Mini 672 - Tranquility (Game Over)

[SpyreX]

Spyrex: Waiting on that case against Camn.

Ok, I'll get to work in this game some. (Posts referenced by Camn's numbers).

#0 - Jokevote Jdodge
#1 - 2: Still jokephase, but focused on the flip of terminology. Definitely not something in and of itself, but considering how ridiculous the terminology war has been it is worth merit.
#3 - 4: Baseball talk. Again, still jokephase, but not even attempting to move the game forward. Definitely not something big, but there once we get into it.
#9:

Do you mean "What is wrong with a healthy bandwagon on Rishi early in day one? ". .

The answer is.. Nothing at all. But if you think he is townie scum.. shouldn't you be asking HIM questions? Or is your method of scum-hunting to interrogate anyone who votes for you?

And if you MUST know.. I used the 4 minutes to check and make sure you only had one vote... because I don't really suspect you enough to be the 3rd vote. I'm not as impulsive as I used to be Smile

a.) More of the terminology business.
b.) The I dont suspect you enough to be the 3rd vote (this comes into play later).

#11: (Unvote in 10). Says just wanted to vote for Charter for killing her in last game (despite giving reasons "above"). Goes back to JDodge for not checking in.

#16:

I also think Stormer just made a clueless newbie error.
Though, I am not really convinced he shouldn't hang for it. Like.. is his play going to get better later on?

Also, Nameless is clearly forgetting about the first part of Roman Numeral I of the so-called "social contract".
But the internet is serious business.

@melikefood... Stormer answered my questions in post 125. Were they particularly insightful answers? No. Were they scummy? I think not, but you be the judge.

a.) Says stormer just made a newbie error.
b.) Said his responses to her questions earlier were not scummy.
c.) Says is ok with the lynch because his play wont get better.

#18: Votes Stef. Makes this comment:

Getting caught up in semantics is the scummiest way to hunt, IMO. You look like you are doing good hunting, with evidence and everything.... but you aren't. Semantics suck.
Also, the tenative nature of this accusation irritates me. Either say it's scummy.. or ask for clarification... or leave it alone. Don't bring it up and say "I'm NOT SAYING this is scummy... but blah blah blah"

(see 16)

#19:

1. I don't vote to be "with" people. I vote to pressure other people.

#20: (Various quotes)

I dispute your assertion that

early

Day One votes are or even SHOULD be based on "who one thinks is scum"

This early, I vote for pressure.

For reactions. To see who else will follow. ANd other reasons I am not even thinking of. I vote to start discussion, and to look back on later.
You have admitted that you do some of the same things.

So you see, the inconsistency is yours. You say you should vote for who you think is scummy, yet you state your vote for Stef is a "gambit".

Your inconsistencies go further.
May I point out these things about your case:

ANyway.. your case is flawed.
Do I think you are scum? No. I think that scum wouldn't build a case this large this early in the game.. .

unless they were bussing.

But, I hope you are as logical as you seem, and can admit the flaws in your case.

a.) Quantifies pressure voting to early in day one.
b.) Finds a lot of weak points in KMD's case.
c.) Comes to the result that a scum would only do this maneuver if they were bussing.

#22:

I can attempt to clear up My vote for Charter.

I felt like voting him for piling on.
HOWEVER.. I don't know how much of me wanted to vote for him just for that, and how much was because I think he is GENERALLY scummy, and how much was for killing me last game.
So, in the interest of being conservative... I checked how many votes he had on him.

Was it because I care what everyone thinks? No. It was because I was questioning my OWN motivations.

Regarding KMDs "gambit"...

KMD ... are you clearing Stef?
Was everything you threw at him Garbage?
Should I even bother reading it? Because, to be honest, I never really read your long, elaborate posts about him. I've been kind of in a hurry this week.
So, should I bother?, or was it all nonsense?

a.) Charter vote was trying to be not-metad.
--- However, more than once she has already stated that early votes are for pressure.
b.) Says never read KMD's gambit.

#23:

I tend to disagree.
I have a big test this week, so I have two choices.

a) Play fast. That is skim, post, skip some stuff.. and catch up on the weekend.

OR...

b) Don't post at all until the weekend.

I choose choice A. I EVENTUALLY read everything.. but I am very 4-dimensional about it.
I think it is better to stay in the game in a superficial way, then to put it all off for a week, don't you?

That said... regarding Stormer.
Don't get me wrong.... I come from the all-lurkers-must-die school of mafia. But it is impossible to really pin him as scum unless he will get in here and do some posting.

Regarding Stef.... I still want to question you about some things.. but I think it can wait, until this whole melikefood thing is addressed.
## Unvote: Stef

@Melikefood.. WTF is going on? Make more sense, please.

a.) Admits to "skimming" during the week and catching up on the weekend.
b.) Says lurkers should die... but wont pin Stormer unless he posts.
c.) Unvotes Stef but still has some questions.
#26

I think your Gambit would be more applicable if I had actually cited your "case".

Because wouldn't the scum-tell be jumping on a crap case?
Whereas dropping a day 1 vote on someone because you don't like something they say... that, I think, is typical. Not particularly scummy.

However, building a crap case is also rather scummy...
In fact, a great scum gambit would be to build a crap case... and then burn down any rookies who actually buy it, citing the KMD gambit. Then, even when they flip town, you can cite them "falling for the gambit" as justification for their lynch.
Additionally, if scum got busted on thier crap case, they could then cite the "KMD Gambit" as their defense!

Brilliant!

a.) Says building the crap case is scummy (in relations to the Gambit).
b.) Gives a good, solid reason why the "Gambit" is a great scum tool.
c.) Doesn't vote, pressure, anything KMD.

#28:

Regarding 245.....

I really wasn't attacking your gambit as a defense. I was just looking at it in general. I think it can be a great tool for scum. Not that I think YOU are scum..I was just saying.

Regarding your case... I was thinking how brilliant it is to cite "trying not to look scummy" and "worried about perception" as faults. Any defense one would care to muster would simply back up the case. How can I convince you I am NOT scum, without trying too hard to look like I'm Not Scum?!

Again, this is simply acedemic. I am happy to answer questions, but at this point I don't think your accusations need much of a response. You think I'm Scummy. I don't really mind.

Maybe it will help me avoid getting night-killed

Smile

a.) Again sees scummy uses of the Gambit. Says KMD isn't scum.
b.) Implies a catch22 with KMD's gambit.
c.) Says that these accusations will help avoid her getting night-killed.

#30:

### Vote Stormer.

For Pressure.

Look, dude. If this game is too much for you, and you are INNOCENT.. just replace out. Do us a favor. If you keep playing like you are, you are going to get lynched.
If you want to avoid this, your behavior needs to change.
Of course, if you are scum, and you just can't figure out how to recover from your play earlier... then keep up the good work. Smile

a.) Votes for pressure.
b.) Says if he's innocent, replace out.
c.) Already resigns to the lynch.

#31:

There have been a couple replacements, neither of them are Stormer. I have certainly seen people perk up when they are looking a lynch in the eye... and, I would rather see Stormer hang than MeLikeFood at this point. The deadline isn't getting any closer, so I would like to see if this
stormer wrote:
charter is a bandwagon hunter.
is REALLY all Stormer has to offer.

