Mini #717 - Alpha Centauri Smalltown (Game Over!)


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Post Post #225 (ISO) » Thu Dec 18, 2008 6:16 pm

Post by farside22 »

Occam wrote:I also think it's worth noting that all it took for farside to drop her whole case on me and unvote was for Oman to speak up against it and Ceph to "get the point":
farside wrote: Cephrir gets the point. Yay. Finally. I agree I was being a jerk because I feel like Occam is just being rediculous on his vote reasons.
Neither my vote reasons nor my note changed, but for some reason your vote did.
We were the only one's talking. Someone actually got the point. The fact that you and charter are still arguing the point is noted.
Here is what cephrir stated that I agreed with that only Oman and him seemed to note with different terms:
This whole discussion is mostly irrelevant. It doesn't even matter who's right, and the fact that you're voting for each other over it seems pretty ridiculous to me.
I stated many times I thought your vote and reason's were ridiculous and I still do. However you want to stand by some dumb ass reason because I truly people self voting is anti town more power to you. Guess what you are of the opinion your right. I see someone unvoting quickly as charter did you bet I'm going to question the fuck out of it. I see someone self vote saying they are making a point. You bet I will call it anti town.
Your reasons for voting me is based on my belief where charter is saying I'm not scum hunting is the most nuttiest thing I have heard this game.
Sarcasm is just a way of saying how stupid you think someone is but in a more polite way.
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Post Post #226 (ISO) » Thu Dec 18, 2008 6:27 pm

Post by charter »

You're hunting all right, you just don't care you you shoot is the problem.
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Post Post #227 (ISO) » Thu Dec 18, 2008 7:09 pm

Post by Occam »

That's not the only reason I'm voting for you farside - and you know it.
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Post Post #228 (ISO) » Thu Dec 18, 2008 9:38 pm

Post by iamausername »

"There are two kinds of scientific progress: the methodical experimentation and categorization which gradually extend the boundaries of knowledge, and the revolutionary leap of genius which redefines and transcends those boundaries. Acknowledging our debt to the former, we yearn nonetheless for the latter."

-- Academician Prokhor Zakharov, "Address to the Faculty"


-=Vote Count #6=-


Cephrir (3) - Gremwell, Oman, Empking
Occam (2) - MonkeyMan576, Drunken Piper
farside22 (2) - charter, Occam
Crazy (1) - farside22

Not Voting (4) - Cephrir, christiano drago, Crazy, MacavityLock

7 to lynch.

-=Crazy has been prodded for the first time=-
Elapsam semel occasionem non ipse potest Iuppiter reprehendere
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Post Post #229 (ISO) » Thu Dec 18, 2008 11:37 pm

Post by Oman »

Oman's post


Post 53
- Empking votes a roleblocker, an interesting move, but doesn't come through with much.

Post 54
- Farside mentions pressure, which removes all power behind pressure, because now the pressure-ees know its only pressure. Nice.

Post 56
- If charter is scum, this post is gold. He actually notes the mafia, then votes for the SK....how interesting.

57
- Farside says one of the dumbest things in mafia "I did something scummy but you missed it therefor you're scum." Farside, your plan there sucked from either angle. And I also wonder what your intention was

59
-The first day of christmas, my true love gave to me: Cavity putting on his big boy pants. Cavity gives a good reason for a "slightly less than random" vote which he doesn't overcommit to too early. This looks like a town play to me, and puts cavity in high standing as a player with me.

60-61
- Monkeyman does this interesting thing where he doesn't say that its scummy or anything but says what he thinks it is: "dumb".

62
- cephrir's interesting post. He is obviously reading, responding to farside's post. But doesn't seem to notice the wagon on Occam. Now, I normally would welcome a fourth vote, thinking the pressure would reveal many an interesting thing. But the fact that Cephrir tried to deny it (and still does IIRC) makes it seem very scummy.

65
- Farside basically calls Gremwell out for not joining the bandwagon, specifically: "Do you think being BP is really helpful for the scum?" The interesting thing is that Gremwell didn't say this at all Gremwell said a four vote wagon was a bit rushed, which is completely legitimate and doesn't make any comment on BP in any way, only on the legitimacy of Occam-wagon. Farside seems desperate to get Occam lynched here, or just push blame onto someone. However, that is a hasty conclusion I don't want to jump to.

69
- There are many out there that would call Occam -> Farside an OMGUS vote, but I am seeing it more and more like distancing. It just screams "look while I rationalise this vote". Not to mention the "if you feel I should be voted out etc." looks like getting the wagon to build to allow someone to victimise people. Of course, on the Hanlon side of things (and I've just been rereading games I've played that makes me think that running with Hanlon is a good thing) he looks like a frustrated townie, backed up by the caps at the top.

