Mini 681 - Mish Mash Mafia - THE END!

[Caboose]

Save lord_hur.

Since I'm now wary of both Sekinj and KoC.

Wary ? Why ?

They seemed in a rush to save Caboose.

I'm taking crap attacks left and right...
Mind explaining this one?

[ShadowGirl]

It's a gut feeling. It just seemed like it was rushed. What more do you wan?

[Caboose]

It's a gut feeling. It just seemed like it was rushed. What more do you wan?

I want something more than a crap attack.

[ShadowGirl]

It's not an attack. It's an observation.

[Caboose]

It's not an attack. It's an observation.

When you accuse me of being scum with sekinj and KoC, that's an attack.

[ShadowGirl]

Okay, I suppose it technically is. Like I said, there's nothing more to it.

[lord_hur]

It's a gut feeling. It just seemed like it was rushed. What more do you wan?

I want something more than a crap attack.

Crap attack ? I'm not so sure... SG's accusation rang a bell, and made me reread Empking's lynch. KoC and sekinj attacked him one right after the other, the third attacker (after me) being none other than Caboose...

I know, Empking was obvious scum and all that, but this is quite a coincidence, don't you think ?

Damn, and these 3 were my top pro-town choices... Voting will be tough, today...

[sekinj]

People are being ridiculous.

LH - you are being blown around by every idea that comes across. How can you possibly be convinced by SG's vibes when you earlier stated that I can't even tell you my personal motives for a vote because they can't be proven?

SG - If there are player that most of the town feels are pro-town, then there is no reason not to vote them safe. This isn't regualr voting/lynching. These small session ARE going to go much faster than a whole day. PLus, yes, it is going to seem like a quick save to you when you don't have the time to check in frequently and make all these big posts you are promising. I think you are just trying to throw doubt around and confuse the town. PLease make a case if youhave one.

[lord_hur]

LH - you are being blown around by every idea that comes across. How can you possibly be convinced by SG's vibes when you earlier stated that I can't even tell you my personal motives for a vote because they can't be proven?

I think saying that I've been "convinced by her vibes" is a bit abusive. I think I've added a sizable element, which originated in my own reflexions. Thus I claim this idea as mine (not that it's a big thing...).

And I don't think I'm getting "blown around", which implies that I'm not controling where my thoughts are leading me. This observation I made only shifted my suspicions a bit, nothing more. I'm not of the type to be influenced by other people, unless I have the obsolute proof that they are town (well actually, it made me lose once, and I'm not going to make the mistake again).

That said, you are free to make your own investigations and come to better conclusions.

[Caboose]

It's a gut feeling. It just seemed like it was rushed. What more do you wan?

I want something more than a crap attack.

Crap attack ? I'm not so sure... SG's accusation rang a bell, and made me reread Empking's lynch. KoC and sekinj attacked him one right after the other, the third attacker (after me) being none other than Caboose...

I know, Empking was obvious scum and all that, but this is quite a coincidence, don't you think ?

Damn, and these 3 were my top pro-town choices... Voting will be tough, today...

It's a gut feeling. It just seemed like it was rushed. What more do you wan?

I want something more than a crap attack.

Crap attack ? I'm not so sure... SG's accusation rang a bell, and made me reread Empking's lynch

in hopes that I can fling around some unfounded suspicions at some people on his wagon

. KoC and sekinj attacked him one right after the other, the third attacker (after me) being none other than Caboose...

Hopefully nobody recognizes the fact that being on a townie wagon is not a scumtell and that I'm using crap logic to try to cast some suspicion onto Caboose and sekinj to get people to second guess themselves.

I know, Empking was obvious scum and

Caboose had a good reason for attacking Empking

, but this is quite a

way to get people to ignore Caboose thinking that he's obvscum

, don't you think ?

Damn, and

Caboose already got cleared so we don't get to mislynch him. I guess we can still go after sekinj. Getting a mislynch

will be tough, today...

[ShadowGirl]

SG - If there are player that most of the town feels are pro-town, then there is no reason not to vote them safe. This isn't regualr voting/lynching. These small session ARE going to go much faster than a whole day. PLus, yes, it is going to seem like a quick save to you when you don't have the time to check in frequently and make all these big posts you are promising. I think you are just trying to throw doubt around and confuse the town. PLease make a case if youhave one.

I would think that two votes three hours from apart would be rather quick. That's all I am saying.

Caboose, why do you seem so hostile?

