Crackers! Mafia -- Game Over. See page 50

[roflcopter]

please note how ckd's insistence that i must be buddying up to des is pretty much admitting that he knows des is town

[Adel]

See this post for a little more explanation about the mechanics of this game.

˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚

votecount as of post 125

_{with 14 alive, 8 will lynch before deadline}

˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚

¬Battle Mage:

3

:Raging Rabbit, Korts, SensFan
Raging Rabbit:

2

:Elmo, destructor
Kison:

2

:DrippingGoofball, Guardian
Korts:

1

:Battle Mage,
Guardian:

1

:Kison
vollkan:

1

:vollkan
roflcopter:

1

:curiouskarmadog
curiouskarmadog:

1

:roflcopter

No Lynch:

none

not voting:

2

:Yosarian2, ZazieR

˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚˚

Day 1's deadline is December 6th at 16:40(UTC)

Countdown timer to deadline

[curiouskarmadog]

i'm not about to give a playbook as to what makes someone seem protown to me. you're trying really hard to make this about something it isn't. bringing in the sk game, for example, is an unnecessary distraction.

Back up your statement..quit avoiding it..you used the terms not me...I am calling bullshit on you.

Des, gut (page 4)..couple posts caught my attention...but now this is just too much

[destructor]

Kison, you openly called it a joke. Maybe you are distancing, but it makes sense to me that you were playing along with DGB, so I'm not reading into it any more than is warranted. BM's tone might have been jokey as well, but I don't see what the point of implicating Sens was.

[roflcopter]

Des, gut (page 4)..couple posts caught my attention...

ckd, gut (page 5)..couple posts caught my attention...

[destructor]

Des, gut (page 4)..couple posts caught my attention...but now this is just too much

I'm rereading his posts on page 4. Why'd they make you think he was a better vote than Korts?

[curiouskarmadog]

Des, gut (page 4)..couple posts caught my attention...

ckd, gut (page 5)..couple posts caught my attention...

again, i am not asking you to defend your vote..I am asking you to explain to me (for the fourth time) why you felt Des is Being town versus acting town.

[curiouskarmadog]

again, gut...not a case.

I didnt like these questions on page 3..who thinks anyone is town on Page 3 of Day 1...I thought maybe he was trying to get conversation started..but just seemed too forced to me.

i love starting wagons

dgb, who do you think is most likely town?

vollkan, who do you think is most likely town?

kison, what do you think of bm?

We should let the SK kill some Mafia for us first.

1. roflcopter
2. Yosarian2
3. Raging Rabbit
4. Kison

i'm on that shortlist why?

more interestingly, yosarian is on that list why?

again, questions to get things started?..maybe...why does he not ask about RR and Kison?...sometime just doesnt feel right.

still waiting for vollkan to respond to me

to me, just seems like someone who is trying to look like they are scum hunting...again this is just a couple pages into the game.

added the buddying up manuver I had to vote to see what happened.

and look at the reaction I got.

OMGUS votes me..and refuses to back up his statements...he knows I caught him in a load a bullshit and he trying to avoid admitting it.

so my vote is in the right place.


and Des, Korts was a random vote...this one, not so much...seems like a silly question.

Des question for you...what do you think the difference is between "acting" protown and "being" protown? Do you understand whay he is saying?...What do you think you have done that deems you "being" protown versus just "acting" so? These are his terms not mine....curious if you have a clue...

[curiouskarmadog]

please note how ckd's insistence that i must be buddying up to des is pretty much admitting that he knows des is town

Again you are deflecting...YOU are the one that "cleared" Des already...I dont think anyone is town...I am sure as hell not going to vouch for anyone this early in the game...why do you feel comfortable doing it?

or is this just another question you are going to avoid..

[DrippingGoofball]

Now I'm confused.

Because I caught all three scum, and now there's a fourth.

CKD...

3 scum + SK?

No, I also caught the SK, that would be vollkan.

[DrippingGoofball]

His suspicions are over the top, uncalled for, and not based in reality. Squirming, flailing scum...

unvote, vote: CKD

[destructor]

and Des, Korts was a random vote...this one, not so much...seems like a silly question.

Well, if Korts is scum, he could call your vote random with more confidence.

Des question for you...what do you think the difference is between "acting" protown and "being" protown? Do you understand whay he is saying?...What do you think you have done that deems you "being" protown versus just "acting" so? These are his terms not mine....curious if you have a clue...

Acting and being are kind of mutually exclusive. So far as I can tell, we can't say what someone "is" without extra role-based info, but we can comment on how they act.

I don't think I should try to explain what rofl was saying. I'm not even sure myself.


I was hoping RR would post before I unvoted him, but I have to agree that ckd's attack on rofl looks like noise to me.