72
- Farside's worst post to date. It's silly and takes things far further than they should be. It runs off the idea "if you disagree with me on mafia theory you must be scum." I'm almost dissapointed in farside who plays to a much higher standard than sinking to "you think it's obvious? Only scum would think of that plan...even though I did!"

76
- Occam's self vote. I must say: I've not seen a parrallel between a self vote and anlignment, it seems to be a player thing more than an alignment thing.

80
- Gremwell is correct here, you guys running for bandwagons is cool, but you need to have a point to it, and no, lynching page threeis not a justification for a D1 wagon.

82
- Monkeyman incorrectly extrapolates that Occam's self vote was designed to make us think he was town. Especially with the discussion that follows it, its hardly making him look town.

95
- Farside hits me with more of these weird extrapolations about "so cephrir wasn't random voting, that means you don't believe Occam had a knee jerk reaction" and all this. Basically I find farside is trying to push the conversation back to Occam from Cephrir. That means that Occamscum and farsidescum are now less liklely than before, because farsidescum was more likely to let Occamscum go there to go after Cephrir town. Of course Cephrir scum makes Farsidescum much more likely.

101
- Cephrir OMGUSes me. Well done.

104
- DP brings up an interesting point about the comment he made whilst choosing his role.

109
- Worst fucking post ever.

116
- Why is DP so aggressive here? The truth is, I've played with DP (and his...brother) and this is definatly a town tell for him. Huge cop out on the couplets though

125
- Farside denys knowledge of SK. So very interesting, but can go either way unfortunatly.

132
- How interesting is Drago's take here. S/he actually says that there is agreement on open bulletproof roles to the town that is trying to kill a guy for saying the same thing!

136
- EMpking is voting Cephrir but not saying much else.

142
- Is Farside really serious here. Damn, farside, you were a much much smarter woman than this.

152
- Need more information than this. What is the meta, what occured, how sure are you?

158
- Farside...C'mon, you're so much better than this!

160
- Nice appeal to authority. As much as I respect the man, Mr Flay thinking something doesn't make it the epitome of mafia theory.

176
- Farside's tunnelvision is hurting the game, because she is the most vocal she's directing too much of the conversation.

192
- Alignments aside (a dangerous idea): FUCK YEAH! This is an awesome post in a pool of wishy crap.

198
- A really strange point here. I just don't seem to get you this game farside. I don't understand where this comes from or goes to. The reason there is not much of a town quickhammer presence is twofold 1. Because scum tend to hold back their votes to wait for the quickhammer, and 2. there is a much bigger incentive for scum to quickhammer.

200
- A point I'd like to make as well. Farside tends to draw stupid conclusions.

202
- This highlights your problem farside, you're tunnelvisioned. You say twice that you will never concede on a point!

211
- Farside! I love you! "Stuff i missed during the argument" I'm so glad you posted this :D

224
- Cephrir here, see questions.

226
- Best line ever. Totally relevant.

Questions


Monkeyman
why would you vote someone you thought was stupid over someone you thought was town?

Cephrir
why did you unvote me in 224? There was no threat, you didn't move it anyway.

Farside
What do you think of the line "You're hunting all right, you just don't care you you shoot is the problem."

If Occam is scum I'm looking at:
  • Empking
  • Monekyman


Crazy needs to be podded:

Mod
: Crazy prod please. That is, a sane prod on a player named Crazy.
It's unfortunate that good oral sex excuses bad chemistry. - Korts
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Post Post #230 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 2:50 am

Post by Empking »

Oman wrote:
Monkeyman
why would you vote someone you thought was stupid over someone you thought was town?.
Is that correct?

Cephrir, I don't buy your defence because it presumes you're an idiot.

Though, Farside does seem scummy but getting in a big, too long argument even when she's wrong does seem like classic town Farside to me.
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Post Post #231 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 3:12 am

Post by Oman »

No Empking, not correct.

Correction:

Monkeyman
Why would you vote someone you thought was stupid over someone you thought was scum?
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Post Post #232 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 3:27 am

Post by Cephrir »

Oman wrote:Cephrir why did you unvote me in 224? There was no threat, you didn't move it anyway
Because I'm probably going to vote for someone else in the very near future, after I go back over Occam/farside.
Emp wrote:Cephrir, I don't buy your defence because it presumes you're an idiot.
I beg to differ. The
case
on me hinges on stupidity, the defense is just based on the fact that I wasn't paying attention.
"I would prefer not to." --Herman Melville,
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Post Post #233 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 5:26 am

Post by Occam »

I like everything in Oman's post except:
Oman wrote: If Occam is scum I'm looking at:

