Mini 727 - Mafia in Standardville - Game Over

[LlamaFluff]

Vote Count

Xdaamno (6) - Lynx the Antithesis, Danchaofan, Panzerjager, Charter, Lowell, Master Ruck
Lynx the Antithesis (2) - Darox, Tubby216
Artem (1) - BSG
Darox (1) - Artifex
Lowell (1) - Artem
Charter (1) - Xdaamno

[Master Ruck]

The perhaps and maybe are suggestions. Take them away and their sentences sound much more forceful, which is not something I imagine is good when you're in the delicate situation that you're in.

As for the WIFOM in my previous post, I'm not sure to what degree I should refute that as it seems OMGUSy, but I'll state a couple of points I liked against Xd that were no help for him at all.

Also,

Unvote, Vote:Xdaamno

He hastily jumped on the Artem wagon with no analysis or evidence of his own(For the hammer vote nonetheless). He's contributed nothing to the active scumhunting and given no case for any of his votes. Just shown little activity, but is still obviously here.

Good, if not brief, reasons;

I admit many of my posts have been speculation. Distancing myself from 'the main scum hunt' is something I do actively.

Self explanatory, thanks to BSG, and Lowell sums it up surprisingly well with his pbp post. I feel confidant with my post.

[Master Ruck]

EBWOP: seems OMGUSy of Xd to throw that back at me.

[charter]

I figured I'd take the time to look at Xd's posts to see if this wagon is unfounded or not. After doing so, I don't have any reason to disagree with it. There was a large week-long gap between posts, the first after the gap saying he'll post more and the post after being the would-be lynch. Arguments have been made against him and he has either barely defended, poorly defended or not bothered to defend against by saying he has lost interest.

I'm gonna

Vote: Xdaamno

and make it

very

that this puts Xd at L-1, so nobody else vote him yet. I'll unvote if people want to feel more safe and discuss more, but as far as I can see with his lack of scum hunting and the potential hammer, discussion is essentially over and unless anyone disagrees Xda should claim.

This is a VERY weak vote. Add in the 'I want to please the town' clause and it becomes extremely scummy. This is actually making me question whether my vote needs to be on Xdaamo or you.

@Xdaamo, do not claim until after you've defended yourself (in case it wasn't obvious)

[Master Ruck]

Well, there's no doubt about it then. I really truly suck at this game. Maybe I should ask for a replacement so someone better redeems me and stick to some newbie games for now. Yes, this is WIFOM to the extreme, but all I can say is that everything I have done thus far is just me being stupid. If you want, you can lynch me now and get me over with. I won't complain.

[Artifex]

@Ruck- Please don't make this kind of argument, for two reasons. The first is that I get very tense and wary whenever someone makes a play for my sympathies, because this by definition is a game where I have no idea if you're really on my side. The second is- assuming you arent putting a show- there's really no need for you to feel that way, I promise. It would really suck to lose a consistent poster and avid follower of the game, plus the farther we get into this the harder it is to get replacements at all, let alone quality ones. Anyway, the honest to God best way to learn how to play is to see a game through to its end, even if you get lynched or nightkilled or survive it all, whatever. And you know, even if you die you can still win if your side ends up on top, remember that.

@Xda- Okay, it will actually be easier to do as you ask me to- analyze your alignment- if you follow through and post some results on scumhunting, so I'll be waiting.

[Lynx The Antithesis]

lynx,- I really don’t like your posts at all nor do I like your reaction to Darox’s claim, I also don’t like your disagreement with xdaamo, pressure votes are good anytime of the game not solely at the beginning.

So I am going to conclude this with

vote lynx

So you don't like the fact that I'm naturally skeptical to a claim that makes you a weapon to any night actions? Especially when it spawns from the player's first post in the game? I believe others shared a similar reaction.

You don't like my disagreement with a scummy Xdaamno who hasn't defended himself too well to the reason he placed any of his votes. If you're referring specifically to the pressure vote aspect, then that has no correlation on my town alignment. My views about how to utilize a pressure vote are mafia and simply a null tell.

Waiting to hear Xdaamno's response tomorrow. But I've already stated my feelings on him. Nothing's changed even with his reponses to my questions so far. We'll see what he has to say tommorow.