Unvote
Vote: curiouskarmadog

[vollkan]

He needs to BUTTER UP EVERYBODY. Not just townies, not just mafiates, but every player in the game.

The hypothesis of SK-vollkan buttering up everybody is perfectly valid, but as is the hypothesis of vollkan (alignment independent) simply expressing enthusiasm for this game.

The self-vote is a symptom of vollkan's solitary proclivities, proclivities that include killing players at night without benefit of team discussions.

I must have missed the logical links between self-vote and being solitary, and between solitariness and solo murdering.

Also, it's self-bus'ing. I mean, he can only bus himself. He's doing it to get town cred in case he goes down in flames.

I'd strongly encourage any SK/s to adopt this excellent strategy.

Question is, do we lynch the SK or do we lynch the mafia? This game is like shooting fish in a barrel.

Barrel of what?

vollkan, who do you think is most likely town?

Me.

again,

gut

...not a case.

Unvote, Vote: CKD

Obv scum.

I didnt like these questions on page 3..who thinks anyone is town on Page 3 of Day 1...I thought maybe he was trying to get conversation started..but just seemed too forced to me.

What do you mean by "forced"?

sometime just doesnt

feel

right.

*vomit*

to me, just seems like someone who is trying to look like they are scum hunting

Reaching. I don't see how you can say that such questions are indicative of an attempt to appear scumhunting, rather than just early an effort to scum hunt or at least spur discussion.

[Kison]

des is so town

Why?

unvote, vote: ckd

scum hate it so much when town starts clearing other town, it makes it so much harder to get mislynches

Except that he makes a good point. Why have you 'cleared'(your words) destructor so early in the game?

We should let the SK kill some Mafia for us first.

1. roflcopter
2. Yosarian2
3. Raging Rabbit
4. Kison

i'm on that shortlist why?

more interestingly, yosarian is on that list why?

again, questions to get things started?..maybe...why does he not ask about RR and Kison?...sometime just doesnt feel right.

He already explained this. He asked about Yosarian2 because he was the one who hadn't done anything to indicate he was scum because he hadn't even posted yet.

I understand and agree with FuriousKarmaDog on one point. roflcopter said in his own words:

1) "des is so town"
2) "scum hate it so much when town starts clearing other town, it makes it so much harder to get mislynches"
3) "i'm not about to give a playbook as to what makes someone seem protown to me."

Note he is implies he is indeed clearing Destructor as Town at this point in the game and does indeed avoid stating what gives him this feeling.

I disagree with just about everything else he said, primarily the buddying - I didn't get that impression nor do I think his focus on Yosarian2 from the list is bothering. I'd like roflcopter to point out what des has done to give him the level of confidence he has that he is Town. I'd demand FuriousDog to do the same with his 'gut' but he already has.

More on the next episode of Crackers Mafia, Kison's PoV.

[curiouskarmadog]

the vote is on page 5...it is gut..there is nothing more to go on this early in the game...

of course I am fucking reaching..it is early in the game..i am trying to scum hunt. lynch me if you need to for my gut vote on page 5...essentially you are voting me for the exact same reason, vollkan..you think i am reaching and your gut says that is scummy....I think he is trying to earn friends..it was a gut reaction..which is why I said in my vote "lets see where this goes" and didnt present a case with it. Vollkan you have seen me vote on my gut NUMEROUS times as town in the passed...funny you seem to be forgetting that now..why is that? Out of everyone in the game YOU should know I vote gut frequently..we have even discussed it before...noted.

[curiouskarmadog]

and Des, you are voting me why?..becauase you think it is noise?

but you said yourself, you dont understand what he is saying...why doesnt he get at least a question from you? He has cleared you...he says you are "being" protown and not "acting" it..but cant back up the statement when I call him on his bullshit...

[curiouskarmadog]

for the record, I cant find the game where vollkan and I discussed gut. I thought it was california trilogy but there vollkan explained why he hated gut votes. he also discusses why he hates gut votes in Invitational, but I was lynched at that point. I know you have busted my balls before about gut votes when we both were town(at least I think you were town)...and I know I told you at that time, that I hate second guessing myself and on Day 1...all we have to go on is GUT and FEELINGS..like it or not...this conversation is so familiar

also vollkan, those questions seemed out of place..it didnt set right with me...this OF COURSE is reaching...I stated several times it wasnt a case...I am not trying to parade it as anything else..it seemed force because they didnt make any sense..."vollkan, who do you think is town" (or something of the like) on page 3-4 IS forced. it looks like someone trying to LOOK like they are doing something without really doing anything.

what I really dont like is his bullshit about Des being town and there is a difference between acting town and being town....it cant back this up anything...how is Des being town versus acting like town 4 pages into the game...it is ridiculous...not sure why he is getting a pass from you on this.

