Mini 734 - GrimMafia - OVER

[Zachrulez]

Bottom line: My opinion hasn't changed. Further arguing along these lines probably won't get it to change, frankly; and in the interest of interest (mine, yours, and others') I'd rather ask who you would rather replace yourself with in my scumteam of you, B_B, and P.Mo. People generally don't read wallposts unless they have to, anyway, so I wouldn't consider it pro-Town to turn this into a Wall War. And besides, didn't you say that you were more interested in lynching scum than clearing yourself?

3 things here.

1. I thought it was pretty apparent that my top suspects were Spring (Who I was voting for before Pablo.) Beyond Birthday, and Pablo. Not that you'd notice since you've gone out of your way to tell me how I've apparently been thinking and acting and strategizing as hyposcum...

2. In retrospect, the wagon on Zero was probably scum driven. (Well duh, my top suspects were on that wagon.) I just love how I apparently argued that the wagon wasn't scum driven, simply because I challenged the assertion that it wasn't for a sure thing. I just love arguments that are made presuming I knew Zero's alignment at a point in the game before it was known. MAYBE I DIDN'T AND THINKING HE WAS SCUM I PRESUMED THAT SCUM WOULDN'T ACTUALLY VOTE FOR HIM. It's not like people were calling the wagon scum ridden and trying to put as much distance as they could from the lynch before it actually went through. (Take a guess at who those people were.)

3. Oh lord, retaliating your text walls with text walls of my own is not pro town?... well it's not like that's hypocritical in the least since you hit me with 2 text walls of your own. (Note my responses to your text wall were generally pretty short and to the point, and it's you own typing in the quotes that makes my response look so lengthy. But whatever. I try to keep my text wall posts to a minimum anyway.)

Yeah... I'm frustrated.

[Beyond_Birthday]

....
Assuming that was an actual day kill, you know who I think the scum team is. Later, if there is a later.

*stands here, waiting to be blown apart in the snow like Rorshach by Dr. Manhattan.*

[hasdgfas]

....
Assuming that was an actual day kill, you know who I think the scum team is. Later, if there is a later.

*stands here, waiting to be blown apart in the snow like Rorshach by Dr. Manhattan.*

still catching up, just wanted to make a note here:

Vi "daykills" anyone who calls him/her(I'm still not sure with all the avatar switching. What is your current avi, anyway?) VI, because VI is village idiot.

*goes back to catching up*

[Vi]

1. I thought it was pretty apparent that my top suspects were Spring (Who I was voting for before Pablo.) Beyond Birthday, and Pablo. Not that you'd notice since you've gone out of your way to tell me how I've apparently been thinking and acting and strategizing as hyposcum...

You say "hyposcum" like it's ludicrous to suggest anyone's Mafia until they flip.
Anyway, yes, I don't tend to notice these things after wallposting. My fault entirely~

So let's fix that. Your case on springlullaby - and correct me if I'm wrong somewhere along the way - looks like this.

*Called to lynch Ectomancer on Page 1 (#2). Joke stage, weak, moving on.

*Argued for a quicklynch D1 (#s 5 and 6). This wasn't much of an accusation, but it WAS unusual for springlullaby to suggest it. I don't usually see people arguing bad theory (if it is bad theory) as scummy more than ignorant (or in this case, something else - see next point), so.

-~This part needs its own section~-

*Pseudo-OMGUSd JereIC after calling his points circular (#10). Without reading JereIC's points much (considering when I started reading, JereIC was suffering from lingering death), springlullaby's vote and her follow-up to it initially looked scummy. However, after actually reading the exchange between JereIC and springlullaby (novel idea, I know), I don't find springlullaby's position to be scummy.

