Open 853 - PYP X/Y S_S [game over!]

[Datisi]

vote count 1.15

with 14 votes in play, it takes 8 to make a decision. day 1 ends in (expired on 2022-06-14 01:30:00).

yeet

humaneatingmonkey [5]:

Dwlee99, implosion, Roden, Aristeia, MathBlade

MathBlade [3]:

Gamma Emerald, Save The Dragons, Harley Quinn

Aristeia [2]:

humaneatingmonkey, Enchant

Dwlee99 [1]:

Ausuka

implosion [1]:

Wallflower

Not Voting [2]:

Bellaphant, Titus

mod notes

~ humaneatingmonkey v/la wednesday to friday.
~ Gamma Emerald v/la for a week.
~ dual mod iso.
~ this is mod note.

flavour

[humaneatingmonkey]

I'm gonna narrate and reflect on my memories from before I left (as an exercise because this game fell off my brain's priority list) and then I'm going to share my impressions of everything that has happened so far.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Thank you for waiting for me everybody.

[humaneatingmonkey]

...nevermind that's too much work i'm just going to iso everyone in my wagon like i've been doing

[humaneatingmonkey]

Without even seeing the other slots, Dwlee's vote stands out to me because it started out as a sheep on Ari because of how impressed they were of Ari's game.

I think HEM asked why I voted him — Last time I saw Aristeia like this she nailed Prism into a coffin. She gets my baa privilege until I have more effort into sorting personally

Be back later

I noticed it because it immediately implies Ari is town. So maybe this is Dwlee's first read? But we really didn't see much of a progression on why they thought Ari is town.

I can forgive that.

what do you think about dwlee

what do you think about HQ coming in to kind of soflty defend dwlee only

FMPOV HQ looks town for this

This is Dwlee's second read. If you squint really hard, you can almost see that it's a pocket.

But maybe that doesn't mean they're not town.

However things really break down when Math comes down hard at Dwlee. Dwlee immediately launches an OMGUS but uncharacteristically doesn't vote Math. (ignoring the urge too, they say.) I can understand if they would OMGUS as town, but what I can't understand is why they wouldn't move their vote towards Math to sort and to pressure when I'd be absent for a long time.

Now that's not town. Town wants to use their vote to pressure. Even as they approach 100% certainty, Dwlee doesn't move their vote.

I really feel Dwlee is scum.

Titus hasn’t given a reason other than “matching” and “trying”

I don’t see that here from them.

That has to be BS because you only think I'm scum rn because of things that aren't there rather than things that are. So you can't be that confident of anything

this is also a BS response from them.

MathBlade and HEM probably are SvS

Math just ignored my response to his terrible read on me

And this read was made without due consideration for what motive would scum!mathblade have for defending scum!me.

If I'm scum and Mathblade is scum, why risk their neck on protecting a buddy that has no way of defending themselves for 3 days when you score easy deepwolf points trying to woo people's confidence in you?

Here's what I'm thinking: They made the SvS read so they can still park their vote on me
And they did it without developing their read on anyone other than slots who they were 1. sheeping, 2. encouraging to townread them 3. omgusing. without regard

VOTE: Dwlee99

My vote can change as I ISO the rest of my wagon (and the rest of the game)

[humaneatingmonkey]

actually implo's iso isn't that bad. it's well-balanced and their progression makes sense up to this post that i've been reading.

A smattering of points on hem. I'm going to do this by just going backwards through his ISO because it'll hopefully avoid common ground with previous cases (plus I think their recent play is worse than their early play). And I will start by re-mentioning this. Their most recent post is very similar, and fit in line with what I described of hem's play being aesthetic rather than material: rather than picking out specific people and targeting them, or trying to appeal to specific people on the wagon, or really making any real effort to use their wagon to find scum... they just say "watch out for people who just rode this wagon". That'd be 8 people if the wagon goes to lim. Not exactly a useful statement. In context, as a last post they're making before they won't be available for a while (and where they think they could be limmed while gone) it feels even scummier; I think natural town inclinations in that situation would be things like a final reads list or a couple specific scumreads, or even something vindictive directed at people on the wagon. But a general "this wagon on me is sus" is utterly useless to the town in the event that hem is limmed.

The closest they got to calling out specific people on the wagon was here. They called out Aristeia for a while but even got shaky on that. I think what speaks volumes on their alignment is what's absent in their ISO, rather than what's present. 122 posts and as far as I can tell they have given exactly two actual reads: a now-retracted scumread on Aristeia that is the focus of roughly half their ISO, and an "I'll die by this read" townread on Mathblade. For most of the game they've been the second-most active player and yet they've left not a trace to tie themself to any other player. This is the brunt of what I mean by asethetic rather than substantive: while they are engaging with the game, they are not making any claims, reaching any conclusions, or, to borrow from MathBlade, creating any hypotheses.

