Mini 729 - WaTR Mafia - Game Over!

[tubby216]

yup

---

Mod-Edit Votecount 2-15

Freeko - 3 (BSG, Raider, tubby)
BSG - 1 (freeko)
Juls - 1 (Vi)
Rhinox - 1 (Korts)

Not Voting - 4 (afatchic, Rhinox, Juls, TonyMontana)

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

Deadline is in 4 Days, in case you happen to be wondering.

[raider8169]

but i do think freeko scum.

You know what. Aside from me wanting to be lynched and out of this game so I can join another one elsewhere. What possible evidence could you have to substantiate this?

Can you counter my claim? That would be a quick way to see that I am lying.

I am full well convinced that its the scum plan to lynch me today. Then when its (most likely lylo) tomorrow Vi gets it, becuase I wasnt scum so their speculation would simply be that Vi obviously was the scum.. though I am pretty certain that neither of us are. I can only speak for myself on that one.

So in the end you are saying that you are going to lynch a confirmed neighbor with no counter or reason to even think that I am scum. Except thats the scum plan for the day so you are just going to stick to it.

Outstanding.

Confirmed neighbor I will give you. What is not confirmed is if you are town or scum. It has already been brought that you both could be scum, town or one of each. Reguardless this lynch is not based on guessing that you are scum or trying to outguess the mod. Or I should say atleast I am not voting you for those reasons. Yes I was thinking that but you have shown no intention for helping out town and instead you just want to lynch anyone as long as it is not yourself.

Reguardless of what you flip that does not seal the coffin for Vi. If you say you think Vi is town and you flip town then that would mean something. If you say Vi is town and you flip scum then it would mean nothing. If Vi was to be lynched, there would be a real case and everyone would be able to chime in. It would not be just because freeko was lynched Vi is next.

[raider8169]

yup

Care to add anything to this? What was the point in just posting that?

[tubby216]

yup

Care to add anything to this? What was the point in just posting that?

to acknowledge i read it.


i will have more later, but i just wanted to show i was reading and this game has my attention

[freeko]

It would not be just because freeko was lynched Vi is next.

This is the problem. Lynching me when you know I am MUCH more likely to be town than scum, is absolutely retarded. Its also the scum's plan to win the game. This I am certain of.

Yes I was thinking that but you have shown no intention for helping out town and instead you just want to lynch anyone as long as it is not yourself.

Umm.. right. For the record I am the ONLY person to be actively playing this game the entire time so far. Excuse me for reaching a bit when less than half the people in the game actually btoher to play it.

I will say this. I no longer have any desire to play this game. I will replace out if I last the day. I dont want to waste my time arguing with tubby over whats more retarded, his play or his self.

[tubby216]

early day one

Raider, my mason partner gave ME away actually. We are actually what looks to be 3rd party masons. Our victory condition (at least mine) is simply to get to the town alive on day 6.

I also have the town win condition of winning when all scum are found.

It is unknown to me what PK's alignment is.

Personally, I dont see how my role is a "power" role. The only thing I have is the ability to talk with someone else during the night phase.

note the bolded part, throwing in town win condition part seems fake. kinda like "gee my win condition is other than town so i better throw this in there". if you are not scum then at best you are survivor esq.

occum questions it then we get this

I don't think you're missing something, I think it's a bullcrap claim.

Then how stupid will you look after I am dead either by lynch or NK? Its not like I can really hide anything at this point.

appeal to emotion wether making someone fell bad for you or callin them a moron is bad mmmkay?

yeah, I dont get it. You could

unvote

just like that.

but then you coudnt do this

vote: monkey man

I dont get it how you could POSSIBLY keep your vote on a claimed mason. I certainly dont see anyone trying to counter my claims or disputing my alignment. As much as I dont horribly care for Occam, you gotta go.

do you see what you did there?? more appeal/bullying

then at the end of day you set this up

I think it was 7 to lynch, but his role only required 6 (regular number -1). When I die tonight, at least promise me you take korts or RS to visit me ASAP. they cant be team players when they run off and make decsicions without our consent.

its a wifom trap, i don't like this play either.

day 2

FFS.. I will say this one last time. Its a flavor of my role , that I have coem to realize is misinterpreted (by me) to be an alternate win condition. It says that I am only interested in getting to the town in the flavor, and the rules state that I get to the town at the beginning of day 6.