**JereIC: Unvoting springlullaby. Fourth vote on Page 2 is bad.
**springl: Why? Quicklynches are great for Town!
**JereIC: (reasons) Why do you want a quicklynch?
**springl: I don't; nobody does. Dunno why you made such a deal of unvoting.
**JereIC: Didn't want to risk it. Change of subject: Zer0, yes or no?
**springl: What kind of--k guys, JereIC is trying to duck out of this one.
**JereIC: LIES. springl is active lurking, thought she would be quicklynched and/or Ectomancer would be quicklynched, and made that argument to knock the game off-topic. (lolno, that argument came after the wagon on her)
**springl: lolwut I was trying to quicklynch Ectomancer? (this is probably referring to the pregame voting spree, where springl placed a third vote on Ectomancer out of seven necessary. The same thing happened after the game officially began)
**JereIC: Oh look, spring's protecting Zer0-scum. If Zer0 flips scum, springl's next.
**springl: Lining up lynches much? And how am I protecting Zer0?
**JereIC: Well, you keep saying "oh he's scummy" when you haven't commented on the actual case against him, and you keep sidetracking the discussion from him.
**springl: LIES. I've said more than you have (in spite of the little springl had mentioned about Zer0, this is actually true), and furthermore you're presuming he's scum - why?
**JereIC: No you haven't. *evidence*
(repeat previous two lines a few times; springl votes JereIC)
**B_B: If Zer0 is an idiot Townie, then the "your case is invalid because it presupposes Zer0 is scum" arguments from springl is false (huh?); vote springl.
**Zach: I see who's winning this argument. spring is scum.

Sorry for the wall of history. I will readily concede that if Zer0 flipped scum, springl should be under much, much more scrutiny. But beside that last part, I don't see springl's side of the argument as unreasonable.

-~Back to your case vs. springlullaby~-

*"Demanded" you explain yourself (#12). I'm not even going to touch this one.

*Apparent faux desire to lynch Zer0phe4r (#14). Not a terrible point, as she goes from "anyone's guess" -> "will vote to get rid of him" -> ambiguous "what do you mean I haven't discussed him?" -> "anyone's guess". This isn't something I can't see a Townie doing (changing their mind or backtracking after saying something impulsive), but it's not immaterial for an accusation.

*Applied some degree of newbie defense to the Zer0 wagon (distancing) (#21). If anything, this is a positive regardless (though Town and scum are known to do this and it's not a strong indication of alignment). Plus the fact that Zer0 actually came up Town kinda knocks the wind out of this.

*Negative points: zwet tried to advance springlullaby-scum on the basis of the JereIC kill (#40). But zwet flipped Town, so this doesn't mean much now.

*Called lurkers at LyLo by voting them instead of letting them get modkilled (#s 52 and #60). If you play Mafia on other sites where inactives suicide for the sake of game speed (EpicMafia is an example), then I can see where this would be coming from. But modkilling basically everyone except you, B_B, and springlullaby - do you see this as a good idea? It's LyLo. Mass modkills were reasonably likely to end the game right there, or at least put Town into a worse position. To be fair, I don't see pressure voting flakers to be a very good idea either (since pressure is for people who can respond to it, obviously). The best answer to this is to get them replaced ASAP, but because of the Awesome modding in this game, I can see why that was not necessarily viewed as an option. I think the best thing to do with this is drop it altogether as an argument against anyone.

*Apparent "fake fighting" between springlullaby and Ectomancer ending on Page 6 (#65). The actual

fighting

ended ~Page 2, but I see that springl and Ectomancer were working in something like a collusion around Page 4. It's a halfway decent start to a case, but hardly good by itself.

Conclusion: You probably weren't expecting me to say otherwise, but I'm not convinced.

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===
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I just love how I apparently argued that the wagon wasn't scum driven, simply because I challenged the assertion that it wasn't for a sure thing. I just love arguments that are made presuming I knew Zero's alignment at a point in the game before it was known. MAYBE I DIDN'T AND THINKING HE WAS SCUM I PRESUMED THAT SCUM WOULDN'T ACTUALLY VOTE FOR HIM.

Seeing a wagon balloon like that is kind of an obvious tell.
Meanwhile, you mean to tell me that you had enough evidence to tunnel on Zer0 relatively early into D1 (126) to the point of suggesting that his wagon was entirely Town-driven (201)?

It's not like people were calling the wagon scum ridden and trying to put as much distance as they could from the lynch before it actually went through. (Take a guess at who those people were.)

springlullaby and Nuwen, correct? One of them flipped Town already. Moreover, since Zer0 flipped Town, I think it would count as credit TOWARD springlullaby for delaying the wagon.
Besides, someone like Zer0 would be highly bussable anyway (would YOU want him on your scumteam?).

Oh lord, retaliating your text walls with text walls of my own is not pro town?... well it's not like that's hypocritical in the least since you hit me with 2 text walls of your own. (Note my responses to your text wall were generally pretty short and to the point, and it's you own typing in the quotes that makes my response look so lengthy. But whatever. I try to keep my text wall posts to a minimum anyway.)

