Newbie 74 - Game Over

[Talitha]

Haven't managed to do my re-read yet sorry. But sticking with my vote.

[Talitha]

Here you go:

Locus: 50%
inHim: 50%
Jagged: 40%
keiron: 30%
Myopia: 20%
JD: 10%
Tal: 0%

And that adds up to 200% too, clever aren't I?

[Locus Cosecant]

Mind explaining why inHim and I top your list?

[Talitha]

It's not that you've done anything particularly incriminating - it's more that others (eg. Myopia) have given me a better feeling about their townieness, than you have.

[Locus Cosecant]

Could you explain, then, why you think Myopia etc. are pro-town? Are these suspicions based on anything, or...

Speaking of which, why do you suspect JDTAY at a whopping 10%? Wasn't it you who said we essentially had to believe his claim?

[Myopia]

Well with two votes on me ive thought about fading into the background a bit but a) that would be contrary to the way ive decided to play and b) it would probably look sus in any event and get me hung even faster.

I cant do percentages because to be honest at the moment objectively I dont have a lot to go on. Only little things. Ive been podding and proking at those little things to see where things end up. Unfortunately that has apparantly appeared suspicious to some. I think though that its at least deriving some info so even if I did it will be of some help to the town.

Most of my thoughts at the moment are subjective because they are based on my personal knowledge that i am a townie. Accordingly its not so helpful for anyone else

The scum havent had a chance to talk yet. I was thinking about what I would do. If I were inexperienced scum I would probably just lay low and try and hang an innocent who stands out (like me) to get through to day 2. If I was experienced scum (obviously harder for me to extrapolate) I dunno I guess Id try and have an obvious innocent patsie for the day 2 vote.

My view at the moment:

jagged - hes lurked (or been genuinely busy) way too much for me to have any clue at all - honestly id be unhappy to go to the next day without hearing more from him

talitha - objectively i have no idea whatever. subjectively shes got a lot more innocent to me at least in the short term in saying i look pro-town and not just because its a relief. if she was scum i think it would have been very very easy for her to push a bandwagon on me (with two votes already) by saying she thought I was very suspicous maybe without even having to vote. then again maybe shes saving me for hanging tommorow when its critical but thats a stretch.

inhim - again he hasnt posted enough. I have no idea. talitha is obviously sus about him but I have no idea about what. have the feeling they have something going on from a past game. i guess im a bit sus generally of an experienced player in a newbie game who doesnt post much. it must be a bit of a public service exercise so why go to the trouble if your not genuinely interested in helping out new players? if youve gone that far why lurk unless your scum? obviously though hes indicated he has had time issues. subjectively again he goes down a tad for me for a similar reason to talitha.

jdtay - i was sure jdtay was scum because the claim seemed to have so many holes. obviously i was wrong. the simple fact that noone has counterclaimed doc makes him 95% innocent. i would still like to hear his thoughts about the game though. Im getting the feeling that he plays the game for the individual achievement and a town victory with him dead at the start would not be particularly satisfying for him.

locus - has been pretty dead set against me from my first substantive post - apparantly for me linking him to talitha. I dont agree with his logic. Not at all. I think my comments were perfectly fair in the context they were given. however the simple fact that hes been fairly consistent in his suspicions (he switched briefly to jdtay for obvious reasons and then switched back) makes it a bit obvious. If im hung and revealed to be town he will look quite scummy.

kieron - is a bit all over the place. I dont agree with his logic. I dont agree with his assessment of who is helpful. i dont think hes taking into account the fact that several players arent really posting. taking offense at the newb/experienced distinction is a bit silly. 4 players in this game are technically newbs (although it looks like locus has more experience than the rest of us so maybe he fits in the middle). everyone is a newb at some point. the issue is whether your logic stacks up not how new you are. because i dont agree with his logic he looks more scummy to me but then its all a bit obvious.

So to sum up:

- jdtay - innocent
- talitha, locus - slightly less innocent than the others
- inhim, jagged - medium
- kieron - slightly more scummy

Who to hang today? Well its a bit disconcerting as I seem to be the front runner but im not really sure at this point. Id like to hear from the lurkers and jdtay.

