Open 873: PYP: Anime Music & Memes - Game Over!

[Ydrasse]

i grow increasingly more okay with not listening to people below me in the draft but you dont see me complaining

Oh look, I think town marci came back to the thread lol

is it just bcuz she’s confrontational?

[Ydrasse]

like that doesn’t really .... say a lot i guess ai only annoyance to me

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Why are you people so american

GreyICE, with an E. ahahah

[Lukewarm]

While i drift to sleep let me do some freestyle rambles about my husband and his alignment.

greyice is a player everyolen should be afraid of because he is adeptly skilled at doing what he does. what he does is a very aggressive attack, good defensive understanding of his positional advantages and weaknesses and utilizing all tools on deck to ensure his wincons are played to.

essentially, he plays mafia like he plays a deckbuilder. reliable is best, replicatable is better and being passive gets you nowhere but a loss.

so it's hard to read him just on what he does because he might be building for a wincon that doesn't involve you having much time alive, or even showing off to you that he's scum.

so i choose to read the negative space around him.

like, if he has good logic, bonus. But what's that logic causing in a ripple efffect around him?

Well, pressuring Unwnd as a primary entry to the game while unwnd is the top wagon doesn't garner him much town cred if unwnd is scum, but loses him a lot if unwnd is town.

so not a bus, it's not svs

so then, what's the goal? if it's unwnd scum GI town, it's simple. He's found a read and is pushing it, correctly.

If both town, same thing but substitute "incorrectly".

But what if GreyICE is scum and Unwnd is town? what does greyice gain here?

he doesn't gain thread control, for sure

he's low on lots of player lists on read wise, so he could easily die from a missed shot

there's not a lot that is gained unless Unwnd was on the right track with Luke.

And this was a follow up to prevent a Luke elimination.

but even then, this is the 5th vote on the wagon? so it's not like he needed to do this to protect anyone really

infact, it almost feels like it would have been better for him to push on someone scummy, who would give some push back to him and let him be townread, but never die today.

Like a cephrir vote with confidence and good logical arguments for why he's scum would have been way more ideal for him as scum, so...

reading the negative space of what he didn't do he feels town?

not that i can be 100%, but that's how i've arrived at this read

thank you for listening to traumatized girl in the dark rambling up next is AHHHHH! but who WERE the real monsters? Staring Harvey Weinstein

The first three paragraphs of this made me questioning if the reason that I originally found greyice's case to be +town to be not valid for him as a player

But then the tail end of this ended up with me generally nodding along as I was reading your thoughts

Maybe I was right for the wrong reason? lol

[Lukewarm]

i grow increasingly more okay with not listening to people below me in the draft but you dont see me complaining

Oh look, I think town marci came back to the thread lol

is it just bcuz she’s confrontational?

like that doesn’t really .... say a lot i guess ai only annoyance to me

I feel like that if she was scum strarting to gather suspicion and votes, she would feel the need to do something to turn it around outside of being max confrontational with everyone suspecting her.

My view of Marci's internal monologue as scum is a constant refrain of "I CANT LET ME TEAM DOWN " -- and that pressure, to help her team, which does not exist in how she approaches playing town, I think would have forced her to take a different approach

[Cephrir]

I actually find GrayIce’s take over explainy.
But I don’t really recall them being explainy as either alignment. So I dunno what to do with that, if anything. It does bother me though so I guess I lean scum on it.

I don't believe I have ever encountered GrayIce before, so no real point of reference. For me, it was more that they were happily flying under the radar, and then skyrocketed them selves into the spot light, when most scum players are kinda happy being under the radar

GreyIce is definitely a player you can't read the way you would read an ordinary rando.

[Lukewarm]

Apparently she is a pirate in her internal monologue lmao

[Cephrir]

In a post bloodstained world, is putting an eye patch on your avatar a scumclaim

[Lukewarm]

Even then that feels weak because Ceph is on the smallest wagon, Luke. And has posted since then.

So I don't detect a point at which he intends to go with the crowd.

