Open 131 - Nightless Vanilla (Over) before 767

[hewitt]

How were we supposed to know that 58, 60, and 67 is what you were referring to in Post 90? Post 90 doesn't name names and there were other votes between 67 and 90 along with earlier votes you didn't comment on.

It was not "SO clear" as you contend in post 199.

If 90 was meant as a vague summary of 58, 60, and 67 then what purpose did it serve other than to add to your post count?

Further, I went back and looked at the votes you mention. Jazzmyn clearly stated the reasons for voting and unvoting. Adam Smith tacked on the third Lowell vote and gave just as much reason as Netlava, whose second Lowell vote you didn't have a problem with. Why Adam Smith but not Netlava?

I agree that millar's vote was scummy to the point I voted for him.

Okay well at this point it would seem as if it was SO CLEAR to everybody but yourself, so sorry you didn't understand it.

My theory is that scum would feel weird playing with more scumpartners than usual and would be more apt to make such a comment.

Vote: Lowell

Unvote: White Castle
Vote: Lowell

If White Castle is right, awesome. If not, I'm keeping my eye on him--something seems weird about him quoting the wiki all the time, like he's searching for ways to cover his ass.

OMGUS aside, this reminds me of something I read here:
http://www.mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php ... dard_Tells
At the bottom of the page is the "Well, That Sucks" Tell.
You signed up for this game knowing the ratio of town to scum, and that it was nightless.

unvote, vote Lowell

I disagree with Tarhalindur's specific "Well, That Sucks Tell" as written in his wiki, actually, but I agree with your take on Lowell's odd post. Why would anyone who signed up for a specific set up in a specific game then feel the need to whine about it in their opening post unless they were scum trying to post something - anything - that they think makes them look sympathetic to the town?

Vote: Lowell

I think you may very well have caught scum on Day 1, page 2 here.

Regards,
Jazz[/quote]

Vote: Lowell

Unvote: Vote Lowell

yay

Netlava's vote to me looked as if it was a joke vote and I think it is. The way it's phrased with the "my theory" makes it sound as if he is kidding, still the random voting period remember?

But Adam Smith and Jazzmyn's votes do not look random at all, they gave reason (albeit very poor ones- which is why I pointed them out). Especially Jazzmyn's with that little "I think you may have caught scum here" comment. And then there's millar's vote.

You're making it seem like I attacked them hardcore or something when all I really did was make some small observations, I think your arguments against it are pretty silly White Castle.

[hewitt]

Argh, FU-CKING A. That little part in the middle was meant to be part of Jazzmyn's quote.

[Lowell]

Okay then how about you unvote me lest the mod doesn't understand.

[Netlava]

My top suspect is still skitzer. Hopefully he can respond to my suspicions soon. His comment about how farside was joking is strange. Looking at farside's posts:

Vote Empking

I have this thing of policy lynching him in every game now.

Where town or scum empking in my opinion is anti-town. I have links to about 3 games I played with him and he always comes off as anti-town and nonsense.

Here is wiki for metagame


http://www.mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=Metagame


As for a policy lynching. Basically people believing in lynching a certain player no matter the game because of their play style or in the matter of someone players they like to lynch lurkers

That's three non-joking posts.

[skitzer]

OK sorry this post should have been posted days ago but my frustration with IE tabs delayed it.

Here is my final opinion on the wiki usage in this game: farside22 used it once, for reference, White Castle used it twice for gameplay reasons. There is nothing scummy about either; however, there is a difference between the two usages.

What makes you think farside was "obviously" joking? Here's a hint: she wasn't.

Very rarely a policy lynch is real. If she was serious, she would still have her vote on Empking.

And what I'm trying to say about your unvote reason is that it could have easily been fabricated, yet people will still believe it.

Some reads:

Netlava is "always in agreement with White Castle"
Lowell is "playing almost stupidly brash"

[farside22]

Notice what I'm doing and follow along.

unvote, vote farside

Something about her play so far makes me think a "oh, sorry I've been out, vote X" bandwagon vote is about to happen. It's not that she's ignoring the thread so much as when she is on the thread, her posts are weak and vague.

Actually if you look at my post I've been ignoring all my games here except mish mash because that is easier to respond to then these games and I'm in a hurry.

Okay no I'm ready to read from the beginning and see what is actually going on around here.

[Rishi]

Vote Count – Page 10

Lowell – 5 (Adam Smith, millar13, Empking, Wall-E, hewitt)
millar13 – 2 (farside22, lixyl)
skitzer – 2 (Netlava, Jazzmyn)
hewitt – 1 (White Castle)
farside22 – 1 (Lowell)

Not voting: skitzer

With 12 alive, it takes 7 votes to lynch.

hewitt's vote was not in a quote block, so it counts. Use preview, folks.