In other words, if we HAVE to settle for a deadline lynch.. which I suspect we might, I would rather see it be Stormer. I don't know who the scum are right now.. but I know who isn't really adding much to the game. And in my mind, he is about as likely to be rookie scum as he is to be rookie innocent.

a.) Prefers Stormer over MLF
b.) Again resigns self to a deadline lynch.
c.) Says that no idea of Stormer is scum, but he isn't adding much to the game.

#33:

Of course I don't take it personal! Smile

You can't help it that your scum-dar is incredibly flawed.
You are still the ONLY vote on me, right?

And thank you for clarifying the word "pressure"... but I disagree. I think pressure is only really effective if there is the threat of a lynch behind it. Thus either a pressure vote OR a you-are-scum vote can lead to a lynch.

In this case, the pressure is to force Stormer to play better.

Your other questions were answered in my previous post, imo... Smile
For the record... are you DEFENDING Stormer? Do you think he is NOT scum?

a.) Says that KMD being the only vote means...she's not scum?
b.) Pressure only effective with the threat of a lynch (look way above).
c.) Says Stormer is scum now?

#37:

I'm not trying to worm out of anything. I wanted to lynch him.

I just wanted him to see it coming.
I wanted everyone to see it coming... so they would all have a chance to make a mistake.

But SOMEBODY had to force the issue.

But it's ok... I'm over it. Time to look at Drake's interactions with everyone.. or lack thereof.

a.) Wanted to lynch him - not as deadline now?
b.) So they would have a chance to make a mistake? About what?

#38:

Second... Why is melikefood alive? Food.. If you ARE a roleblocker.. and the mafia DOES have a choice in who executes kills at night.... telling them who you are going to block defeats the whole purpose. Don't do it any more. Don't even drop hints.

I was totally about to say the same thing! Smile
Look.... I am innocent.. and I suspect KMD is too, just because of the bulldog grip he has on my sweet ass. That would be too scummy for scum to actually do..Smile But if he flips scum, I won't stand in the way of the pointed stick.

a.) I have to assume this is in regards to MLF not being the NK?
b.) Camn delcares her innocence and KMD's innocence because of the bulldoging.
c.) Says if he flips scum, she wont stand against being next lynch.

#44:

@ nameless

Nothing. He was perfectly unscummy. A great choice for a nightkill.
The only thing it tells me is that we have someone with some experience on the scumteam.

OR.. we have food, KMD and Charter, and they let Food decide on who to kill. But I doubt that pretty highly, and WIFOM destroys the logic of it.

BTW, thanks for answering for KMD. Now I totally know his opinion on things Smile

c

a.) Posts the Razor for why Drake was NK.
b.) Says the scumteam has someone with experience on it.
c.) Gets after Nameless for answering for KMD.

Conclusions:

There are a few issues that Camn has been really bizzare with:

1.) Voting for Pressure.

--- Starts out saying votes are for pressure.
--- Moves to "early votes" (in day 1) are for pressure.
--- Votes Stormer later..way way later, for pressure.

2.) The "Gambit"

--- Posts reasons why the Gambit would be a scum tool.
--- Posts reasons why building a crappy case is scummy.
--- Posts how some of KMD's reasons for his vote turn into a catch22 where, despite her answers she will appear scummy.
--- Says KMD is not scummy.
------ Says one reason for this IS because he's bulldogged on her.

3.) The Stormer Lynch

--- Says the play is just newbie mistakes.
--- Says that she doesn't think stormer is scum.
--- Votes because he's being a bad player.
--- Says that lurkers should die... but wont vote Stormer until he posts?
--- Initially votes for pressure.
--- Repeatedly resigns self to the eventually stormer lynch.
--- In #33... now says Stormer is scum. No reason to see why this changed.

4.) Random Oddities

--- KMD's being the only vote on her means she's not scum?
--- Says KMD's case will help her not be a NK (See my KMD - Camn theory).
--- Says KMD is probably not scum early on because the scum would only be bussing at that point (See my KMD - Camn theory).
--- Says that if KMD is scum, she wont stand in the way of a lynch (This hurts my KMD - Camn theory).
--- Lots of pro-Rishi
--- Never saw those "more questions" for Stef.
--- Questioning the NK.
--- The "the scumteam is experienced" remark.
ANnnddddd

5.) Scumhunting

--- Hasn't been ANY. None. Zero.

Personal Results from Analysis

So this reread was because I wanted to backup my feelings (which were more from KMD's end) about the KMD - Camn bussing scenario. Well... I could still see it (although it would be a little more ballsy now), but I did see enough questionable behavior that I really wonder about Camn independently though.

If I got my most tinfoil hat on.. I'd say it was KMD - Camn - Stef in the worlds greatest 3-way bus. Use the "Gambit" with Stef as the target and have the other buddy cluster on it so you've got two scum fighting over the third scum in a dance to end all dances. Still doubt this is the case, personally.

Vote Stays on KMD.

FoS: Camn.

Other post addressing other game issues coming.

[Kmd4390]

Wow, you are giving me, Camn, and Stef some serious credit on that one. I have to ask you this:

You have a great case on Camn there. Why are you NOT voting Camn? Are you afraid that I am going to call this the Gambit and jump on you for it? If that's it, than vote Camn. I really think that she is scum. I've seen others express suspicion on her without voting. I really think she is scum and should be lynched. If I jump on anyone for voting her later (I won't), then quote this post and lynch me. (barring some huge event that pretty much confirms her as town)

So Spy, why the great case, yet no vote?

[Porkens]

@Spy

I appreciate the thought you put in, but I'm afraid I don't see the weirdness or inconsistency with this part;

1.) Voting for Pressure.

--- Starts out saying votes are for pressure.
--- Moves to "early votes" (in day 1) are for pressure.
--- Votes Stormer later..way way later, for pressure.

Are you saying that this is evidence of a lack of scumhunting? Or is there some inconsistency that I'm not seeing?

[SpyreX]

Other recent page news (THIS JUST IN):

What is interesting is the soft-claim and accusing me of "trying to hang innocent". I actually wouldn't have voted for you only based on that. Your blatant OMGUS does make me vote you.

##Vote: Camn

I'll take this case further later on.

...what OMGUS? this, of course leads into the much later:

@Nameless: Are you serious? That is hypocrisy? I do have school. I didn't say i can't post because of it, i just couldn't do so then. Did you bother to read the first one through? Did you bother to learn the difference between claiming that some1 doesn't have time for playing at all because of school and some1 saying he doesn't have time at that moment to post because of school? I hate personal statements when they are unfounded. Stick to the game. If i am inactive make a case against me for lurking ( or w/e ) or ask LG to pron me.

I'll post that "detailed long post" when time will let me, not when you tell me to.

You post citing OMGUS and some case and instead of giving us that you get personally affronted when someone calls you on it?

Excuse me for stating the obvious, but: One can only assume the scum considered drake more of a threat and less likely to be lynched than melikefood. (I mean, there was a bandwagon on melikefood for a while D1 and he's said some pretty stupid things. Drake was one of the few people I at least assumed to be town, was only badly attacked by Charter, and said some pretty smart things. Only an idiot would have NKed melikfood. Why am I needing to state this?)

QFT. Again, and this is becoming a pattern in this game <3 Nameless.