* Empking
* Monekyman
Where does "if occam is scum" come from? The rest of your post doesn't really lead up to that.
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Post Post #234 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 5:38 am

Post by Gremwell »

Since they dominated the last few pages, and most people seem to have an opinion one way or the other, how many people think that either one of farside or occam is defiantly scum?

the reason I ask is that if we can at least agree on that much then we could lynch one and vig the other, I doubt anyone would disagree with a one for one trade

of course this hinges on one of them being definite scum, not just two townies slugging it out

its just a suggestion, as I can see this conflict clouding the rest of the game.
[color=red]in the name of Harman[/color]
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Post Post #235 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 5:45 am

Post by Empking »

Gremwell wrote:Since they dominated the last few pages, and most people seem to have an opinion one way or the other, how many people think that either one of farside or occam is defiantly scum?

.
I don't.
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Post Post #236 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 5:48 am

Post by farside22 »

I'm going to answer these questions and comments and after I get some things done I will read the game again for those things I missed.
57 - Farside says one of the dumbest things in mafia "I did something scummy but you missed it therefor you're scum." Farside, your plan there sucked from either angle. And I also wonder what your intention was?
I think my problem is I see people do this in every game and I wanted to see if there was any fact in it. They do something scummy and say look at the scum jump at ti.

65 - Farside basically calls Gremwell out for not joining the bandwagon, specifically: "Do you think being BP is really helpful for the scum?" The interesting thing is that Gremwell didn't say this at all Gremwell said a four vote wagon was a bit rushed, which is completely legitimate and doesn't make any comment on BP in any way, only on the legitimacy of Occam-wagon. Farside seems desperate to get Occam lynched here, or just push blame onto someone. However, that is a hasty conclusion I don't want to jump to.
I felt and do feel Occam's self vote and comments on the BP very anti town. I want to know why someone doesn't think it what there motive is. Scum love to jump on opportunity when it comes to voting and lynching someone that is town. When I see someone unvote and others talk about it I want to know are they scum looking town or town that is confused.

Farside What do you think of the line "You're hunting all right, you just don't care you you shoot is the problem."
Sen's is in the game?!?! :shock:
No sorry I would say that it's not what I'm doing.I really think Occam's vote for himself was anti-town. I think when he did it was horrible. I remember a game page 3 where scum did hammer someone at L-1 so yes if someone is town and thinks no scum wouldn't do something like that. They are living a lie or they are scum and have nothing to worry about.
Sarcasm is just a way of saying how stupid you think someone is but in a more polite way.
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Post Post #237 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 5:50 am

Post by Occam »

@ Grem -

Wrong does not equal scum. Your plan is something scum would say.

I kind of feel like my vote on farside isn't gonna vitalize the game, so I'm moving it to someone else who has been totally scummy all game:

unvote - vote: Gremwell
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Post Post #238 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 5:53 am

Post by Occam »

farside wrote: I remember a game page 3 where scum did hammer someone at L-1 so yes if someone is town and thinks no scum wouldn't do something like that. They are living a lie or they are scum and have nothing to worry about.
So if its pretty much always scum that quick hammer (something you said) - and if someone had quickhammered - then it would have been a one for one trade. I don't see how that's bad.
farside wrote: Scum love to jump on opportunity when it comes to voting and lynching someone that is town.
Right, that's how I've felt about you this whole game so far. You've been pushing something you seem to know is wrong, which I don't get.
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Post Post #239 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 8:01 am

Post by charter »

Gremwell wrote:Since they dominated the last few pages, and most people seem to have an opinion one way or the other, how many people think that either one of farside or occam is defiantly scum?

the reason I ask is that if we can at least agree on that much then we could lynch one and vig the other, I doubt anyone would disagree with a one for one trade

of course this hinges on one of them being definite scum, not just two townies slugging it out

its just a suggestion, as I can see this conflict clouding the rest of the game.
No. You are scum. Once again, you ignore everything important in the game to give us this. You've commented on virtually nothing that's happened in this game. Also, you're clearly trying to gather everyone else's opinion on this matter without giving your own, testing the waters if you will.

Farside has now switched all her reasoning. Scum as well. Now Occam has done a slew of anti-town things. Before it was a slew of scummy things. This looks like she's trying to drop her whole line of questioning because she sees that no one else is buying it.
farside wrote:When I see someone unvote and others talk about it I want to know are they scum looking town or town that is confused.

...

