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Kison .GIFted
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If anything, what you just suggested is another argument for incompetence among the scum team... The ideal move would have been to save the gun inventor's gun and use the Mafia kill. Because, if they purposely no-killed but instead used the gun, they guaranteed they wasted a kill. On the other hand, if they killed with the Mafia's inherent night kill and withheld use of the gun, they still had a shot of using the gun later and double killing on a single night.
Obviously this assumes the mechanics work traditionally.
So, even if what you suggested is true, the best candidate, in my opinion, for making the blunder of using the gun over the Mafia kill would be afatchic.-
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Ectomancer Mafia Scum
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I dont know that it would have been incompetence. As I said, they may have been concerned about a tracker/watcher being out there and figured if caught out using the gun inventors weapon, no problem. Rather than incompetent, I would say it would be more of a conservative approach. Remember also that it is only my guess that such a weapon would have only a percentage chance of working, but I would be surprised if the mod told the recipient that fact. Now this next part may be incompetence; if they didn't realize that the inventors gun could have a chance of not working, then they probably should have.
I'd like everyone to say which scenario you think the more likely -
1: inventor gun being used in lieu of scum nk and failing
2: Doc/Roleblocker prevented a kill n2 and doesnt want to be forced to claim today
3: Scum was inattentive and didn't send in a kill
I would say that I believe 3 to be the least likely by a wide margin. I'm not certain I believe in 2, but if I did I would believe Korts to be the remaining scum. Option 1 I am not certain who I would hold up as scum. My suspicious mind looks at how Kison ridicules the choice of using the gun instead of a scum kill N2, and actually I feel some truth behind his opinion, but I wonder if the vehemence behind it is because Tubby was Godfather and decided to do it that way over Kison's objections.I have a degree in bullshit. I have patents on entire lines of bullshit. So don't sit here and feed me a line of bullshit and think that I'm not going to recognize it as one.
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Ectomancer Mafia Scum
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Oh yes, I'm spinning stories about anyone or any scenario if it comes into my head. It doesn't mean my compass has settled. I just need several competing ideas and then weed it down to the most likely.I have a degree in bullshit. I have patents on entire lines of bullshit. So don't sit here and feed me a line of bullshit and think that I'm not going to recognize it as one.
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afatchic Mafia Scum
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Comments like this one are really starting to get on my nerves. im not a complete moron, which might be a surprise to some of you.Kison wrote:So, even if what you suggested is true, the best candidate, in my opinion, for making the blunder of using the gun over the Mafia kill would be afatchic.ShowNow taking sign ups:
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Kison .GIFted
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afatchic wrote:
Comments like this one are really starting to get on my nerves. im not a complete moron, which might be a surprise to some of you.Kison wrote:So, even if what you suggested is true, the best candidate, in my opinion, for making the blunder of using the gun over the Mafia kill would be afatchic.
Sorry, I'm not trying to be offensive. I'm not saying that making such a mistake makes you an idiot. I merely think that someone with less time on the site would be more likely to overlook something like this.-
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Adel Crystalline Logick
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I hate hate hate role abilities with random elements. I hope that is not what happened here. I hadn't seriously considered the possibility,and now I have trouble doing so because I find random mechanics so distasteful.Ectomancer wrote:I dont know that it would have been incompetence. As I said, they may have been concerned about a tracker/watcher being out there and figured if caught out using the gun inventors weapon, no problem. Rather than incompetent, I would say it would be more of a conservative approach. Remember also that it is only my guess that such a weapon would have only a percentage chance of working, but I would be surprised if the mod told the recipient that fact. Now this next part may be incompetence; if they didn't realize that the inventors gun could have a chance of not working, then they probably should have.
I'd like everyone to say which scenario you think the more likely -
1: inventor gun being used in lieu of scum nk and failing
2: Doc/Roleblocker prevented a kill n2 and doesnt want to be forced to claim today
3: Scum was inattentive and didn't send in a kill
I would say that I believe 3 to be the least likely by a wide margin. I'm not certain I believe in 2, but if I did I would believe Korts to be the remaining scum. Option 1 I am not certain who I would hold up as scum. My suspicious mind looks at how Kison ridicules the choice of using the gun instead of a scum kill N2, and actually I feel some truth behind his opinion, but I wonder if the vehemence behind it is because Tubby was Godfather and decided to do it that way over Kison's objections.