No, Porkens goes rolefishing towards Food.

I'm assuming this is the inconsistencies in my post. So lets get started!
a.) Day one MLF claims Roleblocker.
b.) He also states he's going to RB Porkens in twilight.
c.) Porkens asks if MLF RB'd him.

NOW, these things all happened. Where we run into a difference in opinion in the implication of c.

I assumed that it was: Porkens asks if MLF RB'd him (because he was a power role and his action didn't go through).
Porkens said it was: Porkens asks if MLF RB'd him (so that later it is documented and if MLF is scum he can't lie about it).
You say I misinterpet it because Porkens is.... rolefishing? On a role that already claimed? And SAID what they were going to do?

This is probably more of a matter of opinion, but I'm not being lazy. I've already explained why I'm not giving every thought I have about everyone. The opinions I've formed are all there, if someone wonders where I stand or what I think on something, ask, and I will tell.

I have other suspects, but none of them are all that good. I don't really see the need to pursue three people all at once when we're only lynching one each day. All it does is lets the townies know where I stand on everyone, which I think is more beneficial to the townies than the rest of my fellow mafiosos, hence why I'm not anxious to post an analysis of every player.

So, here you say you have suspects but you're not going to pursue them. Instead, you're focusing on your one suspect without really giving a case and then doing nothing.

Also, you don't see how its beneficial to post your stances on people and be proactive instead of waiting for people to ask you and responding. You don't see how that "not scumhunting" is easily taken as being.. scummy?

More role fishing.

Again, as awesome as it is to watch you do it over and over again... it can not be fishing when the fish is already caught FFS. We know what he's claimed, he SAID what he was going to do. You said Camn's telling MLF to NOT ANNOUNCE HIS ROLEBLOCK BECAUSE THAT IS RETARDED (one of the most town things Camn has done) is rolefishing? I... I...

Ehh, I haven't seen much that connects scum together, but independantly Nameless is number one, I'm still saying Porkens is number two, and three is basically a toss up between rishi or camn.

Suspects? Check.
Reasons for anything in this game? ....

Nameless you rock, keep it up. Spyrex and Rishi, too.

I bet you dont think I rock anymore.
Again...why Rishi? I want this explanation because srsly.

MLF - POST WORDS THAT MAKE SENSE. ARE YOU SERIOUSLY CURIOUS WHY PEOPLE ARE SURPRISED ON SOME LEVEL YOU WERENT THE NK AS THE ONLY CLAIMED POWER ROLE MY GOD

But, now we move into dance dance time with my old buddy KMD.

1.) Stop talking about Porkens and the hammer. Just... stop. We know. We get it. It still isn't relevant.

But, some quotes and responses:

I asked because it looked like Stormer was going to be our lynch. I wanted to know why everyone was voting him, or if they even wanted him lynched. We never got a chance to find out because you came out of lurking to hammer.

Ahh, but the thing is that you were sitting on the sidelines just wringing your hands acting like OHH NOES WE'RE DOIN SOMETHIN BAD... but not trying to dissuade us.

Again, I'm asking if everyone voting him wants to lynch him and why. Id it came down to it at deadline, I would have been willing to hammer. I just didn't see the case yet.
Yes, I was frustrated that he was being lynched so soon. I was hoping that everyone was right because I didn't feel that he was scum, but everyone liked him for a lynch, so there was that chance that there was something that I wasn't seeing.

No one likes a looky-loo. You sat there not presenting any other options and looking all the part of mr I told you so.

On day 1, I'll always take a lynch over a no-lynch. I wasn't completely sure on stormer's alignment, I just didn't see the case yet. Even if he was town

(which he was)

, we could gain information from his lynch. Even with the speed of the hammer, we have the fact that Porkens hammered, the fact that I was against it, and the fact that your pressure vote was still on. A no-lynch would have hurt us worse than a stormer lynch.

Ohh, we know he was town. Every time you poke this little "I told you so" in just drives me nuts because it reinforces one of the bigger scummy things you have done. I say bigger because you decided to come out and trump this in a bit with the Rishi Defense(TM pending, after The Gambit)

Starting discussion early. This is helpful.

You are right... if anything Rishi did was promoting discussion or consistant. Both things you bring up (Terminology / Baseball) he says it should go one way and then later (or in the same post with the Baseball) keeps going on it with it. Of course, you've decided to take the stance that the terminology discussion was helpful (hint, it wasn't (hint, see your Gambit)).

This is understandable. Food's claim is RB, which is usually a scum role. He also claimed it out of nowhere. Didn't like the "don't lynch spy, lynch Rishi after I die" comment.

What does everyone think of Food now?

MLF is retarded, but I still do not see the rationale for scum at this point when we've got ohh so many other contenders for that throne.

Now, why when you've looked at both sides do I think you're defending Rishi? Because you see the things he's doing that are not good yet, somehow...
Lets break it down

Town (Majority) Points
-Starting discussion early
-Attempting to avoid confusion by discussing terminology
-Didn't want to "pressure" Stormer after it was clear that it wasn't going to do any good.

Scum (Minority) Points
-Possible Nameless connection. (connections don't always mean scum, and aren't always actually there)
-Voted Food, but later said he believed the claim. (I might not have quoted where he says he believes the claim, but I remember reading it.)
-Too picky with terminology when going after Food

Other Points that could probably go either way
-Only one RVS post
-Didn't see Stormer as scum
-"curious" about why Food wasn't NK'd.

The Town points:
1.) Didn't happen.
2.) Avoid or promote, depending on how you want to do it.
3.) Sure, I'll give that.

Scum points:
1.) Possible, doubtful. (I like your parenthetical remark for obvious reasons)
2.) Show the evidence FFS
3.) YES. YES. You make the statement yet... somehow, he's town.

Another great one I like:

When Porkens hammered, he took away any possibility for either of those to happen, so no, I wasn't willing to hammer.

"When the events of the game unfolded where I was being about as neutral as possible and tsk, tsking the town happened and someone hammered, I was not willing to hammer - however, because this occurred in this fashion, I can both say I was willing to hammer (be part of the lynch) yet still distance myself from what happened.. being on both sides is fun!"

And, to catch up to reality:

Wow, you are giving me, Camn, and Stef some serious credit on that one. I have to ask you this:

You have a great case on Camn there. Why are you NOT voting Camn? Are you afraid that I am going to call this the Gambit and jump on you for it? If that's it, than vote Camn. I really think that she is scum. I've seen others express suspicion on her without voting. I really think she is scum and should be lynched. If I jump on anyone for voting her later (I won't), then quote this post and lynch me. (barring some huge event that pretty much confirms her as town)

So Spy, why the great case, yet no vote?

I'm watching all the angles. Yea, it helps that all three of you are doing some amazing work in being not helpful, but.

You really think after the absolute hate I've given "The Gambit" that I would not vote for Camn because of it? I dont even understand the latter half.

As for the yet no vote? I have a vote up. One I'm more confident in than even my great case. If you make me megapost you I swear to the great moonrock that spawned the town this game I will.

The condensed version:
1.) The Gambit
2.) The Hand-Wringing (I'm gonna TM this one)
3.) The Camn-Fascination
4.) The Rishi Defense
5.) The Hammer Fetish

The set of these makes me, still, think you're a better choice. The fact I still see a chance of a connection there makes me think you're a good choice.

