Mini 836: Commie Mafia (Game Over)

[Cyberbob]

On a different note -- what do you think about the argument that, inactivity aside, Le Chat's stances in this game have been rather mellow? Would you agree that it's easier for scum to hide behind such a playstyle?

Now

this

is, to me, a significant point against him; I do indeed agree that a wishy-washy playstyle is easier for scum to hide behind. I also see that charter picked up on this same thing, and his post is rather persuasive...

I would like to reread him for myself before possibly changing my vote; this should be done by tonight. Also note that charter's vote put him at L-1, so I'll definitely be trying to make any possible decision to hammer as informed as I can.

[mathcam]

Hm. L-1 is a pretty serious place to be for someone who hasn't posted today.

Unvote: Le Chat.

Just a preventative measure against reckless hammers (not that I think that's particularly likely in this game, but with CoCo around...) When Chat gets back, he should still be thinking of himself at L-1.

Cam

[charter]

Didn't realize I was putting him at L-1, should have checked and announced that.

Pretty sure I never saw this before, because this is similar to what SC said about Peabody, and I thought that made him scummy, so same deal with le Chat.

This should obviously be Col.Cathart, not SC. My bad.

[charter]

Also, this game just ended. Vaya was lurkerscum in there. He says postgame that it's no tell to his alignment, but I dunno. Just something to keep in mind I guess.

[charter]

PS. We should post, cause we have a deadline.

I am just waiting for le Chat. Don't really have much to say until he comes back to find himself being the wagonee.

[mathcam]

Agreed.

And interesting on Vaya, though I imagine he's a lurker in every game he plays. He's over-committed. I don't see why people prefer to half-ass 10 games instead of playing 2-3 games well, but to each his own, I suppose.

Cam

[SerialClergyman]

Well posting is a little hard when waiting on someone.

Is anyone prepared to stick up for le chat in absense of other discussion?

[Cyberbob]

OK, very very quick reread of le Chat (I was planning on doing this last night when I would have had more time, but the forums were down):

- "Does not know what to think about Vaya v CoCo" in Post 109
- Doesn't see Peabody's initial vote as a scumtell, also continues to "find it hard" to get a read on CoCo
- Next couple of posts are whitenoise
- Big Post 241; writes a

lot

of words yet in effect says nothing
- Next few posts after the above one continue nothing, only thing of note is an unvote of Cathart and agreeing about Peabody's contradiction (no vote though)
- Nope, in Post 337 he reverts to not finding Peabody scummy and in fact finding him town?
- Votes Vaya after another bunch of largely empty words for "not contributing much" (lol)
- Doesn't re-vote Vaya at the beginning of the next day despite having had his vote on him at the end of the previous day and deliberately not allowing the Peabody WIFOM thing to make him "any more or less suspicious" (surely if you didn't feel any less suspicious of someone you were previously voting for you would vote them again?)
- I'm noting a slight theme of buddying towards me; his strongest statements seem to be complimentary of my play
- Is suspicious of Hoopla in Post 686 for being reticient
- Is V/LA from the 26th of September to the 1st of October; this is like the third (or something) time he's been away
- "Hates" Vaya's attitude but provides an out, also claims that he had been suspicious of Cathart previously but his only mention of him that I can find up to that point on Day 2 was a QFTing of a charter post
- Eases off Cathart after the claim, "fears" that his roleclaim was true despite agreeing that he was scummy

Thus far on Day 3 his contributions have consisted of:
- A Vaya vote that has since been retracted
- An attempt to push the possibility that Sens might not have died from targeting scum (which in light of mathcam's list does indeed take on a new significance)
- Posting a town/scum list (charter and SC were listed as scummy) which he was

still

wringing his hands over
- ...



I reckon I could count the number of definite positions he's taken on one hand. I'm still holding out for someone to join me for what seems to me to be a no-brainer CoCo wagon, but yeah - I could live with a le Chat lynch.

I want to hear from Hoopla, CoCo and I want more from SC.

[Hoopla]

Well posting is a little hard when waiting on someone.

Is anyone prepared to stick up for le chat in absense of other discussion?

I'm not overly fussed about a le Chat lynch, but I'll defs back Cyberbob in a CoCo lynch. It still is the most sensible option.

[mathcam]

Don't get me wrong, I'd shed no tears after a CoCo lynch. It's just to me that the evidence on him is, given his playstyle, very subjective. I think most of us at some point in the game have gone from being pretty sure he's town to pretty sure he's scum, or vice versa. I remember Day 1 Hoopla was a big CoCo champion. Subjective is still better than non-existent, though, so that's something.

Cam

[Hoopla]

Don't get me wrong, I'd shed no tears after a CoCo lynch. It's just to me that the evidence on him is, given his playstyle, very subjective. I think most of us at some point in the game have gone from being pretty sure he's town to pretty sure he's scum, or vice versa. I remember Day 1 Hoopla was a big CoCo champion. Subjective is still better than non-existent, though, so that's something.