Ruck, weall have those moments where we feel we're not playing great, but you're really doing fine. You've been trying to play to your best and that's all everybody can ask for(Incredibly cliche) Anyway you're new don't worry about it keep playing and you'll improve. We need all the active posters we can get.

[Master Ruck]

Ok, I'll stay. I'm still keeping my vote on Xda for now, at least until he expresses some opinions on other players that are scummy instead of some form of defense.

[tubby216]

lynx,- I really don’t like your posts at all nor do I like your reaction to Darox’s claim, I also don’t like your disagreement with xdaamo, pressure votes are good anytime of the game not solely at the beginning.

So I am going to conclude this with

vote lynx

So you don't like the fact that I'm naturally skeptical to a claim that makes you a weapon to any night actions? Especially when it spawns from the player's first post in the game? I believe others shared a similar reaction.

You don't like my disagreement with a scummy Xdaamno who hasn't defended himself too well to the reason he placed any of his votes. If you're referring specifically to the pressure vote aspect, then that has no correlation on my town alignment. My views about how to utilize a pressure vote are mafia and simply a null tell.

Waiting to hear Xdaamno's response tomorrow. But I've already stated my feelings on him. Nothing's changed even with his reponses to my questions so far. We'll see what he has to say tommorow.

Ruck, weall have those moments where we feel we're not playing great, but you're really doing fine. You've been trying to play to your best and that's all everybody can ask for(Incredibly cliche) Anyway you're new don't worry about it keep playing and you'll improve. We need all the active posters we can get.

no quite simply put i diddn't like your reaction to anything and it all seem scum motivated to me. quite actually it was the first time while reading a game thread that i had anything jump out at me like that

[Lowell]

Where did 254 come from? Seriously.

I was just about to add MR to my town list. Scratch that.

[Xdaamno]

I think they're poor and indicative of scum. The fact that his wagon didn't balloon after an attempted speedhammer also makes me question why more people aren't voting him.

Bull. Can you show me a point you (or anyone else) have made that I have failed to show does not make me scum?

Not bull.

For the second time, could you please provide a reference?

Xdaamo, why did you say Artem would be a good lynch, then you were "saved" when her lynch didn't actually occur? Why the backpedal? And why did you say you reread when you voted, and then in your next post say you need to reread? And how did you miss it being L-1 with a votecount at the top of the page?

That's unusual. Interrogating, when the answers to all of those questions should be obvious to anyone who's done a moment's thought. This is a real, general "trying to look helpful" scum vibe.

Unvote, Vote: charter

I ask you legitamate questions, and you blow them off and OMGUS vote me. It's not even OMGUS, it's just a TERRIBLE vote you throw down. NONE of the answers there were remotely obvious. What is obvious is that your overreacting and refusal to answer is incredibly scummy of you. When you finally did give answers, they were bad.

You've never explained why you hammered and wanted an Artem lynch, then flipped around once Artem claimed.

The answers were all

very

obvious. Please show how my answers were 'bad'.

Also, I thought I had already made it clear I did not want an Artem lynch. My vote was (primarily) a pressure vote.

Also,

As already mentioned, there was a VC on top of the page where you 'voted' Artem. Strange that you didn't pay much attention towards the VC when you wanted to apply pressure, not?

Uh, I don't think so, especially because my Artem vote was also for pressure.

Adding reasosn for your vote after it's way too late, in an attempt to make it seem like you didn't mean the lynch. In your hammer post, you clearly did want the lynch then. The story changing and flip flopping is scummy.

Either that, or I was

telling the truth

. You have proposed an alternate scenario in which I hammered someone

on purpose

and let the town know as such, then did not rectify my 'mistake' when my vote was not counted. You have not explained why this scenario is more plausable than the status quo. If it looks like a duck and sounds like a duck, we should assume it's a duck. You're eerily reminiscient of the 9/11 conspiracy theorists.

I admit many of my posts have been speculation. Distancing myself from 'the main scum hunt' is something I do actively.

Scummy as well.

You try and change your reasons some more again later. None of the excuses fly because you said you wanted an Artem lynch. Not Artem pressure, not because you were suspicious of Artem.

As I said above, your logic is circular. If I was scum I would be doing as you said (which is an implausable scenario, but I'll be generous and say it's neutral) and if I was town I'd be doing what I had said. What makes one scenario more likely than the other? It's certainly not because you have a kink for stating fallacy as fact.