Also, in general... what do you do when the two people you think are scummy both start patting your back? Thats about the one response to everything that I just dont know what to do with.

[SpyreX]

Damnit, missed one.

@Pork:

It went from - "I vote for pressure" to "I vote early in day one for pressure" to "I dont think he is scum, its later in the day, yet I'm throwing this bad boy pressure vote up there regardless"

[charter]

No, Porkens goes rolefishing towards Food.

I'm assuming this is the inconsistencies in my post. So lets get started!
a.) Day one MLF claims Roleblocker.
b.) He also states he's going to RB Porkens in twilight.
c.) Porkens asks if MLF RB'd him.

NOW, these things all happened. Where we run into a difference in opinion in the implication of c.

I assumed that it was: Porkens asks if MLF RB'd him (because he was a power role and his action didn't go through).
Porkens said it was: Porkens asks if MLF RB'd him (so that later it is documented and if MLF is scum he can't lie about it).
You say I misinterpet it because Porkens is.... rolefishing? On a role that already claimed? And SAID what they were going to do?

I don't see a reason a protown player is as interested in Food's role as Porkens is. Since I can see we aren't going to drop this, I'm just going to do an extremely unhelpful thing and post why Food's claim is far from a full claim, it's a soft claim at best. First, he could be a roleblocker, could be a jailer, could be a one shot of either of those, could be a jack of all trades, could be a few others.
About his claim in twilight, "you're getting teh morphine tonight" is far from a claim that Food will roleblock Porkens...
Porken's question. It's true, porkens could be a PR and his action didn't go through. However, if that's true, porkens would know this and wouldn't even need to ask. The fact that he does ask makes me think he's scum looking for threats. Basically, town (uniformed majority) has no motive to ask a question like he did.

So, here you say you have suspects but you're not going to pursue them. Instead, you're focusing on your one suspect without really giving a case and then doing nothing.

Are you serious? Are you even reading this thread? I've posted my reasons for thinking Nameless is scum. They aren't convincing anybody, but that doesn't mean they are wrong.

Also, you don't see how its beneficial to post your stances on people and be proactive instead of waiting for people to ask you and responding. You don't see how that "not scumhunting" is easily taken as being.. scummy?

Possible, yes. Also possible, I list three people as scum, none of them are actually scum. Guess who's going to live tonight? Yep, charter sure will, and I'll be free to lynch any one of them tomorrow.

More role fishing.

Again, as awesome as it is to watch you do it over and over again... it can not be fishing when the fish is already caught FFS. We know what he's claimed, he SAID what he was going to do. You said Camn's telling MLF to NOT ANNOUNCE HIS ROLEBLOCK BECAUSE THAT IS RETARDED (one of the most town things Camn has done) is rolefishing? I... I...

Oh, you know what he's claimed? I've seen a picture with a circle around the word block. That's all I've seen really, the rest have been vague, at best, references to a half dozen other PRs. Talking about power role's actions completely negates them.

Ehh, I haven't seen much that connects scum together, but independantly Nameless is number one, I'm still saying Porkens is number two, and three is basically a toss up between rishi or camn.

Suspects? Check.
Reasons for anything in this game? ....

Oh, didn't see the part of Kmd's question asking for my reasons for suspecting them. Oh, it wasn't there. Are you asking for reasons I suspect them? This isn't a case or anything, but I feel like Porkens is trying to cover his tracks after he hammered yesterday. I also think he's trying to fish for roles, which I don't find in the interest of the town. Rishi, I'm getting scum vibes from him and camn I get the feeling that she wants everyone to like her, and not find her suspicious.

[charter]

Ugh, to elaborate on why I'm suspicious of camn and Porkens. Both seem to be quite worried that they had a hand in lynching a townie. I didn't think stormer was scum, but that doesn't mean that his lynch was a bad one. They seem to be overly concerned with how they look because of it.

[Lord Gurgi]

No new votes. I feel so useless.

This posting is good stuff guys, thanks.

[SpyreX]

I honestly can't tell if you're being willfully obtuse or not. Either way.

I don't see a reason a protown player is as interested in Food's role as Porkens is. Since I can see we aren't going to drop this, I'm just going to do an extremely unhelpful thing and post why Food's claim is far from a full claim, it's a soft claim at best. First, he could be a roleblocker, could be a jailer, could be a one shot of either of those, could be a jack of all trades, could be a few others.
About his claim in twilight, "you're getting teh morphine tonight" is far from a claim that Food will roleblock Porkens...
Porken's question. It's true, porkens could be a PR and his action didn't go through. However, if that's true, porkens would know this and wouldn't even need to ask. The fact that he does ask makes me think he's scum looking for threats. Basically, town (uniformed majority) has no motive to ask a question like he did.

1.) The picture was Rick Astley (see Rick ROLL) with the circle around block. It is Roleblocker. Not space monkies or anything else. He, flat out, claimed Mafioso Roleblocker that uses morphine to subdue his target.
2.) Thus, ipso facto, saying "You're getting the morphine tonight" IS saying who he was targeting.
3.) Porkens asking "Did you actually roleblock me" is a way of confirming to the town what the claimed power role did so that 1.) we know and 2.) MLF can't dodge the issue later if it comes up.

Are you serious? Are you even reading this thread? I've posted my reasons for thinking Nameless is scum. They aren't convincing anybody, but that doesn't mean they are wrong.

Nope, I DONT READ THIS THREAD YOU CAUGHT ME WOOO ZOOOM ZOOM

Lets try this again: Post your case on Nameless. Post all the words in one spot. Preferably in an order that makes sense.

If I cant remember your case it doesn't mean I dont read the thread - see, I remember most cases. It means that either it was a joke or it never happened. So, show me.

Possible, yes. Also possible, I list three people as scum, none of them are actually scum. Guess who's going to live tonight? Yep, charter sure will, and I'll be free to lynch any one of them tomorrow.

Then I guess you should just say you think you're scum and you'll NEVER DIE!
Or, perhaps, make the cases on why you think they're scum. You know, play the game. You're saying you're not going to talk about players because of some kind of WIFOM? Come on now.

Actually, I'll play the other side of this silly game with you. I wasn't surprised one bit it was Drake. I was torn between it being Nameless, Drake or Myself for the NK.... guess why? Because you and so many of your brethren aren't playing the game or just scummin' it up, either or.

Oh, didn't see the part of Kmd's question asking for my reasons for suspecting them. Oh, it wasn't there. Are you asking for reasons I suspect them? This isn't a case or anything, but I feel like Porkens is trying to cover his tracks after he hammered yesterday. I also think he's trying to fish for roles, which I don't find in the interest of the town. Rishi, I'm getting scum vibes from him and camn I get the feeling that she wants everyone to like her, and not find her suspicious.

WHY SHOULD ANYONE HAVE TO EXPLICIT Y ASK REASONS FOR YOU SUSPECTING SOMEONE. See, you have this uninformed majority versus an informed minority. Guess what a huge tipping point is? Informing the majority!

Again you bring up Porkens and the rolefishing. MLF aside, who or when has he rolefished? Give examples.
Why are you getting scum vibes from Rishi?
Why, inherently, is wanting everyone to like you scummy?

