bothXylthixlm wrote:I tried running 1:4 mountainous for marathon day. It lasted three minutes.
I'm not sure if that's a minus or a plus.
Open Setup Certification Group
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shaft.ed dem.agogue
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farside22 Mafia Mum
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shaft.ed dem.agogue
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Korts Luddite
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I will put some work in tomorrow and say something about Masons and Monks and Twofold. I will also collect some setups to discuss from the old open setup discussion thread.
Meanwhile,vote to kill Quack Multiball; vote to kill 1:4
EDIT: Also, mith, could you update the OP? I've already done the formatting and everything, just add these to the list of certified setups:
Vanilla Nightless- * 6-8 players: 2 scum (2:4 to 2:6)
* 9-11 players: 3 scum (3:6 to 3:8)
* 12-16 players: 4 scum (4:8 to 4:12)
- * 2 Mafia Goons
* 3 Townies
* 1 Cop
* Doctor
Day Start
- * 2 Mafia A Goons
* 2 Mafia B Goons
* 9 Vanilla Townies
Day Start
Ivote to kill V2; vote to certify V1 and V3, which makes 3/6 votes for certification.
EDIT2: Lovers Mafia also has a wiki article, please update OP to reflect that.Last edited by Korts on Sun Apr 05, 2009 8:09 am, edited 1 time in total.scumchat never die-
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MafiaSSK Jack of All Trades
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Korts Luddite
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Tenchi Mafia Scum
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I posted a setup here and I wish to have feedback. Farside pointed that I should talk to you guys.
Here it is anyway:
Tenchi wrote:Doublecrossed
2 Doctors
5 Vanilla Townies
2 Mafia Scum
1 Vampire (becomes Mafia Scum)
Mod Notes:
Vampire: Plays for Town. If NKed, stays and becomes Mafia Scum, cannot be protected
Doctor: Cannot protect self.
Mafia Scum, together submits two choices, one choice to kill and one choice to roleblock.Yes. That same Tenchi.
Reicheru and Tenchi begin to bond more, sending love letters to each other.-
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farside22 Mafia Mum
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Adel Crystalline Logick
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I keep on looking through this thread, and I have some ideas that are still baking for now.-
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shaft.ed dem.agogue
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Korts Luddite
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Adel Crystalline Logick
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kill V.2 and keep the others. I suspect that there may b an argument for killing V.3 (too swingy) but I don't buy it.-
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Korts Luddite
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Approved Setups(as of 09-April-11)
C9
One of four variations, randomly chosen:- * 1 Cop, 1 Doc, 2 Mafia, 3 Townies;
* 1 Cop, 2 Mafia, 4 Townies
* 1 Doc, 2 Mafia, 4 Townies
* 2 Mafia, 5 Townies
It consists of four variations, chosen at random- * 1 Mafia Goon, 1 Mafia Roleblocker, 1 Sane Cop, 1 Doctor, 5 Townies.
* 1 Mafia Goon, 1 Mafia Roleblocker, 7 Townies.
* 2 Mafia Goons, 1 Sane Cop, 6 Townies.
* 2 Mafia Goons, 1 Doctor, 6 Townies.
- * 1 Mafia Goon
* 1 Mafia Roleblocker (for balance reasons, the Roleblocker should also be able to nightkill even if the Goon is dead)
* 1 Sane Cop
* 1 Doctor
* 3 Townies
- * 1 Godfather
* 1 Mafia Goon
* 3 Vengeful townies
Nightless
- * 2 Mafia Lovers
* 4 Townies
Nightless
- * 3 Mafia
* 1 Doctor
* 1 Jailkeeper
* 8 Townies
- * 6-8 players: 2 scum (2:4 to 2:6)
* 9-11 players: 3 scum (3:6 to 3:8)
* 12-16 players: 4 scum (4:8 to 4:12)
- * 2 Mafia Goons
* 3 Townies
* 1 Cop
* Doctor
Day Start
- * 2 Mafia A Goons
* 2 Mafia B Goons
* 9 Vanilla Townies
Day Start
- * 6-8 players: 2 scum (2:4 to 2:6)
* 9-11 players: 3 scum (3:6 to 3:8)
* 12-16 players: 4 scum (4:8 to 4:12)
- * 2 Mafia Goons
* 3 Townies
* 1 Cop
* Doctor
Day Start
- * 2 Mafia A Goons
* 2 Mafia B Goons
* 9 Vanilla Townies
Day Start
- * 1 Mafia Goon
* 1 Mafia Roleblocker
* 1 Cop or Nurse
* 1 Doctor or Deputy Cop
* 3 Townies
- * 1 Mafia Goon
* 1 Mafia Roleblocker
* 1 Cop or Doctor
* 1 Deputy Cop or Nurse
* 3 Townies
scumchat never die-
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mith Godfather
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Adel Crystalline Logick
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still baking.
one half-baked idea: if three members agree on something for now on, it counts as a consensus. that way things can keep on moving.-
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Max Mafia Scum
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Korts Luddite
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I'm looking through the old open setup discussion thread for setups worth review; a setup that springs to mind as something that should be explored is Crush.
