Mini 896 - Jekyll Mafia - Game Over

[wolframnhart]

Yeah, this isn't very hard. Raider claims vig and claims the only kill from the previous night. That kill was of HH, a guy who seemed pretty townie on my intro read, and raider never once mentioned suspicion of him. Looks like a scum nightkill to me.

Unvote. Vote: raider

lol, that would be the worse scum claim ever. I should try that sometime and see what happens.

WIFOM

Any response to my post raider?

[Gerhard Krause]

MrSuave - You are not trying. You haven't done shit since I voted you. At this point it would be more beneficial to the town to mislynch you rather than a scummy, cuz they will keep you around till lylo, and you will make us lose.

Prove me wrong.

Yes, obviously this post makes the assumption he is town. I was speaking to him, and it is not useful to do so as if he were scum, since he will argue from the standpoint that he is town. That is a far cry from me believing him to be town. This is how you argue with people.

I do not have a case on xvart, nor do I wish to make one. If one arose however, I would have something to add to it.

[raider8169]

Ok this makes no sense to me.

You claim night vig, so you played the way you did to draw scum to you? What good doe that do? You can't kill them unless it is night so you say yet I think you are saying you draw votes to you to pick out the scum, but HH never even voted you!

And one other time before the last quote where he asked why you, kiku, and Phantom were not voting anyone. So instead of vigging someone who voted for you yesterday (Ectomancer, xvart, Nachomamma8, Kiku, and Peanutman) you killed someone who was asking if there was a better case against you and never voted for you?

Sorry, site was messing up. Post must not have gone through or something.

I wanted to see how people would react to how I played. I figured it would have more of an effect after day 2. Still has a chance so I will see assuming I am not today's lynch. If I am then town is going to be in a bad position come tomorrow. I never said they needed to vote me to draw scum to me. Town will vote me all the same. Its just me trying to figure out who is what. I was wrong with HH, I admite that. Isnt the first, wont be the last.

Just because someone voted for me doesnt make them instant scum. If I am today's lynch there is going to be town votes on top of the scum votes.

[peanutman]

Raider, I am still trying to make sense of you picking HH as vig. I assume that as a night-vigilante, you would try to NK the person you find scummiest. If this is correct, in what way did you find Hacker scummier than everyone else. If it's not, why wouldn't you NK the scummiest person around? That choice really doesn't make much sense IMO.

[kikuchiyo]

GK: Please don't get your panties in a bunch over a typo. You missed 396. I think its a pertinent question.

Raider: If you are left alive would you consider letting town direct your kill? Would you consider self vigging? If you are town, then lynching you is a mislynch. Both of these options would offer more use of your role. Would you consider them? Why or why not?

Macavity: You seem sure he is scum, do you think this set-up and theme carries the likelihood of a serial killer? In other words, if he doesn't flip scum, we are left with no connections. Do you think it is wise to remove a third party, or bargain as in my questions above? I'd rather not get into a long theory debate, but I would like some opinions on this before we just lynch him.

[MacavityLock]

It's the unnecessarily early power role claim and the fact that he killed HH (who raider

never

suggested was scummy) that clinch it for me. I am of course not certain of anything, but it's an Occam's Razor situation.

Directed kill I'm not so much a fan of, as he can choose to go off the reservation only when it's opportune for him to do so, and if we keep directing him to townies, he could survive to LYLO. I'm fine with self-vig, as long as we get people to agree beforehand that he's the lynch the following day if he doesn't self-vig.

I generally use the term "scum" to indicate all non-townie parties. I don't think the presence of an SK in the game matters one way or the other to my thinking. Why do you think there might be a SK in the game? Why does it make more sense for him to be SK over maf? And even if he is SK, while his flip would provide no connections, it would completely eliminate one night kill. I'd say it's

more

beneficial to take out the SK over the maf. But we have no proof that an SK even exists in the game. I just think it's likely that raider is scum, some type of.

----

Gerhard's answers don't satisfy me at all. If we decide to have raider self-vig, I will likely be moving my vote back to him.

[wolframnhart]

I will save people time and effort and claim now. I am Col Hart and a vig. I am responsible for HH's death.

Ya know looking at this, he never says he is town.

Now unless there is no such thing as a mafia vig, then I would guess he is really more of an SK, in which case it wouldn't be a mislynch at all, but a third party memeber being killed.