The worst part of this is... I can't see a scum reason for this at all. I honestly, more and more, am thinking you probably are town. However (ready for this to jump onto) - if a wagon formed on you I'd hammer you so fast it'd make the Porkens hammer look like it was in slow motion.

[Porkens]

Ugh, to elaborate on why I'm suspicious of camn and Porkens.

Both seem to be quite worried that they had a hand in lynching a townie.

I didn't think stormer was scum, but that doesn't mean that his lynch was a bad one. They seem to be overly concerned with how they look because of it.

I'm not worried that I had a hand in it. I'm glad I did it, I'd do it again.

[Kmd4390]

But, now we move into dance dance time with my old buddy KMD.

Sorry, I don't dance with dudes. I'll be happy to answer any questions you may have about the game though.

1.) Stop talking about Porkens and the hammer. Just... stop. We know. We get it. It still isn't relevant.

Ok, then stop repeating the same questions and expecting different answers. (Not you specifically, anyone who is asking me about it or accusing me of the same things over and over.) You know my stance. If I die, remember it.

Ahh, but the thing is that you were sitting on the sidelines just wringing your hands acting like OHH NOES WE'RE DOIN SOMETHIN BAD... but not trying to dissuade us.

*Sighs* I have to say it again. I asked the question to everyone voting stormer about if they thought he was our best lynch. If they said "no", I'd expect them to unvote. If they said "yes", I'd ask why. If I knew the hammer was coming, I would have said something big, bold, and important looking. Something like

THOSE VOTING STORMER: HE IS AT L-1. IF YOU DON'T THINK HE IS SCUM, UNVOTE. PORKENS WILL HAMMER IF YOU DON'T

Unfortunately, I didn't know the hammer was coming so soon. I did what I could. Also again, if people convinced me about Stormer, or a deadline hit, I would have been more than happy to hammer.

Do you have any new questions or am I going to be answering the same questions, making the same post, until you rush into yet another bad lynch?

No one likes a looky-loo. You sat there not presenting any other options and looking all the part of mr I told you so.

See above.

THIS IS THE LAST TIME I WILL ADDRESS THIS ISSUE, OR THE PORKENS HAMMER UNLESS SOMETHING NEW IS ADDED. IF THERE IS NOTHING NEW, I WILL SIMPLY QUOTE THE POST TO SHOW I READ IT. EVERYONE SHOULD KNOW MY STANCE ON BOTH ISSUES RIGHT NOW.

Seriously, give me something new. No one likes a parrot.

Ohh, we know he was town. Every time you poke this little "I told you so" in just drives me nuts because it reinforces one of the bigger scummy things you have done. I say bigger because you decided to come out and trump this in a bit with the Rishi Defense(TM pending, after The Gambit)

It's not an "I told you so". It's more of a "this is the situation we have, and not a hypothetical one."

You are right... if anything Rishi did was promoting discussion or consistant. Both things you bring up (Terminology / Baseball) he says it should go one way and then later (or in the same post with the Baseball) keeps going on it with it. Of course, you've decided to take the stance that the terminology discussion was helpful (hint, it wasn't (hint, see your Gambit)).

Read his posts thouroughly and tell me you honestly don't think he was promoting discussion early in the game. I DO think the terminology thing was helpful. I wouldn't want to see someone lynched because they claimed town or something stupid like that. It sounds ridiculous, but it's good that it was brought up before we had any issue with it.

Town (Majority) Points
-Starting discussion early
-Attempting to avoid confusion by discussing terminology
-Didn't want to "pressure" Stormer after it was clear that it wasn't going to do any good.

Scum (Minority) Points
-Possible Nameless connection. (connections don't always mean scum, and aren't always actually there)
-Voted Food, but later said he believed the claim. (I might not have quoted where he says he believes the claim, but I remember reading it.)
-Too picky with terminology when going after Food

Other Points that could probably go either way
-Only one RVS post
-Didn't see Stormer as scum
-"curious" about why Food wasn't NK'd.

The Town points:
1.) Didn't happen.
2.) Avoid or promote, depending on how you want to do it.
3.) Sure, I'll give that.

Scum points:
1.) Possible, doubtful. (I like your parenthetical remark for obvious reasons)
2.) Show the evidence FFS
3.) YES. YES. You make the statement yet... somehow, he's town.

Town:
1.Yes it did. Read the beginning of the game.
2.I think I actually said somewhere in that post (conclusion maybe) that while it was helpful at first, he took it too far later.
3.Ok

Scum:
1.Ok.
2.I'll quote it next post.
3.It was helpful at first. Yes, he took it too far, but I think he realized it.

"When the events of the game unfolded where I was being about as neutral as possible and tsk, tsking the town happened and someone hammered, I was not willing to hammer - however, because this occurred in this fashion, I can both say I was willing to hammer (be part of the lynch) yet still distance myself from what happened.. being on both sides is fun!"

quoted to show it's been read and responded to several times.

You really think after the absolute hate I've given "The Gambit" that I would not vote for Camn because of it? I dont even understand the latter half.

You have GOT to be kidding me with this one. You have a GREAT case on Camn, but won't vote because my Gambit caught her? I said to quote that post if I jumped on you for voting Camn for a reason. I am not going to do it. If you think Camn is scum, then vote for Camn. Don't use my attack as a reason not to follow your suspicions.

The condensed version:
1.) The Gambit
2.) The Hand-Wringing (I'm gonna TM this one)
3.) The Camn-Fascination
4.) The Rishi Defense
5.) The Hammer Fetish

1. Ok, you don't like my Gambit. That's fine. How does that make me scum though?
2.Don't even know what that means.
3. I think she's scum. That's bad?
4.I think he's probably town. I'd like him to answer my question first though.
5.Responded plenty.

You know, most of this translates to making points very clear. This can be helpful if I die, which you seem to want to happen. Don't forget these points if you kill me.

Also, in general... what do you do when the two people you think are scummy both start patting your back? Thats about the one response to everything that I just dont know what to do with.

Ok, I'm on the phone and not sure exactly what you are referring to although it is probably obvious, but in general, I would ask "why the need to buddy up?" and follow both cases.

[melikefood]

Just saying I'm here.
I'll try to get an analysis up on Wednesday, I've got tons of work to do...

(Also,I have homework and Samba De Amigo but I doubt any of you care...if you do I'd try to keep it out of here.)

Sorry.

[SpyreX]

Also again, if people convinced me about Stormer, or a deadline hit, I would have been more than happy to hammer.

Frankly, this is the problem. I dont believe this one bit.

My vote on stormer was a pressure vote.
I saw that he was new and if he thought he was about to be lynched, he would give himself away. It looked like an honest mistake to me. He could still be scum but I'm not seeing it yet.

We should only lynch him if we think he is scum. If you don't think he will play better later, he will surely continue to slip as scum.

Camn, do you really think that pressuring stormer more is the right move? I can see a vote if you think he is scum right now, but I think the pressure thing has done all it will do.

I'm not trying to keep pressure off of Stormer.
I just don't think that he should be lynched FOR pressure.
I think we've gotten as much of an answer out of him as we are going to, so I don't see where just pressuring is going to help.
If you think he is scum, vote him for that.
That's fine.

Those voting stormer: Do you

really

think he is our best lynch option today?