Hmm... Fair point. All right, let Vipoleon change the edict a bit.
You can type up a defense; that's just fair. However, after that last wall I have some serious doubt that it will change my mind and I'm not up for going through a series of walls that will also not change my mind.
I would also reiterate the point that nobody actually reads walls unless they have to, and thus minimizing them is pro-Town; but first we actually need people to read and comment on the game, so I'll retract that.

(Yes, I see this is also a wall. But most of it's about springlullaby, who is a different subject and worth the investigation besides.)

-----

What is your current avi, anyway?

Mia the Swordmaster, from Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn. It's my third avatar in a row of a Mia.

-----

Setael. 'Still here?

Looker. Quit being lurkerscum. You're throwing off my Infallible Scum Predictions.
Alternatively, keep it up and I won't have any problems changing my course for the day and voting you.

[Zachrulez]

I've spent a few posts simply defending myself from Vi, and continuing to do that probably ain't going to get us anywhere.

I'm going to be relatively busy over the next few days, but as time allows, I'll be doing an analysis of Beyond_Birthday's play. (I've been debating whether or not I should actually be voting him over Pablo)

Then probably a general look at my other suspects before I decide what to do.

[Vi]

Was my analysis of your case vs. springlullaby accurate-ish (regarding the facts of the matter)?

[Zachrulez]

I would have to say so.

The main reason I voted her earlier in the day was that I was alarmed that at the sudden desire to lurker hunt in a lylo situation.

The mass modkill discussion stuff was a complete mess, and to be fair, something we shouldn't have even had to consider as a possibility. (Mods shouldn't be modkilling over replacing, but since this mod saw fit to have night last 2 weeks, neither the game, nor arguing with the mod about it were high priorities for me...)

[Beyond_Birthday]

....
Assuming that was an actual day kill, you know who I think the scum team is. Later, if there is a later.

*stands here, waiting to be blown apart in the snow like Rorshach by Dr. Manhattan.*

still catching up, just wanted to make a note here:

Vi "daykills" anyone who calls him/her(I'm still not sure with all the avatar switching. What is your current avi, anyway?) VI, because VI is village idiot.

*goes back to catching up*

Ah, in that case, excuse the capitalizing error. (However, I feel relatively certain day vig is, as the sole "odd role," allowed in normal games, so I was like: Well, I can sign up elsewhere, I 'spose.)

On the Vi analysis: Would you say that you conclude that Spring is fairly ambiguous in play but roughly pro town? (This is my read of her from earlier, though not as detailed as yours.)

At Zach: *hm...*

At people who appear to actually be playing at the moment:

Okay, we're in a mislynch and lose situation. Would it be better to nolynch?
I'm considering that we're at a point where 3/8 people are probably mafia. Therefore, about half the town is mafia. I'm thinking tomorrow, assuming only one kill, 3/7 is slightly better odds and holds the same consequences for mislynch as we have today. From my perspective, this makes sense, and I understand that mafia theory on the site typically claims no lynching is a bad move for town, but mathematically, I think it can only help. (Unless mafia decide to no kill, but I doubt they gain anything from a no lynch.)

I'll make a case tomorrow, just felt like posting this right now.

[Vi]

(However, I feel relatively certain day vig is, as the sole "odd role," allowed in normal games, so I was like: Well, I can sign up elsewhere, I 'spose.)

I know I'd use it

On the Vi analysis: Would you say that you conclude that Spring is fairly ambiguous in play but roughly pro town? (This is my read of her from earlier, though not as detailed as yours.)

Stronger than that, but that's the basic idea.

At Zach: *hm...*

Exceptionally detailed survey of the situation, O Psycho.

At people who appear to actually be playing at the moment:

Okay, we're in a mislynch and lose situation. Would it be better to nolynch?
I'm considering that we're at a point where 3/8 people are probably mafia. Therefore, about half the town is mafia. I'm thinking tomorrow, assuming only one kill, 3/7 is slightly better odds and holds the same consequences for mislynch as we have today. From my perspective, this makes sense, and I understand that mafia theory on the site typically claims no lynching is a bad move for town, but mathematically, I think it can only help. (Unless mafia decide to no kill, but I doubt they gain anything from a no lynch.)

