Naive would always get an innocent even if somebody was framed.
Are you sure? Should we check with the mod on that?
In reality, I don't think it matters. I think your result should pretty much be tossed and we should get down to basic scum hunting. I think we got all we are going to get out of the cops and we probably won't get any more results from you since odds are against there being a doctor.
My focus is on KoC, Chaz and Fark. I think 2/3 are scum since I stand by my original belief of the Miller claim and my statement yesterday that your actions (which I viewed as scummy) made sense with your cop claim.
The double-bus theory sticks out to me as a way to spread suspicion to others when it was starting to look like we could narrow down suspects to Rice as pretty certain scum and then 2/4 from the remaining (KoC / Chaz / Fark / Myself) with one of them (minimum) getting investigated. Doesn't quite line up with afatchic getting killed at night, but that may be intentional.
I would like KoC to list his top suspects for today.
Well, any belief I had in the miller claim is pretty much evaporated, and iceman's cop claim now really worries me, since only an idiot wouldn't check someone who (misguidedly) didn't hammer RBT because he had a bit of doubt there.
So, those would be my top two suspects - X and iceman, because I don't trust either of their claims.
Because X's hammer took so long, and it just felt like "we're only losing one scum, and I might as well just to look good for hammering scum". Plus, frankly, he's been niggling away in my mind all game, and I've never particularly believed that there is a Miller in this game.
I have no idea what icemanE's sanity is. Fake is quite the possibility. Guilty on RBT (Godfather), innocent on Xtoxm (VT), and innocent on Bionicchop2.
Mod, do you consider Framers normal? Do you consider any type of Cop outside of { Sane, Insane, Paranoid, Naive } normal?
I ultimately doubt that his investigation on BC2 can tell us anything.
Bionicchop2 wrote:The double-bus theory sticks out to me as a way to spread suspicion to others when it was starting to look like we could narrow down suspects to Rice as pretty certain scum and then 2/4 from the remaining (KoC / Chaz / Fark / Myself) with one of them (minimum) getting investigated.
Call me stupid, but I really don't know what you just said.
Knight of Cydonia wrote:Well, any belief I had in the miller claim is pretty much evaporated, and iceman's cop claim now really worries me, since only an idiot wouldn't check someone who (misguidedly) didn't hammer RBT because he had a bit of doubt there.
So, those would be my top two suspects - X and iceman, because I don't trust either of their claims.
I would think that 3 confirmed Cops & 1 Godfather makes it all the more likely that a Miller would exist. So there has to be some other reason why you would tag me as scum.
X wrote:I have no idea what icemanE's sanity is. Fake is quite the possibility. Guilty on RBT (Godfather), innocent on Xtoxm (VT), and innocent on Bionicchop2.
Minor point, but his other innocent was on afatchic.
X wrote:
Bionicchop2 wrote:The double-bus theory sticks out to me as a way to spread suspicion to others when it was starting to look like we could narrow down suspects to Rice as pretty certain scum and then 2/4 from the remaining (KoC / Chaz / Fark / Myself) with one of them (minimum) getting investigated.
Call me stupid, but I really don't know what you just said.
Not sure which part is throwing you off, but I will attempt to clarify.
Players remaining were:
Ice
afatchic
RBT
KoC
Chaz
Fark
bionicchop2
After the reports, the simplest theory is Ice + afatchic as town with RBT as scum. Any mix of 1-2 of the 3 as scum is fairly plausible. All 3 as scum is the most extreme and least likely. This avenue would be more likely pursued by someone trying to push suspicion as far away from them self and any partners. If there are 2 scum in the group of 4 (KoC, Chaz, Fark, me) then scum would know there would be one more cop report that could incriminate / clear somebody.
KoC throwing suspicion at afatchic and ice expands the realm of suspects so it isn't narrowed down to a group including him. Now if eh suspected them and made a case for each player, I would be less suspicious of the action. Where was he when I was voting for iceman earlier that day or the day before?
X wrote:I have no idea what icemanE's sanity is. Fake is quite the possibility. Guilty on RBT (Godfather), innocent on Xtoxm (VT), and innocent on Bionicchop2.
Minor point, but his other innocent was on afatchic.
Oh, right. I knew it was confirmed town. It was just the other way around - Xtoxm was proclaimed innocent by afatchic.
bionicchop2 wrote:
X wrote:
bionicchop2 wrote:The double-bus theory sticks out to me as a way to spread suspicion to others when it was starting to look like we could narrow down suspects to Rice as pretty certain scum and then 2/4 from the remaining (KoC / Chaz / Fark / Myself) with one of them (minimum) getting investigated.