Wow, we should have talked about the lynch before that hammer.

Well, hopefully you were all right about Stormer...

None of this makes me think you'd want to lynch him. Which, in and of itself isn't bad.
However, you made it very clear that you didn't think this is the right move. Aside from this the only thing you did was your "Gambit Attack" on Camn.
Note that other people weren't on that wagon. Fine. They didn't pull the "Lets talk about this." and the "Well, hope you were right." and then start the next day immediately with "Why the hammer??".

Now, with the above, how in the name of everything would I believe you were willing to hammer?

If I knew the hammer was coming, I would have said something big, bold, and important looking.

L-1 isn't some kinda accident. That is "the hammer is coming". If you had taken a real anti-lynch stance then we wouldn't be in this mess.

Do you have any new questions or am I going to be answering the same questions, making the same post, until you rush into yet another bad lynch?

On one level this is cute. See, Stormer may have been town, but he definitely wasn't a bad lynch. I've got no problems breaking the bad eggs early to get the game moving without all the chaff. The fact that, repeatedly, you've acted like this was such a terrible lynch and, really, the way it played out makes it seem like you knew his alignment and thats why you distanced yourself.

Seriously, give me something new. No one likes a parrot.

Well, you see, you still manage to get this "Ohh, I didn't lynch Stormer therefore I'm holier than thou" attitude. You did it in this post even. So, yea, I'm going to call BS on it.

Read his posts thouroughly and tell me you honestly don't think he was promoting discussion early in the game. I DO think the terminology thing was helpful. I wouldn't want to see someone lynched because they claimed town or something stupid like that. It sounds ridiculous, but it's good that it was brought up before we had any issue with it.

Did. Done. More than once. Called bullshit on it day 1 when he was doing it. Mentioned it again. Mentioning it now.

You have GOT to be kidding me with this one. You have a GREAT case on Camn, but won't vote because my Gambit caught her? I said to quote that post if I jumped on you for voting Camn for a reason. I am not going to do it. If you think Camn is scum, then vote for Camn. Don't use my attack as a reason not to follow your suspicions.

?
You said:

Are you afraid that I am going to call this the Gambit and jump on you for it? If that's it, than vote Camn.

My reply is:

You really think after the absolute hate I've given "The Gambit" that I would not vote for Camn because of it?

To make it clear:
Your gambit has no effect on me still voting you over Camn. The fact that I still, now and forever, find your actions in late day 1 and early day 2 far scummier than even all those words I hvae about Camn are what have me voting for you now.

1. Ok, you don't like my Gambit. That's fine. How does that make me scum though?
2.Don't even know what that means.
3. I think she's scum. That's bad?
4.I think he's probably town. I'd like him to answer my question first though.
5.Responded plenty.

1.) Covered this way back when. More than once.
2.) See you end of day 1.
3.) See my KMD - Camn love fiesta.
4.) Covered again.
5.) Yep. Still scummy. Still, always, going to be a huge mark against you.

Ok, I'm on the phone and not sure exactly what you are referring to although it is probably obvious, but in general, I would ask "why the need to buddy up?" and follow both cases.

It was meant to be Rhetorical. Both you and Camn recently went "Hey, good job" when I want you both to dangle.

[Kmd4390]

if a wagon formed on you I'd hammer you so fast it'd make the Porkens hammer look like it was in slow motion.

Without a claim or decent defense and leaving questions unanswered???
I'd hope not.

I'm not worried that I had a hand in it. I'm glad I did it, I'd do it again.

Quoting so I can say I like the new sig.

Also again, if people convinced me about Stormer, or a deadline hit, I would have been more than happy to hammer.

Frankly, this is the problem. I dont believe this one bit.

My vote on stormer was a pressure vote.
I saw that he was new and if he thought he was about to be lynched, he would give himself away. It looked like an honest mistake to me. He could still be scum but I'm not seeing it yet.

We should only lynch him if we think he is scum. If you don't think he will play better later, he will surely continue to slip as scum.

Camn, do you really think that pressuring stormer more is the right move? I can see a vote if you think he is scum right now, but I think the pressure thing has done all it will do.

I'm not trying to keep pressure off of Stormer.
I just don't think that he should be lynched FOR pressure.
I think we've gotten as much of an answer out of him as we are going to, so I don't see where just pressuring is going to help.
If you think he is scum, vote him for that.
That's fine.

Those voting stormer: Do you

really

think he is our best lynch option today?

Wow, we should have talked about the lynch before that hammer.

Well, hopefully you were all right about Stormer...

Not seeing anythin wrong here. I didn't like the way he was being pressured after it would do any good, and then lynched for it. Yes, I admit I didn't see him as scum. Like I've said, if someone proved otherwise, I'd hammer. This doesn't mean I saw him as scum, it means if someone showed me he was scum, I'd hammer. Also, in case of deadline I'll take any lynch over a no lynch on Day 1.

However, you made it very clear that you didn't think this is the right move. Aside from this the only thing you did was your "Gambit Attack" on Camn.
Note that other people weren't on that wagon. Fine. They didn't pull the "Lets talk about this." and the "Well, hope you were right." and then start the next day immediately with "Why the hammer??".

Because I really didn't think it was the right move. Do you expect me to lie and say "great job lynching a townie. glad you did it." No. I mean, the fact that he flipped town, fine. Probability shows that that will usually happen on Day 1. I just think we could have done better.

I'm pretty sure a few people said that they weren't happy with the hammer. I agree that I've been the most vocal about it, but I see no reason not to be. It's how I play. This is my opinion. I want to make it clear. Take it or leave it.

L-1 isn't some kinda accident. That is "the hammer is coming". If you had taken a real anti-lynch stance then we wouldn't be in this mess.

I thought I was making myself clear enough with the question. Porkens thought it was a good idea to hammer, so he did. Not much I could do there. My vote wasn't on Stormer, so I couldn't unvote. The most I could do was try to convince people to either unvote or show me why Stormer is scum. I thought my question would do that. I guess I should have made it more clear.

On one level this is cute. See, Stormer may have been town, but he definitely wasn't a bad lynch. I've got no problems breaking the bad eggs early to get the game moving without all the chaff. The fact that, repeatedly, you've acted like this was such a terrible lynch and, really, the way it played out makes it seem like you knew his alignment and thats why you distanced yourself.

I've seen too many times where the newbie townie is lynched on obvious newbie mistakes. This was a classic example of that. Of course, if people showed why he was scum, I'd be fine with it. The fact is he was mostly voted for newbie mistakes and pressure. This doesn't look like a lynch to me. It ended up being ours though.

Well, you see, you still manage to get this "Ohh, I didn't lynch Stormer therefore I'm holier than thou" attitude. You did it in this post even. So, yea, I'm going to call BS on it.

Awesome. The last time I was the words "holier than thou" in a mafia game, it was directed at the biggest ego I have ever seen. This guy is so cocky it's not even funny. He actually got worse after the comment just for fun. I'd do it but I don't think I can do it like him. If I was as good as he is, I'd say something like "Lynch Camn now. I'll explain later." and you would all do it.

Seriously though, cockiness doesn't mean scum. It just means someone is having fun with a game. Too much fun? Maybe. Worth it? Of course.