Assuming no bussing (though that's not a reasonable assumption), it still takes every Townie to band together and lynch scum regardless. The only difference is how many Townies are there to band together. Further, the advantage to No Lynch is minimized if there's one person who isn't being considered at all as a suspect. Last, No Lynching deprives whatever Town power roles may be left from saving the game in the event that we mislynch (i.e. Doc protects). If that happened, I'd consider it an advantage that the person picked off for the seven-person LyLo was chosen by Town (via lynch) and not the Mafia.

So in short, I think No Lynch would benefit us most IF we have no clue who the scum are. I don't think that's the case here.

[Looker]

Well excuse me! Exactly what answer were you looking for, Vi? A scummy one...?

unvote

[Vi]

Well excuse me! Exactly what answer were you looking for, Vi? A scummy one...?

unvote

It wasn't what I was looking for, but it's certainly what I got.

[Setael]

Sorry I've been absent - super busy week.

I also would like an explanation from looker. If the only reason you voted me was to pressure me, why unvote before I responded?

Pablo, why are you hiding?

Looker, what do you think of pablo? What is your opinion of the case I made.

Looker AND pablo, what do you think of Zachrulez?

[Zachrulez]

Okay, we're in a mislynch and lose situation. Would it be better to nolynch?
I'm considering that we're at a point where 3/8 people are probably mafia. Therefore, about half the town is mafia. I'm thinking tomorrow, assuming only one kill, 3/7 is slightly better odds and holds the same consequences for mislynch as we have today. From my perspective, this makes sense, and I understand that mafia theory on the site typically claims no lynching is a bad move for town, but mathematically, I think it can only help. (Unless mafia decide to no kill, but I doubt they gain anything from a no lynch.)

I hadn't actually thought about the possibility of a no lynch.

I don't really see how it's going to help us though. The way I see it, no lynching is only going to further dilute the town's voting power and increase the scum's influence on getting a mislynch.

The whole argument of narrowing the field is kinda ridiculous anyway as the scum are likely going to kill the person that town considers least likely to be scum anyway.

So... I think I'd prefer that there be a lynch, even if it's me.

[Beyond_Birthday]

Okay, we're in a mislynch and lose situation. Would it be better to nolynch?
I'm considering that we're at a point where 3/8 people are probably mafia. Therefore, about half the town is mafia. I'm thinking tomorrow, assuming only one kill, 3/7 is slightly better odds and holds the same consequences for mislynch as we have today. From my perspective, this makes sense, and I understand that mafia theory on the site typically claims no lynching is a bad move for town, but mathematically, I think it can only help. (Unless mafia decide to no kill, but I doubt they gain anything from a no lynch.)

I hadn't actually thought about the possibility of a no lynch.

I don't really see how it's going to help us though. The way I see it, no lynching is only going to further dilute the town's voting power and increase the scum's influence on getting a mislynch.

The whole argument of narrowing the field is kinda ridiculous anyway as the scum are likely going to kill the person that town considers least likely to be scum anyway.

So... I think I'd prefer that there be a lynch, even if it's me.

Hm, I see Vi (and your's, quoted) point. Okay, just wondering why this was unsuggested other than standard mafia theory.

Moving on:
Looker: What the hell? There have been several theories on scum and you post a one liner about one point that took up maybe 1/1000th of the content?

*head desk* If the lurkers are mafia, I honestly think that I will shoot my foot. (Not because I believe they are not mafia, but because that if lurkers (except one/two) are mafia, the town is biting its head off in our current predicament.

[Vi]

*passes microphone to Cow*

[Grimmy]

Thanks to Vi's use of

Dayquil

, everyone in this game has no reason to fear any of the following:
Nasal congestion
Cough due to minor throat and bronchial irritation
Sore throat
Headache
Minor aches and pains
Fever

So the game can continue.

Ill post a vote count after I submit a report at work.

Grimmy
the Nyquil....now THATS a b*tch....

[Zachrulez]

From the looks of Beyond's play today he spent the beginning of the day suspicious of Pablo, but not suspicious enough to vote. I guess the feeling is that Pablo's been lazy through the game like him.

He jumps around on suspicions a bit. Seeming to think Spring is scummy enough for a vote one second, and then not scum the next. This leads to an interesting situation where Beyond responds to my 530 by voting for Spring, then doing an analysis of Spring and unvoting her. (Shouldn't you have done the analysis FIRST?)