[lord_hur]

in hopes that I can fling around some unfounded suspicions at some people on his wagon

Unfounded suspicions ? Are you claiming that you know they are unfounded ? Anyway, this is a crap attack.

Hopefully nobody recognizes the fact that being on a townie wagon is not a scumtell

This is your opinion. Unless you can prove me that it is a widely accepted opinion, then it can be a proper defense.

and that I'm using crap logic to try to cast some suspicion onto Caboose and sekinj to get people to second guess themselves.[/color]

Crap logic is logical fallacy. I showed a fact, nothing more.

Caboose had a good reason for attacking Empking

This is the only thing making sense, and should have constituted your only defense. What was this reason ?

Caboose already got cleared so we don't get to mislynch him. I guess we can still go after sekinj. Getting a mislynch

will be tough, today...

Since it seems you need to learn what crap attack is, this is it. An attack not based on any fact or reasoning.

Why are you only talking about sekinj, and not KoC ? Because he is the only one you have to defend ?

[Caboose]

Unfounded suspicions ? Are you claiming that you know they are unfounded ? Anyway, this is a crap attack.

Being on a townie wagon=/=scumtell
The foundation to your argument just vanished.

This is your opinion. Unless you can prove me that it is a widely accepted opinion, then it can be a proper defense.

It's my opinion that I've formed through experience. Do you have an alternate one? If so, please share.

Crap logic is logical fallacy. I showed a fact, nothing more.

You showed a fact that was setting me up to be attacked.

This is the only thing making sense, and should have constituted your only defense. What was this reason ?

Lurking, the self survival comment, which I find to be legitimately scummy.

Since it seems you need to learn what crap attack is, this is it. An attack not based on any fact or reasoning.

I find that people who make crap attacks often flip scum. So no, my attack is not a crap attack but I point out that SG, SSK, and you are trying to attack me for something that's not a scumtell or not even scummy.

Why are you only talking about sekinj, and not KoC ? Because he is the only one you have to defend ?

If sekinj is scum, then she's playing a really good game right now because I don't see anything scummy about her play. KoC, on the other hand, has made some scummy moves Day 1, which includes attacking me for something not scummy.

Caboose, why do you seem so hostile?

What do you want me to say? When I'm being attacked for something that's not a scumtell it makes me mad.

[lord_hur]

Unfounded suspicions ? Are you claiming that you know they are unfounded ? Anyway, this is a crap attack.

Being on a townie wagon=/=scumtell
The foundation to your argument just vanished.

And this is crap logic / logical fallacy : using mere opinion for established fact to make a point.

This is your opinion. Unless you can prove me that it is a widely accepted opinion, then it can be a proper defense.

It's my opinion that I've formed through experience. Do you have an alternate one? If so, please share.

I find rushed votes significantly more scummy. Especially when repeatedly done, *and* with the same persons, since scum tend instinctively to coordinate their attacks.

Since it seems you need to learn what crap attack is, this is it. An attack not based on any fact or reasoning.

I find that people who make crap attacks often flip scum. So no, my attack is not a crap attack but I point out that SG, SSK, and you are trying to attack me for something that's not a scumtell or not even scummy.

Again, your opinion. And since you appear to be anything but flexible, this means that all attacks against you are scummy.

Why are you only talking about sekinj, and not KoC ? Because he is the only one you have to defend ?

If sekinj is scum, then she's playing a really good game right now because I don't see anything scummy about her play. KoC, on the other hand, has made some scummy moves Day 1, which includes attacking me for something not scummy.

Ah ok, sekinj is not scummy because she is the only one who didn't attack you. You should have said that right from the start.


@all : did anyone play with Caboose before, and if yes, does he always show this kind of behavior ?

[MafiaSSK]

@all : did anyone play with Caboose before, and if yes, does he always show this kind of behavior ?

Yup.

[Knight of Cydonia]

MafiaSSK - are you going to anything this game?

[ShadowGirl]

What do you want me to say? When I'm being attacked for something that's not a scumtell it makes me mad.

You just seem rather high strung about it. I wasn't even making a big deal about it. But you are.

[sekinj]

Vote/Save: Rest

She hasn't posted as much as others, but she seems to be the next townies person in my eyes.

[ShadowGirl]

Vote/Save: Rest

She hasn't posted as much as others, but she seems to be the next townies person in my eyes.

Why would that be?

[sekinj]

@SG - She hasn't made any scummy statements and seems to be trying to do what is best for the town

[ShadowGirl]

Examples?