I really can't fault implo for this because

1. even though i already said that the "watch out for people who just rode this wagon" is a note for re-reading, he probably have entrenched into the idea that it's for future behavior listening to excuses from scum!me. at this point, i was handling too much stuff that i was too lazy and preoccupied (was in the hospital a lot since Sunday for labs and tests) to do anything with this game. i wouldn't count it against him that he's scumreading me for this. i would.

2. i didn't retract my scumread on ari, just that i'm saying she's the most "didn't ride this wagon" in my wagon. i still want to know how ari would describe my town game because the things she say are exclusive in my scum game are things that i recognize that are also present in my town game and i was hoping she would see that. she has been ignoring that call for a while now.

[Aristeia]

ok can you point out what lies you told about GuiltyLion in the linked meta game?

[Aristeia]

I recognize maybe I can be too confbiased at this point to give you a fair assessment

anyone other than mathblade is also welcome to let me know if the linked game is similar to HEM's play this game.

[Aristeia]

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=89094

Ari, iso me and GuiltyLion.

this is the game that HEM is trying to reference

[Aristeia]

like in that game you interact with multiple slots

you do not death tunnel GLion right off the bat with bad faith lies. so I don't really understand how it's comparable to this one.

[Aristeia]

there's like a curiosity that is missing here

[humaneatingmonkey]

Mhm i lost interest in reading implo's other posts that aren't about me which is probably a good thing because there was nothing that felt egregious about them. Their whole spat with Mathblade felt like frustrated town than scum trying to discredit Mathblade, which I considered when reading the posts.

[humaneatingmonkey]

like in that game you interact with multiple slots

you do not death tunnel GLion right off the bat with bad faith lies. so I don't really understand how it's comparable to this one.

see you characterize my play this game as a "deathtunnel" when i fact i just wanted you to get to the point. the real heat came when you threw adjectives on me that felt was designed to discredit me more than anything else

[humaneatingmonkey]

also remind me what "bad faith lies" i made to you in this game?

[Titus]

Reading aka skimming now

[Aristeia]

they are in my case

[humaneatingmonkey]

in a game with chavela (dont remember the game) she felt as if i was attacking her when in fact i was trying to sort her. have you read that one? maybe you can recognize yourself in that one.

[Aristeia]

see you characterize my play this game as a "deathtunnel" when i fact i just wanted you to get to the point. the real heat came when you threw adjectives on me that felt was designed to discredit me more than anything else

deathtunnel refers to your singular focus on me to the exclusion of sorting/caring about other slots

what adjectives I use is irrelevant to how you play the game.

[Aristeia]

in a game with chavela (dont remember the game) she felt as if i was attacking her when in fact i was trying to sort her. have you read that one? maybe you can recognize yourself in that one.

yes

your play is markedly different in that game

[Titus]

I think mathblade is much more likely to be bad!town than scum.

if mathblade is scum and hem is town, I don't think mathblade WKs him, scum!blade p much takes any mislim he can get so HEM is almost always a better lim than mathblade.

Depends on wagon setup. If he feels his vote isn't needed it sets him up for d2 and d3

[Aristeia]

it's a very well done WK if he's scum WKing for HEM

I don't have any experience with Mathblade WKing, I've seen him mostly be a to the point scumplayer

if you have any memorable scumblade WK games I'd be happy to read

[Titus]

???
imo that's a massive contradiction to the point you're making here. Titus was being exceptionally not-nice and was scum.

That is my point exactly

Default is not nice

no it isn't??????

It just is and I proved where you said Titus treats me like that every game

It’s what everyone does.

Math is ridiculous.

I could say the sky is blue or cloudy or whatever with a photograph but then we’d still get Math is moonlogicky.

No. If you have

valid,

succint

plausible and simple

theories I agree.

[Titus]

tonally he does feel like fustrated town mathblade :>

100% disagree. He doesn't feel like Math period. There's no drive at all. No push to solve. No theories. Just whatever elim HEM.

If anything, I would expect Town!Math to have a theory on scum and who is defending them since scum theory is obvious here.

[Titus]

ngl what Harley is saying is starting to resonate in my thinkpan a bit
I noticed in a prior game that nero cain tends to have reads on me that are inverse to his alignment
the only exception would be singleball games where I'm scum against him, and I think he's 50/50 on those

Why is Nero relevant here?

[MathBlade]

Ari is town

I am just at my give a fucks zero tbh