-kill.


2) Work on your emotions. I very nearly pushed for your lynch on policy reasons alone on the second day after I replaced. You broke down and became extremely emotional. That has no place in mafia. Yes, you will get attacked. Yes, it will feel uncomfortable - probably even painful. Still, the mark of a mature mafia player is that they can keep their head about them while this is happening - if you can remain calm and cool under pressure, it will make you seem

less

scummy to others, regardless of your alignment and will also help the town's chances of lynching correctly (or incorrectly, if you're playing as scum). If you find yourself getting really worked up and you want to just sit down and hammer out a scathing reply, give it a few minutes. Get a cup of tea. Reread the last few pages. Take a deep breath, and then write a measured and thoughtful reply that attempts to

respond to the criticisms of your opponent and allay their fears

.



Anything else that I would write is mainly a difference of playstyle. I tend to fall much more in the logic camp, while you tend to fall much more in the guts camp. That's alright. Over the last few weeks, I've began to realize that both are legitimate ways of playing (Although I'll still be begging people to justify their votes).

[Incognito]

Oh, right, my sig. This game's eternal lol.

[Haylen]

1) Familiarize yourself better with numbers strategy and tactical play.

The numbers will never ever happen.

[Vel-Rahn Koon]

Why did you guys no kill so much? You would have won a lot sooner if you had NKed.

In hindsight I partially agree with you charter, but at the time I thought keeping the status quo was our best bet. We should have NK'd on Night 4 and gone to a true LyLo. I think I was afraid that I was getting into hot water and that I needed as many suspicious looking people around me as possible (after people started looking at Jase/bronco).

[Netopalis]

1) Familiarize yourself better with numbers strategy and tactical play.

The numbers will never ever happen.

*shrugs* You asked. I think it's the best way you can improve your play.

[Haylen]

Well see if my intensive basic maths lessons help. ^.^

[Haylen]

I've had this really weird theory. You know how being emotional seems to make my play bad? Well the only reason i get emotionally involved in my town games is because I'm trying so hard to improve and then get frustrated when I'm told im bad or my logics swept aside.

Solution: Stop trying! No trying to improve = no emotional involvement = big town improvement.

[Netopalis]

Not exactly...You should try to improve, but a part of improving is checking yourself when you get frustrated. You need to learn to detach yourself from your arguments and your role - people aren't attacking

you

, they are attacking

your position and arguments

.

[Nachomamma8]

I thought that charter was town in the beginning of Day 1. As scum, I would never make my first post of the day as "I'm sorry" when I'm in hot water; I was expecting charter to continue his attack on Haylen...

On another note, why did you kill me, VRK?

[Haylen]

Anyone have any problems with my modding this time? I think the only mistakes i made was with vote counts...

[Haylen]

uhh...wrong game...maybe i should sleep...

[Nachomamma8]

Maybe, eh?

[Vel-Rahn Koon]

Not exactly...You should try to improve, but a part of improving is checking yourself when you get frustrated. You need to learn to detach yourself from your arguments and your role - people aren't attacking

you

, they are attacking

your position and arguments

.

Perfect assessment. The attacks are not personal, they are role based. If they become personal, the Mod steps in and drops the "You F#*ked Up" Hamma!!!

I thought that charter was town in the beginning of Day 1. As scum, I would never make my first post of the day as "I'm sorry" when I'm in hot water; I was expecting charter to continue his attack on Haylen...

On another note, why did you kill me, VRK?

I read bwian as noob Town all the way through my pre-game read. I did not expect Neto and Haylen to go after charter like they did. It seemed too easy. I reread the thread 3 times to make sure I wasn't missing an unvote. I think the length of the game and the constant no lynch/no kill just wore everyone out. I also think that the "3 and it's a tie" rule is good. It keeps the game's spirit intact.

Nacho, I have no idea why I killed you. It was you or Neto. I know I had a reason (or I thought I did), but honestly by the time Night 5 rolled around there were so many different directions the game had gone and was going that I was a bit flabbergasted. I think the main line of thought was to use your death to clear Haylen in a WIFOM-y way. I was thinking that if I could find some way to back off from Haylen she might go after someone else because she was already leaning towards others anyway.

Neto, what was your line of thought that led you to clear me? I'm not sure I see it.

Haylen: I hope you're asleep by now

[Netopalis]

Well, basically, I felt that, given the way that SK was replacing in, I doubted that he would actively try to bus his partner so hard coming out of the gate unless his partner was already under suspicion. You weren't under heavy suspicion at the time, and he really was trying to defend Haylen somewhat. It just seemed like an incredibly unlikely play to me...If you two had gotten a night to chat, my line of thinking would have been different, but since you didn't, I figured he'd probably take a more cautious approach.

[Vel-Rahn Koon]

Ah kk. That makes sense.

[Netopalis]

Yeah, except for the little problem that it

didn't

.

[Haylen]

Haylen: I hope you're asleep by now Smile

Nah, needed to see if any of my newbies need help after their first game, make sure they're ok.

[Incognito]

Yeah, except for the little problem that it

didn't

.

Well, I don't know if confirmation bias got the best of me, but I was pretty surprised that your analysis didn't include focusing on

Jase's

interactions with VRK/bronco. If you look at what was happening around the time Jase got replaced, it makes a lot of sense for a SaintKerrigan-scum to try and distance himself from VRK at his point of entrance since a lot of people were saying they had to be buddies with one another since they hadn't talked much about each other.

[Netopalis]

Fair enough, I suppose. Admittedly, I didn't give Jase enough analysis in this game.

[Jase]

Hey everyone. Sorry I flaked...I totally didn't mean to do that. On the other hand if I hadn't been replaced things probably wouldn't have gone so well. I got waaaay to committed to trying to get that haylen lynch.

[Netopalis]

Well, it wouldn't have been a hard sale. I would have went for it.

[MichelSableheart]

Phew, that was a long read.

I haven't got much to comment on, actually. I kept reading, but stopped analysing, after I was killed.

Personally, I think that the decission of town to actually start lynching after the series of no lynch/no kill, was incorrect. With the way the game had gone to that point, scum simply couldn't have been happy to see a draw. They would ultimately be forced to kill.

On the other hand, this game has really removed my confidence in the "no lynch to get the scum to kill" strategy. By no killing, the scum can completely stop the game in its tracks, removing the will of the town to play.

[Netopalis]

Michel: That would have been my plan, but *somebody* said that a draw was a loss for her, so we didn't.

[Haylen]

Heh. You listened to me when you thought I was scum?

With regards to the late unvote on Day One, every so often I get sick of being told I have to conform to the sites norms, like everythings scummy for the same person ect. That was what happened then, I decided to do what I felt was best (thinking for myself and all that) so I unvoted the person I believed to be a townie. I did what I thought was best for the town at the time. I don't think about future days, I take it as it comes.

Probably a bit farfetched, but I hope you get what Im trying to say.