[sekinj]

Vote: Caboose

I feel strongly that Caboose is town, especially from what I saw of him D1. I'm pretty confident that his ideas have been genuine.

I agree. good post

I believe that Caboose is town because he was the first to come up with a plan that involved town participation D1. He definitely got under fire for it from KoC, but I thought it was a pro-town plan:

We each pick a person that we would kill if elected executioner. Once we have everyone covered (everyone's got somebody that would kill them), then we play like a regular mafia game. Instead of voting for the person we want to lynch, we vote for the executioner who would kill that person.

sekinj's plan wasn't actually that different in effect, even though the process was different. But I am voting Caboose because he was the

first

to take the initiative to come up with a plan. That makes him look town in my eyes, and he hasn't done anything to convince me otherwise. His contributions have all made sense and seemed genuine. I agree with his attack on MafiaSSK (I haven't said much about who I find scummy, if anything, but that is a bad habit of mine and I'll try to discuss it more from now on) and I didn't find his attack on Empking to be scummy.

good explanation of thoughts. critical, but not overly.

I don't like how KoC said he was happy to put Caboose and sekinj in "for now"...as if he has reservations about it. News flash, KoC. You can't take it back later. And if we save the wrong person, it's over. So I think you should be pretty damn sure.

again, calling some players out on things, but agreeing with others. Giving people a chance to explain themsevles, while still being firm in her opinions.


the only fault I see is that I wish she would post more.

happy, SG?

[RestFermata]

I wish I would post more too. I really have a problem with this, and I'm sorry. I have a time management problem so when RL obligations hit me, they hit me really hard.

I'm pleasantly surprised that sekinj would vote to save me. I thought I had lurked enough that many people would feel very iffy about voting me. Glad to see that sekinj isn't taking advantage of that--makes me think she's town. If she's unsuccessful in leading a save wagon on me, I'll probably vote for her. Could be buddying up, but I've found her town so far, for similar reasons as Caboose D1. I like the people who seemed like leaders of the D1 discussion, and sekinj, though not the first to come up with an idea, was one of them.

I don't understand lord_hur's continued accusation of Caboose. How can he continue to attack Caboose now that he is cleared as town? If Caboose was mafia, the game would be over. We've entered the next voting stage, so he needs to lose the tunnel vision and look for other pairs. Even if the mod's a bastard and the game is over but we don't know it yet, we HAVE to consider Caboose town because if not, there's no point because everything we're doing is useless anyway. I'm not finding LH super scummy at the moment, but he's not my first choice to save because the way he went from "these two players are pro-town" to "these two players are probably scumbuddies" fairly quickly strikes me as being possibly dishonest.

Two players that I'm

really

not planning on voting to save at this point are MafiaSSK and SG. MafiaSSK isn't afraid to accuse people, but often does so in an annoyingly vague way. I also see some weird overly trusting vibes from him toward sekinj--if sekinj is in fact town, which I believe she is, this could be an example of trying to get on her good side. Overall MSSK strikes me as really uncooperative. The only thing holding me back from declaring "obvscum" is an occurrence in another game--I won't get too specific about it for obvious reasons--in which I said the same things and the player in question flipped town. So apparently uncooperative behavior and vague accusations are not

necessarily

a scumtell, but they are anti-town. And we should not be saving anti-town people at this point.

SG is another one I'm iffy about. I know my participation D2 was sub-par, but I was confused about game mechanics and didn't want to do anything rash accidentally, whereas SG seemed to be pretending to participate by playing mod. She was posting continually but not as a player. It seemed like she was just letting everyone duke it out round her as she watched. I don't feel very comfortable with that. Lurking in plain sight is more of a scumtell than true lurking for me. I especially didn't like that she asked for prods on certain people. She was the one who needed a prod--a participation prod, not a posting prod. Not a fan at all as of D2.

I'm not a fan of KoC's self-lynch vote D1 either. His attitude isn't my favorite, but I'd feel just a tad more comfortable saving him than MSSK or SG. But anyway, I obviously support a RestFermata wagon--for me, the safest idea.

Vote: RestFermata

[lord_hur]

I don't understand lord_hur's continued accusation of Caboose. How can he continue to attack Caboose now that he is cleared as town? If Caboose was mafia, the game would be over. We've entered the next voting stage, so he needs to lose the tunnel vision and look for other pairs.

Town loses when all 3 scum are voted, not when the first one is. Caboose can still be scum.

[Caboose]

If Caboose was mafia, the game would be over.

No it wouldn't.

That self vote doesn't give me a warm, fuzzy feeling.