As for my partnber BEFORE Vi came in.. I think Vi put it about right that he was retarded... and inactive. Also the game started right when the site crashed and was moved to a new host, so that kinda hindered things slightly.

I have already said EVERYTHING in my role pm now without directly quoting it. And I made it clear already that it is said that I am to be wary of him. Again not helped by the brainless retard outburst from PK that caused this whole thing to start.

If you want even more, too bad. I cant give it to you because that would mean a verbatim quote of my role pm, I cannot do that.

so you blame your pickle on a poor partner? bad form just because you were tryin to set up a gambit in wich you clear both yourself and your partner and he diddn't play along you get all bitter? {reader notes i still need to read vi/pk and will do so when this is complete}

Oh, that im a sheep weaksauce? Yeah great. Thats a load of crap. I fail to see how being a sheep has any bearing on the game at all. Especially with how it relates to the supposed night watch that Korts did on Night 1.

Why not tell us what your role is?

youwere joking with this right but more to the point its the start or around the start of all this sheep talk that has been goin about for most of the day and detracting from actual scum hunting, wich freeko continue's to feed through countless attacks on korts and others. basically it goes like this. blah blah blah sheep this sheep that, korts is scum this guy is scum sheep this sheep that.


so to sum it all up freeko your attacks or your scum hunting as you call it is fail. Its nothing more than you callin everyone who is not you a moron and attempting to dominate the topic of disscussion, plus add in a lil fear about lylo and engame wich i believe we are no where near right now. i do not like your playstyle, i find logic flawed, and i believe you need to hang for it.

[tubby216]

I will say this. I no longer have any desire to play this game. I will replace out if I last the day. I dont want to waste my time arguing with tubby over whats more retarded, his play or his self.

well ok how about this then.

why don't you actually present a case or something other than call m e a moron?

[Vi]

@Rhinox,

i am voting freeko because i believe his wild posting and accusation are a smoke scree very anti town, I have seen nothing of value come from him yet, if he is town is fail, but i believe him clever scum

Clever...

right.

freeko, when's the last time someone's mentioned that one of us HAS to be scum? (Answer: raider 651... where he said he WOULDN'T say that. The time before that was Juls 612. The time before that was Korts a long time ago IIRC

*lazy*

) I'm fairly positive I can take care of myself; the people in this game are generally rational and speaking frankly they can't ALL be scum. I think you can drop the fears about me getting quicklynched now.

I agree with Korts and Juls re: tubby and freeko. Maybe it was just the segment of GFAQs that I was on three years ago, but I can't remember the last time I've seen commentary like what's going on here. (At least, not from people who weren't immediately banned.)

TonyMontana: I got lost somewhere. Are you white and

nerdy

fluffy, or not?

This is the problem.

Lynching me when you know I am MUCH more likely to be town than scum,

is absolutely retarded. Its also the scum's plan to win the game. This I am certain of.

freeko... Realize that one of the few reasons people think you're more likely Town is because I said so... judging your reaction in a private and currently unverifiable QuickTopic... and I've been known to be very wrong before.
I've already mentioned that while the Mafia would gladly take your mislynch - if it IS a mislynch - you're essentially

handing them all the reasons they need to vote you and convince others to do so too.

Right now your head is so big that the halo you think you have is actually around your neck like a noose.

Now if you'll excuse me for changing the subject, our merry band of replacements needs to decide who's worth lynching (other than that guy). The time spent sighing at the sideshow is time lost with 3.5 days left before the deadline. Notice my vote is still on Juls, where I like it.