Really, I think Camn is scum, and after you see that, you will know how right I am. Plenty of people have shown suspicion, but nobody is voting. Why? I think it's fear of Kmd. "Oh crap, she's scum but I can't vote. He'll call me out for it. Crap, what do I do?" I've already said, I'm not going to jump on anyone for it. [/cockiness just to try it out]

Did. Done. More than once. Called bullshit on it day 1 when he was doing it. Mentioned it again. Mentioning it now.

Ok, so you apparently don't see Rishi trying to start discussion. I'll show you when I get around to it. Probably next post. Actually I remember saying that about something earlier and I was on the phone and forgot, so I'll try to get to whatever that was too.

To make it clear:
Your gambit has no effect on me still voting you over Camn. The fact that I still, now and forever, find your actions in late day 1 and early day 2 far scummier than even all those words I hvae about Camn are what have me voting for you now.

Ok, but there's a problem with that. I'm town and you are going in the wrong direction. You should really consider voting Camn.

Being cocky is fun. I see why people do it now.

Things to get to next post: (in case I don't have time tonight, this is for my own reference.)
1.)show what Rishi did about Food's claim. He voted Food day 1, but believed the claim Day 2.
2.)Show where Rishi promotes discussion early.

[Kmd4390]

if a wagon formed on you I'd hammer you so fast it'd make the Porkens hammer look like it was in slow motion.

Without a claim or decent defense and leaving questions unanswered???
I'd hope not.

I'm not worried that I had a hand in it. I'm glad I did it, I'd do it again.

Quoting so I can say I like the new sig.

Also again, if people convinced me about Stormer, or a deadline hit, I would have been more than happy to hammer.

Frankly, this is the problem. I dont believe this one bit.

My vote on stormer was a pressure vote.
I saw that he was new and if he thought he was about to be lynched, he would give himself away. It looked like an honest mistake to me. He could still be scum but I'm not seeing it yet.

We should only lynch him if we think he is scum. If you don't think he will play better later, he will surely continue to slip as scum.

Camn, do you really think that pressuring stormer more is the right move? I can see a vote if you think he is scum right now, but I think the pressure thing has done all it will do.

I'm not trying to keep pressure off of Stormer.
I just don't think that he should be lynched FOR pressure.
I think we've gotten as much of an answer out of him as we are going to, so I don't see where just pressuring is going to help.
If you think he is scum, vote him for that.
That's fine.

Those voting stormer: Do you

really

think he is our best lynch option today?

Wow, we should have talked about the lynch before that hammer.

Well, hopefully you were all right about Stormer...

Not seeing anythin wrong here. I didn't like the way he was being pressured after it would do any good, and then lynched for it. Yes, I admit I didn't see him as scum. Like I've said, if someone proved otherwise, I'd hammer. This doesn't mean I saw him as scum, it means if someone showed me he was scum, I'd hammer. Also, in case of deadline I'll take any lynch over a no lynch on Day 1.

However, you made it very clear that you didn't think this is the right move. Aside from this the only thing you did was your "Gambit Attack" on Camn.
Note that other people weren't on that wagon. Fine. They didn't pull the "Lets talk about this." and the "Well, hope you were right." and then start the next day immediately with "Why the hammer??".

Because I really didn't think it was the right move. Do you expect me to lie and say "great job lynching a townie. glad you did it." No. I mean, the fact that he flipped town, fine. Probability shows that that will usually happen on Day 1. I just think we could have done better.

I'm pretty sure a few people said that they weren't happy with the hammer. I agree that I've been the most vocal about it, but I see no reason not to be. It's how I play. This is my opinion. I want to make it clear. Take it or leave it.

L-1 isn't some kinda accident. That is "the hammer is coming". If you had taken a real anti-lynch stance then we wouldn't be in this mess.

I thought I was making myself clear enough with the question. Porkens thought it was a good idea to hammer, so he did. Not much I could do there. My vote wasn't on Stormer, so I couldn't unvote. The most I could do was try to convince people to either unvote or show me why Stormer is scum. I thought my question would do that. I guess I should have made it more clear.

On one level this is cute. See, Stormer may have been town, but he definitely wasn't a bad lynch. I've got no problems breaking the bad eggs early to get the game moving without all the chaff. The fact that, repeatedly, you've acted like this was such a terrible lynch and, really, the way it played out makes it seem like you knew his alignment and thats why you distanced yourself.

I've seen too many times where the newbie townie is lynched on obvious newbie mistakes. This was a classic example of that. Of course, if people showed why he was scum, I'd be fine with it. The fact is he was mostly voted for newbie mistakes and pressure. This doesn't look like a lynch to me. It ended up being ours though.

Well, you see, you still manage to get this "Ohh, I didn't lynch Stormer therefore I'm holier than thou" attitude. You did it in this post even. So, yea, I'm going to call BS on it.

Awesome. The last time I was the words "holier than thou" in a mafia game, it was directed at the biggest ego I have ever seen. This guy is so cocky it's not even funny. He actually got worse after the comment just for fun. I'd do it but I don't think I can do it like him. If I was as good as he is, I'd say something like "Lynch Camn now. I'll explain later." and you would all do it.

Seriously though, cockiness doesn't mean scum. It just means someone is having fun with a game. Too much fun? Maybe. Worth it? Of course.

Really, I think Camn is scum, and after you see that, you will know how right I am. Plenty of people have shown suspicion, but nobody is voting. Why? I think it's fear of Kmd. "Oh crap, she's scum but I can't vote. He'll call me out for it. Crap, what do I do?" I've already said, I'm not going to jump on anyone for it. [/cockiness just to try it out]

Did. Done. More than once. Called bullshit on it day 1 when he was doing it. Mentioned it again. Mentioning it now.

Ok, so you apparently don't see Rishi trying to start discussion. I'll show you when I get around to it. Probably next post. Actually I remember saying that about something earlier and I was on the phone and forgot, so I'll try to get to whatever that was too.

To make it clear:
Your gambit has no effect on me still voting you over Camn. The fact that I still, now and forever, find your actions in late day 1 and early day 2 far scummier than even all those words I hvae about Camn are what have me voting for you now.

Ok, but there's a problem with that. I'm town and you are going in the wrong direction. You should really consider voting Camn.

Being cocky is fun. I see why people do it now.

Things to get to next post: (in case I don't have time tonight, this is for my own reference.)
1.)show what Rishi did about Food's claim. He voted Food day 1, but believed the claim Day 2.
2.)Show where Rishi promotes discussion early.

[Kmd4390]

Crap. Double posted.

[Kmd4390]

Day 1 after the claim.

##Vote: melikefood

Day 2:

Yes. I believe his claim.

Spy, there it is.

And as far as starting discussion:
Just realized. If I do that, I'm doing something that was already done. Go read my post where I look at Rishi at Nameless's (that can't possibly be gramatically correct.) request. Post 412.

[SpyreX]

You are no Tucker. Don't try.

You are also scum. So its all good.

And, again - if you didn't like the lynch, that's fine. Going "Ohh I hope you guys are right" in twilight really reaks of knowing his alignment.

As for the first question (too lazy to open up a real reply) - all these "unanswered questions" and other unicorns and leprechauns you seem to think happen at L-1 I just haven't seen. So, there ya go. I would leap from the shadows to throw that hammer laughing all the way.