[Korts]

CKD's vote seems to root in OMGUS. After you've justified your suspicion of rofl with "page 4 gut", why do you feel the need for rofl to justify his read on des?

If ckd is scum, is his vote still random?

What do you mean? Scum don't randomvote?

He didn't say why he voted for rofl either, so why say that was a better place for his vote?

He implied reasoning ("vote is boring... and I think lacking"). Are you implying I should be suspicious of CKD for that unvote?

I can understand asking rofl that question the first time. I don't see as much merit in persisting for an answer like you have, though. I'm not convinced that your play so far is pro-town, so I wonder about ckd leaving your wagon.

I like my questions answered. Avoidance of them, however minor or pointless they seem to be, is a scumtell and is done for a reason, therefore the more they're avoided, the more I want them answered.

Incidentally, rofl, you may now answer.

[destructor]

Also, it's self-bus'ing. I mean, he can only bus himself. He's doing it to get town cred in case he goes down in flames.

I'd strongly encourage any SK/s to adopt this excellent strategy.

Whether this is what's happening here or not, if you swap bussing with distancing, what DGB says has merit. A Mafiate can die and still win. SKs need to stay alive, so implying that you're willing to be lynched is alluding to not having survival in your win condition.


I think rofl's "clearing" of me is being blown out of proportion. I said I'm not sure of what rofl meant, but I have an idea of what rofl's train of thought was. I'm not saying more than that because it's not my place to speak for him.

and Des, you are voting me why?..becauase you think it is noise?

I think it's an unreasonably reachy argument. There is no reason arguments and cases have to be weak just because it's early in the game. What you're doing isn't even prodding and probing.

I stated several times it wasnt a case...I am not trying to parade it as anything else

I don't buy this. It's like you're saying you're only testing the waters. Here are some quotes:

first major scum move this game..

vote in the right place.

because I dont think you are "clearing" people right now. you are trying to buddy up with people right now.

he knows I caught him in a load a bullshit and he trying to avoid admitting it.

These all sound like you're definitely accusing rofl of being scum, more than just sniffing around.

it looks like someone trying to LOOK like they are doing something without really doing anything.

What do you make of Korts' contributions before page 5?

[destructor]

Korts, If ckd is scum he's going to be conscious of whether or not he's voting for someone who's on his team. He unvoted you and moved to rofl without giving much more reason than his first vote.

ckd saying ""vote is boring... and I think lacking" only tells me that he didn't think he should vote for

you

anymore. You aren't curious about what reason he had to vote rofl in the first place? You've said his vote is OMGUS, but he voted rofl before they started their exchange. ckd can't justify his vote retrospectively and you're ignoring this.

I like my questions answered. Avoidance of them, however minor or pointless they seem to be, is a scumtell and is done for a reason, therefore the more they're avoided, the more I want them answered.

He said he'd answer them after vollkan replied. Generally speaking, what was wrong with that? Did you think he wouldn't?

[destructor]

DGB said rofl and I are 100% town, which seems a bigger statement than rofl ever made. I'm wondering why ckd and Kison are making rofl the bigger deal here and in fact saying nothing about DGB at all.

[destructor]

quadruple post

Vollkan, do you have a problem with rofl's gut read of me?

[roflcopter]

DGB said rofl and I are 100% town, which seems a bigger statement than rofl ever made. I'm wondering why ckd and Kison are making rofl the bigger deal here and in fact saying nothing about DGB at all.

god what an astute comment! des is

so

town its like blindingly obvious.

Avoidance of them, however minor or pointless they seem to be, is a scumtell...

so you think avoiding any question ever is automatically a scumtell? thats just an unreasonable statement.

...and is done for a reason

yes this is true

Incidentally, rofl, you may now answer.

dgb and vollkan were two people i personally found marginally more likely than average to be protown at that stage, and i wanted their opinions on who

they

thought likely to be protown because i like to see scum squirm if townspeople start to recognize one another early. as happened.

on a related note, vollkan's answer was legitimate, but not what i had been looking for. too late now though.

and ckd, i have been saying that my town read on des is a gut read just like your scum read on me is, not that my vote on you is gut. my vote on you is perfectly well reasoned, and has nothing to do with oh my god sucking you.

kison deserves some closer scrutiny

[SensFan]

I actually agree with ckd on all of this. Having a gut scum read on page 4-5 is not the same at alll of claiming to have a gut town read on page 3.

[roflcopter]

I actually agree with ckd on all of this. Having a gut scum read on page 4-5 is not the same at alll of claiming to have a gut town read on page 3.

whats the difference, exactly?