[freeko]

If you bothered to play the game AT ALL, then there might be something. Though you only prove yourself to be a moron more and more. Look at the 3rd quote, then the 4th. This shows you arent even looking in the thread at all and only looking at your scumbuddy cue cards in the quick topic. Hell you even admit that you arent even looking at anyone else, much less my neighbor partner UNTIL AFTER this plays out.

So now im thinking this.

unvote

vote: tubby

You seem content to do NOTHING but sit on the sidelines and snipe at your marked target. Since you have offered nothing into the game since you started, maybe now would be a good time to start.

[tubby216]

no i am currently reading vi/pk, what i meant was after i make this post

[tubby216]

finished read on vi/pk

vi is town. I have been in enough games with vi to notice viscum and vitown this looks like vitown to me.

[Rhinox]

@Tony: what was your purpose for fake claiming sheep?

I wasn't. The part of taking it back was a joke.

Ok Im confused by this. Why would you joke about that?

Because of my epiphany about there might being someone with an anti-sheep agenda.

Ok Cool. Thanks for clearing that up.

@Rhinox,

i am voting freeko because i believe his wild posting and accusation are a smoke scree very anti town, I have seen nothing of value come from him yet, if he is town is fail, but i believe him clever scum

ok... I was only asking because it seemed you wanted to lynch freeko more out of utility, and not because you thought he was scum. But I also see you laid out a nice case in 655.

I will say this. I no longer have any desire to play this game. I will replace out if I last the day. I dont want to waste my time arguing with tubby over whats more retarded, his play or his self.

Replace out now. I'm sick of your attitude, and your unhelpfulness. And comments like this really piss me off:

For the record I am the ONLY person to be actively playing this game the entire time so far.

Who the fuck do you think you are?

This is the problem. Lynching me when you know I am MUCH more likely to be town than scum, is absolutely retarded.

We DON'T know you are any more likely to be town than scum, let alone MUCH more likely. Your insistance doesn't prove anything.

Its also the scum's plan to win the game. This I am certain of.

How would you be certain of the scum's plan unless you were scum yourself?

Freeko, the only thing you're doing right now is preventing scum hunting, because anybody could vote you right now and not look scummy for doing it. If you were trying to be pro-town, make cohesive cases, cut the sarcasm and crappy analogies, and stopped insulting everybody, then there would be no reason to find you scummy, and it would be easy to find scum if the "master plan" was to force your mislynch, and then Vi's. The way you're playing, you're either

a)paranoid
b)an asshole
c)scum
d)any and all of the above

Setting 2 on the Massclaim Machine is "random", which takes care of this reservation. Dice tags are wonderful for this.

yeah... that makes a mass claim fair for everybody. I want a massclaim to be beneficial to the town, and detrimental to the scum. Thats why I want players I think are scummiest to claim first. One way of doing that is through normal playing and voting someone to L-1. Rinse and repeat if it is a believeable claim.

How did the whole mass claim thing start? I know I said something about it to freeko but I never said we should mass claim. I just meant that at the rate we are going it is going to turn into that before long.

pretty sure we're just talking hypothetically right now.

Mod: if we need to get replacements for freeko, BSG, and/or afatchic, would we be able to extend the deadline to accomodate?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

LT PbPA:

0:

I find it really annoying that you guys are making so much of a fuss about a clearly random, at least for now, choice. Even though it is day one, surely we can find something better to talk about.

Didn't random vote (personal pet peeve of mine). expressed annoyance over the random choice, and said we could find something better to talk about, without suggesting an alternative to talk about. This post basically contains no real content at all - LT was trying to stop 1 line of conversation (preventing conversation is anti-town), while not suggesting anything better to talk about.

1:

@Monkeyman: You seem to be confusing me with Rogue Shenanigans. Maybe.