I think 2 is the most likely. 2 > 3 > 1 for me then.
Tubby, as a grown man and vet, would not be psychologically disposed to vetoing the opinion of a more experienced player.-
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Kison .GIFted
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That's just it, though. Ever since when did watchers and trackers determine the weapon used? Why not just have the recipient of the gun go out and make the kill with the mafia's night kill(assuming that is possible)? What difference would it make from the perspective of the person doing the tracking/watching? But for them, it makes a difference in that using the gun wastes the future use of that kill.Ectomancer wrote:I dont know that it would have been incompetence. As I said, they may have been concerned about a tracker/watcher being out there and figured if caught out using the gun inventors weapon, no problem.
You made a suggestion which I'm assessing, and after my assessment I believe scum would have had far less reason to use the gun over their own kill. I can't really argue that I'm doing this from the perspective of a townie rather than the perspective of scum - I'd probably be saying this regardless of my alignment.Ectomancer wrote:My suspicious mind looks at how Kison ridicules the choice of using the gun instead of a scum kill N2, and actually I feel some truth behind his opinion, but I wonder if the vehemence behind it is because Tubby was Godfather and decided to do it that way over Kison's objections.
Secondly, does tubby216 look like someone who would push to have things his way rather than follow someone else?-
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afatchic Mafia Scum
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would it be a possibility that the mafia can only kill every other night. like n1, n3, n5; and can't kill n0, n2, n4. and maybe the scum got the gun n0/1 and used that last night instead of their scum kill.ShowNow taking sign ups:
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Korts Luddite
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This theory is invalid because there was a kill n4.afatchic wrote:would it be a possibility that the mafia can only kill every other night. like n1, n3, n5; and can't kill n0, n2, n4. and maybe the scum got the gun n0/1 and used that last night instead of their scum kill.
I'm pushing for any possible protective/blocking roles' claims because we are down to five people and any confirmations or implications would be worth outing power roles.
But on the other hand I hadn't considered that perhaps they wouldn't want to claim if their confirmed/implicated targets are dead already.
my list would go 2->3->1. I just don't really see TDC putting random choices into the roles (or if he did, the role PMs would include them). Plus flavorwise it doesn't really make sense for gun inventor guns to be any different from mafia guns.Ecto wrote:I'd like everyone to say which scenario you think the more likely -
1: inventor gun being used in lieu of scum nk and failing
2: Doc/Roleblocker prevented a kill n2 and doesnt want to be forced to claim today
3: Scum was inattentive and didn't send in a killscumchat never die-
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Adel Crystalline Logick
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whenever a town player has information that scum do not have, the potential exists to trap scum. The gun inventor would know who he gave guns to, and therefor who shouldn't have guns, and who shouldn't know that extra guns exist.afatchic wrote:
How could he ttap them in a mass claim? its not scummy to claim that you received a gun, so why would they deny it and get caught.Adel wrote:he could confirm innocents and he possibly could trap scum in a massclaim.-
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Adel Crystalline Logick
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he kinda just went over that. idiotKorts wrote:
This theory is invalid because there was a kill n4.afatchic wrote:would it be a possibility that the mafia can only kill every other night. like n1, n3, n5; and can't kill n0, n2, n4. andmaybe the scum got the gun n0/1 and used that last night instead of their scum kill.
@afatchic: what is your case against Korts?-
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Korts Luddite
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afatchic Mafia Scum
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So would that be allowed, and something we could look at for a bit? i have seen it where scum could only kill on odd/even nights but it was always in open games. however, that may have been what the mod did to offset a mass slaughter with the gun inventor. i need to reread some stuff before i do anything else though...Adel wrote:
he kinda just went over that. idiotKorts wrote:
This theory is invalid because there was a kill n4.afatchic wrote:would it be a possibility that the mafia can only kill every other night. like n1, n3, n5; and can't kill n0, n2, n4. andmaybe the scum got the gun n0/1 and used that last night instead of their scum kill.ShowNow taking sign ups:
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Ectomancer Mafia Scum
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You really want to discourage the idea of a misfiring gun for explaining no kill on N2. You also seem to want to push to find the player that might have blocked/protected that night. You almost have me convinced, but only because I am coming to believe that you know such a role exists because you were blocked.Korts wrote:my list would go 2->3->1. I just don't really see TDC putting random choices into the roles (or if he did, the role PMs would include them). Plus flavorwise it doesn't really make sense for gun inventor guns to be any different from mafia guns.I have a degree in bullshit. I have patents on entire lines of bullshit. So don't sit here and feed me a line of bullshit and think that I'm not going to recognize it as one.