Taly

His vote on me was quite literally following STD's vote onto me lmao

[Lukewarm]

Hmm

I don't know either of them enough to discern the significance. But it is a good note to ISO check there if there is time to deep dive.

LLD/Ceph
Marci/Ydra
Luke/unwnd/Dragons

Peta in loose association to any of these groups

Taly

Taly, I cannot for the life of me figure out what methodology was used to make these pairings, or what that criteria would need to be for peta to be able to loosely slot into any of them. Elaborate?

[Lukewarm]

I could see an argument that ydra and marci were hyping each other up and then ydra faded followed by marci I suppose?

I’m still not scumreading any of the last 3

What are your thoughts on STD?

[Ydrasse]

im bussing

[notscience]

I don’t really understand the push on him

I could just have a soft spot for the memeing I suppose? I’m really confused about this whole dynamic between him and unwnd

[petapan]

I don’t really understand the push on him

probably because i don't actually have a case

and i'm not sure i could construct one

but it's something i feel, right now

[petapan]

im bussing

im disgusting

[notscience]

If you can figure it out lemme know thx

[Lukewarm]

I don’t really understand the push on him

I could just have a soft spot for the memeing I suppose? I’m really confused about this whole dynamic between him and unwnd

Okay, well here are my thoughts. I got two things right now, which are his approach with me, and then his pivot onto unwnd, and my thoughts on the two are kinda linked.

Starting with me, I think that he started our dialogue already with the intent on calling me scum and voting me.

Our conversation started here

Spoiler:

luke

did you ever consider unwnd could be scum trying to push you

in case it was missed amongst all me memes

You can see that he was already setting up the idea that I was not considering scum unwnd, which ended up being the exact reason he cast his vote onto me.

Which, sure, if he were town with a suspicion that I was tmi'ing him, that could be visable in his initial approach to me, but what stands out to me is actually his responses to me. To answer his question, I spent quite a bit of time explaining why I thought that unwnd's push came from town unwnd

Spoiler:

luke

did you ever consider unwnd could be scum trying to push you

in case it was missed amongst all me memes

Yeah, but I landed on him more likely to be town for it. Hold on Ill grab a quote

During this interaction, I have been thinking that you seem more likely to be town for it. I don't think of myself as an easy target, especially after several other people had started voicing town reads on me. So I don't feel like I am a convenient place to go. You seem reading my posts really closely for possible alignment indicators, when if you were scum I would be a fairly easy person to scum read. Both because it is common, and because of your history of confidently declaring me town in our past games. IF you were just trying to get me to town read you, it seems like you could just imitate that. Given fact that in our last game you repped in an immediately declared a read on me.

-- and it got me to town read you (is how that thought ended in my head, but it apparently did not make it to the post)

Basically, at the time that unwnd started pushing me, I was being town read by quite a few people. And there is a history of me town reading him for town reading me.

So it seems like the easier path as scum would be to town read me there.

It seems *less* like that is a stance that makes sense now that more people are expressing doubt on me, where it seems easier for scum to see me as a target. But at the time that he started, it felt that way

But in response, he did not actually *engage* with any of that, to see if he bought my town read, to see if it makes sense if I was confidently town reading him in this scenario, or anything. All of which SHOULD matter, if he is trying to figure out if I am treating unwnd like he is town because I am tmi'ing him as town, or if I am treating him as town because I am reading him as town.

Instead of actually engageing with what I am saying to see if my read makes sense, he just keeps pushing forward the idea that he set up, which was "luke is treating unwnd as town, and is therfore scum"

Spoiler:

i get you think unwnd is town but you seem to have no doubt that you'll be able to point to this game to teach unwnd a lesson

if he's town

VOTE: lukewarm

And even as he does so, he is openly saying that it is a weak read, but it is where he is at at that point

my point is you almost act like you know that he is

i dunno it's not a great read

but it's also not a great look

----

Okay, that is his interaction with me, but then what caught my eye was when he turned on unwnd during their fight, he said this

i think you're being calculating and performative and that's why i think you're scum. i encourage people to look at your iso and determine for themselves if they agree or not. i would bring examples but i'm too busy being hysterical right now and can't bring myself to do it.

but an example is the "this makes my skin crawl" thing said to luke about his comment on peta and lld solving the game for him.