Another contentless post.

2:

@Monkeyman: Defending the move is just as bad as doing it, if not more so. Like Prom King said, it's unlikely scum would actully choose a path this early, but having someone defend the tactics worries me.

Your whole post and vote assumes that the choice has any kind of bearing on the game. You are very far from being sure of your claims, at least not close enough to make any kind of conclusion and subsequently vote on it. And if you are sure of your claims (and it seems that you are), then you are highly suspicious.

Also I don't like the way you use the word "tactics" in your post, when there was clearly no under-hand mafia scheme but rather a random choice.

Had to think about the broken quote tags. I believe the LT quote in this post was originally lots in the site crash, and I think the rest of the post was MM's response. LT is clearly playing both sides here. On one hand, he says he thinks the choice was random. Then he uses WIFOM reasoning to explain why scum wouldn't make the choice. Finally, he says he's worried about someone defending the choice - which is a way of throwing suspicion both at RS for making the choice, as well as anybody who expressed that the choice didn't matter and didn't find RS scummy for making it.

3:

The only way you could know if there was a scheme or if it was random choice is if you were scum, a townie would not know the difference.

Or maybe the mod told me.

I still assume this was a joke. But, its not pro-town, helpful, or content of any kind.

4:

It there more of a reason for your [MM's] vote then post 66?

What reason is there in post 66?

Post 66 was LT's post #3. i'm assuming raider was asking MM to justify his vote. This comment by LT might be a bit of paranoia - LT seems to think that raider thought post 66 was a good reason for a vote, when its clear (at least to me) that raider was questioning MM because 66 wasn't a good reason and he wanted to know if MM had any better reasons.

After this, LT disapeared and was eventually replaced by afatchic. afatchic has been in for a week now, and how only made 2 posts promising to catch up as quickly as possible. We're less than a week away from deadline now. A week is more than enough time to read the thread, and even if it weren't, a town player should be trying to participate as much as possible to give some input before deadline, and try to catch up on the fly. I get the feeling afatchic is just trying to stall, hope we lynch freeko, and get to the next day without participating at all. Combined with LT's horrible play, I'm wondering if afatchic wouldn't be a bad lynch today. What do you guys think?

Look back at BSG: I want to her exist more, but looking back at her posts, I'm no longer sure she would be a good lynch choice. Nothing up to asking freeko for his flavor name really stuck out to me. While I think asking for flavor is scummy, I think what BSG was doing was checking to see if mason or neighbor was the actual role name in the PM, or if there was an alternate flavor name. BSG explained how MM didn't have a traditional role name, and neither did she. So If Vi and freeko claimed that mason or neighbor was actually what was listed in their PM's, that would indicate they were both lying. I got that feeling from this post:

@Korts
I asked, because the claim has changed a lot. First they were masons, then when Vi comes in, it changed to neighbours. Nothing much, as this could be an honest mistake. But then I thought back of MM's role which was cleric. According to the mod, this meant that he was a doc. My role has also a completely different name than usual. This is most likely the case with everybody.
What I do find odd is that one of them claimed merchant, while the other claimed merchant companion, so I'm not sold yet on either claim.

[Rhinox]

finished read on vi/pk

vi is town. I have been in enough games with vi to notice viscum and vitown this looks like vitown to me.

Can I ask you how many times you've played with Vi, and the how many of the games were vi-scum? how many were vi-town?

[freeko]

Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2009 8:53 am
Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2009 9:52 am
Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2009 10:05 am

So it took you 13 minutes to come to the conclusion that vi is town? Of course you offer up as much evidence to this effect as you do for justifying a vote on me. Even if I gave you the benefit of the doubt from your first post today, thats an hour to read the whole topic over?

Try actually playing the game next time instead of posting something irrelevant. Lurking, skimming, and who knows what else. Excellent scumhunting on your part.

