Mini #893 - Dollhouse Mafia (Game Over!)

[SerialClergyman]

I want to get a feel for your understanding of the game.

[Limerickx]

Out of curiosity SC, what would you answer to your own question? Out of the three players near imprint, how many do you think might be mafia, and how many mafia do you think might be voting those townies close to imprint?

[elvis_knits]

This is not the first time that people refuse to answer questions posed by other players, insisting that the asker answer the question first or explain why he is asking.

WTF.

THIS IS LAME.

WHY CAN'T PEOPLE ANSWER A QUESTION?

[iamausername]

-=Vote Count #11=-

Nevada (6) - Virginia, Georgia, Montana, Iowa, Colorado, Florida
Virginia (2) - Arizona, Kansas
Alaska (1) - Hawaii
Arizona (1) - Alaska

Not Voting (2) - Nevada, Ohio

7 to lynch.

-=Imprint Count #11=-

Ohio (5) - Nevada, Florida, Arizona, Ohio, Colorado
Colorado (5) - Nevada, Ohio, Colorado, Iowa, Florida
Hawaii (5) - Nevada, Arizona, Kansas, Colorado, Hawaii
Alaska (3) - Alaska, Nevada, Virginia
Florida (3) - Nevada, Florida, Ohio
Iowa (3) - Arizona, Iowa, Kansas
Virginia (2) - Alaska, Virginia
Montana (2) - Nevada, Ohio
Georgia (2) - Nevada, Georgia
Arizona (1) - Nevada
Kansas (1) - Nevada
Nevada (1) - Nevada

7 to imprint.

ALASKA = SerialClergyman
ARIZONA = Starbuck
COLORADO = Messiah
FLORIDA = Limerickx
GEORGIA = Plum
HAWAII = TheButtonmen
IOWA = xRECKONERx
KANSAS = farside22
MONTANA = Pug89
NEVADA = DeathNote
OHIO = Vala Mal Doran
VIRGINIA = elvis_knits

[elvis_knits]

Messiah having 5 votes is mind boggling to me.

[elvis_knits]

^^ I mean 5 votes to imprint

[Limerickx]

E_K, if that first part (asking him to answer first) was directed at my last post, I would have been happy to answer the question had SC directed it towards me. He specifically directed it towards Button, so I assume he did so with a purpose. I am just interested what he personally thinks about the matter himself.

[elvis_knits]

Buttonman posted three times without answering SC's question, and now you want SC to answer his own question first?

That destroys the purpose of a question.

And I don't know why someone would refuse to answer a simple question, or why someone else would ask the asker to answer before the answerer even does it.

[Limerickx]

Im never I agree with Button not answering, and I never demanded SC answer his own question first, and Im not sure why you think that was my intent. My only point was that I am curious as to what SC thinks about the his own question. He doesn't have to answer the question before Button if he is looking for a certain response from Button first, but Im making it known, in advance, that Id like to know what sort of answer he was looking for, and why he feels that way himself. Is that unreasonable?

[elvis_knits]

No, but you made no comment about buttonmen, so I had no way to know you wanted him to answer first. You didn't say, "oh, interesting question, SC, I want to know what buttonmen thinks, but I also want to know what you would answer to your own question." The way you said it just turned attention to SC without mentioning buttonmen.

[Limerickx]

Sorry for not being clearer. I think Button should answer, as I don't think the question is particularly pointed. I don't get the reluctance to answer.

I would also like to know SCs opinion, what is he looking for? Truthfully, I wouldn't mind hearing other players opinions, but since SC brought it up, and I get the feeling he has his own opinion on the matter set, Id like to know what he thinks.

Also, EK, im sure you've already mentioned it and i just missed it on my reread, but where does your mind boggle-ness regarding Messiah come from\is laid out?

[elvis_knits]

I don't find Messiah that town. I think he's been reactionary and not originating ideas, following other people's ideas and playing it safe. (I mentioned this a little, but haven't talked too much about it).

I'm also suspicious because people don't really seem to have much reason for putting Messiah to imprint. It's like "I have a town read of him," with very little explanation from everyone voting him.

[Limerickx]

While I can understand your view (and hey, Im one of the people voting to imprint him because he 'feels town') I don't see that view making his nearing an imprint as 'mindboggling.' Just seems a but strong.

[farside22]

^^ I mean 5 votes to imprint

I agree with this ^ about messiah. Those that are voting to imprint massiah need to explain why for me. So far the only 2 I heard a geniun reason that are in the lead for imprints is VMD and TheButtonmen


Since SC and EK are so found of using the DN lynch to in a sense clear them if he does flip scum based on trying to push his lynch day 1. Here is my question.
If TheButtonmen is trying to break the game in the town favor on day 1 before the mod puts a stop to the idea why is he not assume townie?
Do you know scum who try to break the game in town's favor often?

@SC: Clearly I'm getting the impression you have never seen a scum buss another scum day 1.