Also out of the 11 remaining players at night alive, then chances of Raider and scum picking the same player to kill is like a doctor picking the right person to protect ont he first night, very little chance of that happening. Even IF mafia didn't submit a kill why would they do that on night 1 with no idea if there was a vig/sk whatever or not?

Something just doesn't add up here.

vote raider

[Slaxx]

Raider, I am still trying to make sense of you picking HH as vig. I assume that as a night-vigilante, you would try to NK the person you find scummiest. If this is correct, in what way did you find Hacker scummier than everyone else. If it's not, why wouldn't you NK the scummiest person around? That choice really doesn't make much sense IMO.

If you look at his previous post, it was 'on a hunch'. The chance of killing the same person mafia did is 1 in 10. (12 to start-suave, and not including himself). In essence, the chances are slim. And out of all people HH doesn't seem right, as many others have said.

[raider8169]

I will save people time and effort and claim now. I am Col Hart and a vig. I am responsible for HH's death.

Ya know looking at this, he never says he is town.

Now unless there is no such thing as a mafia vig, then I would guess he is really more of an SK, in which case it wouldn't be a mislynch at all, but a third party memeber being killed.

Also out of the 11 remaining players at night alive, then chances of Raider and scum picking the same player to kill is like a doctor picking the right person to protect ont he first night, very little chance of that happening. Even IF mafia didn't submit a kill why would they do that on night 1 with no idea if there was a vig/sk whatever or not?

Something just doesn't add up here.

vote raider

I knew I was dead shortly after the day started. Saying I am town is obvious as anyone scum or town would say it. If I survived I think I would have killed you next. So I am thinking wolf and kik are scum.

[raider8169]

Raider: If you are left alive would you consider letting town direct your kill? Would you consider self vigging? If you are town, then lynching you is a mislynch. Both of these options would offer more use of your role. Would you consider them? Why or why not?

I would have no problem with this. Self vigging would go against my win condition so I would have a problem with that.

[wolframnhart]

Raider: If you are left alive would you consider letting town direct your kill? Would you consider self vigging? If you are town, then lynching you is a mislynch. Both of these options would offer more use of your role. Would you consider them? Why or why not?

I would have no problem with this. Self vigging would go against my win condition so I would have a problem with that.

So you would have no problem doing something a person that you think is scum suggests, and you have some sort of special win condition?

Seriously folks third party member here if he isn't lying mafia, this is in no way a mislynch.

[raider8169]

Raider: If you are left alive would you consider letting town direct your kill? Would you consider self vigging? If you are town, then lynching you is a mislynch. Both of these options would offer more use of your role. Would you consider them? Why or why not?

I would have no problem with this. Self vigging would go against my win condition so I would have a problem with that.

So you would have no problem doing something a person that you think is scum suggests, and you have some sort of special win condition?

Seriously folks third party member here if he isn't lying mafia, this is in no way a mislynch.

Did you bother to read what she wrote. Oh noes I have no problem using my vig towards someone who the majority wants me to use it against. Seriously when I flip town, kill him. Or yell let me live and I will do it myself.

Vote Wolf

May be a moot vote but at least its there.

[wolframnhart]

Did you bother to read what I wrote?

You just said you have no problem with a suggestion that someone you think is scum brings up. Even if the town agrees on it there is no guarantee that you will even kill the person the town tell you to. Or let's say you do, for a day, maybe two days, building credibility, then when it looks like everything is all good, BAM, you kill off the remaining town because of your "win conidtion" which I more and more believe your role is some kind of vig survivor or SK role, since apparently vigging yourself is agaisnt your win condition.

So what kind of win condition is given to a person whose role is "town" that would make him loose if he vigged himself? Not town, because if it was all town would have to do is win and he would win, even if he was dead. So that leaves survivor or SK, roles that let him win as long as he is alive and all remaining town and mafia roles are eliminated.

This is a no brainer.

[raider8169]

Did you bother to read what I wrote?

You just said you have no problem with a suggestion that someone you think is scum brings up. Even if the town agrees on it there is no guarantee that you will even kill the person the town tell you to. Or let's say you do, for a day, maybe two days, building credibility, then when it looks like everything is all good, BAM, you kill off the remaining town because of your "win conidtion" which I more and more believe your role is some kind of vig survivor or SK role, since apparently vigging yourself is agaisnt your win condition.