[Lowell]

I'm not convinced hewitt is intentionally voting for me.

@hewitt- pay attention

[millar13]

I'm not convinced hewitt is intentionally voting for me.

@hewitt- pay attention

Sounds almost like an annoyance at a fellow scum buddy bussing you

[Lowell]

No it sounds like an annoyance at someone who meant to quote SOMEONE ELSE voting me and ended up voting me himself.

[hewitt]

Mod: Can you fix my obvious quote I fucked up instead of listing me as voting for Lowell.

[White Castle]

hewitt, you're really taking this no voting to an extreme. Just unvote for crying out loud.

This would have been a lot funnier if Lowell was already at L-1 when you did it.

[Lowell]

yeah. hilarious.

[Rishi]

Mod: Can you fix my obvious quote I fucked up instead of listing me as voting for Lowell.

It's not obvious where the quote is supposed to begin and end from your original post, so I will not fix the quote tags. (If the post was simply missing a quotation mark or something, then I could easily fix it, but there's no beginning to the quote tag.)

However, from this statement, it is obvious that you did not intend to vote for Lowell. I will consider this an unvote in this instance, but in the future, please

Unvote

to avoid ambiguity.

[White Castle]

Netlava's vote to me looked as if it was a joke vote and I think it is. The way it's phrased with the "my theory" makes it sound as if he is kidding, still the random voting period remember?

You're making it seem like I attacked them hardcore or something when all I really did was make some small observations, I think your arguments against it are pretty silly White Castle.

Not random voting this game.

[quote=""Netlava Post 45""][quote=""Lowell""]Great a nightless with a billion scum...

vote white castel

[/quote]

My theory is that scum would feel weird playing with more scumpartners than usual and would be more apt to make such a comment.

Vote: Lowell

[/quote]

We disagree about Netlava's vote then. After Netlava stated he wouldn't random vote, I interpreted the "my theory" to be Netlava dropping subtle town vibes.

I'm doing my best to look for scum, while you continue to exaggerate.

[White Castle]

Still waiting on this Lowell. Why don't you "try harder".

Still here. Will write a summary post when I get a chance.

Hey Lowell - we're still waiting for that summary post from April 4th. Here are all of your posts since then.

Still here. Jury duty kept me away.

154 is a dumb response to 153. millar looks worse in my eyes as a result of 153.

pretty sure skitzer is town. don't ask how I know. magic.

I also noticed that you've posted about 50 times since you resolved to write your summary. So when will you "get a chance"?

We're going to need more from you than just "majic" reasons too.

[White Castle]

farside - when you get caught up, please answer this (and include all of Empking's posts, not just the ones mentioned below).

So which, if any, of these 6 game posts is Empking deserving of a policy lynch? Is Empking displaying a different playstyle this game? I'm looking for comments from anyone who has played with Empking before, but especially farside (she brought it up first in post 24), and hewitt (commented on it in post 25).

Vote: FS

- Liars who push policy lynches are almost always scum.

Ah, so metagaming is essentially the opposite of playing to win?

The second one is.

I dislike the speed of that. I'm going to be paying attention to the last three plsayers this game.

Unvote: Vote Lowell

yay

Can you give a reason with your vote?

Unvote

Vote; Lowell

The Nigtless and Try Harder comments.

Lowell looks like he's sitting back.

[millar13]

Post 240...proof that Lowell is on the lurk.

[hewitt]

How is that not an obvious quote fuck up? Seriously that pisses me off because I quoted that straight from Jazzmyn and I have no idea how that screwed up but I don't want it on record that I said that when it is CLEARLY Jazzmyn's post #47, that is ridiculous.

[millar13]

just quote the mistake.....

and and then correct it. Simple As

[White Castle]

hewitt, if you are scum keep it up and get modkilled. Otherwise just let it go.

It's a good decision by the mod because it follows the rules, likely didn't impact the outcome of the game, and prevents scum from "accidental"-broken-quote-hammering.

[hewitt]

Whatever on the quote thing, over it.

Anyways Netlava's vote could hardly be considering jumping on a bandwagon.