Call me stupid, but I really don't know what you just said.
Not sure which part is throwing you off, but I will attempt to clarify.
Players remaining were:
Ice
afatchic
RBT
KoC
Chaz
Fark
bionicchop2
After the reports, the simplest theory is Ice + afatchic as town with RBT as scum. Any mix of 1-2 of the 3 as scum is fairly plausible. All 3 as scum is the most extreme and least likely. This avenue would be more likely pursued by someone trying to push suspicion as far away from them self and any partners. If there are 2 scum in the group of 4 (KoC, Chaz, Fark, me) then scum would know there would be one more cop report that could incriminate / clear somebody.
KoC throwing suspicion at afatchic and ice expands the realm of suspects so it isn't narrowed down to a group including him. Now if eh suspected them and made a case for each player, I would be less suspicious of the action. Where was he when I was voting for iceman earlier that day or the day before?
So your criticism is basically that icemanE + afatchic + RBT as the scumteam was a radical proposition, and KoC didn't properly develop the proposition to seem viable or like an honest conclusion.
X wrote:So your criticism is basically that icemanE + afatchic + RBT as the scumteam was a radical proposition, and KoC didn't properly develop the proposition to seem viable or like an honest conclusion.
Yes, that would be a fairly good way of simplifying it. My initial reaction was that it was an attempt to plant a seed of doubt as far away from him as possible. This is not my sole reason to vote since I had suspicions of him previously (though I would have to look over the earlier game with a focus on KoC to properly recall my earlier thoughts).
I'm here - I'm devoting more time to another game right now, unfortunately. So are we all waiting for chaz's replacement to show up?
Ice wrote:Why were those choices better than bio?
Well, I've been getting a strong pro-town vibe from bio since day 1. He's certainly the last person I would have investigated. You might not agree, but why did you pick him to investigate? Why pick him over me, or KoC, or chaz?
Also, peeking from the previous page... oh wait, that does make two possibilities. Oh no.
Possibility A: There's only 1 scum left. Since chaz wasn't around for night and I replaced in, I can't be the 1 scum.
Possibility B: There's 2 scum left. With 6 alive, we're at lyol unless we abstain from voting to bring it down to 5 to increase the odds we hit scum.
Looks like it might come down to getting reads off people. The scum have been killing nothing but cops, and the lynches have been nothing but vanillas and the godfather.
Claiming doesn't seem like it'll be of any use in this game (although I'm obviously vanilla, unless you think the mod would let inactive power role players skip their night abilities).
I've only read the first two pages and the last two, so now it's time to get into the meat of the story.
Sorry if any of this was already posted or common sense.
- I always assume 3 scum in minis, then get pleasantly surprised if there is less.
- no lynching doesn't gain us anything IMO since I believe we have 'non-suspects' (no real chance of being lynched today) that can be killed at night without helping narrow things down. I think this is kind of what you are saying about them mowing down cops. I would rather save a no lynch for a time with 1 scum / 3 suspicious town if that occurs.
bionicchop2 wrote:- no lynching doesn't gain us anything IMO since I believe we have 'non-suspects' (no real chance of being lynched today) that can be killed at night without helping narrow things down.
Good point. We're also not allowed to place even one wrong vote if we did NL today. Today is the day to find scum.
Well, I just finished reading day 1 and the rest of page 22. I'm halfway caught up! This has been exciting!
Just so I don't lose it to some horrible crash, I'm just going to post all my notes so far.
There's a lot! Sorry if this is a lot to read! I was reading for 5 hours! XD
---
I am getting the vibe that this Mafia is a satire of Portland, where, assumedly, there are cops everywhere but they don't do their job. XD
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Very Towny:
X
Farkshinsoup
Towny feel:
bionicchop2
Scummy Feel:
TS / icemanE
very Scummy:
Knight of Cydonia
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Notes:
X claimed miller, which sounds completely believable with so many cops. WIFOM: Role PM might have coached him.
Everyone who said that claiming miller is a good idea is still alive.
Farkshinsoup, post 79: "What exactly do you mean by "further investigation"?" Possible cop?
Amusing, because they're both still alive:
Mr Adams, post 158: "Farkshinsoup and X- yes, I know, an odd combination. Farkshinsoup was one of the lead protectors of X though. so, my assumption is that if Farkshinsoup is scum, X is as well, and Farkshinsoup was protecting X. I think a lynch on one would tell alot about the other."
Farkshinsoup, however, has been pro-town.
Xtotm, too:
TSN, 176: "Newbies are scum too, and adams is dropping common new player scum tells, (pushing a wagon on a 'hunch,' resorting to OMGUS). So yes, I am pushing a newbie lynch, in the sense that I believe Adams is a newbie who is also scum."