So what kind of win condition is given to a person whose role is "town" that would make him loose if he vigged himself? Not town, because if it was all town would have to do is win and he would win, even if he was dead. So that leaves survivor or SK, roles that let him win as long as he is alive and all remaining town and mafia roles are eliminated.

This is a no brainer.

The reason I am a town aligned vig is due to the flavor of my char on the show. I wouldnt lose if I vigged myself but I would not see that as helping out the town in the long run. It would just be an idea that scum would use to kill off another townie.

When I flip town killing you should be a no brainer.

[wolframnhart]

Self vigging would go against my win condition so I would have a problem with that.

If self vigging would make you not loose why did you say that? That doesn't mean anything along the line of not helping out the town in the long run, that sounds more like it wouldn't help YOU in the long run.

also mod i think xvart and nacho need to be prodded/replaced?

[Nachomamma8]

Vote: Raider

I believed his vig claim pretty much completely at first. That is, until I saw post 424. And 427. And 433...

[wolframnhart]

Welcome to the conversation nacho, i believe you were the hammer in case you didn't realize.

Last vote count:

3 - raider8169: (Green Crayons, peanutman, Slaxx )
1 - Gerhard Krause: (MacavityLock)
1 - kikuchiyo: (Gerhard Krause)
Not Voting: xvart, Nachomamma8, kikuchiyo, raider8169, wolframnhart

With 10 alive it will take 6 to lynch.

Deadline: 8th February 10pm AEST.

Then Mack voted raider, I voted raider, and at l-1 nacho voted

[kikuchiyo]

Oh well. There was something not right about that claim anyway.

Mac: In general, I think vig is a better fakeclaim for sk than it is for mafia. Whether or not there is one in this game is in the air, but flavor would certainly not exclude it, would it? Moot point now. 434 looks like a slip to me, though.

[peanutman]

Krazy! I'm not sure if you realized, Nacho, that you were the hammer vote, but that's not cool in my eyes. Last we heard from you, you said this :

I'm not sure about the Raider case, but I'm going to look over peanut's/GC's cases and ISO Raider, and come back with an actual opinion on this.

Let's fast forward three days, and you come back with this :

Vote: Raider

I believed his vig claim pretty much completely at first. That is, until I saw post 424. And 427. And 433...

All you posted is that you believed his claim (what? when did you say that? until his final posts, without justification. Lazy, first of all, because you hammer with very little supporting arguments (rather vague ones), which could provide you with leeway to change your reasoning later on if necessary. Likely to also play the "I didn't realize it was the hammer" card.

I know this is based on Raider being town, because, let's be honest, odds are, early on, that the town mislynches. But, in the event that Raider is scum, I still suspect you for dropping such an out-of-nowhere, non-chalant hammer, trying to earn "town points" without really contributing to the town.

HOS : Raider

[Budja]

Votecount

6 - raider8169: (Green Crayons, peanutman, Slaxx, MacavityLock, wolframnhart, Nachomamma8)
1 - kikuchiyo: (Gerhard Krause)
1 - wolframnhart: (raider8169)

Not Voting: xvart, kikuchiyo

With

10

alive it will take

6

to lynch.

Deadline:

8th February 10pm AEST.

xvart has not picked up his prod and will be replaced.

...and thats a lynch.

[Budja]

Surrounded by his co-workers, raider admitted he had attempted to kill HackerHuck. But, he cried out to them, He had the best of intentions. He was sure that HackerHuck was not one of them. The others looked at him skeptically, none of them believing a word. He didn't last long after that.

raider8169, Colonal Hart,

Vigilante

, lynched day 2.

---

Night will not end until a replacement has been found.

[Budja]

Pulindar replaces xvart.

Night ends 28th Jan 10pm (AEST)

[Budja]

Two bodies today. Good news and bad.

kikuchiyo, Christopher,

Jailkeeper

, killed Night 2.
wolframnhart, Miranda Callendar,

Mafia Rolecop

, killed Night 2.

Day 3 begins.

Votecount

Not Voting: Green Crayons, Pulindar, Nachomamma8, Gerhard Krause, peanutman, MacavityLock, Slaxx

With

7

alive it will take

4

to lynch.

[peanutman]

Vote : Nacho

(explained in post 443)
EBWOP : meant to write HOS : Nacho in my previous post.

[peanutman]

V/LA until Sunday evening.