Something similar to this happened on day 1, where Beyond started by going after Zero, changing his vote to Spring, and then doing his turnaround and once again voting for Zero.

I am finding it strange how beyond constantly finds himself aimed at Spring, but when the time comes to actually back up a case, back to the popular bandwagon. On day 1 this was Zero. On day 3, with the strength, size and veracity of Vi's case against me, he suddenly decides to adapt to the replacement and find me scummy despite the fact that he practically declared me town earlier.

At this point, I'm feeling a Pablo/Beyond team quite strongly... and I wouldn't be surprised if someone weird that I haven't seriously suspected was scum with them.

I'd take a lynch of either Pablo or Beyond today. (Still feeling slightly better about a Pablo lynch, mainly because knowing I'm town and presuming Setael is as well, I have to wonder why Pablo wouldn't have been run up by scum yet...)

Other recent observations: Beyond seems to feel that I'm the top scum candidate (564) as per his most recent list that I'm on the top of, but apparently not strongly enough to risk pushing my lynch over proposing a no lynch. (582) (Does he know I'll flip town?)

When that idea doesn't fly, he starts pushing the theory that MAYBE the lurkers are scum. (588)

I see a lot of digesting of what is posted from Beyond, and then a general regurgitation of the most recently posted thoughts and Beyond tends to try to adapt to what is the fashionable topic of discussion at the particular point in time.

[Vi]

You would think with the amount P. Molinero's name has been thrown about, he would show up to say SOMETHING.

*blatant call-out #2 for the day*

[Beyond_Birthday]

From the looks of Beyond's play today he spent the beginning of the day suspicious of Pablo, but not suspicious enough to vote. I guess the feeling is that Pablo's been lazy through the game like him.

He jumps around on suspicions a bit. Seeming to think Spring is scummy enough for a vote one second, and then not scum the next. This leads to an interesting situation where Beyond responds to my 530 by voting for Spring, then doing an analysis of Spring and unvoting her. (Shouldn't you have done the analysis FIRST?)

Something similar to this happened on day 1, where Beyond started by going after Zero, changing his vote to Spring, and then doing his turnaround and once again voting for Zero.

I am finding it strange how beyond constantly finds himself aimed at Spring, but when the time comes to actually back up a case, back to the popular bandwagon. On day 1 this was Zero. On day 3, with the strength, size and veracity of Vi's case against me, he suddenly decides to adapt to the replacement and find me scummy despite the fact that he practically declared me town earlier.

At this point, I'm feeling a Pablo/Beyond team quite strongly... and I wouldn't be surprised if someone weird that I haven't seriously suspected was scum with them.

I'd take a lynch of either Pablo or Beyond today. (Still feeling slightly better about a Pablo lynch, mainly because knowing I'm town and presuming Setael is as well, I have to wonder why Pablo wouldn't have been run up by scum yet...)

Other recent observations: Beyond seems to feel that I'm the top scum candidate (564) as per his most recent list that I'm on the top of, but apparently not strongly enough to risk pushing my lynch over proposing a no lynch. (582) (Does he know I'll flip town?)

When that idea doesn't fly, he starts pushing the theory that MAYBE the lurkers are scum. (588)

I see a lot of digesting of what is posted from Beyond, and then a general regurgitation of the most recently posted thoughts and Beyond tends to try to adapt to what is the fashionable topic of discussion at the particular point in time.

*Shrugs* I agreed with your point on Spring. I voted her and decided to follow it up afterward because I know at one point I suspected Spring and then later recanted, I did another analysis. See later for the dilemma I have.

Wrong. Being at the top of my list is meaningless.

What idea?

Well, if the lurkers arn't scum, I'm forced to conclude that some people, who I felt relatively certain are town, are very likely to be scum.

Your last statement: To be fair, this may or may not be a fair ascertainment of my play, but this is not how I literally process things.