Xtoxm, 177: "As newbie-town, I often built cases around OMGUS style, and voted on hunches. I have never heard of a newbie-scum doing either."
Bionicchop2 is aggressive, possibly town. Voted for chaz even though I'm town.
I liked Mr. Adams's point against Knight of Cydonia (I am NOT abbreviating his name! XD) It might have been a slip of the tongue, but I feel it was more scummy to not pay attention to the votecount for a QL.
Knight of Cydonia, 208: ""If the wagon I'm currently pushing fails, I'll be more than happy to jump on the next convenient one! Or this one that's just being started!" You're spreading out so many different accusations, and agreeing with so many bandwagons it hurts. Scummy, much? ... unvote; Vote Xtoxm"
An Xtoxm bandwagon was just forming. Hypocritical much?
I read bionicchop2 as an aggressive player.
Knight of Cydonia, 271: "Xtoxm would definitely defend Adams if he knew he were town and Xtoxm is scum: Xtoxm looks good for defending a pro-town player from a mislynch that way, and makes life a little easier for himself later in the game. Scum defending town is a pretty common play to ingratiate oneself with the town."
Sounds like arguing WIFOM to keep the bandwagon alive.
Knight of Cydonia, 273: "Like you said, it's WIFOM. What isn't WIFOM is the poorly constructed cases Xtoxm has put forward, and his suspicions of literally everyone except Mr. Adams, AFAIR."
KoC goes on to show that Xtotm has temper tantrums and swears. Ooer.
Post 300, my previous self agrees that KoC looks scummy. XD
Knight of Cydonia, 306: "Let's face it, a vanilla townie claim, we have no way of proving. Either we hammer the player who's been the most scummy today (Xtoxm), or someone brings together a decent case against another suspect - and frankly, D1, the only other people I'm wondering about are Zazier and Mr Adams, who has dropped off the map almost completely since getting the votes off him."
Mr. Adams was somewhat actively trying to give decent post at that time. Doesn't mention RBT, whose introductory post felt so scummy to me. (although I'm a bit biased, knowing the dead's roles before they die)
X convinced me with post 316: "I think that I'll assume we have a Cop. :Wink: But point taken."
That is a VERY good post in favor of X's towniness. WIFOM: Could have been well-played as scum, especially if the scum had hints to the setup.
Regardless, X is painted as town to me now.
Post 327, my previous self is awesome. Seriously wondering how Xtoxm got lynched day 2 now, but expecting cop shenanigans to tear everything apart. Will be an exciting read, I hope.
Still wondering how Mr. Adams gets lynched after all of this.
Ooh, there it is, Cop claim, post 351. The fact that only assumed vanillas reply after it is great for the endgame position.
Fark, 356, is honest scumhunting. If he claims cop later, then there may be some problems.
Fark, 431, rejects dual-cop theory even though G-Force is doing some hard hinting.
464: My previous self believes Knight of Cydonia is scummy, and I do too! I like my previous self.
286: Knight of Cydonia talks about his meta.
icemanE, 505: Asks for an Adams claim, even though Adams has claimed twice already.
icemanE, 511: This post makes me feel like he's trying to make sure the bandwagon stays alive since Mr. Adams is at L1.
icemanE then makes posts of urgency, gives up, and flames. Rough playstyle, or trying to get a mislynch?
icemanE, 525: "Useful results on day 3" There should only be 1 result on day 3. Since all cops claimed, this is bad for the cops. No cop is going to live until day 4 unless there's a doc, and I think iceman knows that, but WIFOM.
At 528, my previous self said what I just said. The last cop alive is going to be able to clear at most 2 people. if they all start with investigating X. My previous self expounds on this on 530 about the prospect of not investigating X. I actually like this idea, though it relies on luck to keep the sane/insane cop alive on D3.
I don't like that my previous self hammered Mr. Adams. It feels like an unnecessary death.
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Day 2. NO! Don't have the cops claim yet!
Knight of Cydonia, 542, begins the day by firing on Xtoxm.
Unfortunately, at 544, I agree with Xtoxm's profane comments (minus the profanity!)
Casey wrote:Claiming doesn't seem like it'll be of any use in this game (although I'm obviously vanilla, unless you think the mod would let inactive power role players skip their night abilities).
As you said, don't claim...
Casey wrote:I am getting the vibe that this Mafia is a satire of Portland, where, assumedly, there are cops everywhere but they don't do their job. XD
Not really familiar with Portland, but that's pretty funny all the same.
Keep going! You're a little over halfway.