And the next day someone would go "Ohh NO WHY DID YOU HAMMER" and the cycle would repeat.

[SpyreX]

Are we still going on about Rishi? The examples you gave before that I read and replied to about his discussion were not actual mafia hunting discussion.

Going "baseball talk is bad (ps I hate baseball )" isn't helpful.
Terms discussion is weak at best and ABSOULTELY WORTHLESS at worst - guess which game this has been.

[charter]

And the next day someone would go "Ohh NO WHY DID YOU HAMMER" and the cycle would repeat.

Yeah, not going to bite.

[Nameless]

(FYI, this post is replying to things on page 17. After that everything just kind of blurs. Seriously, though, I did read it but nothing said was particularly unexpected or changed my mind about likely scum at that point: Kmd, Charter and now probably Camn for a 3rd FTW revision.)

This morning, and moreso now, I suspect that Camn and KmD are scumbuddies who are playfighting. Especially since the whole, two-way, "Don't tie my alignment to his/her's."

That is actually a good point that I hadn't thought of. Hmm.

I said I found myself agreeing with him most of the time, but I wanted to know about the whole Food thing. Why is that noncommittal?

The best example (which speaks for itself) is probably this:

The town points are things that scum can do.

Nameless, knowing now that Stormer was town, can you see scum jumping on the stormer wagon for an easy lynch?

Yes, but I can also see them avoiding the likely lynch in order to make it repeatedly absolutely clear that they were against it D2.

Ack, didn't realize it'd been ages since I posted here.

I'm sure you didn't. Lurker.

Second... Why is melikefood alive? Food.. If you ARE a roleblocker.. and the mafia DOES have a choice in who executes kills at night.... telling them who you are going to block defeats the whole purpose. Don't do it any more. Don't even drop hints.

More role fishing.

Role fishing accusation FAIL. (What Porkens said #420)

@Nameless, can you please state your reasons for voting kmd in 365.

I was already (and still am) 99% sure Kmd and you are scum. Two other people had voted Kmd, so naturally I figured I have a better chance of having Kmd lynched than you. Also, like I said, to see where/if the bandwagon went and other player's reactions to it ETC.

Regarding #387 ... No, I didn't answer the questions because doing so would obviously benefit the scum but not the innocents (and you admit they are 'ridculous'). If I were scum, I wouldn't be stupid enough to answer them. I am innocent, and I'm not stupid enough to answer them. It's a nulltell, and the reason you bring it up is because ... you also wouldn't be stupid to answer them as scum? Right.

Also, would you be willing to hammer Porkens if it was clear I wasn't going to be lynched?

Oh, and #415 isn't putting together a case ... that's just ADDING a possible something else to what Kmd has already done scummy.

I don't see this as scummy. He's not waving it around saying "I was right yesterday, listen to me today!"

Yes, he is. Oh dear god, yes he is.

[camn]

I like this game

First off...

Don't make the mistake of thinking that "helpful" players are always town.

I know, dude. But it certainly isn't scummy, right?
And yes, We DO agree the hammer was too fast. I don't think it was scummy though.



Second...

I bet you dont think I rock anymore.

Actually, I totally do. Your "case" on me was fair and balanced, I think. KMD seems to characterize it as a knockout punch.. but I like it. You are observant and precise. Thats what I like about you. You mention things that make me look good as well as stuff that makes me look bad. KMD doesn't do that, because he works for Fox News.

Now.. for response.
1.) Voting for Pressure.
I consider "early" all of day one.. and most of day 2 and 3. Pretty much any time before I really know who scum are... and when the game isn't totally in the balance.

2.) The "Gambit"
That was an acedemic comment on the poor efficacy of the "Gambit" as a practical tool. I think it is poorly designed, and can be used equally well by scum and town. That is all. I really don't think KMD is scum.. and I think he will feel bad if he ends up lynching me.

3.) The Stormer Lynch
I don't see my post #33 as calling Stormer scum. I was for his lynch for the same reasons as you... he sucked. I never was CONVINCED he was scum.. but I had no better ideas. And I was not calling him scum in 33.

4.) Random Oddities
No... KMD being the only one means I am not

Obv

Scum.. . like he was implying.
If it looks like I am going to earn a lynch.. then I won't get nightkilled. I think that is pretty well-recognised scum-meta.
I DO think KMD is innocent.. but I could be wrong. I won't defend him.
I Heart Rishi.
You think a rookie scumteam could have picked Drake out for a kill? He was a great choice, imo.

5.) Scumhunting
I know. I am terrible the first couple days.
Plus.. I have a subtle style. I ask a web of questions.. and see who I can trap. I am not aggressive like some of you guys. Also, TBH, I am having a little bit of a hard time keeping up with the pace of this game. ALSO.. it is hard to hunt when you are getting hounded by KMD all day


And you are right.. that WOULD be the greatest 3-way bus ever. I almost wish it were true!

[camn]

Yes, he is. Oh dear god, yes he is.

QFAT!

[Nameless]

I consider "early" all of day one.. and most of day 2 and 3.

I know. I am terrible the first couple days.

I really don't like these replies. Retroactively redefining terms and blaming scumtells on lack of skill ... Yeah, try again.

Your "subtle style" excuse made me LOL, though. I have to try that one out on my boss sometime.

[Kmd4390]

You are no Tucker. Don't try.

Holy Crap! You play on SA. Wow. Actually, you prove my point. You know who I am talking about. No more though because the game is ongoing. (How did you know I meant TT and not Ecco?)

You are also scum. So its all good.

To take a page from Rishi's book, we are all scum. Or claiming to be at least. [/terminology]

And, again - if you didn't like the lynch, that's fine. Going "Ohh I hope you guys are right" in twilight really reaks of knowing his alignment.

Quoted to show it's been read. A lot.

As for the first question (too lazy to open up a real reply) - all these "unanswered questions" and other unicorns and leprechauns you seem to think happen at L-1 I just haven't seen. So, there ya go. I would leap from the shadows to throw that hammer laughing all the way.

It's been quoted. I'll quote it again:

Those voting stormer: Do you

really

think he is our best lynch option today?

Right there. Also, you know as well as I do that Stormer never claimed. *Stops self from elaborating as it would be the SAME conversation yet again*

And the next day someone would go "Ohh NO WHY DID YOU HAMMER

so soon

" and the cycle would repeat.

Fixed.

Are we still going on about Rishi? The examples you gave before that I read and replied to about his discussion were not actual mafia hunting discussion.

He brought up small issues early in the game to get us talking. Off the top of my head, I'm remembering the way he reacted to somone (Stef?) saying interesting statment.

Going "baseball talk is bad (ps I hate baseball )" isn't helpful.
Terms discussion is weak at best and ABSOULTELY WORTHLESS at worst - guess which game this has been.

The baseball thing was getting ridiculous. I'm so sports obsessed that I made one comment and when everyone responded, I kept going. Unfortunately, others are the same way and it just blew up. Rishi was not wrong to try to stop the discussion. Terminology is more important than you think.
Why don't you realize this?
Spy: Because Rishi talked about it early and now nobody is confused by it and I don't realize the issue we could have had with it!
Kmd:Very good. Now you get it. (At least in my own mind here)

I see Nameless, charter, and Camn have posted. I'll get to those in about an hour. I have to go for now.