Newbie #851 (Game Over!)

[PorkchopExpress]

This isn't happening with spinach. He doesn't scumhunt.

This. The only action we are getting out of him is defending himself. Even his questions to Pierre are invitations for Pierre to make a case that Spinach can then respond to.

[iamausername]

-=Vote Count #14=-

Alviaran (2) - swimmer4lyfe, mykonian
Pierre Sickle (2) - Spinach, Einlanzers
swimmer4lyfe (1) - Alviaran
Spinach (1) - PorkchopExpress

Not Voting (1) - Pierre Sickle

4 to lynch.

-=Alviaran has been prodded.=-

[Alviaran]

Sorry for not posting. Didn't have anything to say particularly and been catching up on missed classwork from being sick. I'm still here! Not dead yet!

[iamausername]

-=Einlanzers and Pierre Sickle have been prodded=-

[Einlanzers]

Hrm while there has been some interesting headway into a possible Spinach case I don't see too much else to comment on. Not very many other people are talking aswell :/.

The way I see it right now we have 3 main suspects: Pierre, Alvarian, and Spinach. Or am I mistaken? Does someone have a top suspect that isn't on that list?

[mykonian]

the way this day started, I think we should go for Alv. We had some small tells, in the end of day 1 he was too much busy with looking good (PCE's case), the lie that he didn't know he was lynching S2R, but thought he would lynch swimmer shows no intent to tell the truth.

And townies should never lie.

Does anyone need a summary Einlanzer style? Because I think it wouldn't be read, so I don't do it. But I believe alv should be our lynch, esspecially because of the obvious lying.

[Pierre Sickle]

Confirming Activity - Sorry, school schedule had me tied.

[mykonian]

Pierre, I have one question:

do you want to be lynched?

Since no-one cares if you are "active", if you don't do a thing. You are supposed to search for scum, so please do that, in stead of posting that you haven't fallen in front of a train.

Same counts for Alv's last post, but I have seen it happen a few times now with you.

[PorkchopExpress]

Is it exam time or something?

It's between Alv and Spinach for me. Their play is not that dissimilar, really.

Einlazers took a long time to get going, in my opinion. A lot of Day 1 was spent discussing the finer points of theory and play. That said, I've found some of it useful today so... I guess I should shut up. I didn't like that he took so long to find a suspect, but he eventually went to the S2R bandwagon, and by no means is he the ugliest vote on the S2R wagon. That still goes to Alv.

Day 2 has been more promising. The vote analysis wasn't bad, but is a victim of offering a little too much information, and too little analysis. Hmm, I'll do something more thorough at some stage.

[Einlanzers]

do you want to be lynched?

While I agree Pierre is scummy and should be pressured as a scum...I don't agree with your line of questioning. Do you really think ANYONE would answer "yes" to this? Or are you just hoping that he will infer "Why shouldn't you be lynched?" from it?

[mykonian]

do you want to be lynched?

While I agree Pierre is scummy and should be pressured as a scum...I don't agree with your line of questioning. Do you really think ANYONE would answer "yes" to this? Or are you just hoping that he will infer "Why shouldn't you be lynched?" from it?

The answer is obvious, and is therefore this isn't expected to be answered. It is a rhetorical question.

[swimmer4lyfe]

I haven't looked over Spinach with as much scrutiny as myk, pierre or alv. Will have to do that.

Myk, just because someone agrees with my logic doesn't mean they're buddying up. I think its a little scummy that anyone "agreeing" with me or thinking that your whole case against me was wrong is suddenly portrayed as scummy. Another reason why I think you made up the silly "I was just trying to figure out your alignment" case.

Alv is by far the best choice for the lynch. I'm also down for a pierre or myk lynch, but prefer Alv. Pierre I'm beginning to feel is just horribly horribly newbish and is refusing to learn from his mistakes. Possible scum cover? maybe...but this is the stuff that makes towns lose at lylo. We should've lynched him day 1

[Alviaran]

Swimmer, you list three of us. You'd be happy lynching us with a preference for me. Do I have to point out there are two scum in the game as per the opening possibilities? Since we didn't hit scum on day one, there are still two. And there are three people you're willing to vote for. Do I have to do the math for you?