I remember a game page 3 where scum did hammer someone at L-1 so yes if someone is town and thinks no scum wouldn't do something like that. They are living a lie or they are scum and have nothing to worry about.
OR TOWN NOT WANTING A LYNCH ON PAGE FIVE. Guess what, scum won that game with the hammer on page two. So why would you want to repeat the mistake again here? Farside was town in that game and scum won, I have no idea how she doesn't see the obvious parallel here.
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Post Post #240 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 8:07 am

Post by MonkeyMan576 »

Monkeyman
why would you vote someone you thought was stupid over someone you thought was town?

Only scum would vote someone they thought was town.

FOS: Oman
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Post Post #241 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 8:11 am

Post by farside22 »

Chater: post 56 your predicition post why would you vote for the person you predict is the SK?
Cephrir: post 62 what do you consider a useless pr in this game?
Gremwell: Post 74 why did you think the votes where random. Only Cephrir stated no reason for his vote.

Just a note for Occam. charter stated the following:
Every game I've been in with a lynch in 3 or so pages or less for day one has resulted in a town loss... More later.
Do you believe that scum would not hammer with that thought in mind?
Empking: post 88 why did you feel the need to put this statement in bold and what was stoping you?
Cephrir post 101 OMGUS much.
Cephrir: Post 106 How is it do you read a game and not notice votes? FOS
Empking: Post 136 can you, you know try and give a view on each player please.
charter: Post 151 I answered your questions but you keep claiming I'm not. I think you just like to hear yourself talk.
Occam: Post 177
FOS
just for ignoring my post in 176 saying it's not self lynching because L-1 vote is in terms if someone hammers self lynching.
Gremwell Post 178 seems to follow the leader. I want opinions about everyone in the game from you.

Occam post Points against me: #1 Hi pot this is kettle guess what?
Post 2. Wow did you ever bring this up. (looks) nope not once till now. How convients.
3. Yeah for some reason I thought you said more then BP is useless for town by bad.
4. Not a misrep. You keep missing my point.
Empking: post 230 Yay I think we both learned something from a game where we stubbornish isn't always right.
Gremwell Post 234: Bad, just bad. You know better then to try and line up lynches and tell PR's what to do. Horrible logic.
FOS


Mod: Please prod the following players:
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Post Post #242 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 8:12 am

Post by Gremwell »

I will wait to comment until others weigh in
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Post Post #243 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 8:13 am

Post by MonkeyMan576 »

Gremwell wrote:I will wait to comment until others weigh in
Scumtell. If you have an opinion you should say it now.
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Post Post #244 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 8:23 am

Post by MacavityLock »

I will weigh in and say
FoS: Gremwell
. No votes from me until after finals finish (tomorrow ~5 PST) and I can do a re-read.
Yes, my fake claim is Innocent Aligned with the Town win condition as per the mod's first post.
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Post Post #245 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 8:52 am

Post by Empking »

Yeah, this last page of Gremwell's posts have been bad.

FoS: Gremwell


Farside

88, was a sort of FoS. I don't think posting my thoughts on players I think are Pro-Town would be good for the town.
Plus, if you guys want to make a point, skip the walls, because everyone else in the game does as well. - Magister Ludi
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Post Post #246 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 8:54 am

Post by farside22 »

Empking wrote:Yeah, this last page of Gremwell's posts have been bad.

FoS: Gremwell


Farside

88, was a sort of FoS. I don't think posting my thoughts on players I think are Pro-Town would be good for the town.
Players who you think are scum is all I want. You have been really quiet this game compared to our last it it makes me itch.
Sarcasm is just a way of saying how stupid you think someone is but in a more polite way.
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Post Post #247 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 8:56 am

Post by Empking »

Cephrir and Gremwell.

Cephrir: Bandwagoning and then denying it. I don't think his defence was very good either.
Gremwell: The worlds most anti-town plan is mostly why I suspect him.
Plus, if you guys want to make a point, skip the walls, because everyone else in the game does as well. - Magister Ludi
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Post Post #248 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 11:22 am

Post by Oman »

MonkeyMan576 wrote:
Monkeyman
why would you vote someone you thought was stupid over someone you thought was town?

Only scum would vote someone they thought was town.

FOS: Oman
You are being stupid. Read some more, maybe the next two posts or so. Then stop being an idiot, com back and talk to me.
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Post Post #249 (ISO) » Fri Dec 19, 2008 11:24 am

Post by Oman »

Occam wrote:I like everything in Oman's post except:
Oman wrote: If Occam is scum I'm looking at:

* Empking
* Monekyman
Where does "if occam is scum" come from? The rest of your post doesn't really lead up to that.
There is a possibility I'm wrong. I accept that. I don't think you're scum, but if you are, these two look like scumbuddies.


Also on the Gremwell's "either Farside or OCcam is scum" I believe they are not both scum, though one could be scum and the other SK so its interestingly useless to think that way.
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