[tubby216]

with out looking i'd say three. but i need to check

[Juls]

@Rhinox: Thank you for the pbpa post. I plan on doing something similar in the next day or so after I finish studying for this test (test is 2 hours away...eek!).

I have a quick question though...I think I missed what you guys were talking about with the massclaim (in the way someone misses an inside joke, not that I didn't see it). Are you guys saying that if there is a massclaim you want to just do a random dice roll (like say from 1 to 12) and the person assigned the rolled number claims?

I am becoming more and more in favor of a mass claim. I am kinda at a loss right now. I have decided to stay away from Vi/freeko and raider/Korts for today at least. I believe you to be town so the only other people are the people who aren't participating as much. Tony and tubby seem to be talking more now though. After I do my pbpa I will give a definitive yay or nay on the whole mass claim thing.

[tubby216]

games i was in with vi

mini 669- vi=scum, tubby=townie result =mod abandoned
newbie 664 vi=townie,tubby=scum result mod cancelled due to wreckage {mis comunication with replacements}
xyl's relative chaos vi= townie, tubby =scum group 2 result scum group 1 {i made it to end game then botched it}

[Vi]

with out looking i'd say three. but i need to check

Newbie 644 - tubby-scum, Vi-town (tubby replaced in for the best Doc claim ever)
Mini 667 - tubby-Town, Vi-scum (this must be a typo, as I'm

never

Mafia)
Xyl's Relative Chaos - tubby-scum, Vi-town (7 out of 15 players were scum in this game; wth Xyl)

Also, Richard Nixon wins post 666 (:P @Korts)

nyaaaaaaaaaaaaa--

I have a quick question though...I think I missed what you guys were talking about with the massclaim (in the way someone misses an inside joke, not that I didn't see it). Are you guys saying that if there is a massclaim you want to just do a random dice roll (like say from 1 to 12) and the person assigned the rolled number claims?

That's the basic idea.

I'm not sure if we need claims from anyone who hasn't already brought their role up (BSG, Korts, raider).

[freeko]

a)paranoid
b)an asshole
c)scum
d)any and all of the above

Nice more mulitple choice. I like those. Again the answer is B. Though if you added in eccentric and arrogant they would both fit in just as well.

[Rhinox]

games i was in with vi

mini 669- vi=scum, tubby=townie result =mod abandoned
newbie 664 vi=townie,tubby=scum result mod cancelled due to wreckage {mis comunication with replacements}
xyl's relative chaos vi= townie, tubby =scum group 2 result scum group 1 {i made it to end game then botched it}

I ask because I also think I have a pretty good meta on Vi based on past games:

Newbie 645 - I was scum, Vi was town
Mini 644 - Both were town
Mafia 87 - I was town, Vi was scum

The only combination I'm missing is where we're both scum. Maybe then I can really get inside Vi's head

Anyways, I can't call Vi town based on my meta, so I find it a little odd for you to so strongly call vi town. What I can tell from this game compared to my other 3 is that Vi isn't playing quite exactly how I would expect Vi-town to play, but I don't see many similarities with how vi-scum played in mafia 87 either (although, that doesn't mean as much because players are more likely to adjust how they play as scum, rather than town, especially after

someone

pegged vi as scum in mafia 87 solely because of meta .

Really though, what I've decided is that my meta of Vi isn't going to help me determine allignment in this game. Can you tell me what parts of Vi's play in this game are consistent with your town meta of Vi?

@freeko:

What makes you assume that tubby only first started to examine Vi at 9:52? What makes you think he only took 13 minutes to read Vi?

[freeko]

Post times tell all. His first of the day was an hour beforehand. I actually yanked the wrong one it should have been the one at 8:56. Nonetheless that was the first post and was a little more than an hour before the riveting evidence that tubby produced in the evaluation of Vi being town. Though I think that whole "I'm gonna look at Vi/Pk now" is shenanigans. Even if he started when he made the first post at 8:53, thats still an hour (which i noted in the beginning) to re-read the entirety of the thread and then go back and look for all the past games.