Five town left. Two scum. You are fine with lynching three different people. Uh, only scum should be happy with lynching three different people, unless I'm so n00bish to the game this somehow makes sense. To me, town should be dialing in on at most two people, the two they find the scummiest, the two they think ARE scum and going after them while keeping their eyes open for the rest because quite obviously, all three of us can't be scum.

Yes, I get scummy feelings off of, well, just about everyone. But I'm paranoid. But my two I think are the scummiest are Pierre (that has been done to death now) and Swimmer here, who I have said before I mistakenly hammered Stands instead of. My feeling that he is the scummier of the two is why my vote on him is still standing. Pierre could be scum, but could also just be very newbie town. I feel that Swimmer or Pierre are likely to not be both scum (Swimmer has gone a tad too ardently after Pierre it seems to be bussing him this long...though his sudden switch to following me around is certainly a tad odd, at least from where I'm sitting, could be maintaining his Pierre bit simply to appear consistent) but I am convinced one of the two of them is. Lynching one of them, prefereably Swimmer, I think is not only most likely to yield a scum lynch but to also provide the most information towards other scum.

[mykonian]

I haven't looked over Spinach with as much scrutiny as myk, pierre or alv. Will have to do that.

Myk, just because someone agrees with my logic doesn't mean they're buddying up. I think its a little scummy that anyone "agreeing" with me or thinking that your whole case against me was wrong is suddenly portrayed as scummy. Another reason why I think you made up the silly "I was just trying to figure out your alignment" case.

Alv is by far the best choice for the lynch. I'm also down for a pierre or myk lynch, but prefer Alv. Pierre I'm beginning to feel is just horribly horribly newbish and is refusing to learn from his mistakes. Possible scum cover? maybe...but this is the stuff that makes towns lose at lylo. We should've lynched him day 1

I gave it as a possibility, for that reason, since buddying arguements are very hard to make, and often come from the same feelings that also start omgus votes. Further, if you finally read the start of my argument against you, you see that it wouldn't make any sense to get you lynched. Now, if you assume I am not stupid, you know I was trying to find out your allignment.

But you never even argued that point, you just keep going on how your feelings tell you I am scum. I think you don't want to argue that point, since it shows that point is in my favor.

[mykonian]

alv, why did you lie?

[PorkchopExpress]

Alv, your latest argument against Swimmer is terrible. Having three lynchable suspects is not the same thing as thinking there are three scum or opportunistic voting.

What's more, you are now trying to wedge Swimmer into an untenable situation where you can attack him from both sides of the argument: Earlier, you are criticising him for tunnelling, but now he has too many suspects (3). How is this not an opportunistic scum move for you, and a no-win situation for S4L? You are going to claim scum on him either way. Scummier and scummier.

Unvote. Vote: Alviaran

Deadline is looming, people.

[Spinach]

@First Quote: I've said this and I am going to say it again, I wasn't trying to sound pessimistic, I was just trying to be real, because face it, most lynches on D1 are in fact town, and I wanted a claim to avoid PR lynching. (like we did..)

I'm not giving you a hard time because you think Day 1 is more likely to end in a mislynch. That's not what I'm talking about and I'd appreciate it if you didn't try to reframe the issue again.

What I'm talking about here (clearly) is that you know the town has to lynch otherwise it isn't chasing leads and isn't gaining information, but when the deadline was looming you were of two minds about whether to lynch because it might make you look bad.

I was of two minds because I had never been in that situation before. I did not know what to do. That is why I asked that question.

This is after you've stated that you don't believe any claims will be coming.

So, you started at a position of:

Scumlynch is better than a mislynch, which is better than a no lynch.

and shifted to:

No lynch is better than a claimless mislynch.

When did I state this?