[Talitha]

Could you explain, then, why you think Myopia etc. are pro-town? Are these suspicions based on anything, or...
Speaking of which, why do you suspect JDTAY at a whopping 10%? Wasn't it you who said we essentially had to believe his claim?

Please don't put too much emphasis on the numbers i have used. They're rough. In a game of mafia the only person you should trust 100% is yourself.

Why I think certain players are more likely to be innocent than others: its just my gut reaction as I read through. I'm sorry to be vague.

[inHimshallibe]

Ugh. I had a long post, but it got wiped. I'll post tomorrow with something possibly interesting, but for now, I'm off to bed.

[JDTAY]

Are we all ready to lynch Tally yet? This day is getting long, even for a newbie game. It's not that I want us to make a quick and uninformed lynch, but haven't we all agreed that Tally is suspicious? You can't let Day 1 drag on forever or you'll kill the pace of the whole game; we'll have much more info to work with tomorrow.

[Locus Cosecant]

She's third on my list, after Myopia and kieron, although the way she places me at the top of her list and refuses to give me any justification for it is... worrisome to say the least. It would be nice if you gave me something to respond to, Talitha.

confirm vote: Myopia

, though if a wagon on kieron or Talitha got big, I wouldn't want to Nader the voting.

[Myopia]

vote kieron

for the reasons stated

[Myopia]

She's third on my list, after Myopia and kieron, although the way she places me at the top of her list and refuses to give me any justification for it is... worrisome to say the least. It would be nice if you gave me something to respond to, Talitha.

confirm vote: Myopia

, though if a wagon on kieron or Talitha got big, I wouldn't want to Nader the voting.

imo, this is the scummiest thing weve heard from you yet locus. so basically your willing to jump on any of three different bandwagons, me, kieron or talitha???

[Locus Cosecant]

imo, this is the scummiest thing weve heard from you yet locus. so basically your willing to jump on any of three different bandwagons, me, kieron or talitha???

Don't get so defensive, Myopia. I'm just making it clear who I would be willing to vote for at this point, so that the town knows. Any one of the three seems like it has a decent chance of finding scum. I'm sorry if you're upset that your name appears upon the list, but...

[Locus Cosecant]

imo, this is the scummiest thing weve heard from you yet locus. so basically your willing to jump on any of three different bandwagons, me, kieron or talitha???

Don't get so defensive, Myopia. I'm just making it clear who I would be willing to vote for at this point, so that the town knows. Any one of the three seems like it has a decent chance of finding scum. I'm sorry if you're upset that your name appears upon the list, but...

[Myopia]

Defensive? You're already voting for me. I dont exactly have too much more to worry about from you do I

I called you focused before. Now you just seem indiscriminate. Isnt leaping from bandwagon to bandwagon a scum trait? Arent you proposing just that?

What about talitha? You didnt seem to find her a bit suspicious until she identified you as slightly more likely to be scummy. Now your happy to hang her? Pot. Kettle.

[Myopia]

Jdtay could you explain why we should hang talitha. Why is she more suspicious in your eyes than say inhim?

Your obviously a very experienced player. Your now the only confirmed innocent. To be blunt, it would be great to get some useful and objective information before you have an accident walking home tonight.

[Talitha]

It would be nice if you gave me something to respond to, Talitha.

But I'm not even voting for you. I simply responded to the request for percentages!

And I'm not budging my vote from inHim. At least not until he starts posting some decent content.

[Locus Cosecant]

Defensive? You're already voting for me. I dont exactly have too much more to worry about from you do I

That's not what I meant, Myopia. I meant the intimidation tactic of "oh, person X suspects me, so I'll throw suspicion on him".

I called you focused before. Now you just seem indiscriminate. Isnt leaping from bandwagon to bandwagon a scum trait? Arent you proposing just that?

Crap logic + misrepresentation of my position. I have much first-hand experience with games that stall out and then randomly lynch someone at deadline. I do not want this to be one of these games, so I make sure the town knows where my voting pattern is right now.