Okay, my dilemma:

Archeon - Springlullaby: I can say that I have long term suspicion of Spring where I will be legitimately certain she is scum, but when I express this (see day 1) it comes out as non sense or barely coherent. Then, I reread, and find her play to be amiable. I guess the issue is that her play has been so "town/scum" that I cannot read her, and thus, have an issue pursuing her as a lynch.
Beyond Birthday: The serial killer. I just know this, you know?
Vi: Eh, Skillit and hero did nothing to really sway me either way. Vi looks town to me, and his cases have been strong and relatively free from bias. I disagree with his conclusion that I'm scum, but he has several good points against Zach. Also, his agreement with Setael with Pablo (and Pablo's reaction to disappear) makes the two of them seem mildly tied, but each presenting a valid opinion.
Pablo Molinero: Setael's case is very convincing and this is probably who I'm going to vote.
Hasdqfas: Per, no idea. Wolf came in like a slightly pro town player. Has has made no posts.
Zachrulez: Oh so much. I can see Zach as very skilled scum who is suddenly flustered (mildly) by Vi's attack. Zach's target was Springlullaby, which, given his thoughts, made her seem a sensible enough lynch for the day. However, his latest posts make it seem that he is primarily interested in having someone lynched other than him. I have a vague feeling that Zach/spring is scum, but not both together.
Looker: Ugh... I dunno on sips or looker. I just don't know.
Seteal: Hm... Ecto seemed really town, but I can somewhat see Seteal as scum if Spring were scum, but overall, I kind of doubt it.

So:
Spring/Zach (Dilemma 1)
Pablo (Pseudo Dilemma)
Third scum is...
Setael, Vi, looker, has: So either 1/2 lurkers or 1/2 "town" people. (Dilemma 2)

THe good news is that after doing this list:

Vote Pablo

He seems like best bet for scum as he looks definitive (as one of the scum as I've outlined.)
I think I slightly suspect Zach more than Spring, but I wouldn't have any idea who the third would be.

[Setael]

BB - you tied me to Vi AND Spring in that post without backing it up. I have a problem with this since I have reason to suspect both of them. So if one of them come up scum (which I actually find likely), after your last post you could then point fingers squarely at me without ever giving a reason. Please be more specific so I can tell you why you're wrong. What makes you suspect a Vi/me and a Spring/me scumpair? Please answer this without parroting others' arguments. I happen to think zach has a point about a lot of your posts.

[Vi]

BB - you tied me to Vi (...) in that post without backing it up. I have a problem with this since I have reason to suspect (...) them.

Well this is news to me.

[Archon]

Vi, why should I not vote for you?
Scum can sometimes be some of the most posting people, and you certainly have posted allot.

FOS: Setael, for not posting for almost a week.

[Zachrulez]

Vi, why should I not vote for you?
Scum can sometimes be some of the most posting people, and you certainly have posted allot.

FOS: Setael, for not posting for almost a week.

So you have threatened a vote on an active player while FOSing one for the opposite reason?

Isn't that a tad contradictory?

[Pablo Molinero]

Man, I'm tied to BB/Zach by Vi, Spring/Zach by BB, and Spring/BB by Zach as a buddy. Anyone see something wrong with this? In my experience, people agreeing is never, ever a good thing. Either epic bussing is happening (very unlikely at presumed LyLo), or ya'll are wrong. Think about it.

----

Well, for one, I've been moving from Dayton to Columbus to Cincinnati in the past week. (Like, moving, moving, not just driving to and from). Would it be better if I just popped in with a "sorry busy week, lol" and went away? As for when I'm not moving about the state, "Hiding" isn't really an apt word for my behavior, methinks, more frustration and apathy with all the fukkin' replacements and never really getting "into" the game, so I never established any momentum.

(Thanks for your 562, Vi, so I know who the hell is who and who was on the wagons)

As for your other question Setael question about Zach, I'm finding him scummy from both Vi's (high protown player sofar) arguments and his recent "I'd like a lynch, even if it's me" noble-bullshit attitude WHEN WE'RE AT LYLO. No logical town would say that seriously, so I'm highly suspecting that it's just an act.

Vote: zachrulez

Beyond's recent behavior does nothing to inspire confidence (how the hell am I potential buddies to these two, Vi??) in that Zach expresses his desire for a Pablo or BB lynch and BB is quite quickly on the Pablo train. Cause and effect.

[Vi]

I feel like I should

Unvote: Zachrulez

for the moment until I evaluate what has been said since I came in...

Unofficial vote count. Votes are probably in reverse order or something.

Pablo Molinero (L-2) ~ Beyond_Birthday, Setael, Zachrulez
Zachrulez (L-4) ~ Pablo Molinero

Not Voting: Looker, Archon, hasdgfas, Vi

Contentful post to come when I'm less busy...