In a position that you thought might bring you unwanted scrutiny.

Then this whole, trying to dodge the NK thing. If you were trying to survive the NK by not being overly townie, why wouldn't you engage in behaviour that you considered somewhat scummy (but defensible none the less)?

I thought of this to be defensible.

More to the point, as a vanilla townie why were you trying to dodge the NK at all? Part of what Vanilla does is make nice big pro-town targets of themselves to give the PRs some breathing room.

If all VTs make big targets of themselves then won't the PRs be spotted easily? I just have been frustrated with having seemingly little input on the game, I wanted to try something new and actually get somewhere and test the waters beyond D1

If you value PRs so much that you'd risk a No Lynch to ensure not lynching one, why wouldn't you try and draw the NK away from potential PRs?

When did I say I'd risk a no-lynch to save the PRs?

Your strategy is illogical and self-serving, your defence doesn't stand up to scrutiny. You are scum. Hell, I don't even need to drag this down into a debate about the merits of PR claims on Day 1.

Responded in Bold.


Pierre: Respond.

I'm willing to hammer Alv once he claims. That last post seemed like a desperate scum trying to make a case on someone to save him/herself.

[Alviaran]

I do not exactly know the accepted requirements for a claim are among players, but since I am sitting at L-1, I will do it now.

I'm a vanilla townie. I have no roles and am only useful to the town thus as a warm body carrying a vote.

However, I have a feeling that Spinach is likely to hammer as soon as he sees this. Or Pierre if he comes along since he is the most likely to be hit otherwise based on the current votes. I only hope that after this happens the rest of you do nail the scum because otherwise you guys are going to be down to needing all of the town to bring a lynch to bear on the scum.

But here, just to make some tough decisions, I'll put good ol' Pierre at the L-1 too!

Unvote, Vote: Pierre Sickle

Have fun with that guys!

Yes, I'm being fatalistic but I do feel that because of some newbish mistakes I made, people got certain ideas about me and they will be the end of it. I'll watch the game through to its conclusion probably to see how right/wrong I was, but that will probably be it. Take care and good luck.

[Pierre Sickle]

If we can claim now, I'll claim, though I wouldn't resort to that so quickly. Obviously, most of you will think I've been lying with how I play. But, here it is and don't say I didn't tell you so... but I won't if Spinach does actually hammer. That being said, if he does, there's a suspect already, trying to get me off so fast.

Vanilla townie. I have no night powers and I can only vote in the day.

Oh and Alv, just had to put me down there with that attitude of yours didn't ya?

Don't worry, I'll get you back SOMEHOW.

[PorkchopExpress]

So, on the one hand we have Alviaran ditching arguments in favour of hammer baiting, and Pierre milling around rather than analysing or voting. This is incredibly frustrating.

Pierre, do you find Alviaran scummy or not? Why? If not, who is your big suspect? It's 5 days from deadline and you should have voted one way or another by now.

[swimmer4lyfe]

I'm ok with either of them being lynched. I prefer Alv though.

Although it is kinda funny that Pierre is the only one that hasn't voted yet and he hasn't tried to save himself.

[Spinach]

Gah, I'm totally split on this. I'm leaning Alv though, because if PS was scum I think he'd have a little more effort, and while PS has done.. nothing, Alv has actually done things that are scummy. (I hope that made sense)


I'd like to hear Myk's thoughts before I decide.

[mykonian]

confirm vote alviaran

?

I don't understand the meaning of that question.

[PorkchopExpress]

A quick isoread gives me a pretty solid idea of what Myk thinks about Alv. Have you not been reading along, Spinach? Was there something from Alviaran that made you think Mykonian would change his mind? Why do you need his assessment before providing your own and acting on that?

...and while PS has done.. nothing, Alv has actually done things that are scummy.

You seem to be suggesting that Pierre hasn't done anything scummy. Is that right?

[Alviaran]

Because Spinach is too busy doing what evidently condemned me at the end of day 1: worrying about appearances.