Between the riveting conclusion that was reached, and the lack of ANY presentation of .. well anything.. I think its safe to assume it was a smoke and mirrors act or skim-job.

@Rhinox: Whats with the trick question on the multiple choice? Letter D is a rather loaded answer isnt it? Seems like something I would be trying to do to you. Any or all of the above? ORLY.

[tubby216]

Post times tell all. His first of the day was an hour beforehand. I actually yanked the wrong one it should have been the one at 8:56. Nonetheless that was the first post and was a little more than an hour before the riveting evidence that tubby produced in the evaluation of Vi being town. Though I think that whole "I'm gonna look at Vi/Pk now" is shenanigans. Even if he started when he made the first post at 8:53, thats still an hour (which i noted in the beginning) to re-read the entirety of the thread and then go back and look for all the past games.

Between the riveting conclusion that was reached, and the lack of ANY presentation of .. well anything.. I think its safe to assume it was a smoke and mirrors act or skim-job.

you do relize you can read players in isolation right??

all you do is select their name at the bottom of the thread and all of their posts in that thread majically appear,

when seeing if a player matches his scum or town meta it is very helpful,
plus i knew vi was town with in his first page of posts, he has a tell and if i inform you of it his tell will dissapear,

and what is your end goal of this why the way to discredit me or vi?

and does this topic clear you or incriminate you?

[freeko]

I actually didnt know you (or anyone) could do that. I learned something just now. Though what good is reading someons posts if you dont also see the context with which they are made? Seems like a great way to make an excuse for misinterpreting something.

Like where you point out my response to korts and calilng it a wifom trap. Completely wrong. I was full well convinced that either myself or PK were going to be nk'd at night at that point. I now realized what the scum plan would most likely be after that. Suffice to say you are fitting into what I believe that plan to be.

My endgoal? Scumhunt, since 5(maybe up to 7) of us actually played for the first 3 weeks of the game day, seems like there is a little catching up to do. So what If I make myself into something of a "red herring" I am done with this game no matter what. More on that later.

Lastly, I dont know.

I do know that this game is a waste of my time. So I dont even care if I am lynched at this point. Im leaving the game irreguardless of how the game day plays out. Since I personally am beyond frustrated with this game and its lack of play. I will at least play the game day out. Its god damn pathetic that the scum will most likely win this game because there will be like 4 posts made by the entirety of the game after I am gone. I even just used the silly search to realize how many people in this game have done absolutely NOTHING in the game.

[Rhinox]

I actually didnt know you (or anyone) could do that. I learned something just now. Though what good is reading someons posts if you dont also see the context with which they are made? Seems like a great way to make an excuse for misinterpreting something.

Like where you point out my response to korts and calilng it a wifom trap. Completely wrong. I was full well convinced that either myself or PK were going to be nk'd at night at that point. I now realized what the scum plan would most likely be after that. Suffice to say you are fitting into what I believe that plan to be.

My endgoal? Scumhunt, since 5(maybe up to 7) of us actually played for the first 3 weeks of the game day, seems like there is a little catching up to do. So what If I make myself into something of a "red herring" I am done with this game no matter what. More on that later.

Lastly, I dont know.

I do know that this game is a waste of my time. So I dont even care if I am lynched at this point. Im leaving the game irreguardless of how the game day plays out. Since I personally am beyond frustrated with this game and its lack of play. I will at least play the game day out. Its god damn pathetic that the scum will most likely win this game because there will be like 4 posts made by the entirety of the game after I am gone. I even just used the silly search to realize how many people in this game have done absolutely NOTHING in the game.

ty;dr

don't let the door hit ya on the ass on the way out.

[BSG]

Responding to prod. As said, I have been busy, however the holidays are starting tomorrow so I should have a post with content tomorrow. But now, I'm going to celebarte 'Carvanal'