You said "story changing and flip flopping is scummy". This is also circular logic; see above. I was only flip-flopping if I was

scum in the first place

.

I figured I'd take the time to look at Xd's posts to see if this wagon is unfounded or not.

After doing so, I don't have any reason to disagree with it.

There was a large week-long gap between posts, the first after the gap saying he'll post more and the post after being the would-be lynch. Arguments have been made against him and he has either barely defended, poorly defended or not bothered to defend against by saying he has lost interest.

As I mentioned, this post is very fallacious. We should not agree with a wagon because we have no reason to disagree with it. Please provide references for my 'poorly defended' (or etc) points, then explain why that makes me scum rather than a poor scumhunter.

I'm gonna

Vote: Xdaamno

and make it

very

that this puts Xd at L-1, so nobody else vote him yet. I'll unvote if people want to feel more safe and discuss more, but as far as I can see with his lack of scum hunting and the potential hammer,

discussion is essentially

over and unless anyone disagrees Xda should claim.

This is a very,

very

anti-town manuoever, but it may be poor methodology.

On a re-read, it seems the most likely scenario was a combination of a scum's mindset to rush a lynch and poor methodology in general; a town player would not be in a mindset to say such a thing in the first place.

EBWOP: seems OMGUSy of Xd to throw that back at me.

Gross misunderstanding of the OMGUS scumtell.

I admit many of my posts have been speculation. Distancing myself from 'the main scum hunt' is something I do actively.

Self explanatory, thanks to BSG, and Lowell sums it up surprisingly well with his pbp post. I feel confidant with my post.

I'm still not sure how your gripe with my methodology self-explanatorarily (great phrase) indicates me as scum. Can you clarify?

@Xdaamo, do not claim until after you've defended yourself (in case it wasn't obvious)

Yep. This bandwagon is unfounded anyway, and I don't believe it's strong enough to warrant a claim.

@Xda- Okay, it will actually be easier to do as you ask me to- analyze your alignment- if you follow through and post some results on scumhunting, so I'll be waiting.

What "results" are you expecting? I suggested that I would address my bandwagon, which is easy as I know the ultimate question of my alignment anyway. Scumhunting is something I do not wish to do by request.

Ok, I'll stay. I'm still keeping my vote on Xda for now, at least until he expresses some opinions on other players that are scummy instead of some form of defense.

Please justify how my defense instead of offense makes me scum. This is the second time you've played the 'self-explanatory' card, so I'll assume you have no idea what you're talking about yourself unless you address this remark.

Where did 254 come from? Seriously.

I was just about to add MR to my town list. Scratch that.

You have it backwards. I would argue his flimsy, fallacious reasoning is more indicative of scum than his jumping at the slightest attack.

After reading my own post I agree with you, except I was about to vote him regardless.

Vote: Master Ruck

I had directed questions to both charter and Master Ruck. I will be following these up if no response is given.

[Xdaamno]

*EBWOP: Have.

[Master Ruck]

I will do what I can to answer your questions intelligibly, Xda, but first, did you just forget to unvote or did you know that and try to rattle me further into more stupid comments?

[Xdaamno]

Unvote, Vote: Master Ruck

[charter]

Happy with an Xdaamo lynch if he's going to continue saying the answers were obvious, when the only obvious thing is that they were confusing (as is shown in the thread)

[Xdaamno]

Happy with an Xdaamo lynch if he's going to continue saying the answers were obvious, when the only obvious thing is that they were confusing (as is shown in the thread)

What the

heck

? The only time I said the answers to those questions were obvious in my post is when I had already answered them. I believe I specifically asked you to

challenge

those answers if you did not believe they were correct. If you are going to claim the answers are confusing, please state

why

, just as I did.

[Xdaamno]

EBWOP: A spelling mistake or two.

Happy with an Xdaamo lynch if he's going to continue saying the answers were obvious, when the only obvious thing is that they were confusing (as is shown in the thread)

What the

heck

? The only time I said the answers to those questions were obvious in my post was when I had already answered them. I believe I specifically asked you to

challenge

those answers if you did not believe they were correct. If you are going to claim the answers are confusing, please state

why

you believe so, just as I did.

Seriously, though? Calling me out for saying the answers were obvious when I had already explained them, then calling my answers "confusing" without doing the same thing? Hypocrite.