[Lowell]

Runthrough:

24- farside votes emp for policy lynch
29- emp votes farside
44- White castle votes lowell for whining
45- ditto netlava
46- ditto adam smith
47- ditto jazzmyn
55- wall-e agrees, but vows to wait until end of day to vote Lowell [-, scared?]
56- farside points out dumbness of 55 [+], demands more of lowell [-]
58- hewitt questions speed of the wagon
59- millar votes lowell [-, no explanation]
61- skitzer doesn't like lowell wagon
63- jazzmyn unvotes
64- farside unvotes, votes millar for wagon-hopping, says she never liked lowell wagon [-, too easy]
66- wall-e votes lowell [-, why now?]
71- lowell FOSs millar, farside
77- white castle votes millar, peppers thread with posts [+, at least he's trying]
92- lowell leads w/ 3 votes
90s- hewitt and wall-e argue, sort of [-, looks a little staged]
103- wall-e votes lowell... again
104- lixyl votes millar
111- netlava votes skitzer [+, good hunch, new angle, town points]
120- emp wakes up, votes lowell for reasons in 44 [-, again, why now?]
132- lowell 4 votes, millar 3
136- emp accuses lowell of "sitting back"
137- millar quickly agrees, says lowell playing "nervous games" [-, so quick to agree]
138- farside disagrees
140s- white castle posts like whoa
150- white castle wants a "list" from everyone [-, this can't help]
153- millar questions the attacks on him, not the attackers [-, bad]
154- wall-e quickly agrees [-, why?]
156- lowell calls out millar's dumbness
165- lowell 4 votes, millar 3
167- jazzmyn votes skitzer for various reasons [+, good logic]
170- hewitt explains his voting habits [+, strangely town]
171- emp wants the millar case explained
179- lowell calls skitzer town
180- jazzmyn defends skitzer vote [+, good]
180s- hewitt and white castle argue over former's voting habits
188- white castle votes hewitt [-]
193- wall-e buys the white castle "slip" (# of townies voting), votes white castle
204- netlava does not consider it a slip
219- lowell says white castle town
221- wall-e votes lowell for "clearing people for scum to kill" [-, I have no idea what that means]
222- millar quickly agrees, says no townie should "know" who is town [-, brilliant?]
224- lowell votes farside for lurking, mostly
228- netlava reiterates interest in skitzer [+, not lowering to the crowd]
231- lowell leads w/ 5 votes
242- millar reiterates that lowell is lurking

Some things that strike me now that I'm actually paying attention:

netlava

and

hewitt

are the most pro-town players, by far. Netlava has not jumped lazily on bandwagons. He doesn't post all that much, but I feel like I know clearly where he stands, which is a plus. The fact that hewitt isn't afraid to make people angry is good. Also that he hasn't been an idiot and jumped on my wagon is a plus.

Something is up with

millar

, and it isn't good. I read him originally as town, but now I'm not feeling it. He jumped on the lowell wagon in 59 with no explanation (right after wall-e had said he wanted to). In 136 emp accuses me of lurking. Millar immediately agrees in 137. Again, in 221 wall-e votes lowell, and millar posts right after to CONFIRM his vote on me. Everything millar does reeks of a desperate need to be loved... particularly by emp and wall-e.

wall-e

, as well, looks bad. He initially states his interest in voting me, but is cautious to do so in fear of looking too eager. Then he votes for me when it's safe. Later, post 221 makes no sense, and he looks eager to go back to a safe wagon. Worse, he did this after I voiced my disagreement with those who considered there to be a white castle "slip." Wall-E was one of these people. So, if he thinks white castle slipped, and is scum, why did he immediately jump on to me and say that I was "clearing people for scum to kill"? I think his heart was never in the white castle wagon.

white castle

is hard to read. On the one hand, I admire his aggressiveness and willingness to move the thread forward. On the other hand, I have him linked to unsavory characters like wall-e and millar a little too much for my liking. They tried a bit too hard in the 220s to run interference.

I expect more, generally, all the way around, from

skitzer

and

farside

. I've played with them before and nothing about their play here makes me think they care who wins.

jazzmyn

looks relatively town, though I don't have much to go on.

Anyone I haven't mentioned I have no opinion of because they're lurky or pointless.

FOS millar
FOS white castle
unvote, vote Wall-E

[Wall-E]

Jazzmyn also used the wiki in this game, and it was an appeal to authority (Tarlhandur's debunked tells), which is a logical fallacy. He did append the reference by saying that he disagreed with the specific tell, but the fact that he used it at all is still AtA.

[Wall-E]

Lowell's 247 is biased. He lists votes by me without stating my reasons while simultaneously extending the courtesy to other players, calls my arguments staged (how can anyone prove/disprove that?) and is trying generally to paint me scummy without justification.

He initially states his interest in voting me, but is cautious to do so in fear of looking too eager.

Quote or you're lying.

Do you deny that you were clearing people for the scum?

You're right that my heart hasn't been in any of my votes yet. So? Is bandwagoning a scumtell all of a sudden?