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Korts Luddite
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It is the most likely explanation for the lack of kills, Ecto. Your theory depends on the mod not including information which I strongly believe should be included in the role PM, as well as the mod employing a random chance-based element, something which is frowned upon by the majority of mods on-site. As for explanation no. 3, everyone here was accounted for during at least one of the no-kill nights. I don't think any more that power roles should absolutely claim now, only if they have an innocent or a guilty on someone still alive. WHICH WOULD MAKE SENSE.scumchat never die-
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Korts Luddite
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Again, I don't think this theory is particularly credible, because the scum's inability to kill on alternating nights would probably be included in the role PMs as well.afatchic wrote:
So would that be allowed, and something we could look at for a bit? i have seen it where scum could only kill on odd/even nights but it was always in open games. however, that may have been what the mod did to offset a mass slaughter with the gun inventor. i need to reread some stuff before i do anything else though...Adel wrote:
he kinda just went over that. idiotKorts wrote:
This theory is invalid because there was a kill n4.afatchic wrote:would it be a possibility that the mafia can only kill every other night. like n1, n3, n5; and can't kill n0, n2, n4. andmaybe the scum got the gun n0/1 and used that last night instead of their scum kill.
However, going back to check the role PMs, there is no specific mention of a seperate scumkill group ability; onlypossibletown aligned/mafia aligned/group mafia abilities are listed. Which draws the question: do we know scum have a night kill, or is it possible that the kills were another role/ability's fault?scumchat never die-
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Adel Crystalline Logick
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1.Serial Killer
2.Bodyguard
3.Doctor
4.One-Shot Doctor
5.Roleblocker
6.Syringe Inventor
7. "The last mafia member may use both one group ability and his role ability in the same night. Group abilities may or may not be used on themselves in that case"-
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TDC Mafia Scum
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Kison .GIFted
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Ectomancer Mafia Scum
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I think a couple have said it before, but who is everyone's pick for most likely to have failed to send in scum's NK?I have a degree in bullshit. I have patents on entire lines of bullshit. So don't sit here and feed me a line of bullshit and think that I'm not going to recognize it as one.
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Kison
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Adel Crystalline Logick
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I just read Night Watch where afatchic was town and pivotal for his side winning the game.
unvote, vote:afatchic-
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afatchic Mafia Scum
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Adel you fail. lol. i was pivotal for my side winning because i had the most powerful role that game. Adel/korts for scum.
Guess this will be my bah post.
Bah! go town.ShowNow taking sign ups:
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Adel Crystalline Logick
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no, you paid attention and thought a couple of moves ahead. You totally don't suck at mafia, and you've been playing intellectual rope-a-dope with Korts and Kison.afatchic wrote:Adel you fail. lol. i was pivotal for my side winning because i had the most powerful role that game. Adel/korts for scum.
Guess this will be my bah post.
Bah! go town.
You never gave a case for why you think Korts is scum.
Nice try, now please just admit you are scum, I know you've played charades before. You are legitimately lynched. Claim your alignment, please.-
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afatchic Mafia Scum
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No i know i don't suck, but im really wondering that about you. why would scum say bah go town?Adel wrote:
no, you paid attention and thought a couple of moves ahead. You totally don't suck at mafia, and you've been playing intellectual rope-a-dope with Korts and Kison.afatchic wrote:Adel you fail. lol. i was pivotal for my side winning because i had the most powerful role that game. Adel/korts for scum.
Guess this will be my bah post.
Bah! go town.
You never gave a case for why you think Korts is scum.
Nice try, now please just admit you are scum, I know you've played charades before. You are legitimately lynched. Claim your alignment, please.
My last will: Town lynch Adel.ShowNow taking sign ups:
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