Crush- * 1 Mafia Godfather (vengeful-style)
* 1 Mafia Goon
* 1 Lyncher (informed of their target)
* 4 Townies (one of whom is unknowingly the lyncher's target)
Day Start
scumchat never die-
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Thok Disgrace to SKs everywhere
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If you need suggestions for set ups to confirm, please talk about some form of Friends and EnemiesKorts wrote:I'm looking through the old open setup discussion thread for setups worth review; a setup that springs to mind as something that should be explored is Crush.
3 Mafia
3 Masons
6 Vanilla Town
Tweak it if you have to, but it's clearly the set up that was closest to the "run 3 times" rule used to originally pick set ups (it was run twice in Open Games as is, and twice more with various tweaks, and it was based off of a slightly different set up run by Thesp before the Open Queue existed), and it's clearly a set up that adds something to the approved games list that isn't already there.I replaced into Chess Mafia for 6 months, and all I got was a win and this lousy sig.-
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farside22 Mafia Mum
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I agreeThok wrote:
If you need suggestions for set ups to confirm, please talk about some form of Friends and EnemiesKorts wrote:I'm looking through the old open setup discussion thread for setups worth review; a setup that springs to mind as something that should be explored is Crush.
3 Mafia
3 Masons
6 Vanilla Town
Tweak it if you have to, but it's clearly the set up that was closest to the "run 3 times" rule used to originally pick set ups (it was run twice in Open Games as is, and twice more with various tweaks, and it was based off of a slightly different set up run by Thesp before the Open Queue existed), and it's clearly a set up that adds something to the approved games list that isn't already there.Sarcasm is just a way of saying how stupid you think someone is but in a more polite way.-
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Adel Crystalline Logick
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3 Mafia
3 Masons
x Vanilla Town
which value for x balances this setup?
According to mith's ev spreadsheet in the numbers thread, between 43 and 46 vanilla townies balances out a 3-person scum group... so how many townies is 3 masons worth?
9? 25? 41?
previous runs: Open 78: Friends & Enemies (Over) - before 608 :: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... ds+enemies :: x=6 :: mafia win
Open 63 -- Friends and Enemies 2.0 (Denouement) before 562 :: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... ds+enemies :: x=6 :: mafia win
Open 42 - Friends and Enemies - (Game Over) before 495 :: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... ds+enemies :: x=5 :: mafia win
Open 21 - Friends and Enemies (Game Over), before 453 :: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... ds+enemies :: x=5 :: mafia win
I think the proper x value for a 3 player scumgroup should be much higher. I think we should certify a 2-scum variant first.
2 mafia goons
2 masons
x townies
EV for 2 scum is between 20 and 24 townies.
I don't like using EV like this, the numbers are so counter-intuitive to me.
My educated guess is that 2 masons in this set-up are worth ~5 townies, which would yield between 15 and 19 townies, and two scum, for a 17 to 21 player game.-
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mith Godfather
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As a quick back-of-the-envelope type of calculation, 3:3:5 has an EV of around 21% if the masons claim immediately. It is almost certainly better for them to not claim immediately, and I'd guess the EV is closer to 30%.
2:2:7 should be reasonable, I would think. 2:9 already has an acceptable EV of 35.21%, and the masons might bump that a bit. If you're aiming for 50-50, 2:2:13 is probably about right.-
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shaft.ed dem.agogue
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Max Mafia Scum
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Adel Crystalline Logick
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which is the same as the EV for 3:16 or 3:17, so 3 masons are worth ~11 townies? Then 40-11=29, so 3:3:18 would be about 50%? Am I doing this right?mith wrote:As a quick back-of-the-envelope type of calculation, 3:3:5 has an EV of around 21% if the masons claim immediately. It is almost certainly better for them to not claim immediately, and I'd guess the EV is closer to 30%.
I wish we would figure out what the "acceptable" range is. I've been shooting for 50-50 for two faction games. If we are going to make progress on the multiball (three faction) games I thin we first need to figure out what the target EV for each faction is.2:2:7 should be reasonable, I would think. 2:9 already has an acceptable EV of 35.21%, and the masons might bump that a bit. If you're aiming for 50-50, 2:2:13 is probably about right.
nominate 2:2:11for friends an enemies. I estimate the town will have a >40% EV, and could easily be higher in practice.-
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mith Godfather
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I would avoid trying to put things in terms of "How many Townies is this role/group worth?". It's not that simple. The strength of the Mason group depends on how many Mafia/Townies there are. For that matter, the worth of additional Townies depends on how big the game already was (but the strengths of the Mason group and the Townies don't diminish at the same rate).
2:2:7 is probably already 40%. As a better strategy than the Masons coming out immediately, we can just pick a random player, have them claim, if they claim townie, lynch them, if they claim Mason we ask for a counter; if there is a counter, we ask the original claim to verify by outing their buddy (Mafia won't ever fake this unless it somehow gets to 2:2:1, since it's a instant loss for them; for that matter, they won't ever counter either, but this is just to be safe). Would need a bit of adjustment for endgame, but should still be a significant improvement. I'll see if I can work out the exact EV for this sort of setup when I am a little more inspired.
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