Unwnd made that post about me in post 308.
STD made his case against me as scum elading up to post 832.
STD and Unwnd get into it, and then
STD makes that post saying how bad unwnd's 308 post was so clearly bad and people should look back at it with post 943


That timeline does not make a lot of sense to me, if he really felt that way about unwnd's post when he read unwnds. If he felt like unwnds posts around posts 308 were showing him as "calculating and performative" and while reading those posts, they "made his skin crawl" why was he off focused on me with what he himself described as "it's not a great read." around 832? And conversely, if his case on me was the best scum ping that he had around post 832, what part of his fight with unwnd would make him suddenly *realize* that unwnd's posting in the 300s were so terrible?

It looked to me, like he was getting into it with unwnd, and felt the need to put a vote into it. And that was the first thing that he thought of as an angle to push unwnd. Not that it was a concern about unwnd that existed when he was reading the game prior to getting into that argument.

[Dunnstral]

When Lukewarm says "here are my thoughts" and follows with a massive wall post where he digs into something, and he does this multiple times, that's a pretty strong indication that they are town IMO

[Dunnstral]

I'm thinking Unwnd and GrayIca are town

[Lukewarm]

This is a note for myself to go back to post 649+ when I get back on

[petapan]

If you can figure it out lemme know thx

i'm chewing on it because i want to at least put the feelings into words but i am certainly not completely confident that i wanna grab the steering wheel and hardshove it thru, but then i'm not sure i'm gonna get that type of read day 1


what i am confident in is that unwnd is a bad wagon and lld and i are both going to drop the shield there

if i had to guess why it's grown larger than any wagon i would speculate that scum are taking advantage of the overall lack of cohesion elsewhere and a few misguided votes there to make that wagon larger and possibly seem inevitable

[Dunnstral]

if i had to guess why it's grown larger than any wagon i would speculate that scum are taking advantage of the overall lack of cohesion elsewhere and a few misguided votes there to make that wagon larger and possibly seem inevitable

So you think that mafia are voting unwnd right now?

[unwnd]

When Lukewarm says "here are my thoughts" and follows with a massive wall post where he digs into something, and he does this multiple times, that's a pretty strong indication that they are town IMO

Yep

VOTE: Save the Dragons

[unwnd]

Had faith in you Luke

[Taly]

Even then that feels weak because Ceph is on the smallest wagon, Luke. And has posted since then.

So I don't detect a point at which he intends to go with the crowd.

Taly

His vote on me was quite literally following STD's vote onto me lmao

to which he jumped onto

unwnd

shortly after

Hmm

I don't know either of them enough to discern the significance. But it is a good note to ISO check there if there is time to deep dive.

LLD/Ceph
Marci/Ydra
Luke/unwnd/Dragons

Peta in loose association to any of these groups

Taly

Taly, I cannot for the life of me figure out what methodology was used to make these pairings, or what that criteria would need to be for peta to be able to loosely slot into any of them. Elaborate?

iM eCcEnTrIC GEt oVeR iT

LLD/Ceph

was because

notty

was following at their dynamic looked weird so I wanted to see if that had anything juicy

Marci/Ydra

because there are solid reasons to sus

Ydra

but

Ydra

also sus'es

Marci

who is also pretty suspected, which is worth discerning

Luke/unwnd/Dragons

because of the spicy votes yesterday and because my other headmates didnt vibe with

unwnds

progression on both of the other slots

peta

is a good to throw in anywhere here because he is both mindmelding with

ceph

but also scumreading both

marci/ydra

, and it's interesting contextually given that unwnd is the largest wagon

so yeah

dO YoU uNDerStAnD Me nOW?