This is not a bandwagon leaping move at all. It's exactly the opposite. Now that I've said who I suspect, if I were leap opportunistically on a bandwagon to kill someone who wasn't on the list, I would have some explaining to do to the town. If I'm scum, I've just weakened my position noticeably. And you say this seems scummy?

What about talitha? You didnt seem to find her a bit suspicious until she identified you as slightly more likely to be scummy. Now your happy to hang her?

Yes, the percentages she posted were what put her on the list. I'm as suspicious to her as the person she's voting, but she won't give me anything to defend myself against. Even after she said "we have to believe the claimed doc", she still puts JDTAY on the list at 10%.

And I take issue with you saying I didn't find her the least bit suspicious earlier. I just had no particular reason to suspect her above anyone else. In fact, I seem to recall saying something along the lines of "Please think about these things a little more before appealing to a player [Talitha] who, for all we know, could be scum." Saying that I found her utterly unsuspicious before is a flat-out lie.

[inHimshallibe]

Mind explaining why inHim and I top your list?

I find this post fairly suspicious. I think it's scummy play to bring someone into the picture with yourself. And, I feel scum would post this in hopes that the town would not suspect them because they defended someone else.

And then, I really distrust anyone who posts something along the lines of "If I were scum" or "Do you really think I would have done this as scum?" I find this a fairly weak defense, because there's no telling what scum would do to save their skin. This approach is also very manipulative, because it would tend to make a reader automatically assume the posting player is not scum, a very useful mafia tactic. So, along those lines, I suspect Myopia and Locus for posting these hypothetical statements.

Locus elicited a negative reaction from me twice in the same page, and I now find him most suspicious.

unvote, vote : Locus

[JDTAY]

Well, Myopia, you see, Tally's being evasive. She's specifically trying to avoid opposition with her passive, fact-stating posts, and right now she's voting for someone who is pretty much ignoring her.

[Locus Cosecant]

I find this post fairly suspicious. I think it's scummy play to bring someone into the picture with yourself. And, I feel scum would post this in hopes that the town would not suspect them because they defended someone else.

Well, I couldn't very well ask "Why do I top your list?", now could I? That would have been inaccurate, because I shared the top spot. I wasn't defending you, just wanting Talitha to post

reasons

behind her statements.

And then, I really distrust anyone who posts something along the lines of "If I were scum" or "Do you really think I would have done this as scum?" I find this a fairly weak defense, because there's no telling what scum would do to save their skin.

I agree, saying "my actions hurt me if I'm mafia" is not a very strong general defense, because if those actions draw suspicion away, then they aren't hurting me. However, when someone points to the very actions that would make my position as mafia weaker as being scummy, I need to point this out. How can they be scummy actions if they're harmful to the mafia?

This approach is also very manipulative, because it would tend to make a reader automatically assume the posting player is not scum

Now, be fair. It's in my interest as a pro-town player not to be thought of as scum. If I get lynched, we just mislynched, after all.

Locus elicited a negative reaction from me twice in the same page, and I now find him most suspicious.

unvote, vote : Locus

At least I post twice in the same page.

[mathcam]

Official Vote Count:

Myopia (2, Locus, Keiron)
Tally (1, JD)
inHim (1, Tally)
keiron (1, Myopia)
Locus (1, inHim)

Not Voting: jagged

Cam

[Myopia]

And then, I really distrust anyone who posts something along the lines of "If I were scum" or "Do you really think I would have done this as scum?" I find this a fairly weak defense, because there's no telling what scum would do to save their skin. This approach is also very manipulative, because it would tend to make a reader automatically assume the posting player is not scum, a very useful mafia tactic. So, along those lines, I suspect Myopia and Locus for posting these hypothetical statements.

Locus elicited a negative reaction from me twice in the same page, and I now find him most suspicious.

unvote, vote : Locus

Agree that the "I wouldnt have done that if I was scum defence" has little or no objective value. Disagree that conjecture about what the scum might do by putting yourself in their position is necessarily suspicious. And while such comments may not be particularly useful to everyone else while your own innocence is the very question it might well become useful after your dead.

[kieron]

I'm waiting for Jagged to vote...

[mathcam]

JC has been prodded.

Cam