Cam

I know you and Cyberbob has covered this over the last few posts about what constitutes objective evidence and the value of scum reads, but an important variable that factors in to my lynch choices is value to town. If someone doesn't have the capacity (or will) to think critically and analyse well in the event of endgame scenarios for town, they're a worthwhile lynch.

Like you, I don't rate my own personal scumreads too highly. I feel I have a more realistic judgement of the probable percentages of someone being scum, than a lot of people, and the margin is slimmer than most would like to believe. Many that claim to have great scum/townhunting abilities are likelier to have selective memory when it comes to their previous outings.

I'd like CoCo lynched because of his inability to play logically - I usually love erratic playstyles, but there still needs to be a core of logic underneath the persona. I don't trust CoCo in an endgame scenario as town, and I don't like the pattern developing with CoCo mostly posting when he comes under fire.

I think there is a reasonable chance of him being scum.

[charter]

MOD, what is the prod/replacement status of le Chat?

[mathcam]

I agree completely, even with the reasonableness of him being scum. I only meant that, for example,

I think CoCo's abrasiveness is an asset to the town, despite getting caught up in useless semantics debates occasionally, and is starting to appear a little pro-town, if only because of his activeness which is a loose town-tell.

is almost exactly the reverse sentiment. I certainly concede there's been plenty of time to change your mind since that post on day one, but if it's anything like my experience, you've been going back and forth between the two extremes all game.

So what do you think about the fact that a hider SensFan would almost certainly not (imo) have hid with CoCo?

Cam

[Kublai Khan]

MOD, what is the prod/replacement status of le Chat?

Not too good. Looks like CoCo & le Chat (& Vaya) all need replacement. Looks like I got my work cut out for me. All try to get replacements in ASAP. (deadline rescinded until replacements found.

Official Vote Count

Players needed to lynch: 5

charter

- 1 - CoCo - (L-4)

CoCo

- 1 - Cyberbob - (L-4)

le Chat

- 2 - SerialClergyman, charter - (L-3)

Vaya

- 1 - le Chat - (L-4)

Players not voting: Hoopla, mathcam, Vaya

[Kublai Khan]

Socrates

replaces

Vaya

[Socrates]

Greetings.

I have read and hopefully will have a post up within the hour.

[charter]

Ugh, this is bad news. Coco and le Chat are both getting replaced. These are the two realistic lynch candidates we have today. A replacement isn't going to be able to defend their predecessor's actions.

I dunno. I see two ways to handle this. Go ahead and lynch one and save Kublai the trouble of finding a replacement, or wait for all of the slots to get filled, let the replacements read, then take it from there.

Honestly, I think le Chat's actions are lynch worthy and unless his replacement finds some undiscovered gold mine, I'm probably still going to want to lynch him.

Welcome Socrates.

[Cyberbob]

Honestly, I think le Chat's actions are lynch worthy and unless his replacement finds some undiscovered gold mine, I'm probably still going to want to lynch him.

This describes my thoughts about CoCo almost perfectly, and with all these replacements I can see today dragging on for a very very long time; I fear the possibility of one or more of them getting bored and flaking as well if we don't pick things up.

[Cyberbob]

It is good to see that Socrates has already done his reading, though.

[charter]

Argh, I will take another look at Coco and see what I think about him. le Chat seems most likely to be scum to me, but yeah, not really interested in this day dragging out.

[Kublai Khan]

Debonair Danny DiPietro

replaces

le Chat

Raskol

replaces

CoCo

Updated Vote Count..

Official Vote Count

Players needed to lynch: 5

charter

- 1 - Raskol - (L-4)

Debonair Danny DiPietro

- 2 - SerialClergyman, charter - (L-3)

Raskol

- 1 - Cyberbob - (L-4)

Socrates

- 1 - Debonair Danny DiPietro - (L-4)

Players not voting: Hoopla, mathcam, Socrates

No deadline at the moment.

[charter]

Wow. Thanks a lot Kublai, thanks guys for replacing.

Guess that answers the question of whether or not to wait.

[Socrates]

My computer crashed as I was in the midst of posting and I have to start over. Gah. My apologies.

[Hoopla]

So what do you think about the fact that a hider SensFan would almost certainly not (imo) have hid with CoCo?

Cam

I'd suggest we're almost certainly playing in a 3-scum set-up, so I guess it does lower his chances, but doesn't clear him. I think it's an ominous task trying to pick where Sens hid - I could realistically see him hiding behind you, Cyberbob, le Chat or even possibly SC. I think le Chat would be the slight favourite out of this group.

What about the possibility of something else, ie; Sens failing to submit an action, or him being roleblocked?

--

Ooh, look at all the new people we have.

[Raskol]

Hello all.

I've been following the game since mid day 1 and I'm already mostly familiar with what's been going on, so it shouldn't take me too long to do a quick reread to refresh my memory.