[Xdaamno]

Double EBWOP: Also, it's clear you didn't read half of that post. For the third time, I would like you to answer my questions (and perhaps address each point).

[Artifex]

What "results" are you expecting? I suggested that I would address my bandwagon, which is easy as I know the ultimate question of my alignment anyway. Scumhunting is something I do not wish to do by request.

Why the heck should you have to be requested to do that, anyway? You should just be doing it by nature of being a player in this game. Look, maybe the misunderstanding is mine, but I was responding to what you wrote in this post:

OK, I certainly admit to that. I'm being lazy, in that I'm going for the easy arguments to make (that is, those for which I know the ultimate answer beforehand). I'm still slacking at my second job. Several of your points, such as the below, fall under this general area. If you're going to be analyzing me, we should stick to my alignment.

Which I thought was directed towards me, seeing as how you quote me in the post (although you have the quote attributed to Artem). Isnt the second job youre referring to in this post scumhunting? And the best way I know how to fulfull your request- to analyze your alignment- is to read posts where you do more than the type of posts you've been making.

[charter]

Xdaamo, I did read all your posts. When I asked you a bunch of questions, all you did was get worked up, say I'm just asking questions for the hell of it, and say the answers are obvious. Clearly they weren't and you had not answered them already (else I wouldn't have asked them).

I don't even understand your other request. Are you telling me to show where you haven't responded to points against you? If so, then your answers weren't satisfactory, evidenced no votes are moving off of you.

I don't believe that your vote was for pressure when in the post you cast it

you specifically stated you were fine with an Artem LYNCH

. You can keep telling me it is, but all I see is story changing. The story changing combined with an attempted quickhammer you didn't agree with is scummy enough for me to want to lynch you.

[Xdaamno]

You to make things clear, charter, you are implying I tried to make it look like an accidental lynch?

Also, here are the questions in my post make things clear:

I think they're poor and indicative of scum. The fact that his wagon didn't balloon after an attempted speedhammer also makes me question why more people aren't voting him.

Bull. Can you show me a point you (or anyone else) have made that I have failed to show does not make me scum?

Not bull.

For the second time, could you please provide a reference?

By this, I meant "show me the answers that are poor and indicative of scum".

Also,

As already mentioned, there was a VC on top of the page where you 'voted' Artem. Strange that you didn't pay much attention towards the VC when you wanted to apply pressure, not?

Uh, I don't think so, especially because my Artem vote was also for pressure.

Adding reasosn for your vote after it's way too late, in an attempt to make it seem like you didn't mean the lynch. In your hammer post, you clearly did want the lynch then. The story changing and flip flopping is scummy.

Either that, or I was

telling the truth

. You have proposed an alternate scenario in which I hammered someone

on purpose

and let the town know as such, then did not rectify my 'mistake' when my vote was not counted. You have not explained why this scenario is more plausable than the status quo. If it looks like a duck and sounds like a duck, we should assume it's a duck. You're eerily reminiscient of the 9/11 conspiracy theorists.

I admit many of my posts have been speculation. Distancing myself from 'the main scum hunt' is something I do actively.

Scummy as well.

You try and change your reasons some more again later. None of the excuses fly because you said you wanted an Artem lynch. Not Artem pressure, not because you were suspicious of Artem.

As I said above, your logic is circular. If I was scum I would be doing as you said (which is an implausable scenario, but I'll be generous and say it's neutral) and if I was town I'd be doing what I had said. What makes one scenario more likely than the other? It's certainly not because you have a kink for stating fallacy as fact.

You said "story changing and flip flopping is scummy". This is also circular logic; see above. I was only flip-flopping if I was

scum in the first place

.[/quote]

Here, I asked "what makes one scenario more like than the other"? This was rhetorical, but if your argument is not completely invalid you must have an answer for this, or you must point out the question is flawed.

[Xdaamno]

Just

to make things clear, charter, you are implying I tried to make it look like an accidental lynch?

Fix'ed.

[Artem]

The original attack on Artem was obvious BS, but I'm surprised Artem needed me to point that out for him.

After a re-read,

it's a good lynch right now.

Also, I thought I had already made it clear

I did not want an Artem lynch

. My vote was (primarily) a pressure vote.

[Artem]

So, it was a good lynch but you didn't want it? How does that work?

[LlamaFluff]

Bump for ToP votecount