[elvis_knits]

Well, VMD I also have a town read on despite some dodgy moves, so I won't fight VMD getting an imprint. However, reckoner is saying her vote on buttonmen is a towntell... which is like absolutely wrong. So I'm not totally fond of all the votes on VMD, but I don't think it would be horrible to give her an imprint.

I do not care about trying to clear myself at this point. If you people can't see it, then you are either scum or nothing I say or do will convince you. Judge me for yourself, you shouldn't need my convincing.

Regarding buttonmen, I agree he is probably town, and I think he's the safest person besides me and SC to imprint.

[farside22]

I do not care about trying to clear myself at this point. If you people can't see it, then you are either scum or nothing I say or do will convince you. Judge me for yourself, you shouldn't need my convincing.

Regarding buttonmen, I agree he is probably town, and I think he's the safest person besides me and SC to imprint.

A lot of you trying to clear you and SC is based on WIFOM. But the fact that nothing I said to you thus far in regards to how it is WIFOM makes me wish I could vote you all over again.
I need to read back on DN. For me no matter what DN's role is it doesnt' clear you. I'm starting to feel that SC is just blinded by you and trying to clear him. However him saying he can't see scum having a reason to do this is laughable at best.

[elvis_knits]

It's not WIFOM if you think one of the options has a much better chance of being true.

I realize there is always a chance I'm wrong, I've said so from the beginning, I just think the odds are really in favor of what I think.

And SC's behavior toward me since my original theory has only increased how sure I am.

At this point I wish I had kept my realization to myself because I could have just voted to imprint him and known secretly that he is town without alienating everyone. The thing that really sucks most now is that not only do people not want to imprint either of us, is that people aren't really listening to us. Losing the influence of two town players in a game where 1/3 is scum, is like, really bad. Hopefully as the game progresses though we can look back at the reactions to my theory about me and SC and find the scum easier.

[farside22]

It's not WIFOM if you think one of the options has a much better chance of being true.

I realize there is always a chance I'm wrong, I've said so from the beginning, I just think the odds are really in favor of what I think.

And SC's behavior toward me since my original theory has only increased how sure I am.

At this point I wish I had kept my realization to myself because I could have just voted to imprint him and known secretly that he is town without alienating everyone. The thing that really sucks most now is that not only do people not want to imprint either of us, is that people aren't really listening to us. Losing the influence of two town players in a game where 1/3 is scum, is like, really bad. Hopefully as the game progresses though we can look back at the reactions to my theory about me and SC and find the scum easier.

Saying we are town base on not reading your role or looking at the scum role and assuming you have a NK is just assuming. Is this true or not true?
Assuming scum do not buss day 1 on page 1 and seeing players that do this is again assuming.
Being all buddy, buddy and supporting one another based on assumptions like this = scummy.
Let me know if I missed anything with why myself doesn't agree with either of your assesments.

[xRECKONERx]

However, reckoner is saying her vote on buttonmen is a towntell...

Um, I retracted that on the last page.

[elvis_knits]

However, reckoner is saying her vote on buttonmen is a towntell...

Um, I retracted that on the last page.

I still don't understand why you ever thought that in the first place though.

[Vala Mal Doran]

I concur that Buttonmen should answer SC's question.

@SC: Are you planning on addressing that question to anyone else, or just Buttonmen? Why are you so curious to know Buttonmen's position specifically?

@EK: I have an imprint vote on Messiah. Several pages ago I asserted that I had a town read on pretty much every one of his posts. He doesn't post as much as some, but the overall impression I get is that he values being succinct, and when he does post he clearly has a good head on his shoulders. He responds to what's important and asks the right questions/poses the right pointed statements and it doesn't take an hour to read through his posts like it does with some of us. <_< I like that and think he is a good choice.

[TheButtonmen]

I concur that Buttonmen should answer SC's question.

I want to get a feel for your understanding of the game.

If your trying to ask me who I think is scum, I would point out that I'm currently voting you. As for my other thoughts on town / scum well call me old fashioned, I know scum / town lists are popular in this game but somethings I like keeping close to the chest D1.

As I said I'd rather not post a town / scum list. Now when I asked him why he asked me that, he responded he wanted to get a feel for my understanding of the game. I belive I've made my thoughts clear already and it's not as though I've been lurking.

[Vala Mal Doran]

I don't think he's asking you to make a scum/town list, I think he's asking you to venture a guess to how many scumbags are supporting your imprinting, not who, specifically. At least, that's the impression I got.

[elvis_knits]

Well, I'm a fan of scum/town lists, but that's not even what you were asked. You were asked if you think any of the people voting to imprint you are scum.

[TheButtonmen]

I don't think he's asking you to make a scum/town list, I think he's asking you to venture a guess to how many scumbags are supporting your imprinting, not who, specifically. At least, that's the impression I got.

In that case 0-1 and I'm curious as to why he directed it at me in particular.